GC: Canada vs Mexico - Thursday, July 29th, 10pm Eastern / 7pm Pacific - Houston TX

[CanadianSoccerFan]

Even Berhalter called out the refs over the choking incident

 

 

[Unnamed Trialist]

3 hours ago, apbsmith said:

I'll take a non confrontational stab on a few points that I think helps our WCQ from participating in this Gold Cup.

1) The way we competed and were competitive in every match against all opposition, proved we were adequately prepared. Not that the players did not trust Herdman or his staff, but this tournament will only re-enforce that the players will trust the staff with preparation, tactics and in game adjustments for WCQ matches. 

2) Many of our 23 spent a significant chunk of time together as a team in training. I'm a big believer in more time together the more you develop chemistry and unity, even if it is just from training. This GC they experienced both training together and playing games together.

3) When you take away our big guns, many of our 23 men for WCQ will have gained valuable international and big game experience. Yes I consider QF & a SF(in front of 50k+ opposition supporters) in a knockout tournament a "big game experience". This simply can't be taught, you have to live threw it and experience it. Many men learnt and experienced it. They can carry this experience forward the rest of their lives.

4) The chemistry or as our players are calling it "brotherhood" has only grown from this tournament. Look at some of the top countries in the World: Spain, France, Holland. You can have all the talent in the world but if the chemistry or unity is not 100% there, you will have difficulties.  I guarantee our top players watching afar are only more fired up to crush it for our flag come September, simply after watching their teammates give it everything for the flag this GC.

5) We've learnt Crepeau is very capable in a CMNT uniform. Club vs country competition vs how you show in training are all different beasts.  Crepeau has proven this tourny he is the clear #2, pushing for #1. Do we learn this without the GC? Or have the same level of confidence? I'm not sure, but the question has now been answered. 

I'm sure I am missing more and I will agree with you, this GC is by no means a game changer for WCQ. 

At the same time, both of us are essentially and somewhat debating alot of hypotheticals. The true answer will likely always remain opinion based anyways, so tbh there really is no right or wrong answer. It's more where your opinion lies.

For me, I felt the tournament a positive for the CMNT, which only carries forward and helps us in WCQ, which is only a month away and will happen very very quickly.

I'd agree with you on most of that, although 3 points are essentially the same point (1,2,4). And you're overstating it, we also had it for the critical qualifiers. For 4, I'd say every player in the mix has played away in a full hostile stadium. 

5 is the best point, I agree with that view, Crepeau seems reliable when we felt before that Borjan was our only premium option in goal. I'd add a similar 6, being Tajon. I don't think anyone thought he'd take this step up. Instead of only keying on Davies the rival would have to handle him. Interesting for us. 

A 7th would be Junior getting a contract on the basis of his play with us. Or Eustaquio a transfer. 

The drawbacks are injuries to key players, one season ending. Players missing needed rest, then preseasons. Missing club options and being out of the club mix. Creating false narratives both about our team and all our rivals. 

[JohnnyFranchise]

29 minutes ago, Joe MacCarthy said:

Or Crepeau, many of us have followed him since he was a young buck and he has matured into a real hard nosed competitor.  Tajon/Stache may be the obvious ones but to me Crepeau's stock has quietly risen with the others.  Did he set a foot wrong all tournament?  His decision making and execution were fantastic IMO.

 

i don't know, goalies can be a bit loopy at times. i could imagine some dude trying to tee off on me and the guy watching my back runs off chasing a squirrel 🤣

but for real, crepeau was lights out this tournament, i hope that cements him as our #1 moving forward.

[Floortom]

I agree with all the intangibles (big game experience, opposition crowds etc) but for me the rise of Tajon is a major factor. Not saying that wouldn’t have happened without the Gold Cup but our opponents will know all about him now and will have to account for him. That will make a huge difference and open things up for the rest of the team 

[apbsmith]

2 hours ago, dyslexic nam said:

I will give you that one.  

As soon as I posted, I saw your post about moving on and was like "that's a good point" - but I was not going to delete what I had just wrote down or posted, not really my style.

It's a Saturday and raining here so had some time to kill and write down some thoughts.

Not going to derail this Mexico game thread anymore.

The game itself was pretty wild and incredibly exciting for Canadians, supporters, fans and neutrals.  As much I have respect for OneSoccer, it really is unfortunate it was not on main stream TV here in Canada, would have really picked up many more casuals/soccer/sport fans with that performance.

[Joe MacCarthy]

19 hours ago, BearcatSA said:

One of the many famous incidents during the most dramatic game in Canadian sports history (Game 8 of the 72 Summit Series) was Eagleson and trainer Frosty Forrestal (in his all red Canada tracksuit) walking across the ice and flipping the bird at the Russian crowd.  Now that would have been great here!

As an amateur scholar on this subject I almost committed a major fox pass when responding to this.  I was going to fact check you and say that it was Joe Sgro and not Frosty Forrestal delivering the finger to the Soviet crowd but you had it correct.  Although both men looked similar and wore the same red outfit you can clearly tell the difference when you see Sgro behind the bench when they leave the ice.  Forrestal came with Sinden as the Bruins trainer while Sgro was nearby (training camp) as the Leafs trainer.

