Ballou Tabla

[SpecialK]

26 minutes ago, matty said:

It's always about winning for a lot guys and it's very possible even if Canada was a top 50 nation Tabla would still desire to play for the nation of his birth. Don't discount that sense of home.

I agree with a lot of what you're saying here (more so than other posts you've made about what the program needs). Guys do weight options and have every right to.

The CSA seems to have gone through a very messy transition from Vic to Reed and hopefully it's able to focus on things like that will help like getting the CPL and provincial programs working together well. Success in the Nations League and the Olympics really need to be the next goals competition wise (I really don't care about the Copa America).

While they've been messy I don't think you can really blame them outright for Tabla, they called him up, nurtured him and even honoured him and he wants to wait.

Matty totally agree, Getting CPL off the ground and the provincial programs and other  academies working well and on the same page should be a huge  priority for the CSA. But that should be  separate from the goals and the priority of the men’s national team. This is where the huge mistake is being made, they give Herdman the job fine but they made him not just the manager, he’s the CSA handyman, the guy to do everything. Then the CSA puts him on TV for interviews and he really only talks about 2026 and fixing youth programs and how his the “right man for job”.  Really nothing about 2022 , olympics, Gold cups , rasing ranks and  recruitment. What kind of message does that sends to players who want to  qualify and win now,  especially players that have options. 

Getting invited for Copa America would be huge for the program 

I blame the CSA for making Canada look like a joke and laughing stock in the eyes of the football world. Why would a player with options choice Canada when the  Association is being run by  amateurs. 

Edited January 27, 2018 by SpecialK

[matty]

5 minutes ago, SpecialK said:

Matty totally agree, Getting CPL off the ground and the provincial programs and other  academies working well and on the same page should be a huge  priority for the CSA. But that should be  separate from the goals and the priority of the men’s national team. This is where the huge mistake is being made, they give Herdman the job fine but they made him not just the manager, he’s the CSA handyman, the guy to do everything. Then the CSA puts him on TV for interviews and he really only talks about 2026 and fixing youth programs and how his the “right man for job”.  Really nothing about 2022 , olympics, Gold cups , rasing ranks and  recruitment. What kind of message does that sends to players who want to  qualify and win now,  especially players that have options. 

Getting invited for Copa America would be huge for the program 

I would say getting those two on the same page would be a big gains for the CanMNT down the line and is a highly important task that could have an impact on events like the 2021 and 2023 U20 World Cups and the 2024 Olympics. It also would like grow our pool from 100 to like 300 in a few short years. The CSA isn't in control of the project but getting the CPL and provincial programs and various boutique academies working together quickly and on the same page should be the #1 non-2026 task for the men's program.

Herdman's job is kind of stupid. I have no issue with him as the coach but wish they'd have installed Findlay, de Vos or someone as Technical Director for the men's program. Time will tell with Herdman.

Copa would be big but it should not be the focus of the program.

[Kadenge]

2 hours ago, MtlMario said:

So you're saying that even with all the interviews he gave, saying he didn't feel CANADIAN, he eats, speaks and feels African, he was BULLSHITTING all along and he really feels Canadian and wants to play for Canada but he can't because IC has a better ranking. Give me a break. Even if Canada was ranked # 1, we would't be his first choice. Trust me.

Guess he felt more Canadian when he played for our youth teams then?  Perhaps he got a crash course in being more Ivorian from Drogba  over 2 seasons and suddenly saw the light........now that's what  I call bs.

[Kent]

Of course the prestige of the national teams involved is a huge driver in the decision. And that doesn’t even have to be as cynical as it may sound. I can’t speak to Tabla’s experiences and I personally am something stupid like 6th generation Canadian but no doubt for some players in Canada their connection to their other nationality can be driven by memories of watching the World Cup with their family members cheering on that nation. If Canada actually accomplished things in international soccer it would help foster affection and connections to the country. Every case is different and you can’t win them all, but things only start to slant in our favour when we start to get results.

I have to say, I find the suggestion (from moldy I think) to try to cap tie players with competitive senior games before calling them up to the U20 team so they don’t waste our time and resources to be pretty hilarious.

