Mark-Anthony Kaye

[Bikerack]

It’s absolutely wild to see all the hate on twitter and other platforms 

he has been a great player and person representing our program. One terrible mistake shouldn’t take away from all good he has done . He’s not a villain 

Davies got sent off a few years ago after being on the pitch for 5 minutes and he has learned from that, I know MAK will do the same

ALLEZ LES ROUGES

[archer21]

13 minutes ago, Shway said:

And this was the conversation with my dad last night who's not really a soccer guy (grew up playing basketball and football, watches basketball religiously)

....But he loves basketball, a non contact sport that has the biggest and most softest guys flopping and and acting.

I can't blame Venegas for his acting, he did his part in securing the victory for his team. Nobody likes to see it, but when it works in your favour there's not much complaining.

Until the rules of the game change such that you are punished more than rewarded for acting, it will continue. If anything needs VAR, it’s this. If a VAR official sees simulation/acting, review it and issue cards/revoke cards for the foul. It’ll disappear very quickly.

[Bison44]

If they can use VAR to check whether a guy is offside by 2 inches they can go over a red card situation.  Especially if something happens off the ball and no one sees it.  And if not during the game after, watch the tape, rescind the card/suspension and punish the diver.  There is no way any resaonable human could see two guys walking towards each other,bump shoulders, 1 guys keeps walking and the other throws himself on the ground and rolls around like he was shot and not laugh out loud.  My wife says to me "they wrestle and push each other before every corner kick?? how is that not a card?"  Sometimes this game is very frustrating.    

[TOcanadafan]

20 minutes ago, archer21 said:

Until the rules of the game change such that you are punished more than rewarded for acting, it will continue. If anything needs VAR, it’s this. If a VAR official sees simulation/acting, review it and issue cards/revoke cards for the foul. It’ll disappear very quickly.

It’s just logical that you’d… A) Want this crap out of the game, because, let’s face it, it’s cheating; b) Use VAR to check such an important/contentious decision.  But alas, ‘the powers that be” still like to have the ability to influence the results.

Edited March 25, 2022 by TOcanadafan

[Colliedor]

Not even considering the red card when I say this and I say this as a fan of his, he shouldn't be starting as of right now. His form seems to have dipped. He does have a good game here and there but I don't see him as a regular starter right now, even if we continue to play with 3 mids.

[toontownman]

19 minutes ago, Colliedor said:

Not even considering the red card when I say this and I say this as a fan of his, he shouldn't be starting as of right now. His form seems to have dipped. He does have a good game here and there but I don't see him as a regular starter right now, even if we continue to play with 3 mids.

Wasn't he in the MLS team of the week a couple of weeks ago and has score 2 in 6 games? His form has dipped for the national team though I would agree. 

[narduch]

20 minutes ago, Colliedor said:

Not even considering the red card when I say this and I say this as a fan of his, he shouldn't be starting as of right now. His form seems to have dipped. He does have a good game here and there but I don't see him as a regular starter right now, even if we continue to play with 3 mids.

He's been playing really well in MLS leading up to this game. 

We should just chalk it up as a lesson learned and move on. I have a feeling that's what Herdman will do.

 

[Bison44]

He has been playing very well In MLS so far this season.  Eustaq and kaye have been successful as a midf team in the past.  Who takes his place?? Piette is injured, Kone still only has a handful of pro games, Fraser left MLS for a lower league to find playing time and Atiba got shifted to CB. He is going to be in the mix and he deserves to be, depending on formation and opponent etc.  

[Approve My Account Pls]

Not sure if there's time, but I think it would be a great gesture from the V's to have a support of MAK either through banner or even a simple chant in the south end...

Criticize the decision leading to the red card sure, but never want to see any of these guys get racial abuse - or any abuse - that extends beyond purely football 

[Corazon]

13 minutes ago, Approve My Account Pls said:

Not sure if there's time, but I think it would be a great gesture from the V's to have a support of MAK either through banner or even a simple chant in the south end...

