Canadian Dual Nationals 2.0 Edition, Chase for the 5 stars

[WestHamCanadianinOxford]

2 minutes ago, VinceA said:

It was the rule change from 2019 that people were talking about, so it doesn't affect us.

Which rule change in 2019?

[dyslexic nam]

Me:  

“I am done caring about these guys until they commit” 

 

Also me:  

Opens thread every time it has new comments.  

[Bigandy]

12 minutes ago, Obinna said:

What's the deal with Tomori? I saw something about a rule change making him eligible again, so long as he didn't play against Ukraine (which he didn't do). 

My understanding is that ferguson is switching and has played 6 games under the age of 21. 3 are friendlies so do not count. Therefore its the same rules that allow him to switch. 3 games or less under 21. 

Tomori played a game over the age of 21. Thus, he is still ineligble. 

I dont believe theres been a rule change. Just a misunderstanding of rules by some fans 

[phresh]

11 minutes ago, Bigandy said:

My understanding is that ferguson is switching and has played 6 games under the age of 21. 3 are friendlies so do not count. Therefore its the same rules that allow him to switch. 3 games or less under 21. 

Tomori played a game over the age of 21. Thus, he is still ineligble. 

I dont believe theres been a rule change. Just a misunderstanding of rules by some fans 

I have not seen anything to indicate Ferguson is switching, Southgate has implied so himself. And friendlies do count. As per @rydermike's summary, a player can only play a max of three senior matches, official or friendly, to be eligible to switch

[WestHamCanadianinOxford]

53 minutes ago, Bigandy said:

My understanding is that ferguson is switching and has played 6 games under the age of 21. 3 are friendlies so do not count. Therefore its the same rules that allow him to switch. 3 games or less under 21. 

Tomori played a game over the age of 21. Thus, he is still ineligble. 

I dont believe theres been a rule change. Just a misunderstanding of rules by some fans 

 *Friendlies do count.  No more than 3 games played "whether in an official competition or non-official competition".  

*They count for number of games played but not the 21 age limit.

I covered it on the Tomori threat. thread.  (Edit: not sure if that was a mistake or not😉)

Edit:

Article saying that just to make sure I'm not crazy.

"Why Evan Ferguson cannot switch from Ireland to England"

https://theathletic.com/4837533/2023/09/07/evan-ferguson-england-ireland-fifa-nationality-change/

 

Edited September 13, 2023 by WestHamCanadianinOxford

[rydermike]

Yeah, friendlies count if they have one official match.

6 friendlies and 0 official = okay to switch

3 friendlies and 1 official = not okay to switch

[InglewoodJack]

1 hour ago, WestHamCanadianinOxford said:

 *Friendlies do count.  No more than 3 games played "whether in an official competition or non-official competition".  

*They count for number of games played but not the 21 age limit.

I covered it on the Tomori threat. thread.  (Edit: not sure if that was a mistake or not😉)

Edit:

Article saying that just to make sure I'm not crazy.

"Why Evan Ferguson cannot switch from Ireland to England"

https://theathletic.com/4837533/2023/09/07/evan-ferguson-england-ireland-fifa-nationality-change/

 

What's funny is I don't even know if the players themselves know how the rules work. Ferguson said something along the lines of "I can't switch, they wouldn't let me back home" ie he's not switching because he doesn't want to, not because he isn't eligible.

Glad to see Ireland win at least one of their guys.

[WestHamCanadianinOxford]

34 minutes ago, rydermike said:

Yeah, friendlies count if they have one official match.

6 friendlies and 0 official = okay to switch

3 friendlies and 1 official = not okay to switch

Yeah none of these rules (Article 9) are appicable to a player until (this from the commentary on it) "after they have participated (at least in part of a match) in an “official competition” for the representative team of an MA in any age category or kind of football."

[toontownman]

Either way isn't there a 3 year window in between caps or something? So he couldn't switch until June 11/12th 2025 anyway.

If he doesn't get another cap in that time for England I am sure he and his camp will be looking for every loophole possible lol. Maybe FIFA will have changed the rules again 😆

Edit...plus Nimmick will be captain of Real Madrid by then.

Edited September 14, 2023 by toontownman

[Kent]

On 9/13/2023 at 11:55 AM, Bigandy said:

Now that mitrovic is officially gone, I thought I'd make a list of current duals.