[Grizzly]

3 hours ago, Kadenge said:

Guess he felt more Canadian when he played for our youth teams then?  Perhaps he got a crash course in being more Ivorian from Drogba  over 2 seasons and suddenly saw the light........now that's what  I call bs.

We need to stop blaming Drogba for this. Whatever choice he was going to make he was going to make with or without Drogba.

[Free kick]

They need to find out what Switzerland is doing and emulated it.  The Swiss managed to go from an decent to average national side to one that is qualifying for world cups and euros on an almost regular basis.  And the bulk or heart of their squad is Albanians; Players born in Albania or players born in Switzerland to Albanian parents.  Then there is a sprinkling on Kosovars, Bosnians and other Balkan states.  Then there are others from Chilean, Portuguese etc background.  

There might be (an educated guess) less than a handfull that are swiss born and to parents of swiss background.  If you are Albanian, it must feel strange watching your national side play Switzerland.  

When Japan hosted the world cup in 2002,  they had naturalized a Brazilian and he happened to be their best player. Or one of.  You could go on and on with these kind of stories.  

 I have read the counter arguments defending the notion that there was nothing that could be done in the case of BT.  All the arguments are valid IMO.   But are we really sure that the CSA and the coaches  is really doing everything they can and should be doing to not only prevent defections but also try and poach talent from other countries or just get quality talent from the TAM and GAM players on canadian MLS clubs?  Man, its mind boggling when you look over the past 15 years (starting with Hargreaves) the talent that has skipped through the cracks!  And what the possibilities are!

Back in the the day, i thought that with the arrival of MLS in canada and with three clubs with weathy owners and spending powers on salaries that would be the envy of every nation in Cncacaf except Mexico,  that we too could poach just like Switzerland.  Until they traded Stefan Frey, i thought that there might have been a chance.   What about Piatti?  He is not capped by Argentina, do we have anyone of ilk up front on the NT.  He is now on his second contract in canada and never been capped.  There are others i am sure.  But for this to happen, the CSA needs to be working with the clubs.  I dont get the sense from afar that this is happening unless its just with the Whitecaps.  Not in the same way that Basketball Canada is working with the Raptors.  Recently, MLSE contributed $5 mill to Basketball Canada.  

With the increased TAM and GAM as well as 3 dp’s, the non domestic (ie non canadian and US) talent in MLS is going to be better than Concacaf.  You look at the CCL, you should already seeing hints of this.  There should be opportunities. But right now, i am not sure that NT coaches even show up at league games in in the east. 

 

Edited January 28, 2018 by Free kick

[Stryker911]

Random thought. Would Tabla be able to play for Canada at Olympic qualifying/ at the Olympics and still keep his eligibility for IC?

[jpg75]

Just now, Stryker911 said:

Random thought. Would Tabla be able to play for Canada at Olympic qualifying/ at the Olympics and still keep his eligibility for IC?

Yes. He's already provisionally cap-tied to us so nothing short of playing for the MNT in an official match changes anything.

Edited January 29, 2018 by jpg75

[El Hombre]

Other players that would be cap-tied to Canada if we concentrated on cap-tying teens with promise:

Adam Street
Andrew Gordon
Bryce Alderson
Chris Nanco
Damien Merrette
Derrick Bassi
Duwayne Ewart
Ethan Gage
Hanson Boakai
Josh Doughty
Keenan Gracey
Kennedy Owusu-Ansah
Matt Stinson
Olivier Lacoste-Lebuis
Oscar Cordon
Ryan Gyaki
Shane Lammie
Wyn Belotte

 

[jpg75]

32 minutes ago, El Hombre said:

Other players that would be cap-tied to Canada if we concentrated on cap-tying teens with promise:

Andy Williams

Owen Hargreaves

Daniel Fernandes

Charlie Mulgrew

Landon Donovan

Jonathan de Guzman

Asmir Begovic

Yassine Bounou

Ricardo Ferreira

Ferdi Kadioglu

 

 

/troll

[A_Gagne]

1 hour ago, Stryker911 said:

Random thought. Would Tabla be able to play for Canada at Olympic qualifying/ at the Olympics and still keep his eligibility for IC?

