Justin Smith

[Bdog]

I probably mentioned this before but I played two seasons of soccer with a current NHLer, when we were 10 and 13. The first year he was our best player, he was the typical smaller but skilled/agile kid who'd deke people out easily and score a bunch of goals for us. The second year he might have been our second best player, but I'm sure he could have went pro on soccer if he focused on it. Though he's starting to kind of breakout so I'm sure he made the right choice sticking with hockey. 

The funny story: he stopped showing up to games probably half way through the season because of hockey. When playoffs came around my brother (who coached us) phoned his parents asking if he was able to make it and they said maybe, he had a hockey tournament but might have been able to show up after. He didn't show up in the end but I guess I don't blame him haha. 🤷‍♂️

[Shway]

45 minutes ago, Bdog said:

I probably mentioned this before but I played two seasons of soccer with a current NHLer, when we were 10 and 13. The first year he was our best player, he was the typical smaller but skilled/agile kid who'd deke people out easily and score a bunch of goals for us. The second year he might have been our second best player, but I'm sure he could have went pro on soccer if he focused on it. Though he's starting to kind of breakout so I'm sure he made the right choice sticking with hockey. 

The funny story: he stopped showing up to games probably half way through the season because of hockey. When playoffs came around my brother (who coached us) phoned his parents asking if he was able to make it and they said maybe, he had a hockey tournament but might have been able to show up after. He didn't show up in the end but I guess I don't blame him haha. 🤷‍♂️

Hockey is the most skilled sport by far.

[Unnamed Trialist]

5 hours ago, Shway said:

Hockey is the most skilled sport by far.

I agree the skill in hockey is outrageous. It's on late here live but yesterday I rewatched part of game 4. I've been away from Canada for a long time but I'm still amazed by how well they skate, the average level is off the charts. Then when you see the Avs swarming in overtime and you realize the conditioning + team play + way lines are put together + changes on the fly, extremely high level of play. 

But it's like a lot of sports, if you don't know you just won't see it. 

Edited June 24, 2022 by Unnamed Trialist

[Bertuzzi44]

Watching high level professional hockey up close you really see how fast the game is and how skilled and coordinated the players are. No out of bounds. Tiny puck moving at speed. Full contact. Really impressive actually.

Edited June 24, 2022 by Bertuzzi44

[Unnamed Trialist]

50 minutes ago, Bertuzzi44 said:

Watching high level professional hockey up close you really see how fast the game is and how skilled and coordinated the players are. No out of bounds. Tiny puck moving at speed. Full contact. Really impressive actually.

That is true with most sports, though for some, like football, the impact is not as high.

First time I saw pro tennis it took a while to adjust to the speed (think it was Spain playing Davis Cup).

With football we are often quite a distance from the play and don't perceive it. I am not sure it impresses people in the same way, perhaps the way it is filmed on tv does not distort it as much. People are usually more impressed by stadium atmospheres when the go for the first time.

One thing I have seen when watching elite u-16s or u19s up close is the balance, they can run through legs and not fall, the balance in a top dribble is surprising. This is a reason why people complaining about footballers going down are so idiotic, you are playing with a loose ball on your feet and using the same limbs to move quickly as you are to move the ball. 

A sport I've seen at high quality in row 5 is futsal, talking about Spanish league. I highly recommend going to see top quality futsal up close if you ever get the chance, quite the spectacle. 

[Joe MacCarthy]

On one of my channels (can't remember if it is Eurosport or Freesports) they've been showing mini football.  Don't know the difference between that, futsal or what they used to call (or maybe still do) indoor soccer.  Also starting to develop a liking for jai alai.

[Bdog]

1 hour ago, Bertuzzi44 said:

Watching high level professional hockey up close you really see how fast the game is and how skilled and coordinated the players are. No out of bounds. Tiny puck moving at speed. Full contact. Really impressive actually.

One thing I have noticed with hockey compared to soccer: plays are always so much cleaner. Most passes connect, players rarely lose the puck while stick handling, shots tend to be fairly accurate or not far off the net. 

In soccer you’ll have some games where there are tons of passes that are nowhere close to the target, shots that aren’t even close, a lack of chemistry, etc. Even at high levels it can get pretty ugly at times. 

[Unnamed Trialist]

15 minutes ago, Joe MacCarthy said:

On one of my channels (can't remember if it is Eurosport or Freesports) they've been showing mini football.  Don't know the difference between that, futsal or what they used to call (or maybe still do) indoor soccer.  Also starting to develop a liking for jai alai.

Futsal: here are the highlights with no commentary of the 1st match of the Spanish final, FCB vs Palma, from Mallorca. 2nd match tomorrow.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mF8S-akVdfs

11 is Ferrao for Barça, some say the best player in the world now (Brazilian). Also good are 7 Dyego and 9 Sergio (The Buffalo) Lozano the captain. 

Futsal court as you can see is longer and wider than basketball (and handball).

