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lazlo_80

CPL new teams speculation

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1 hour ago, Bison44 said:

That link to the Bunbury interview is from mid Jan and the article is from end of April.    Who knows whats changed since then?  

We know he had to sign a non-disclosure agreement (NDA). ;)

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15 hours ago, Initial B said:

I was just reading in another thread how WestJet is providing transportation options for the CPL. If we narrow down prospective cities to match those that WestJet flies to, then teams can be drawn from a prospective pool of:

East: St John's, Gander, Corner Brook, Sydney, Halifax, Charlottetown,  Moncton, Fredericton, Quebec City, Montreal.

Central: Ottawa, Toronto, Hamilton, Kitchener-Waterloo, London, Windsor, Thunder Bay, Winnipeg, Brandon.

West: Regina, Saskatoon, Calgary, Edmonton, Grand Prairie, Fort McMurray, Kamloops, Kelowna, Penticton, Abbotsford, Prince George, Fort St John, Vancouver, Victoria, Nanaimo, Whitehorse(!), Yellowknife(!)

Notice there is no Saint John, NB. Still, that is 36 towns that WestJet flies to - enough for a Div1 and possibly Div2 setup.

WestJet also has direct flights to Barcelona now--if Catalonia separates we might need another league to play in.

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On 6/18/2019 at 5:17 PM, Gopherbashi said:

I can't wait for the CatPL.

 I use .ca and .cat sites, and frequently put the wrong one in going fast and get weird results. 

I loved it when some of the more partisan Catalans wanted their own Olympic Committee, rejecting the Spanish OC, and there were literally stickers out there saying "we want COC"

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7 hours ago, Unnamed Trialist said:

 I use .ca and .cat sites, and frequently put the wrong one in going fast and get weird results. 

I loved it when some of the more partisan Catalans wanted their own Olympic Committee, rejecting the Spanish OC, and there were literally stickers out there saying "we want COC"

Reminds me of this one time I started getting ads on Facebook to join some Albanian Socialist group.

To this day, I still have no idea how I got lumped into that demographic.

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On 5/30/2019 at 2:44 PM, Initial B said:

I've been doing some thinking about how to implement a regional 2nd division in CPL and the problem I come across is that I don't think there are enough teams out west to do it. They can't even get a regional 3 division off the ground in BC or Alberta, they have to join USL2. Ontario and Quebec seem to have the majority of the I'm wondering if the plan is to build the footprint of soccer clubs out west (say 7 teams) in a 16-club CPL. The remaining teams will be in Ontario and parts east. I could see a second division solely comprised of eastern teams. If they institute pro-rel, only the eastern teams would be considered for relegation because if a western team was relegated, that would be a death sentence due to the loss of media revenue and ballooning travel costs. This asymmetrical format would have to continue until they get enough western teams to make it's own regional Div2, which might take 2 decades.

Let's get a few years of stable Div 1 football before we worry about D2.

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On 6/3/2019 at 8:42 PM, lazlo_80 said:

Just curious, how many teams do people here believe will be in the CPL by the time we host the World Cup?

People aren't expecting full first and second division within 7 years are they?

We need to stop fixating on certain numbers, or certain cities, or certain rivalry possibilities. The ONLY thing that matters is financial stability. It is okay to only add one team every four years if that is what is necessary to create a stable, long-lasting, viable league. Take note of the CFL's 1990s United States Expansion project and then do the exact opposite.

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1 hour ago, YEG Round Baller said:

We need to stop fixating on certain numbers, or certain cities, or certain rivalry possibilities. The ONLY thing that matters is financial stability. It is okay to only add one team every four years if that is what is necessary to create a stable, long-lasting, viable league. Take note of the CFL's 1990s United States Expansion project and then do the exact opposite.

It was just a fun question to stir up some debate. of course everyone wants the league to be stable, it's just interesting to get people's takes on how aggressive or not they think the league will be with adding new teams.

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1 hour ago, lazlo_80 said:

It was just a fun question to stir up some debate. of course everyone wants the league to be stable, it's just interesting to get people's takes on how aggressive or not they think the league will be with adding new teams.

I think they will be aggressive until about 12 teams, then start planning D2:

Phase 1: Quebec City (Dynamo de Quebec?), Ottawa & Saskatoon coming aboard, then a couple more in the GTA (probably off the bones of a couple of the bigger L1O teams) - eta: 2022

Phase 2: Merge PLSQ & L1O into Can2E (CanPL2 - East), start western league (Can2W) with T-Bay Chill, WSA, Foothills & all. - eta 2026

Phase 3: Start pro/rel with pulling the top 4 teams from Can2 into CanPL in the first year with west & east divisions. Bottom ranked in each division goes down to their respective areas while the winner comes up. eta: 2032

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32 minutes ago, T_Bison said:

I think they will be aggressive until about 12 teams, then start planning D2:

Phase 1: Quebec City (Dynamo de Quebec?), Ottawa & Saskatoon coming aboard, then a couple more in the GTA (probably off the bones of a couple of the bigger L1O teams) - eta: 2022

Phase 2: Merge PLSQ & L1O into Can2E (CanPL2 - East), start western league (Can2W) with T-Bay Chill, WSA, Foothills & all. - eta 2026

Phase 3: Start pro/rel with pulling the top 4 teams from Can2 into CanPL in the first year with west & east divisions. Bottom ranked in each division goes down to their respective areas while the winner comes up. eta: 2032

What happened to Laval?

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Alex Bunbury's last newspaper article interview seemed to emphasize Quebec City as being the main target city in Quebec.