 

1 hour ago, jpg75 said:

Yes. He's already provisionally cap-tied to us so nothing short of playing for the MNT in an official match changes anything.

Not holding my breath considering he already turned down U20 call ups.

[Stryker911]

43 minutes ago, A_Gagne said:

 

Not holding my breath considering he already turned down U20 call ups.

Probably not, especially since that would cut into the beginning of their season. However, would be an interesting decision. If him and Davies can continue to develop they could give us a great shot at qualifying. And if it doesn't effect his opportunities with Ivory Coast would be a great opportunity for him.

[Acid-Tone]

On 1/27/2018 at 10:21 PM, Free kick said:

They need to find out what Switzerland is doing and emulated it.  The Swiss managed to go from an decent to average national side to one that is qualifying for world cups and euros on an almost regular basis.  And the bulk or heart of their squad is Albanians; Players born in Albania or players born in Switzerland to Albanian parents.  Then there is a sprinkling on Kosovars, Bosnians and other Balkan states.  Then there are others from Chilean, Portuguese etc background.  

 

It's unfair to compare us to them.  I believe that being in Europe and giving players that valuable passport, which opens up the whole continent for them is a huge advantage that we can't offer.

[Obinna]

http://www.goal.com/article/uuid/1r9ua3ja78f411wvv2z8hmhafw

Seems like Barca B are bringing in more than one "Tabla" type player. This guy is an Arsenal youth player, 18 years old, English youth international. Signed a 5 year deal with a 25 mil release clause.

"

Marcus McGuane has joined Barcelona from Arsenal for an undisclosed fee, the Premier League club have confirmed.

The 18-year-old has completed a medical in Spain and signed a five-year contract that includes a release clause of €25 million.

McGuane’s deal will keep him in Catalonia for three seasons, plus two option years.

The midfielder, who had been at Arsenal since the age of six, made his first two senior appearances under manager Arsene Wenger in Europa League group-stage matches against BATE and Red Star Belgrade this season.

McGuane, an England youth international, will join Barca's B team with a view to earning a spot in the first-team squad in future."

Edited January 30, 2018 by Obinna

[Gordon]

1 hour ago, Obinna said:

http://www.goal.com/article/uuid/1r9ua3ja78f411wvv2z8hmhafw

Seems like Barca B are bringing in more than one "Tabla" type player. This guy is an Arsenal youth player, 18 years old, English youth international. Signed a 5 year deal with a 25 mil release clause.

"

Marcus McGuane has joined Barcelona from Arsenal for an undisclosed fee, the Premier League club have confirmed.

The 18-year-old has completed a medical in Spain and signed a five-year contract that includes a release clause of €25 million.

McGuane’s deal will keep him in Catalonia for three seasons, plus two option years.

The midfielder, who had been at Arsenal since the age of six, made his first two senior appearances under manager Arsene Wenger in Europa League group-stage matches against BATE and Red Star Belgrade this season.

McGuane, an England youth international, will join Barca's B team with a view to earning a spot in the first-team squad in future."

I saw too. It interesting as to whether Barcelona sees something that Arsenal is missing (McGuane is generally considered outsaid of Arsenal’s top half dozen prospects at that age group) or if the fast rising costs of players is resulting in a change in their thinking.

These ‘kids’ - including BT - are older than the typical prospect signing I’d think. Maybe the Chelsea model of signing dozens of youth, loaning them out with an eye to selling for a profit? Just speculation of course, but Lord knows Arsenal has taken/stolen their share Barca youth, some at least that Barca did not want to lose, so turnabout is fair play.

[Obinna]

53 minutes ago, Gordon said:

I saw too. It interesting as to whether Barcelona sees something that Arsenal is missing (McGuane is generally considered outsaid of Arsenal’s top half dozen prospects at that age group) or if the fast rising costs of players is resulting in a change in their thinking.