4x4 plus keepers, teams often pull their keeper for the extra attacker. 

Clock stops for all outs, fouls, every time the ball is not in play. 2 halves of 20 minutes, counting down. All corners and ins with the foot.

2 refs. 5 fouls per half; any more after that and a penalty shot is given. So teams often take their five then hold back. Yellows and reds are similar to reg football. 

I won't get into the only rule that is a bit hard, and has changed, which is when you can return the ball to the keeper.

[Joe MacCarthy]

Here is what I have been watching (not this game) just the same sport called mini football.

 

[Shway]

1 minute ago, Joe MacCarthy said:

Here is what I have been watching (not this game) just the same sport called mini football.

 

looks like 5v5 indoor soccer to me. Whats the difference?

[Unnamed Trialist]

12 hours ago, Joe MacCarthy said:

Here is what I have been watching (not this game) just the same sport called mini football.

 

Not pro in Spain at least. 

Up to age 13 they play 7 aside which is great. There's a tournament on right now in Orlando, Liga, MLS and LigaMX teams, born 2009 and after. 

[costarg]

On 6/23/2022 at 11:38 PM, Shway said:

Hockey is the most skilled sport by far.

Interesting, I don't really see it.  Having played a tonne of sports, and a lot of hockey, the thing that stands out about hockey is the quickness, but that's cause its played on skates, its obviously faster than on foot.  Moving a puck or ball with a "tool" will always be quicker than with a hand or foot (lacrosse, tennis, etc...).  It might be the fastest sport, but I wouldn't say the most skilled.

To me it seems like the simplest sport strategically speaking, there is very little "thinking" happening, it's mostly muscle memory.  The only two innovations to the game in the past 50 years were "the trap" and bigger equipment. 

This is coming from a fan, I just feel it's the most neanderthal of all sports.  Get the puck, skate, pass or dump it in.  Shoot and crash the net.  Extra if you hit a few things along the way.  Repeat.  

 

Edited June 25, 2022 by costarg

[Unnamed Trialist]

23 minutes ago, costarg said:

Interesting, I don't really see it.  Having played a tonne of sports, and a lot of hockey, the thing that stands out about hockey is the quickness, but that's cause its played on skates, its obviously faster than on foot.  Moving a puck or ball with a "tool" will always be quicker than with a hand or foot (lacrosse, tennis, etc...).  It might be the fastest sport, but I wouldn't say the most skilled.

To me it seems like the simplest sport strategically speaking, there is very little "thinking" happening, it's mostly muscle memory.  The only two innovations to the game in the past 50 years were "the trap" and bigger equipment. 

This is coming from a fan, I just feel it's the most neanderthal of all sports.  Get the puck, skate, pass or dump it in.  Shoot and crash the net.  Extra if you hit a few things along the way.  Repeat.  

 

I see what you're saying, but if you play like that, you lose. 

I'm a shitty skater, which is why I admire the skating so much. 

[Ozzie_the_parrot]

1 hour ago, costarg said:

...To me it seems like the simplest sport strategically speaking, there is very little "thinking" happening,...

Especially with the NHL version of the sport on smaller rinks.

[Buchta]

13 hours ago, Shway said:

looks like 5v5 indoor soccer to me. Whats the difference?

Canada has a minifootball team.

https://www.minifootball.ca

[vancanman]

14 hours ago, Shway said:

looks like 5v5 indoor soccer to me. Whats the difference?

Extremely loud, annoying music after a goal?

[vancanman]

1 hour ago, costarg said:

Interesting, I don't really see it.  Having played a tonne of sports, and a lot of hockey, the thing that stands out about hockey is the quickness, but that's cause its played on skates, its obviously faster than on foot.  Moving a puck or ball with a "tool" will always be quicker than with a hand or foot (lacrosse, tennis, etc...).  It might be the fastest sport, but I wouldn't say the most skilled.

To me it seems like the simplest sport strategically speaking, there is very little "thinking" happening, it's mostly muscle memory.  The only two innovations to the game in the past 50 years were "the trap" and bigger equipment. 

This is coming from a fan, I just feel it's the most neanderthal of all sports.  

Get the puck, skate, pass or dump it in.  Shoot and crash the net. Extra if you hit a few things along the way.  Repeat.  

 

I agree with you, and I'm also a fan of non-Bettman hockey, but...I see your hockey, and I raise you Aussie rules:

No offside.  No keepers. No minimum or maximum height for a goal (six points) and just get the ball between two posts that are 27 metres apart at any height, and you get a point. The ball can be played in any direction by any part of the body (must be punched from the hand).

I also like Aussie rules, but I'm attempting to out-neanderthal you.

[WestHamCanadianinOxford]

1 hour ago, costarg said:

Interesting, I don't really see it.  Having played a tonne of sports, and a lot of hockey, the thing that stands out about hockey is the quickness, but that's cause its played on skates, its obviously faster than on foot.  Moving a puck or ball with a "tool" will always be quicker than with a hand or foot (lacrosse, tennis, etc...).  It might be the fastest sport, but I wouldn't say the most skilled.