All the way through most people on here have greatly underestimated how difficult it is to put a suitable investor and a viable stadium solution together in any particular market. Their ability to put some decent soccer teams together on a budget with mainly younger and less experienced Canadian players means the league should be in good shape. Being this far along with only one questionable looking market is a considerable achievement and should drive a slow but steady rate of future expansion.  

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2 hours ago, Ozzie_the_parrot said:

Alex Bunbury's last newspaper article interview seemed to emphasize Quebec City as being the main target city in Quebec.

All the way through most people on here have greatly underestimated how difficult it is to put a suitable investor and a viable stadium solution together in any particular market. Their ability to put some decent soccer teams together on a budget with mainly younger and less experienced Canadian players means the league should be in good shape. Being this far along with only one questionable looking market is a considerable achievement and should drive a slow but steady rate of future expansion.  

While you are correct in saying only one questionable looking market, I really think it's too early to say one way or another about York9 (I assume that's the one you meant). At the end of a couple of years then we can start to worry I think.

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What I tend to point out where York 9 is concerned is that lower budget coast-to-coast level pro soccer in Toronto usually finds a way to keep going season after season even when actual attendance at games is usually in three digits as was the case with the CSL and APSL era Blizzard and Rockets, and subsequently with the Lynx. There is usually somebody around who is willing to squander some of their wealth on a pro soccer team and doesn't view the team as an investment. Having said that, they clearly need to do something radically different to turn things around in terms of spectator interest. More of the same is likely to lead to the same outcome. 

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23 hours ago, T_Bison said:

I think they will be aggressive until about 12 teams, then start planning D2:

Phase 1: Quebec City (Dynamo de Quebec?), Ottawa & Saskatoon coming aboard, then a couple more in the GTA (probably off the bones of a couple of the bigger L1O teams) - eta: 2022

Phase 2: Merge PLSQ & L1O into Can2E (CanPL2 - East), start western league (Can2W) with T-Bay Chill, WSA, Foothills & all. - eta 2026

Phase 3: Start pro/rel with pulling the top 4 teams from Can2 into CanPL in the first year with west & east divisions. Bottom ranked in each division goes down to their respective areas while the winner comes up. eta: 2032

I can agree with the spirit of your plan, but I foresee the following path:

  • The CanPL will be aggressive about expanding to 10 clubs before focusing on building the regional leagues as incubators for future potential CanPL clubs
  • There will be three Regional leagues instead of two, which would mirror the structure of Canadian Junior Hockey, with no inter-regional games.
  • the Regional leagues will be based around L1O, PLSQ, and a new Western Regional League incorporating eligible clubs from the PCSL and PDL.
  • As the regional clubs mature, the CanPL will invite those clubs that meet the Div 1 standards to join the national league, similar to what seems to be going on between MLS and USL in America.

Once the CanPL reaches 16 teams and there is sufficient pressure from the Regional leagues, they may start implementing Pro-Rel.  But more likely I expect they'll have an annual draft of Regional players to join CanPL clubs to replace CanPL players that were sold on to other leagues. CanPL clubs will have to pay transfer fees to the Regional clubs they draft the players from. The Regional leagues will morph into U-20 leagues, much like Canadian Junior Hockey is now, with graduating players moving up the ladder instead of clubs. Likewise, players from the development leagues like the OPDL and SAAC will be drafted into the Regional leagues, with payments being made to those smaller clubs as well.

So in about 20 years I could see CanPL being the top Canadian league, with L1O, PLSQ, and Western Canada Soccer League supporting it from below developing the U20-U17 players. And below that are the provincial elite player development leagues developing the U16-U13 players. And at the lowest level there would be the local elite programs for the U12-U8 players with festivals showcasing their talent.

Edited by Initial B

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1 hour ago, Initial B said:

Once the CanPL reaches 16 teams and there is sufficient pressure from the Regional leagues, they may start implementing Pro-Rel. 

So what you are implying here is that the CPL will only go to 16 teams.  I talked to my "coach on the Montreal South Shore" (name and city withheld by request) and he said the CPL should just get to 16 teams and that is it. ie a closed league,  I also suggested to him that there should be a Division A and Division B just like this article:

https://www.theroar.com.au/2018/05/17/leagues-promotion-relegation-solution-needs-unique-australia/

Like Down Under, Canada is unique so we need a creative solution.   FWIW the coach liked the idea of Division A and Division B.

https://www.ffa.com.au/news/australian-football-working-towards-national-second-division-2021

Of interest also, Australia's plan for National Second Division.

I have talked to other people re CPL and some think it could goto 24 teams maybe 12 in D1 and 12 in D2.

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On 6/26/2019 at 1:43 PM, narduch said:

My prediction is that we will never see promotion/relegation.

You’re probably right. I do hope they continue with the acquisition/creation of  L1O style leagues across the country. A series of regional second divisions would be cool. 

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I can't see pro/rel coming within the forseeable future. 99% of Canadian sports fans have no idea what that is. 60-70% of Canadian CASUAL soccer fans have little idea what that is. We will have to have an established, highly stable CPL alongside a fairly well-established and reasonably stable D2 for some years before even thinking of pro-rel.

"What? --Our City's-- soccer team has been kicked out of the league?" Can you imagine the education required for any local market's fanbase, especially the corporate ticket-holders, as well as the sponsors?

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40 minutes ago, YEG Round Baller said:

99% of Canadian sports fans have no idea what that is. 60-70% of Canadian CASUAL soccer fans have little idea what that is.

Since when have we become Americans? :rolleyes:

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54 minutes ago, YEG Round Baller said:

I can't see pro/rel coming within the forseeable future. 99% of Canadian sports fans have no idea what that is. 60-70% of Canadian CASUAL soccer fans have little idea what that is.

That’s not true at all.

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