1. Jebbo
2. LDF
3. Koleosho
4. Costa
5. Farsi
6. Abzi 
7. Van eerden
8. Sigur
9. Sali
10. Flores ( i think hes still technically possible?)
11. Goodman
12. Odunze
13. Dias 
14. Davidson

Obviously some of these guys are prospects. We also have guys like smith that are pretty well committed to canada but are technically duals. 

Any obvious misses? 

Honest 2 part question. First, are these guys in your approximate best to worst order? Second question, are any of these guys good enough to walk on the team today? Based on merit I mean, not "worth throwing caps their way to tie them to Canada in case they are soon good enough to play. The guy I am most familiar with is Abzi, which I am a fan of and think he is pretty close. Jebbison is the guy I am second most familiar with but haven't actually watched a game, and I feel like he isn't at the level for a cap right now.

[dyslexic nam]

9 hours ago, Kent said:

Honest 2 part question. First, are these guys in your approximate best to worst order? Second question, are any of these guys good enough to walk on the team today? Based on merit I mean, not "worth throwing caps their way to tie them to Canada in case they are soon good enough to play. The guy I am most familiar with is Abzi, which I am a fan of and think he is pretty close. Jebbison is the guy I am second most familiar with but haven't actually watched a game, and I feel like he isn't at the level for a cap right now.

Koleosho has gotten multiple starts in the EPL so he easily has to be considered good enough to get into our team.  The only thing that could potentially keep him out of the starting 11 is the fact that he plays the same position as Davies, but I have no idea if he is versatile enough to play on the right wing.   If so, he make a pretty strong case to start over Tajon - and I say that as someone who had been a huge fan of Buchanan.  

And FWIW, Koleosho is the reason I don’t think these are in order of skill or potential.  As an 18 year old playing in the Premier League, he would  have to be considered the top prospect on the list by quite a margin.  

[Stoppage Time]

What has to be done to convince some of these guys to choose Canada? Is there some kind of deliberate campaign that could be incorporated? I recently met a 13 year old kid playing for a local soccer club who is born in Canada but already desperately wants to play for Croatia. Yes, his dad is is big on Croatia, but has lived in Canada for many years. How do we make the CMNT the dream? Is it even possible?

[MtlMario]

I think the only way possible to change that is to win consistently. I see the same thing here all the time unfortunately. Hopefully the next generation .

7 minutes ago, Stoppage Time said:

What has to be done to convince some of these guys to choose Canada? Is there some kind of deliberate campaign that could be incorporated? I recently met a 13 year old kid playing for a local soccer club who is born in Canada but already desperately wants to play for Croatia. Yes, his dad is is big on Croatia, but has lived in Canada for many years. How do we make the CMNT the dream? Is it even possible?

 

[dyslexic nam]

4 minutes ago, Stoppage Time said:

What has to be done to convince some of these guys to choose Canada? Is there some kind of deliberate campaign that could be incorporated? I recently met a 13 year old kid playing for a local soccer club who is born in Canada but already desperately wants to play for Croatia. Yes, his dad is is big on Croatia, but has lived in Canada for many years. How do we make the CMNT the dream? Is it even possible?

Continuing to accumulate positive results in international competition is about the only thing in my IMO. That will do multiple things:

- raise the profile of the sport/team in this country

- earn respect for our program from the international soccer community, which in turn will…

- effectively convince fence sitters that Canada is a team that can help them advance their club careers

- bring more money into the program, thereby allowing more opportunities 

There are more, but this shows the impact that on-field results have.   In the absence of that, all of these things are much more challenging.  

[Stoppage Time]

2 minutes ago, dyslexic nam said:

Continuing to accumulate positive results in international competition is about the only thing in my IMO. That will do multiple things:

- raise the profile of the sport/team in this country

- earn respect for our program from the international soccer community, which in turn will…

- effectively convince fence sitters that Canada is a team that can help them advance their club careers

- bring more money into the program, thereby allowing more opportunities 

There are more, but this shows the impact that on-field results have.   In the absence of that, all of these things are much more challenging.  

You nailed it with the money comment. We have seen so clearly how the lack of money in the CSA has hobbled our youth development of late. Development and exposure to clubs are so very important

I would also say that, based on the comments of others, scouting has to be improved and, perhaps regional age-based camps could be held a couple times per year with top kids called into a national camp. This could deepen the pool of "identified" younger players.