Criticize the decision leading to the red card sure, but never want to see any of these guys get racial abuse - or any abuse - that extends beyond purely football 

Agreed.  I made note of this on the previous page of this forum.  He is probably absolutely gutted and feels terrible for his decision.  We need to show him our support for all his done for our program.  Even if he was to never play for Canada again, I firmly believe Kaye needs our support.  No one should be subject to racist comments and forced to turn off comments on social media.

[gator]

I will be honest, I am have not been sold on Kaye to begin with for our CMNT anyway, it doesn't matter what he is doing in MLS, he was very poor in Hamilton but I see enough in his game to see why Herdman plays him but last night should send him down the list a bit! Yes we have to support all of our players who proudly wear our shirt but MAK potentially delayed our qualification last night and robbed all of the travelling V's potentially of a night to remember by actions that should not happen at this level!

[ag futbol]

11 hours ago, ECW said:

That was very stupid from Kaye but I’d never post negative stuff on a player’s IG account or even boo our own team in the stadium. That’s much more stupid. I don’t see the point of that level of disrespect. 

Agreed. I’ll criticize him for the play on this board but he otherwise deserves a chance. I thought he was very good in several of the other, earlier games in the cycle. 
 
And all that aside, every one of our players deserves respect and to be free from harassment. Anonymous Twitter posts suck. 
 

 

[footballfreak]

With Kaye suspended for the next match and presumably unable to sit on the bench with the team, would it be possible to extend an invitation to stand with the Voyageurs? Could be a good way to show him support after what’s been a rough 24 hours.

[CanadaFan123]

3 minutes ago, footballfreak said:

With Kaye suspended for the next match and presumably unable to sit on the bench with the team, would it be possible to extend an invitation to stand with the Voyageurs? Could be a good way to show him support after what’s been a rough 24 hours.

No chance Canada Soccer would allow that. He still has another match to play and we’re in a pandemic.

[N1ckbr0wn]

39 minutes ago, CanadaFan123 said:

No chance Canada Soccer would allow that. He still has another match to play and we’re in a pandemic.

I think if this idea lands in the right hands it’s worth a try. The gesture alone would probably mean a lot to Mark. 
 

love the idea 

Edited March 25, 2022 by N1ckbr0wn

[Stryker911]

I don't know who is in charge of leading the cheers, but I was wondering if someone could start one for Kaye prior to the game? @Admin @rob.notenboom Even just to chant his name. I feel it  would go a long ways with the rest of the team that the fans/country have their back. Especially after the online hate he got. 

I'm disappointed with how he played, but he is still a big part of this team goin forward.

[apbsmith]

Give the man the drum post game. 

In addition to some type of MAK cheer during the game. 

MAK was a HUGE piece for us in our away results. Which is a significant reason why we are going to the WC.

[SpursFlu]

I'm confused because I don't personally know anyone who cares more about the CMNT and Kaye taking that red card registers so low on my give a shit level 

I dont live out football culture on line a family member does and watches epl monitoring social media for "banter". I find it such a turn off because it feels so phony and some kinda English hooligan cultural appropriation done by the comfort of your house. I see people all over the world freaking out and theyve never set foot in a stadium. Most of the so called "passion" just feels like a put on trying to get attention. It all feels like a big act

Edited March 25, 2022 by SpursFlu

[Ally McCoist]

 

[gator]

I haven't read any of the vile posts nor do I want to, from my experience in following the game in England these are usually posted by so called fans from other teams or in this case other countries, how could any CMNT supporter single out MAK for racial abuse given the make up of our squad?

[SpursFlu]

Usually it's a 13 yr old in a basement somewhere who's brain hasn't fully formed so they can't yet make a proper connection between actions and consequences. Either that or someone in a troll factory somewhere trying to get everyone in certain regions of the world to hate and distrust each other

[Obinna]

Only now just learning about the online racial abuse (from this thread). Real shame (goes without saying). Good on the CSA for having our player's back (also goes without saying).

