Jay Chapman

[Gian-Luca]

Just now, Obinna said:

It's a long season and Chapman will get his chance.

Indeed - I expect we will see minutes for everyone on the senior roster come July (if not sooner) given that TFC are scheduled to play 8 games that month. And March just got congested by another two games.....

[Club Linesman]

The new guy looked very solid in a brief outing last night.  Chapman will get the odd game but if he could move on to a similar level or to another team in the MLS and be a starter in most of the team's matches he would be much better off.  The only encouraging news for Canadians in our midfield at this point is that Osorio is outplaying Delgado and Vanney is actually recognizing that.  Let's hope it sticks.

[shamrock]

Well, TFC has become a top team and as we all know, it's hard to break into the line-up of a top team. However I agree that if there's another club on the same level where he can get more minutes, he should go there. Ad honestly I think there are clubs out there who could use him. Unfortunately the way MLS is structured, you don't see lateral loans (at least not to my knowledge) cause that would be the best solution IMO. 

[Ruffian]

18 hours ago, Stryker911 said:

Bumping this thread. Aketxe is on the bench tonight. No sign of Chapman. This guy really needs to move on. I can't imagine how frustrating it must be for him. 

I make an argument in another thread that Scott Arfield needs to get regular starts to stay on or join a new team. In Chapman's case I think he should stick with Toronto and compete for playing time. He is still young and the team he is with has a very competitive mentality that could rub off on Chapman. Also he has some great players to learn from in that roster.

[Shway]

24 isn't  young. Typically players of this age have amased at least 80+ games. Chapman has only 40. Love that he's on TFC, but in addition to being a CMNT fan - he needs to play now. 

[Obinna]

30 minutes ago, Jahinho Guerro said:

24 isn't  young. Typically players of this age have amased at least 80+ games. Chapman has only 40. Love that he's on TFC, but in addition to being a CMNT fan - he needs to play now. 

I get that argument but I would like him to stay where he is for the time being. Not as a TFC fan, but a national team fan.

I said the same thing about Edwards.

Like Edwards, he'd certainly get more playing time elsewhere, but unlike Edwards, he plays centrally and as an attacking central mid, he's competing for time in a position where teams are using TAM to bring in South Americans.

Chapman is not as versitile as Edwards and while he is a good player, I think there are very few teams he starts at. Maybe at a Colorado, but even Enzo Martinez looked quite good over two legs, so I am not sure.

Also, I know it's been stated and I am sure you know, but having players winning silverware on the top MLS club is a benefit for the national team. I get that the development window is small, but so is the opportunity to win, especially in MLS. 

As much as I want TFC to dominate forever, it won't last. This is a great chance for him to learn from and train with great players everyday in a winnimg environment.

So yeah, I wouldn't be that upset if he moved, but I do think he's in a good spot at Toronto, and I do think he'll get his chance. 

[El Diego]

Chapman is clearly behind:

1. Delgado

2. Osorio

3. Aketxe

4. Hasler

for one of two spots in central midfield. If TFC play a 3142 then he is also behind Vazquez. He is also possibly behind Auro for a central midfield spot. I like the guy, and he is probably getting improvement in training with such quality players day in and day out, but I have no clue how he's gonna get minutes this season. He needs to think long and hard about what his career needs.

[Kadenge]

3 hours ago, shamrock said:

Well, TFC has become a top team and as we all know, it's hard to break into the line-up of a top team. However I agree that if there's another club on the same level where he can get more minutes, he should go there. Ad honestly I think there are clubs out there who could use him. Unfortunately the way MLS is structured, you don't see lateral loans (at least not to my knowledge) cause that would be the best solution IMO. 

That's one of the major roadblocks for the development of young players in the League

[Yohan]

3 hours ago, shamrock said:

Well, TFC has become a top team and as we all know, it's hard to break into the line-up of a top team. However I agree that if there's another club on the same level where he can get more minutes, he should go there. Ad honestly I think there are clubs out there who could use him. Unfortunately the way MLS is structured, you don't see lateral loans (at least not to my knowledge) cause that would be the best solution IMO. 

Incorrect. Interleague loan has been allowed since 2013, just not something MLS teams do very often.

[Kadenge]

56 minutes ago, Obinna said:

I get that argument but I would like him to stay where he is for the time being. Not as a TFC fan, but a national team fan.

