Ryan Telfer

[El Hombre]

15 hours ago, Obinna said:

Definitely agree with this. When did we get so good that we can just brush off the fact a player like Telfer may play elsewhere? I guess beating T&T in a closed door friendly was a game changer....

Again, nobody is saying Telfer is going to take us on his back to the world cup, but the nonchalant attitude of some in response to possibly losing him is coming off as a little overconfident.

I don't think anyone is brushing him off.  What I am saying is that maybe Pasquotti and Borges should potentially be capped first, based on talent alone.

You can only cap a finite number of players.  I put that number at 1, maybe 2, players per game.  I prefer using those opportunities to cap the best players available and not the ones that are non-committal about playing for Canada.

Also, there is a slight cognitive dissonance with your reasoning.  We are not so good that we can brush Telfer off, but we are good enough to throw away a position just to cap someone during a cap-able game.  Maybe during the Nations League, but even for those games we had to have our best XI on the field to run up the score.  B camps and friendlies do nothing (or very little) to keep players like this.

[Obinna]

2 hours ago, El Hombre said:

I don't think anyone is brushing him off.  What I am saying is that maybe Pasquotti and Borges should potentially be capped first, based on talent alone.

You can only cap a finite number of players.  I put that number at 1, maybe 2, players per game.  I prefer using those opportunities to cap the best players available and not the ones that are non-committal about playing for Canada.

Also, there is a slight cognitive dissonance with your reasoning.  We are not so good that we can brush Telfer off, but we are good enough to throw away a position just to cap someone during a cap-able game.  Maybe during the Nations League, but even for those games we had to have our best XI on the field to run up the score.  B camps and friendlies do nothing (or very little) to keep players like this.

I am not necessarily suggesting we cap him against Cuba, but I do think it is a shame he wasn't capped before this point.

Had he been capped without being tied last year, he still may be considering his options, but he would have to file a one-time switch at that point, making it more likely he sticks around.

[narduch]

On 8/22/2019 at 3:42 PM, Obinna said:

 

That is like Teal Bunbury "getting he word around" not to go with the USA because they are going to call you once or twice and never use you again...

Wait is that an actual thing that happened. 

I might stop hating him...

[Shortdutchcanuck]

 

Good luck to Ryan, he'll have a better chance playing regularly on the wing with T and T although I think there was still a good chance he might have been useful for us.

[Shway]

He should've been the replacement call up, and not Millar. 

Sadly another one is gone to our direct rivals. 

[king1010]

1 hour ago, Shway said:

He should've been the replacement call up, and not Millar. 

Sadly another one is gone to our direct rivals. 

I dont agree with this. Millar is 5 years younger, with a higher ceiling playing at a higher level currently. 

Telfer is just a victim of our deepening player pool. He's so far down the pecking order, he did what was best for his career. We only have so many spots. We harp on some of our other duel nationals playing 1 or 2 games for another country and wasting their international career, there is a strong possibility that is what would have happened to Telfer if he played for us. 

[Obinna]

1 hour ago, king1010 said:

I dont agree with this. Millar is 5 years younger, with a higher ceiling playing at a higher level currently. 

Telfer is just a victim of our deepening player pool. He's so far down the pecking order, he did what was best for his career. We only have so many spots. We harp on some of our other duel nationals playing 1 or 2 games for another country and wasting their international career, there is a strong possibility that is what would have happened to Telfer if he played for us. 

He was so far down the pecking order that he was actually on the bubble to make this roster...

Good luck to Telfer, but I hope he doesn't come back to sting us down the road. 

This one hurts. First ever goal scorer of the CPL goes on to play for T&T after being earmarked to play for Canada by our coaches. 

Fortunately, we are deep in many areas, but I want us to get deeper. I want our depth players to play for Canada, not elsewhere, and I definitely don't want the CPL to churn out internationals for other countries, who are eligible for Canada.

That's what just happened here. 

[Corazon]

I know there were some recent articles posted on what Herdman allegedly said about Telfer being one of the current CPL players under his radar.  The fact is that Telfer had committed to T&T at least a month ago when I brought it up.  That's based on the information I had, perhaps he had committed even earlier.

Perhaps Herdman caught wind of this and wanted to make sure to comment on the fact he's been in discussions before it was official.  Again from what I gathered he was committing to T&T but it did seem like he accepted the call after waiting for Canada. 

[Shway]

2 hours ago, king1010 said:

I dont agree with this. Millar is 5 years younger, with a higher ceiling playing at a higher level currently. 

Telfer is just a victim of our deepening player pool. He's so far down the pecking order, he did what was best for his career. We only have so many spots. We harp on some of our other duel nationals playing 1 or 2 games for another country and wasting their international career, there is a strong possibility that is what would have happened to Telfer if he played for us. 