These ‘kids’ - including BT - are older than the typical prospect signing I’d think. Maybe the Chelsea model of signing dozens of youth, loaning them out with an eye to selling for a profit? Just speculation of course, but Lord knows Arsenal has taken/stolen their share Barca youth, some at least that Barca did not want to lose, so turnabout is fair play.

I think it's both. Agree with your post, for sure.

[Unnamed Trialist]

I heard they paid a million for McGuane. I also agree it is odd, first time Barça has ever poached a kid playing for an EPL side (technically, being 18, it is not poaching or illicit).

In other news, Barça B just sold Lozano, the Honduran, to Girona in La Liga, that is a big step up for him, top flight.

This means the Barça B attack is going younger, including Ballou, the only guy over 20 for their attack is Arnaiz. 

[jpg75]

Winger Sergio Gomez is leaving Barca for B.Dortmund as well.

[Chad_Impact]

Got his first minutes this past weekend and trained with the first team today.

 

[kohanz]

http://www.espn.com/soccer/soccer-transfers/story/3380761/barcelonas-ballou-jean-yves-tabla-didier-drogba-is-proud-of-me

Ballou's ability to run at defenders has helped him make an impression at the club already, with B team coach Gerard Lopez hopeful he will add something different in the side's battle against relegation from the second tier of Spanish football.

"Ballou's a player that has that special spark out wide," Gerard told a news conference. "We were struggling to break [Alcorcon] down and he had two or three good moments where he beat a man.

"But he's not just good in one-on-one situations, he's also good at linking up with his teammates. His adaption is a work in progress still, due to the language and everything that comes with the move, but he's an 18-year-old kid with a lot of potential and he could be important for us."

[Ansem]

I think lots of stuff will fall into place if we win 2026 world cup bid. 

That means that the odds of a lot of dual citizens to actually play in a world cup drastically increases I'd they commit to Canada, making the more attractive choice the riskier one.

[Obinna]

For many dual internationals, the choice often seems to hinge on what country is best for their club career.

I think with Ballou, neither Canada or Ivory Coast is going to do much more to put him in the spotlight. I mean, the kid is 18 and is already slated to train with the Barcalona's first team. 

[matty]

2 hours ago, Ansem said:

I think lots of stuff will fall into place if we win 2026 world cup bid. 

That means that the odds of a lot of dual citizens to actually play in a world cup drastically increases I'd they commit to Canada, making the more attractive choice the riskier one.

 

2 hours ago, Obinna said:

For many dual internationals, the choice often seems to hinge on what country is best for their club career.

I think with Ballou, neither Canada or Ivory Coast is going to do much more to put him in the spotlight. I mean, the kid is 18 and is already slated to train with the Barcalona's first team. 

For him the choice seems more personal so stuff like a WC and a raised profile don't really matter I think. I do think Canada has an edge on both fronts.

[Ansem]

1 minute ago, matty said:

 

For him the choice seems more personal so stuff like a WC and a raised profile don't really matter I think. I do think Canada has an edge on both fronts.

Also, isn't playing in a World Cup the ultimate dream for a soccer player?

Reports saying that he's "torned" between Canada and Ivory Coast means that even if he prefers Ivory Coast, deep down he still cares for Canada.

It's a matter which trumps what. Representing Ivory Coast at all cost or play in a World Cup for a country that kind of face you everything and will most likely add you to a world cup roster when you are far from being guarantee that with IC?

Of course, North America needs to win the bid first and Canada needs to get the confirmation that we are automatically qualified. This actually gives incentive to those on the fence to commit to us faster as they will want to solidify their spot on a potential 2026 World Cup roster by giving their all at the League of Nations, Gold Cup (qualification to next Copa America) and next WCQ.

[matty]

1 minute ago, Ansem said:

Also, isn't playing in a World Cup the ultimate dream for a soccer player?

Reports saying that he's "torned" between Canada and Ivory Coast means that even if he prefers Ivory Coast, deep down he still cares for Canada.

I think it is, I think they all want to but I've seen players like Ryan Giggs say they'd rather never play in a major tournament then represent another nation.

Fully agree that he cares for Canada and that he isn't "lost". It's a deeper issue for him and in the end I don't think it'll matter when it comes to tournaments and profile.