We should be accurate about one point, however, Eagleson did not give the finger!  He gave a thumbs up and shook his fist but did not flip the middle digit.  But that didn't preclude the aforementioned Forrestal and Administrative Coordinator Mike Cannon from doing so.

Personally, I have always been very proud of that moment as crass as the gesture was.  I love when people go in the belly of the beast and walk towards the flames.

More here

We now return you to our regularly scheduled thread.

[apbsmith]

4 minutes ago, Joe MacCarthy said:

 I love when people go in the belly of the beast and walk towards the flames.

 

Why you need to love the Tajon goal celebration. He scores a beautiful goal, walks right towards the crowd, looks up towards the crowd and plugs his ears.

The average on looker sees it as going into the belly of the beast and silencing the crowd. Yes, true, but even deeper meaning after he decided to turn off his social media accounts due to the mexican fan base blowing up his account with racial remarks.

Come at me, well I'll ignore you and come right back at you where it hurts even more on the scoreboard.

[Joe MacCarthy]

3 minutes ago, apbsmith said:

Why you need to love the Tajon goal celebration. He scores a beautiful goal, walks right towards the crowd, looks up towards the crowd and plugs his ears.

Have to say I enjoyed that, almost as good as giving the finger.

[BearcatSA]

18 minutes ago, Joe MacCarthy said:

As an amateur scholar on this subject I almost committed a major fox pass when responding to this.  I was going to fact check you and say that it was Joe Sgro and not Frosty Forrestal delivering the finger to the Soviet crowd but you had it correct.  Although both men looked similar and wore the same red outfit you can clearly tell the difference when you see Sgro behind the bench when they leave the ice.  Forrestal came with Sinden as the Bruins trainer while Sgro was nearby (training camp) as the Leafs trainer.

We should be accurate about one point, however, Eagleson did not give the finger!  He gave a thumbs up and shook his fist but did not flip the middle digit.  But that didn't preclude the aforementioned Forrestal and Administrative Coordinator Mike Cannon from doing so.

Personally, I have always been very proud of that moment as crass as the gesture was.  I love when people go in the belly of the beast and walk towards the flames.

More here

We now return you to our regularly scheduled thread.

I stand corrected regarding the Eagle.  If his clients on that team who came to his rescue only knew then that he was going to rip them off later on, they probably would have joined the Russian police in roughing him up! 

I was on a beach in Nha Trang, Vietnam, which is like Puerto Vallarta for vacationing Russians, a few years back and I wanted my wife to take a picture of me "doing the Frosty" as I walked among the sun bathing Russian tourists.  Unfortunately, she wouldn't do it, and I didn't have the needed red ensemble.  

[Joe MacCarthy]

17 minutes ago, BearcatSA said:

I stand corrected regarding the Eagle.  If his clients on that team who came to his rescue only knew then that he was going to rip them off later on, they probably would have joined the Russian police in roughing him up! 

I was on a beach in Nha Trang, Vietnam, which is like Puerto Vallarta for vacationing Russians, a few years back and I wanted my wife to take a picture of me "doing the Frosty" as I walked among the sun bathing Russian tourists.  Unfortunately, she wouldn't do it, and I didn't have the needed red ensemble.  

Yes, ironically the one holding him up crossing the ice was Brad Park who is one of the few holdouts keeping Eagleson from being involved in team celebrations and reunions.  You can't blame him, but most of the team recognize the important and critical role Eagleson played in the series and are willing to include him but in deference to Park and one or two others keep the status quo.

Maybe the all red ensemble and the double barrelled "Frosty Finger" could become a Canadian fan thing, kinda like getting a photo crossing Abbey Road

 

Edited August 1, 2021 by Joe MacCarthy

[Joe MacCarthy]

Don't mean to beleaguer this Canada Russia 72 thing but this is exactly the stuff I said Herdman would bring to the table when everybody was arguing about his appointment

Found this in the Canada Russia thread from a Swedish observer.

The Russians were stronger, faster, more durable and were better organized. They should have won. But that didn't happen. Why? The explanation can be found on the psychological level. In my opinion the Soviet team couldn't handle the emotional pressure in the series. The Canadians were more seasoned and their minds were more open to do whatever it took to win. Their intensity in the battles on the ice was devastating. On top of that they had superior self confidence and better nerves.

This is the stuff we always needed and what I thought (and hoped) Herdman would instill in the players.

 

Edited August 1, 2021 by Joe MacCarthy

[BearcatSA]

32 minutes ago, Joe MacCarthy said:

The Canadians were more seasoned and their minds were more open to do whatever it took to win.

Like Clarke breaking Kharlamov's ankle?

(As I throw a smokebomb then disappear from the discussion)

Edited August 1, 2021 by BearcatSA

[Joe MacCarthy]

9 minutes ago, BearcatSA said:

Like Clarke breaking Kharlamov's ankle?

Nobody had any problem with it at the time, it's the revisionism of today that has the problem.  And unbelievably CBC's Bruce Dowbiggen (who had a lifelong vendetta against Don Cherry) amazed me by admitting that at the time nobody had a problem with it.