Yes he is younger, but Millar needs to establish himself at the club level. Plain and simple. Liam, and Ballou are in the same boat of trying to solidify themselves with their big club tags still attached.

Ultimately for me it's always a question of who is most in form? 

If not Telfer, I would prefer Borges if your talking about age. Or if not Borges than Elva. 

A lot of confused faces, but I just don't get how some guys have an easy pass to the national team solely based on promise. It doesn't happen with other national teams, especially if our player pool is "so deep". 

Edited September 3, 2019 by Shway

[king1010]

47 minutes ago, Shway said:

Yes he is younger, but Millar needs to establish himself at the club level. Plain and simple. Liam, and Ballou are in the same boat of trying to solidify themselves with their big club tags still attached.

Ultimately for me it's always a question of who is most in form? 

If not Telfer, I would prefer Borges if your talking about age. Or if not Borges than Elva. 

A lot of confused faces, but I just don't get how some guys have an easy pass to the national team solely based on promise. It doesn't happen with other national teams, especially if our player pool is "so deep". 

 

There is a difference between establishing yourself at Barcelona and Liverpool vs York9. Would you be content if Millar and Tabla moved to the CPL and featured regularly, would that warrant a callup vs their current situations? 

Furthermore, Tabla has not been called up since his he hasn't featured regularly. Millar is playing regularly in the SPL. 

Who is getting an easy pass? Surely not Millar as he has been a regular feature in the SPL, lets also not forget Millar wasn't even in the first 23, rather a replacement. For this cycle the person who was called and given an easy pass was Straith based on his past body of work with the NT. 

Edited September 3, 2019 by king1010

[jordan]

25 minutes ago, Shway said:

Yes he is younger, but Millar needs to establish himself at the club level. Plain and simple. Liam, and Ballou are in the same boat of trying to solidify themselves with their big club tags still attached.

Ultimately for me it's always a question of who is most in form? 

If not Telfer, I would prefer Borges if your talking about age. Or if not Borges than Elva. 

A lot of confused faces, but I just don't get how some guys have an easy pass to the national team solely based on promise. It doesn't happen with other national teams, especially if our player pool is "so deep". 

People will have different opinions so you can't be surprised at the reaction of confused faces. 

But I fully agree with Liam being ahead of Ryan, and as for establishing him self at club level, I feel going on loan in the first week of August, coming off the bench on the 10th, and starting the next three would likely mean he has established himself at Kilmarnock in a relatively short period of time. 

[king1010]

1 hour ago, Obinna said:

He was so far down the pecking order that he was actually on the bubble to make this roster...

Good luck to Telfer, but I hope he doesn't come back to sting us down the road. 

This one hurts. First ever goal scorer of the CPL goes on to play for T&T after being earmarked to play for Canada by our coaches. 

Fortunately, we are deep in many areas, but I want us to get deeper. I want our depth players to play for Canada, not elsewhere, and I definitely don't want the CPL to churn out internationals for other countries, who are eligible for Canada.

That's what just happened here. 

There are only so many international games. Every national team has this problem. France, Brazil, Germany all have their "depth" players switching allegiances to get a taste of the international game. If those countries can't prevent depth players from switching we surely won't be able to either. Losing B and C guys is going to become more common in the future as our depth increases, as is the case for stronger international sides. Also yes Telfer MAY have been a fringe callup, but chances are slim to none that he sees the field. Maybe he wanted to be a regular out and out first 11 starter, which is something we can't give to him. The decision was his to leave, and we can't fault him or the CSA IMO. 

Right now the CPL just started so it is in a unique situation where our "depth" players are being showcased to mid to lower tier Concacaf sides for the first time. Hopefully once the league becomes more established and competition improves, Canadians will either get those NT call ups, or be transferred to bigger leagues where they then get NT callups. 

Edited September 3, 2019 by king1010

[MtlMario]

1 hour ago, Obinna said:

He was so far down the pecking order that he was actually on the bubble to make this roster...

Good luck to Telfer, but I hope he doesn't come back to sting us down the road. 

This one hurts. First ever goal scorer of the CPL goes on to play for T&T after being earmarked to play for Canada by our coaches. 

Fortunately, we are deep in many areas, but I want us to get deeper. I want our depth players to play for Canada, not elsewhere, and I definitely don't want the CPL to churn out internationals for other countries, who are eligible for Canada.

That's what just happened here. 

I for one cannot offer a good luck to anyone that could of played for us and then one day could knock us out of WCQ or whatever competition.Sorry but that's just me. Otherwise i agree 100%.

[Bison44]

17 minutes ago, MtlMario said:

I for one cannot offer a good luck to anyone that could of played for us and then one day could knock us out of WCQ or whatever competition.Sorry but that's just me. Otherwise i agree 100%.

