CONCACAF U-20 Championship (November 2018)

[harrycoyster]

Wasn't able to watch the game. Would you guys say we outplayed them?

[Shortdutchcanuck]

9 minutes ago, LeoH037 said:

CPL? Sorry but we should hope they aim higher than that... much higher

I don't think he meant long-term.  The top 5 or 6 may already be beyond CanPL but at 18 or 19 the rest would certainly benefit from a year of solid playing time in their home country when the MLS teams are unlikely to be giving them regular minutes yet.

[gator]

1 minute ago, Shortdutchcanuck said:

I don't think he meant long-term.  The top 5 or 6 may already be beyond CanPL but at 18 or 19 the rest would certainly benefit from a year of solid playing time in their home country when the MLS teams are unlikely to be giving them regular minutes yet.

Thanks for explaining what I was going to post!?

[toontownman]

Certainly wasn't for the want of trying from our players. They all put in a shift. Impressed with Bayiha when he came on especially. Panama players wanted it more early on though and it paid.

Okello is the midfield Doneil Henry, when he is on he is on and has all the tools to be a major player for us. 

We are really lacking the quality in defence which is no surprise to anyone. We had two CB's with good attributes but they are still a bit of where we need, even for this level. All youth efforts need to go towards unearthing some quality CB's or praying some of ours mature way past their current trajectory. 

 

[Shortdutchcanuck]

31 minutes ago, Obinna said:

I assume by "more" guys you mean "different" guys.

And by different guys, you mean Davies, Millar, Tabla, and David.

The latter two would have probably been held back by their clubs anyways. Davies and Millar may have been allowed to join, especially Millar.

Davies though, I still imagine Bayern would have influenced him not to play in this. Just hard to imagine that ever of happening.

This.  Davies may have even have been the only one released and having seen some of the reffing and tackling by opponents I'm glad he wasn't here.  I'd say Phonzie getting off to a good start and making an impact with the first team at Bayern might have an even  greater positive development on soccer development and visibility in this country than qualifying for the u20 World Cup would have had.

[Shortdutchcanuck]

9 minutes ago, gator said:

Thanks for explaining what I was going to post!?

What is it they say, mediocre minds think alike or something along those lines? ?

[1996]

15 minutes ago, Shortdutchcanuck said:

This.  Davies may have even have been the only one released and having seen some of the reffing and tackling by opponents I'm glad he wasn't here.  I'd say Phonzie getting off to a good start and making an impact with the first team at Bayern might have an even  greater positive development on soccer development and visibility in this country than qualifying for the u20 World Cup would have had.

Don’t worry always think positive in about 100 years we Canada will be a power house ! 

[1996]

32 minutes ago, harrycoyster said:

Wasn't able to watch the game. Would you guys say we outplayed them?

Same shit different tournament!

[1996]

54 minutes ago, SirBobsaget said:

2mins extra time in the 1st. Only 4 despite all the time wasting in the 2nd.

 

This is why this fucking sport that we all invest so much time in needs to bloody change for fucks sake ! Bring in a bloody time clock and stop the time whenever there is an injury, a goal is scored, on goal kicks , free kicks, corner kicks and ya even throw ins and there you go time waisting is gone ! 

[Kent]

2 hours ago, C2SKI said:

Could the same not be said for the senior team?

No. Nations League A isn’t the holy grail for the CMNT, but the U20 World Cup is the holy grail of youth soccer. If the CMNT had a make or break WCQ then sure, but that’s not what our November game is.

Plus the drop off from Davies to Hoilett, for example, isn’t as big as the drop off from Davies to whoever is playing the wing for the U20’s. Or from David to Larin rather than David to Bair.

This idea that some people have that we should be able to qualify despite handicapping ourselves is ridiculous. Yes, USA can do it, but we aren’t the USA. And Trinidad isn’t Panama for that matter. Why don’t we wait until qualifying is routine before we get so cocky that we leave out players that are head and shoulders above the rest of our U20 team.

[harrycoyster]

4 minutes ago, Kent said:

This idea that some people have that we should be able to qualify despite handicapping ourselves is ridiculous. Yes, USA can do it, but we aren’t the USA. And Trinidad isn’t Panama for that matter.

Mexico is tied with Jamaica right now despite bringing almost a completely first team roster. Can't underestimate the size & speed of these athletic CONCACAF countries.

[Zem]

12 minutes ago, Kent said:

No. Nations League A isn’t the holy grail for the CMNT, but the U20 World Cup is the holy grail of youth soccer. If the CMNT had a make or break WCQ then sure, but that’s not what our November game is.

Except youth soccer isn't remotely as important as senior team soccer, and we should never be handicapping the senior team regardless what tournament the youth teams are playing in. U20 tourneys are essentially just an exhibition for young players, while every Nations League game has long-term consequences.

"Holy grail" or not, making League A is obviously far more important for us making the next World Cup than qualifying for an U20 World Cup is.

[Gian-Luca]

2 hours ago, harrycoyster said:

Wasn't able to watch the game. Would you guys say we outplayed them?

It was pretty much a stalemate until the red card in the 24th minute. After that it is tougher to judge given the disadvantage. Panama hit the post a couple of times but both goals came off mistakes at the back. Gave up a goal 2 min into 1st half injury time and very quickly after we tied it, which are not the greatest signs of mental strength. Great goal to temporarily tied it. Who know what would have happened without the early red though.

[Gian-Luca]

I feel better about this game from a TFC fan perspective than a CMNT fan - I thought Okello, Dunn and Peruzza all looked great. Okello really covers a lot of ground and  can't argue with 3 goals and 1 assist from a d-mid. 