A few points on the matter, Kharlamov, while extremely skilled, was a major league shit disturber.  Before that he gave Clarke a shot in the ribs and was given a ten minute misconduct in Game 2 for pushing the referee.

It's actually never been proved AFAIK that his ankle was broken, sprained, bruised or what.  You hear a million people saying a million different stories.  The fact is he missed Game 7 and played in Game 8.

All sport is intimidation, in one way or another: physical, mental, skill, fitness...

[BearcatSA]

26 minutes ago, Joe MacCarthy said:

Nobody had any problem with it at the time, it's the revisionism of today that has the problem.  And unbelievably CBC's Bruce Dowbiggen (who had a lifelong vendetta against Don Cherry) amazed me by admitting that at the time nobody had a problem with it.

A few points on the matter, Kharlamov, while extremely skilled, was a major league shit disturber.  Before that he gave Clarke a shot in the ribs and was given a ten minute misconduct in Game 2 for pushing the referee.

It's actually never been proved AFAIK that his ankle was broken, sprained, bruised or what.  You hear a million people saying a million different stories.  The fact is he missed Game 7 and played in Game 8.

All sport is intimidation, in one way or another: physical, mental, skill, fitness...

I knew I would get a rise out of you on this 😉.  I thought you had a thread about the series in the General Discussion:  if you want to move it there, I will talk to you more about this great series.

Edited August 1, 2021 by BearcatSA

[Joe MacCarthy]

18 minutes ago, BearcatSA said:

I knew I would get a rise out of you on this 😉.  I thought had a thread about the series in the General Discussion:  if you want to move it there, I will talk to you more about this gtest series.

Nobody has to worry about baiting me, this fish will always be first to bite the line

[Joe MacCarthy]

1 hour ago, Joe MacCarthy said:

The Russians were stronger, faster, more durable and were better organized.

Let's contrast "better organized" with adaptable.  You notice how in almost every game we seem to turn it around near the 60 minute mark.  In 1972 we adapted, they didn't, Herdman's boys seem to have adaptability in their makeup.

[gigi riva]

Now that the GC is over . and the way it ended for us Now its time to focus on WCQ,we have the motivation to succeed

[Kent]

I skipped 5 or 6 pages of this thread, so I don't know if this has been mentioned. Lots of people are blaming the game stoppage for allowing Mexico back in the game. The stoppage happened around the 88th minute I believe, which was after Mexico's first good non-penalty chance of the game in the 86th minute. Also, if there wasn't that stoppage and Mexico didn't score I think that game was almost definitely headed for extra time. They would have gotten their break in a couple minutes even if the chant stoppage hadn't happened, then had 30 minutes to score against us. Sure it would have given us more time to respond if they scored shortly after the break, but still, I'm not going to blame that stoppage. I will say though that if we got a BS penalty instead of them, we had an amazing chance at a win.

Unrelated, I feel like in all the CCL games I watch involving Mexican teams, if they need a goal late, they always seem to get it. It's really annoying.

[CanadianSoccerFan]

 

[JamboAl]

2 hours ago, CanadianSoccerFan said:

 

Reminds me of the time I was in the bleachers at Fenway Park.  Fight like that every half inning usually started by drunk fan calling another fan’s wife/girlfriend fat and/or ugly.  Unfortunately, alcohol and men with too much testosterone do not mix well.

[BearcatSA]

2 hours ago, CanadianSoccerFan said:

 

One minute, two American citizens are duking it out but later in the match they probably bond through the chant of a homophobic slur at the opposition (at least that's my guess).

[MtlMario]

22 hours ago, BearcatSA said:

This derby always seems like it is defacto home fixture for the Mexicans when played in California or Texas.

I will watch this match because I think there is even more potential for volatilty.

 

21 hours ago, Free kick said:

They will cheer for Mexico.  I have alluded to this in other posts recently; Concacaf is a unique conferation.  The central american countries could probably play all of their home WCQ matches in the US and they would get just as good (if not better) support.  The facilities and the $$$ they would get from it would be better than if they actaully played in their own countries.  I will bet, that if FIFA allowed it,  thats what would happen.

 

Yes I knew the answer (we have the same problemo here) but I still find it sad that it happens to this extent. I won't go any further.

[afun]

On 7/29/2021 at 11:03 PM, Gian-Luca said:

Although Fox Soccer highlights leave out the Canada goal (!!) they let the video run quite a bit to get the post-game analysis from Edu & Lalas who are full of praise for our boys:

 

So much more exciting than the OneSoccer highlights because Fox has the right crowd noise vs play by play volume. 

[king1010]

9 hours ago, afun said:

So much more exciting than the OneSoccer highlights because Fox has the right crowd noise vs play by play volume. 

Right? The crowd noise on the ONEsoccer broadcast was non existent. 

[Macksam]

9 hours ago, afun said:

So much more exciting than the OneSoccer highlights because Fox has the right crowd noise vs play by play volume. 

 

24 minutes ago, king1010 said:

Right? The crowd noise on the ONEsoccer broadcast was non existent. 

Always the case for them unfortunately.