How do you know he could have played for us??  A few self serving/promotional tidbits herdman threw out about looking at some CPL players??  I seriously doubt that he got invited to camp, Look at the reaction on this page when Shway suggested Telfer be called in front of Millar as a 23rd man replacement..shock and confusion!!  I dont think he was part of Herdmans plans, he probably knew that and he has every right to go to T+T.  And if we are seriously thinking that T+T are going to be the reason we dont qualify for the WC....boy we are in trouble.  

[Shway]

I dislike how often I hear how ___________ national team (Concacaf) we shouldnt worry about. When We Canada, haven't achieved anything in nearly two decades. We most recently lost the Gold Cup QF to a Haiti team that had 3 born Canadians. The USA infamously didn't qualify for the World Cup for the first time since 1986 because of T&T.

When did we earn the right to be so boastful? When did we become a Concacaf giant? When did we afford to be better than teams where we aren't giving our deserving compatriots a look before we say okay, you can go? 

If the US does it, why can't we. Tesho got his look from the US before they ultimately told him he wasn't in the plans. 

We aren't as deep or good, as most of you think we are....

... Oh yea and I wish any Canadian good luck  internationally. Especially the ones don't get a look from Canada and they want it. 

Edited September 3, 2019 by Shway

[Obinna]

1 hour ago, Bison44 said:

How do you know he could have played for us??  A few self serving/promotional tidbits herdman threw out about looking at some CPL players??  I seriously doubt that he got invited to camp, Look at the reaction on this page when Shway suggested Telfer be called in front of Millar as a 23rd man replacement..shock and confusion!!  I dont think he was part of Herdmans plans, he probably knew that and he has every right to go to T+T.  And if we are seriously thinking that T+T are going to be the reason we dont qualify for the WC....boy we are in trouble.  

Because he's a good player that should have been capped already. 

If he's good enough for T&T, it's not a stretch to say he could have played for Canada.

Edited September 3, 2019 by Obinna

[Bison44]

17 minutes ago, Obinna said:

Because he's a good player that should have been capped already. 

If he's good enough for T&T, it's not a stretch to say he could have played for Canada.

I mean how do u know he was even called?? We are assuming this was even an option...who knows if Herdman called him??  If he didnt get a call now...why turn down T+T?  

[Bison44]

1 hour ago, Shway said:

I dislike how often I hear how ___________ national team (Concacaf) we shouldnt worry about. When We Canada, haven't achieved anything in nearly two decades. We most recently lost the Gold Cup QF to a Haiti team that had 3 born Canadians. The USA infamously didn't qualify for the World Cup for the first time since 1986 because of T&T.

When did we earn the right to be so boastful? When did we become a Concacaf giant? When did we afford to be better than teams where we aren't giving our deserving compatriots a look before we say okay, you can go? 

If the US does it, why can't we. Tesho got his look from the US before they ultimately told him he wasn't in the plans. 

We aren't as deep or good, as most of you think we are....

... Oh yea and I wish any Canadian good luck  internationally. Especially the ones don't get a look from Canada and they want it. 

Well, if we are worried about not beating T+T, then we dont have a hope in hell of beating Costa rica, Honduras, Jamaica,  let alone Mexico or USA.  If we cant beat the teams below us in the rankings, then every other post about reaching the old hex, the WC, or semis in gold cup etc, is completely full of shit.  Hell 90% of the posts on here are out to lunch then.... When I look at their line up I dont see Bayern Munich, Gent, Puebla, Red star Belgrade, Cardiff, Besikas, LAFC or Rangers.  Enough of this baloney....we may not have done much lately, but there are some damn good players in our squad and we have to stop playing like we are just waiting to be upset. How can we even talk about WC if we have so little confidence??   

[JuicyHam]

1 hour ago, Shway said:

I dislike how often I hear how ___________ national team (Concacaf) we shouldnt worry about. When We Canada, haven't achieved anything in nearly two decades. We most recently lost the Gold Cup QF to a Haiti team that had 3 born Canadians. The USA infamously didn't qualify for the World Cup for the first time since 1986 because of T&T.

When did we earn the right to be so boastful? When did we become a Concacaf giant? When did we afford to be better than teams where we aren't giving our deserving compatriots a look before we say okay, you can go? 

If the US does it, why can't we. Tesho got his look from the US before they ultimately told him he wasn't in the plans. 

We aren't as deep or good, as most of you think we are....

... Oh yea and I wish any Canadian good luck  internationally. Especially the ones don't get a look from Canada and they want it. 

It irks me to know end the amount of Canadian fans who just assume we're better than all the other teams we haven't been better than for the last how many years because we have a couple of young talented players. We literally just lost to Haiti and some of y'all think we're the third best team in CONCACAF and we can just let players go willynilly? 