I said the same thing about Edwards.

Like Edwards, he'd certainly get more playing time elsewhere, but unlike Edwards, he plays centrally and as an attacking central mid, he's competing for time in a position where teams are using TAM to bring in South Americans.

Chapman is not as versitile as Edwards and while he is a good player, I think there are very few teams he starts at. Maybe at a Colorado, but even Enzo Martinez looked quite good over two legs, so I am not sure.

Also, I know it's been stated and I am sure you know, but having players winning silverware on the top MLS club is a benefit for the national team. I get that the development window is small, but so is the opportunity to win, especially in MLS. 

As much as I want TFC to dominate forever, it won't last. This is a great chance for him to learn from and train with great players everyday in a winnimg environment.

So yeah, I wouldn't be that upset if he moved, but I do think he's in a good spot at Toronto, and I do think he'll get his chance. 

While I agree it is beneficial to be on a winning team, practicing with players like Vazquez and Gio and win trophies, this is his 3rd season with the main team (?) and there is only so much he can improve through osmosis. He is buried in the depth chart for mids and is at an age where playing time is critical for his development. I think if a loan can be arranged for him to play in Europe he should grab it or even a move to another MLS club, where even if he does not start he can get consistent sub minutes

[Kadenge]

6 minutes ago, Yohan said:

Incorrect. Interleague loan has been allowed since 2013, just not something MLS teams do very often.

why is that? Perhaps because there is no pressure of relegation  and  lower teams would rather give playing time to their own young players?

[Obinna]

20 minutes ago, Kadenge said:

While I agree it is beneficial to be on a winning team, practicing with players like Vazquez and Gio and win trophies, this is his 3rd season with the main team (?) and there is only so much he can improve through osmosis. He is buried in the depth chart for mids and is at an age where playing time is critical for his development. I think if a loan can be arranged for him to play in Europe he should grab it or even a move to another MLS club, where even if he does not start he can get consistent sub minutes

A loan would be good for him, but if the injury bug hits Toronto they are going to need him. 

Also, there is no guarentee the greener on the other side anyways. And I don't see the logic of leaving unless it is to a place where he can get a significant raise in playing time. Can you suggest any club in MLS who'd be willing to give him that?

Sure, there are clubs in the league with less competiton, but he'll be fighting for minutes anywhere he goes. MLS is getting deeper across the board.

I don't see a lot of possible options so if he stays I won't be surprised. Again, just a few injuries away from being called upon.

I honestly am not convinced he needs to move.

He'll get USL minutes if he can't get into the first team, and that league is improving also.

I don't think PT is the issue here, it is a desire for him to get more PT at the MLS level. To that, I would maintain that no other MLS team out there is going to give him a big raise on PT. Perhaps some will give him more, but I don't think they'd offer enough of a carrot to intice him to move.

Edited February 28, 2018 by Obinna

[Bison44]

Lets look at the facts, his minutes last year in MLS play were cut in half to 380min.  He got in 1 championship game and 3 USL games.  He is 24, he has to play now or its getting too late.  Another year like last year and then he is competing against another group of youngsters from the academy with more upside.  If he isnt going to get moved, then he should go to TFC2 and tear it up there.  Play every week, get 10-15 starts by WC time, be the boss of the midfield and show that you are head and shoulders above those guys.  Staying with the big club and being consistently left out of the game day roster will do little for his game.  

[BearcatSA]

He really needs to stand out in a big way in the starting or subbing opportunities he gets.  Unfortunately for him, his performances have been a varied:  mixed in with some good has been some poor to underwhelming, such as in the Multi-Level Marketing Cup semi-final first away leg vs Ottawa, as a sub vs Jamaica and then not getting a call up in the following final friendly of 2017.

 

[Obinna]

Just now, Bison44 said:

Lets look at the facts, his minutes last year in MLS play were cut in half to 380min.  He got in 1 championship game and 3 USL games.  He is 24, he has to play now or its getting too late.  Another year like last year and then he is competing against another group of youngsters from the academy with more upside.  If he isnt going to get moved, then he should go to TFC2 and tear it up there.  Play every week, get 10-15 starts by WC time, be the boss of the midfield and show that you are head and shoulders above those guys.  Staying with the big club and being consistently left out of the game day roster will do little for his game.  