 

[SpursFlu]

I thought it was a shame because even down i felt as the game went on we were the better team. 

[aloyol]

1 hour ago, harrycoyster said:

Mexico is tied with Jamaica right now despite bringing almost a completely first team roster. Can't underestimate the size & speed of these athletic CONCACAF countries.

Mexico - Jamaica ended 2-2. So group B will most likely be decided by goal differential.

 

[ray]

9 hours ago, Kent said:

No. Nations League A isn’t the holy grail for the CMNT, but the U20 World Cup is the holy grail of youth soccer. If the CMNT had a make or break WCQ then sure, but that’s not what our November game is.

Plus the drop off from Davies to Hoilett, for example, isn’t as big as the drop off from Davies to whoever is playing the wing for the U20’s. Or from David to Larin rather than David to Bair.

This idea that some people have that we should be able to qualify despite handicapping ourselves is ridiculous. Yes, USA can do it, but we aren’t the USA. And Trinidad isn’t Panama for that matter. Why don’t we wait until qualifying is routine before we get so cocky that we leave out players that are head and shoulders above the rest of our U20 team.

Yes.  If several of our best youth (maybe best ever youth) aren't available due to club commitments, so be it.  However, the end result is a forgone conclusion.

[MtlMario]

Why go into any tournament without trying to win with your best possible players? Everything you do should be done the best possible, not only in sports but life in general. That's my take.

[El Hombre]

6 minutes ago, MtlMario said:

Why go into any tournament without trying to win with your best possible players? Everything you do should be done the best possible, not only in sports but life in general. That's my take.

You're absolutely right.  Why did the CSA convince Liverpool to refuse to release Millar?  Makes no sense!

[michaeltfc91]

No matter what the excuse is or why it happened, not qualifying for a World Cup tournament is embarrassing for this country. Haven't qualified for the U-20 tournament since 2007 (6 tournaments) and the U-17 since 2013 (2 tournaments so far) is absurd. 

Qualifying for these tournaments is bigger than doing well in a Gold Cup or making it into Nations League in my opinion. World Cup is bread and butter and we fail to qualify every time, no matter how good we think our team is on paper no one will care unless we make tournaments 

[deschamp86]

9 minutes ago, michaeltfc91 said:

Haven't qualified for the U-20 tournament since 2007 (6 tournaments)

Canada automatically qualified in 2007. So they haven't earned a spot since 2005, so its actually even worse than you make it sound

[Kadenge]

How many times do we need to get burned by playing a slow CB against teams with speedy forwards before we get it right? My earlier comments about Cdn MLS teams investing in their academies but not improving the quality of their product still stands. Having coached boys youth soccer 8-11 yrs, there is an incredible amount  of talent in just the GTA. Harsh to judge players from 1 or 2 games but the 2 CBS, other than Dunn who I thought played well, did not appear to have the athletic ability to play at this level and both are with an  MLS academy. I know that we were missing our best U20 players but CDN MLS youth players should have an edge against teams like Panama.... It's hard to imagine that their soccer infrastructure is superior to MLS. Which means either MLS academies are not selecting the right players or not properly developing them. Our result yesterday was more than just the red card.

 

[Guest]

12 hours ago, Kent said:

No. Nations League A isn’t the holy grail for the CMNT, but the U20 World Cup is the holy grail of youth soccer. If the CMNT had a make or break WCQ then sure, but that’s not what our November game is.

Honestly I feel like Fonzie and co could have played in this u20 qualifying tournament if they were allowed, but when the time came I would prefer they played in the Gold Cup rather the the u20 World Cup.

If they had gotten Canada there and into the spotlight that would have been great. Although I recognize the chance that they perform poorly without our best youth players, I would rather we be there at the u20 tournament than not be there at all.

Edited November 7, 2018 by Guest

[red card]

1 hour ago, michaeltfc91 said:

No matter what the excuse is or why it happened, not qualifying for a World Cup tournament is embarrassing for this country. Haven't qualified for the U-20 tournament since 2007 (6 tournaments) and the U-17 since 2013 (2 tournaments so far) is absurd. 

Qualifying for these tournaments is bigger than doing well in a Gold Cup or making it into Nations League in my opinion. World Cup is bread and butter and we fail to qualify every time, no matter how good we think our team is on paper no one will care unless we make tournaments 

Not qualifying all these years is embarrassing for Canada especially since as someone put it succinctly "same shit, different tournament". 

But from a global perspective, u20 World Cup isn't a big deal. Teams often don't release players especially if they're starters. Winning or being in the final does not mean the senior team will also do well. Matches are played in half empty stadiums ex home team. Media coverage is overshadowed by club football. Possible time zone difference means less people watching than Gold Cup. It's going to end in tears anyway as Canada isn't getting out of the group stage.

It can be of benefit to individual players to get some exposure. But historically, Canadian players haven't grasped onto the opportunities given to them ex players like Hutchinson and Hume.

[dyslexic nam]

I think someone mentioned something like this a while back, but just for a bit of context:

France won the U20 WC in 2013.  Their squad included Pogba, who was capped in the senior side in March of 2013 and then played in the U20 tournament later that year. 

Brazil won in 2011.  Their squad featured Coutinho, who had his first senior cap in October of 2010, and then played in the youth tournament in 2011. 

Argentine won in 2007.  Aguero was part of their team.  His first senior cap was in Sept 2006, and he then played in the U20 tourney a year later.

These are top teams, playing world class players (who were already capped with their senior sides) in the U20 tournament.