While I do think it's not a gigantic loss there's literally zero reason we should be so arrogant when he haven't proven anything to anyone.  

[Shway]

13 minutes ago, Bison44 said:

Well, if we are worried about not beating T+T, then we dont have a hope in hell of beating Costa rica, Honduras, Jamaica,  let alone Mexico or USA.  If we cant beat the teams below us in the rankings, then every other post about reaching the old hex, the WC, or semis in gold cup etc, is completely full of ****.  Hell 90% of the posts on here are out to lunch then.... When I look at their line up I dont see Bayern Munich, Gent, Puebla, Red star Belgrade, Cardiff, Besikas, LAFC or Rangers.  Enough of this baloney....we may not have done much lately, but there are some damn good players in our squad and we have to stop playing like we are just waiting to be upset. How can we even talk about WC if we have so little confidence??   

We lost to Haiti.... Not Mexico, not USA, not Costa Rica, not Honduras..... As fans our confidence only means so much. 

Just two years ago before Bayern Munich, Gent, LAFC it was Whitecaps, Ottawa Internationals, and Louisville City. 

Nobody should be overlooked. 

[Bison44]

24 minutes ago, JuicyHam said:

It irks me to know end the amount of Canadian fans who just assume we're better than all the other teams we haven't been better than for the last how many years because we have a couple of young talented players. We literally just lost to Haiti and some of y'all think we're the third best team in CONCACAF and we can just let players go willynilly? 

While I do think it's not a gigantic loss there's literally zero reason we should be so arrogant when he haven't proven anything to anyone.  

Who did you want to sit???  Millar was suggested and it was met with confusion and amazement.  What does arragance have to do with it?  Are you sitting Lareaya??  Telfer got sent to CPL so Lareya could take his spot on the wing.  Are you sitting Akendele/Wotherspoon??  These are real desicions not made with arrogance, but a coach who is trying to win games (allegedly).  As soon as you say play Telfer, 20 guys will jump up and say he doesnt deserve it..________ is at a higher level and playing better, younger etc etc.  If you can give legit reasons that sway a large % of people I'll buy it, but its got nothing to do with arrogance.  Most of us cant figure out how to get him on a roster and who we would sit so he can play without endangering our chances of winning.  Arrogance and whether the team has proved shit has nothing to do with it.  

[Kadenge]

the real issue here is  we don't have camps or friendlies to assess depth players like every other nation and make them feel a part of the program. Instead every game has been a must win game...yes some  against minnows, but  competitive matches and an opportunity to build momentum with the squad that JH identified...  don't recall too many complaints re player selections over the past 18 months, other than lack of defenders at the GC. I do like Telfer, but he was a late bloomer with less than 2 yrs of pro experience. Perhaps if he was a little more patient and made it back with TFC next season the call would come? Look at  Riccardo Ferreira or Arfield who  waited longer for a Portugal/Scotland call. We simply cannot cap everyone. I am just happy that we have called Cordova, Adekugbe and Laryea for Cuba. Its unfortunate t we have lost Telfer, but we do have Bayiha, Choiniere, Bair, Kinumbe and all have MLS minutes this season plus Borges etc in CPL. I am not even going to name all the blue chip wingers  we are churning out at the youth level  as they are only prospects at this point.

[Kadenge]

47 minutes ago, Shway said:

We lost to Haiti.... Not Mexico, not USA, not Costa Rica, not Honduras..... As fans our confidence only means so much. 

Just two years ago before Bayern Munich, Gent, LAFC it was Whitecaps, Ottawa Internationals, and Louisville City. 

Nobody should be overlooked. 

Yes we lost to Haiti and that was on JH for not selecting or playing experienced wide defenders, his stubbornness at playing the "best XI" regardless of their positions and being tactically outcoached, especially with his subs . The vast majority of us were concerned about that going into the GC and it played out that way. The only forward/mid that was excluded was Tesho and I don't think he could have won that game for us. I agree  we are not top 5 until we beat the top 5 and  we should continue to increase and improve our depth but we need camps and friendlies to do that.

[toontownman]

This is going to happen just as much as we benefit the other way round when players like Arfield find themselves in the same position and go where they are wanted and will get international minutes. 

Doesn't make it any better but that is always the reality of national allegiances when it comes to fringe players. 

I am all for the horde mentality and would prefer if he does blossom in his imminent peak years to blossom playing for Canada. However, there is a much higher probability of games with T&T. 

Let's hope the balance is corrected by Tomori committing

[RS]

6 hours ago, Shway said:

A lot of confused faces, but I just don't get how some guys have an easy pass to the national team solely based on promise. It doesn't happen with other national teams, especially if our player pool is "so deep".

1. It happens with other national teams all the time.

2. Who on the current Canada roster does this apply to?