[TOcanadafan]

17 minutes ago, Stoppage Time said:

You nailed it with the money comment. We have seen so clearly how the lack of money in the CSA has hobbled our youth development of late. Development and exposure to clubs are so very important

I would also say that, based on the comments of others, scouting has to be improved and, perhaps regional age-based camps could be held a couple times per year with top kids called into a national camp. This could deepen the pool of "identified" younger players.

This is it.  The only way to combat the push from families with strong ties to their "motherland", is to have a vibrant National youth development program with frequent camps for all age groups.  Unfortunately we have no funds for this, so we'll always be in danger of losing future elite youth talent who have ethnic ties to bigger football nations overseas.

[Soro17]

48 minutes ago, Stoppage Time said:

What has to be done to convince some of these guys to choose Canada? Is there some kind of deliberate campaign that could be incorporated? I recently met a 13 year old kid playing for a local soccer club who is born in Canada but already desperately wants to play for Croatia. Yes, his dad is is big on Croatia, but has lived in Canada for many years. How do we make the CMNT the dream? Is it even possible?

Hey, we’ve got Walt Sedin(for now)! Daniel and Henrik Sedin were obviously essential players for Sweden for over a decade. This is the way. 

[Fullback]

The reality is that ex-Yugoslav countries (and many others) are very nationalistic/patriotic compared to Canada. A Croatian immigrant is going to raise their child to feel a strong connection to their heritage.  I'm not sure there's a lot we can do other than continue to get better as a soccer nation.

[Bigandy]

On 9/15/2023 at 8:46 PM, Kent said:

Honest 2 part question. First, are these guys in your approximate best to worst order? Second question, are any of these guys good enough to walk on the team today? Based on merit I mean, not "worth throwing caps their way to tie them to Canada in case they are soon good enough to play. The guy I am most familiar with is Abzi, which I am a fan of and think he is pretty close. Jebbison is the guy I am second most familiar with but haven't actually watched a game, and I feel like he isn't at the level for a cap right now.

Here is my order based on what I want for CMNT, not necessarily the highest ceiling. 

1. Koleosho
2. LDF
3. Jebbison
4. sigur
5. Sali
6. flores
7.Costa
8. Farsi
9. Abzi
10. van eerden
11. Goodman
12. Dias
13. Davidson
14. Odunze 

Based on merit, Koleosho would be our only starter. However, I think LDF, Jebbison, and sigur would make our A squad. There will obviously be debate about LDF inclusion but he looked comfortable starting preseason games for fulhams A team. I think that is at a higher level than a guy like kennedy. 
Farsi, Abzi, goodman flores and sali would all potentially make our gold cup squad "B or C" squad. 

Long term, I think kolo, LDF, Jebb, Sigur, Sali, Flores, Costa and dias are the only players with high enough ceilings to make our A squad at some point. 

[VinceA]

Sali is apparently signing with FC Dallas. Does he even want to play for Canada? I could swear there was some story on this board that he wasn't thrilled with Romania.

[Dominic94]

16 minutes ago, VinceA said:

Sali is apparently signing with FC Dallas. Does he even want to play for Canada? I could swear there was some story on this board that he wasn't thrilled with Romania.

Where did you see he’s with Dallas ?

He is going to switch back to Canada from what I’ve heard, I think Hagi was the big factor in his days with and in Romania, very powerful figure.

[VinceA]

https://www.gsp.ro/fotbal/liga-1/gica-hagi-enes-sali-transfer-farul-fc-dallas-711647.html This was posted on the MLS Subreddit.

[frmr]

10 minutes ago, Dominic94 said:

Where did you see he’s with Dallas ?

He is going to switch back to Canada from what I’ve heard, I think Hagi was the big factor in his days with and in Romania, very powerful figure.

Sauce?

[An Observer]

16 minutes ago, VinceA said:

https://www.gsp.ro/fotbal/liga-1/gica-hagi-enes-sali-transfer-farul-fc-dallas-711647.html This was posted on the MLS Subreddit.

I had forgotten how close to French that Romanian is. 

[VinceA]

9 minutes ago, An Observer said:

I had forgotten how close to French that Romanian is. 

As a Spanish speaker when I learned that Romanian is a latin language it blew my mind. I know why it is historically but at first glance it seems to random that a latin language exists surrounded by Greek and Slavic languages cut off from other latin based languages.