PaulV Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 (edited) Definitely a hybrid model with elements of both and definitely not the MLS. Seems very similar to a traditional North American model like the NHL or CFL. Things like broadcasting, sponsorships, uniforms etc. are central (and some scouting and draft too apparently). Expansion fee (or, franchise fee, if you prefer) to join the party. Edited January 10, 2020 by PaulV Rattler280 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ams1984 Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 10 hours ago, JamboAl said: I think this is probably where I can't tell the difference. Aren't the owners of the teams in the traditional North American leagues distinct entities? I can distinguish in the MLS model where the players are "owned" by the league and assigned to the teams (in a way), except for homegrown talent like Davies. But aren't the individual owners of the MLS teams not also distinct entities? Fundamentally, I can't tell what makes the CPL teams not franchises or what doesn't make MLS teams, clubs. I feel like the 6 year old kid who is always asking why? Think of it this way: clubs are distinct corporate entities that are members of a league. I think some people get hung up on the expansion fee. In the CPL’s case, it seems to be that the ‘expansion fee’ could be clubs buying their shares of CSB (actually sharing ownership of a distinct corporation which is in charge of their collective media negotiating) but they appear to be separate juridic entities, clubs. On the other hand, franchises (while leased by different entities, like MLSE) are licensees of the league. If I own a Tim Hortons franchise, what I actually own is XYZ Holdings Corp which leases a license to operate a Tim Hortons location for a period of time. JamboAl and IAmPappy 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ruffian Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 The definitions of franchise versus club teams are not clearly defined. If there has to be scale scale of club <----------> franchise then it seems CPL is further to the club side than franchise side compared to MLS based on the little info we have. No league in the world is likely completely on the club side (according to this made up scale) as then they would not have any financial reasons to play against each other. BuzzAndSting 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BradMack Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 I’m not sure it really matters if the teams are called clubs or franchises... the important thing is how they feel... and to me they feel incredibly different to the corporate feel mls gives out. Having Rob Gale come out in an interview and be so honest about player contracts, and laughing at the idea FC Edmonton signs Bustos.... and then doubling down and essentially calling LBG an average player that they have a few of already.... is so different. That wouldn’t happen in MLS. It feels real. Not to mention both Gale and Bobby have come out and talked about moving players onto better leagues in the past few days instead of playing dumb and acting like they’re on par with Europe. The league is doing a good job of letting the teams sort of do their own thing while keeping the business in order... while I’d definitely like more transparency, right now things are going pretty well. CanadaFan123, Kadenge, Winnipeg Fury and 7 others 7 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanadaFan123 Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 Agreed with @BradMack - there is just something so raw about the league. It's like true lower league football and everyone is open and hoenst about their position. No one is trying to pretend that this is top-tier football where you need to pay EPL prices like in MLS. IAmPappy, gator, Winnipeg Fury and 1 other 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IAmPappy Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 4 hours ago, Ozzie_the_parrot said: Learn some manners, if you want a conversation. Dear Mr Parrot, At your earliest convenience, would you please share with us your brief view on what differentiates a club model from a franchise model. Thank you in advance. gator, Ams1984, Viruk42 and 6 others 3 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shermanator Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 (edited) 4 hours ago, Ozzie_the_parrot said: Learn some manners, if you want a conversation. Counterpoint. Go f.uck yourself. Edited January 10, 2020 by shermanator longlugan, Bison44, Lofty and 11 others 3 3 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ansem Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 @Ozzie_the_parrot=Joke Account Sorry...couldn't resist. Would love to see this in the stands 🤣 T_Bison, deschamp86 and Bbeto 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamboAl Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 3 hours ago, BradMack said: I’m not sure it really matters if the teams are called clubs or franchises... the important thing is how they feel... and to me they feel incredibly different to the corporate feel mls gives out. Having Rob Gale come out in an interview and be so honest about player contracts, and laughing at the idea FC Edmonton signs Bustos.... and then doubling down and essentially calling LBG an average player that they have a few of already.... is so different. That wouldn’t happen in MLS. It feels real. Not to mention both Gale and Bobby have come out and talked about moving players onto better leagues in the past few days instead of playing dumb and acting like they’re on par with Europe. The league is doing a good job of letting the teams sort of do their own thing while keeping the business in order... while I’d definitely like more transparency, right now things are going pretty well. Agreed as it's all about perspective. It just seems like some people on this board are using the "franchise" vs "club" tag to the CPL teams to differentiate themselves from the MLS/USL when in fact, as I have now concluded, this point or description has no real relevance. Personally, I'll exit the discussion. Ozzie_the_parrot 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m-g-williams Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 Ams1984, The Real Marc, Lofty and 11 others 4 10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kent Posted January 11, 2020 Share Posted January 11, 2020 So to summarize the last couple pages, there is no new info about a possible Ottawa team in CPL. sloth8, baulderdash77, IAmPappy and 10 others 4 2 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ansem Posted January 13, 2020 Share Posted January 13, 2020 Where are my naysayers? 