To me it seems like the simplest sport strategically speaking, there is very little "thinking" happening, it's mostly muscle memory.  The only two innovations to the game in the past 50 years were "the trap" and bigger equipment. 

This is coming from a fan, I just feel it's the most neanderthal of all sports.  Get the puck, skate, pass or dump it in.  Shoot and crash the net.  Extra if you hit a few things along the way.  Repeat.  

 

The most skilled, not sure, but I would respectfully disagree with the substance of your post. I had not watched hockey for years but, at the behest of my brother, I made the effort to watch the early Oilers games or at least extended highlights. The game was different in an number of ways since I last watched and certainly since I played or the old Oilers were changing things.  The things Connor McDavid, for instance, was doing, at speed, goes well beyond your summary of the game. In my opinion.  

Also I would say skill and game strategy are two different things.  NFL football has literal books and books and books of strategy that are a very seperate component from the skills used in play.  

[dyslexic nam]

Not trying to sound dismissive but I think the debate is a bit artificial.  Every sport played at the highest level is maximizing skills and the skillsets are always diverse.  Sometimes it can be a bit more subtle but that just means they are less obvious to those who don’t watch a lot of the sport.  They are still present.  Any time you have players who can potentially make millions of dollars by honing elite skills, you will get natural selection the drives innovation - and that happens in every sport.  I don’t see anything unique about hockey, footy or anything else that would make me think it is a more refined skillset.    

I wonder what Justin Smith thinks about this issue. 

Edited June 25, 2022 by dyslexic nam

[costarg]

13 hours ago, vancanman said:

I agree with you, and I'm also a fan of non-Bettman hockey, but...I see your hockey, and I raise you Aussie rules:

No offside.  No keepers. No minimum or maximum height for a goal (six points) and just get the ball between two posts that are 27 metres apart at any height, and you get a point. The ball can be played in any direction by any part of the body (must be punched from the hand).

I also like Aussie rules, but I'm attempting to out-neanderthal you.

Funny, I was also gonna mention Aussie rules, i also love it.  Totally fell for it while I was in Australia.

[costarg]

13 hours ago, WestHamCanadianinOxford said:

The most skilled, not sure, but I would respectfully disagree with the substance of your post. I had not watched hockey for years but, at the behest of my brother, I made the effort to watch the early Oilers games or at least extended highlights. The game was different in an number of ways since I last watched and certainly since I played or the old Oilers were changing things.  The things Connor McDavid, for instance, was doing, at speed, goes well beyond your summary of the game. In my opinion.  

Also I would say skill and game strategy are two different things.  NFL football has literal books and books and books of strategy that are a very seperate component from the skills used in play.  

Well if we're gonna use the best player in the last 20 years as an example, I'll just throw Ronaldinho in the convo, and i'll back that up with Zidane.  They can also turn the most anti-soccer minds around.  There is no one else in the hockey world who's done what McDavids doing.  He's an outlier, not the norm, and definitely not an example of what is happening in the league, he's in his own league.

[Matro25]

13 hours ago, dyslexic nam said:

Not trying to sound dismissive but I think the debate is a bit artificial.  Every sport played at the highest level is maximizing skills and the skillsets are always diverse.  Sometimes it can be a bit more subtle but that just means they are less obvious to those who don’t watch a lot of the sport.  They are still present.  Any time you have players who can potentially make millions of dollars by honing elite skills, you will get natural selection the drives innovation - and that happens in every sport.  I don’t see anything unique about hockey, footy or anything else that would make me think it is a more refined skillset.    

I wonder what Justin Smith thinks about this issue. 

He's probably thanking his parents they moved to Paris otherwise he'd be a CHL player right now.

[El Diego]

He is always looking forward, always wants to split lines, always looking to beat a man on the dribble and then go vertical. Never satisfied with a lateral or backwards ball unless that's the only real solution. 

Love this type of player running things from a deep midfield position.

[Olympique_de_Marseille]

On 5/24/2022 at 3:01 PM, Unnamed Trialist said:

I think they should loan him out for minutes, like into Ligue 2, if they don't think he can get on the pitch for the first team. 

On 6/20/2022 at 11:55 PM, Olympique_de_Marseille said:

If he can't get minutes with the first team then he should be in Ligue 2 or MLS.

Ligue 2 it is!

Nice-Matin is reporting the following:

"Chez les jeunes, Justin Smith va être prêté à Quevilly/Rouen..."

https://www.nicematin.com/amp/football/comment-lucien-favre-pourrait-retoucher-lequipe-de-logc-nice-777712

US Quevilly-Rouen Métropole were 18th out of 20 in Ligue 2 last season. They won their relegation playoff and therefore are still be in Ligue 2 and will be trying to do better this season. I think this is a team where Smith has a real chance of being a starter.

 

[toontownman]

Smith vs Abzi... nice.