At the same time, does anyone else feel these kind of statements are totally detached from the people the abusers? I just can't imagine the next person to racially abuse someone is now going to think twice because the CSA or whoever put out a statement. I just don't think it works that way. 

The issue has nothing to do about awareness. We have been raising awareness for decades now.

I think the issue is that people are jerks and like saying hateful shit, especially behind a computer screen. And what's the best way to deal with a jerk? Just ignore them.

Sure, if we want to keep putting out statements to stand in solidarity, then fair enough. It's not going to make it worse or anything, but it's not going to make it better, either. 

When this kind of thing happens to us, I think we just have to ignore it, shake it off, and move on, rather than seeking retribution in whatever form it takes (legal or otherwise). Not saying Kaye, the CSA or anyone is specifically seeking retribution, but I am just speaking generally. I always feel with these things that there's an undertone of retribution, because when there's an avenue to punish for such a thing, that avenue is taken, but you cannot punish your way to a polite society (I feel it never works - hasn't worked for racism at least).

Anyways, rant over.

Shame that Kaye has to deal with that, because the red card is enough to deal with as it is. I am sure he'll bounce back for Panama and he should be fresh and ready to go for that one. 

[Onelessstar]

36 minutes ago, Obinna said:

When this kind of thing happens to us, I think we just have to ignore it, shake it off, and move on, rather than seeking retribution in whatever form it takes (legal or otherwise). Not saying Kaye, the CSA or anyone is specifically seeking retribution, but I am just speaking generally. I always feel with these things that there's an undertone of retribution, because when there's an avenue to punish for such a thing, that avenue is taken, but you cannot punish your way to a polite society (I feel it never works - hasn't worked for racism at least).

 

I get what you're trying to say.... but we can't "ignore" our way to a polite society either. You're likely 99% correct that these statements (from the CSA etc) have no affect on many/most of the perpetrators but it does raise awareness to the issue/concern and opens many people's (privileged) eyes to the fact that this shit still happens and that, maybe, it's your (or my) 13 year old keyboard warrior initiating some of it. I'm betting most 13 year olds will learn more through intervention and support rather than being ignored.

Honestly, I  have no idea of how Mark Anthony-Kaye (or Saka, Sancho or Rashford) are dealing or feeling about this type of abuse. I never will. So... I am sure not going to tell anyone how to feel, or how deal with it.... or how those closest to them should feel or deal with it.

I would say that the world is much more supportive and aware of these issues than when I was a child of the 70s and 80s and that it is the 13 year olds (and 9 year olds and 17 year olds and 4 year olds....) who are going to, hopefully, grow up as allies and not be trying to learn/catch up as a middle aged person.

That said.. . I get what you're trying to say. I just feel that approach is mostly proven not to work. But, then again, what the hell do I know...

Edited March 25, 2022 by Onelessstar

[GasPed]

25 minutes ago, Obinna said:

I think the issue is that people are jerks and like saying hateful shit, especially behind a computer screen. And what's the best way to deal with a jerk? Just ignore them.

"The best way to end racism is to stop talking about it" (Morgan Freeman)

This probably isn't the forum to have an in-depth discussion about this, and I know there are many diverse views out there, but I will say that in my own experience as an ethnic minority, Mr. Freeman's advice has been the only strategy I've observed that's worked.  No, it doesn't work instantly, nor does it work in all cases.  But, in my experience, it has been far more effective than the other approach (i.e. confrontation, call-outs, retribution).  Imho. 

[Addona]

6 hours ago, Approve My Account Pls said:

Not sure if there's time, but I think it would be a great gesture from the V's to have a support of MAK either through banner or even a simple chant in the south end...

Criticize the decision leading to the red card sure, but never want to see any of these guys get racial abuse - or any abuse - that extends beyond purely football 

I was just going to post essentially the same comment!  We need to show our support for MAK.  He made a mistake ... it happens.  The response is absurd, and those involved are cowards who should be ashamed of themselves!

If MAK is reading this, we love you like a brother, and thank you for everything that you've given to our national team.