I do agree with that and never realized his USL minutes were so low.

[Stryker911]

1 hour ago, Obinna said:

I get that argument but I would like him to stay where he is for the time being. Not as a TFC fan, but a national team fan.

I said the same thing about Edwards.

Like Edwards, he'd certainly get more playing time elsewhere, but unlike Edwards, he plays centrally and as an attacking central mid, he's competing for time in a position where teams are using TAM to bring in South Americans.

Chapman is not as versitile as Edwards and while he is a good player, I think there are very few teams he starts at. Maybe at a Colorado, but even Enzo Martinez looked quite good over two legs, so I am not sure.

Also, I know it's been stated and I am sure you know, but having players winning silverware on the top MLS club is a benefit for the national team. I get that the development window is small, but so is the opportunity to win, especially in MLS. 

As much as I want TFC to dominate forever, it won't last. This is a great chance for him to learn from and train with great players everyday in a winnimg environment.

So yeah, I wouldn't be that upset if he moved, but I do think he's in a good spot at Toronto, and I do think he'll get his chance. 

I don't know whether or not he would be starting at any other MLS side, but he would certainly be higher on the depth chart and in the game day squad then he would be on TFC. If he can't even get on the bench then even a couple of injuries/international duty won't necessarily get him into the squad.

I don't see why TFC won't be dominating for the foreseeable future. They will more than likely replace their current set of DPs with equal or better when the time comes and they can afford to spend more than almost every other team.

[Chad_Impact]

I like Chapman a lot, I'de like to see him move to Spain or Italy (D2 Probs). I think his game could translate there. 

[Shortdutchcanuck]

If only CPL had started up this year Chapman would have made a fantastic loan.  Would look great in a Hamilton jersey and could be one of the early CPL stars.  (Wishful thinking as a Hamilton native--my real preference as a CMNT fan would be 3rd level Spain or Germany to continue his stalled development).

[CNMNTPERUELIGIBLE]

3 hours ago, Kadenge said:

While I agree it is beneficial to be on a winning team, practicing with players like Vazquez and Gio and win trophies, this is his 3rd season with the main team (?) and there is only so much he can improve through osmosis. He is buried in the depth chart for mids and is at an age where playing time is critical for his development. I think if a loan can be arranged for him to play in Europe he should grab it or even a move to another MLS club, where even if he does not start he can get consistent sub minutes

How about CANPL next year and for this year TFC II or any other USL club or no??... 

[Kent]

I didn’t realize his USL minutes were so low either. If he is further down the depth chart this year (will be dependent on injuries) he might get pushed down far enough that he gets more USL time.

Anyways, as with most players, I would be happy to see him in CPL next year, presuming something miraculous doesn’t happen with him at TFC this year.

[C2SKI]

Is he better than Mezquida in Vancouver? We could use another central attacking mid. 

[A_Gagne]

D1 Norway or Sweden would be a good loan destination. I think I'm in the "needs to play" camp on this one. I don't see it happening in MLS though. 

[shamrock]

9 hours ago, Yohan said:

Incorrect. Interleague loan has been allowed since 2013, just not something MLS teams do very often.

I never said it wasn't allowed. The reason is that players are under contract with MLS and not the specific club. So you could say every MLS-player is already on loan. It's impossible to loan out a player you don't own (but you could trade him, and later trade him back). 

[Kadenge]

Interesting article on Jesse Marsch re playing young homegrown players in MLS and challenging other coaches to do the same. Resonates with what we have been discussing on youth at TFC

https://www.mlssoccer.com/post/2018/02/28/jesse-marsch-urges-fellow-mls-coaches-commit-playing-young-players

[Ruffian]

18 hours ago, Kadenge said:

Interesting article on Jesse Marsch re playing young homegrown players in MLS and challenging other coaches to do the same. Resonates with what we have been discussing on youth at TFC

https://www.mlssoccer.com/post/2018/02/28/jesse-marsch-urges-fellow-mls-coaches-commit-playing-young-players

I like the fact that MLS changed it's rules with regards to selling home-grown players. Now the teams will get 100% of the money home-grown players are sold for, I believe. This creates a great business incentive to develop good players that they potentially could sell. Previously the only reason to develop players was to make the team better, but in the recent North American soccer world it is usually easier to go and find good players outside of your own system.