9M is pure robbery Rattler280, IAmPappy and BuzzAndSting 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rattler280 Posted January 13, 2020 Share Posted January 13, 2020 I think I'll hold off on the excitement until something actually happens beyond rumours of a mystery group being interested and Ottawa "leading the pack." Greatest Cockney Rip Off 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winnipeg Fury Posted January 13, 2020 Share Posted January 13, 2020 16 minutes ago, Rattler280 said: I think I'll hold off on the excitement until something actually happens beyond rumours of a mystery group being interested and Ottawa "leading the pack." As encouraging as it sounds, you are absolutely correct. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamboAl Posted January 13, 2020 Share Posted January 13, 2020 1 hour ago, Ansem said: Where are my naysayers? 9M is pure robbery Before you get too cocky, let’s see what happens about whether any group winds up actually paying $9M. I still personally think that fee is preposterous. Lofty 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ansem Posted January 13, 2020 Share Posted January 13, 2020 14 minutes ago, JamboAl said: Before you get too cocky, let’s see what happens about whether any group winds up actually paying $9M. I still personally think that fee is preposterous. Ottawa attracting investors is really a no brainer as it's the biggest market with no pro clubs in Canada right now. The stadium is there and available for use. As for the $9M expansion fee, it's accurate especially if OneSoccer increases their portfolio (they will bid on MLS & and got all CONCACAF tournaments). Teams can turn around and make even more money on sponsors. I mean, we're hearing places like St.John's, Saskatoon, Moncton etc... Ottawa, having more potential fans and the marketability of the city over the other markets is a huge incentive for investors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big_M Posted January 13, 2020 Share Posted January 13, 2020 Ottawa should be #8..stadium in place with good population and history of pro soccer..an investor and staff and they are ready to go Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamboAl Posted January 13, 2020 Share Posted January 13, 2020 (edited) 6 minutes ago, Ansem said: Ottawa attracting investors is really a no brainer as it's the biggest market with no pro clubs in Canada right now. The stadium is there and available for use. As for the $9M expansion fee, it's accurate especially if OneSoccer increases their portfolio (they will bid on MLS & and got all CONCACAF tournaments). Teams can turn around and make even more money on sponsors. I mean, we're hearing places like St.John's, Saskatoon, Moncton etc... Ottawa, having more potential fans and the marketability of the city over the other markets is a huge incentive for investors. I agree with most of your points about the market. My problem is that this is only Year Two of the league and to have that high of a valuation seems crazy - that's probably due to my estimate of what One Soccer's (CSB's) actual financial backing is worth. $9M is a very high (too high) for the vast majority of potential Canadian markets which means the CPL can be no more than about 9-10 teams. Edited January 13, 2020 by JamboAl Rattler280 and Lofty 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ansem Posted January 13, 2020 Share Posted January 13, 2020 8 minutes ago, JamboAl said: I agree with most of your points about the market. My problem is that this is only Year Two of the league and to have that high of a valuation seems crazy - that's probably due to my estimate of what One Soccer's (CSB's) actual financial backing is worth. $9M is a very high (too high) for the vast majority of potential Canadian markets which means the CPL can be no more than about 9-10 teams. Every league inflate their valuations. Are we really to believe that FC Cincinnati is worth more than say Serie A Fiorentina? No F'N way. This is whole debate is pointless as valuation is really subjective. As I pointed out before, as long as people are willing to pay it, forget about CPL lowering the fee. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamboAl Posted January 13, 2020 Share Posted January 13, 2020 11 minutes ago, Ansem said: Every league inflate their valuations. Are we really to believe that FC Cincinnati is worth more than say Serie A Fiorentina? No F'N way. This is whole debate is pointless as valuation is really subjective. As I pointed out before, as long as people are willing to pay it, forget about CPL lowering the fee. And how many people got duped into investing into Bre-X? Or the more recent IPO for WeWork? And what happened to the financial doping that Scottish football was on when Setanta was found out to be an unsustainable business model? I don't want One Soccer being the sole basis for the existence of the CPL. If someone is willing to pay $9 M for a CPL franchise in Moncton or Saskatoon (let alone Ottawa) in 2021, that makes me much less positive about the future of the league. grande and Lofty 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ansem Posted January 13, 2020 Share Posted January 13, 2020 26 minutes ago, JamboAl said: And how many people got duped into investing into Bre-X? Or the more recent IPO for WeWork? And what happened to the financial doping that Scottish football was on when Setanta was found out to be an unsustainable business model? I don't want One Soccer being the sole basis for the existence of the CPL. If someone is willing to pay $9 M for a CPL franchise in Moncton or Saskatoon (let alone Ottawa) in 2021, that makes me much less positive about the future of the league. ok Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ozzie_the_parrot Posted January 13, 2020 Share Posted January 13, 2020 27 minutes ago, JamboAl said: ... And what happened to the financial doping that Scottish football was on when Setanta was found out to be an unsustainable business model? ... That will be very obscure for a few people on here. ITV digital and the Football league in England is another one: https://www.thelondoneconomic.com/sport/remembering-when-itv-digital-collapsed/08/12/ It's not clear at this point how much money CanPL is actually getting in cash each season from the Onescoccer deal. The subscriptions for season tickets move suggests there may be minimum targets on subscriptions that have to be met. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuzzAndSting Posted January 13, 2020 Share Posted January 13, 2020 25 minutes ago, Ozzie_the_parrot said: The subscriptions for season tickets move suggests there may be minimum targets on subscriptions that have to be met. No it doesn't. It's possible but it doesn't suggest that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rintaran Posted January 13, 2020 Share Posted January 13, 2020 Because silly season isn't silly enough: Personally, I think it's pretty late to put a team in place for 2020, but anything could happen I guess. Ams1984, Ansem and dyslexic nam 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bison44 Posted January 13, 2020 Share Posted January 13, 2020 Wasnt Jakubec a mouthpiece for the Fury?? Hmmmm, the plot thickens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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