Ayo Akinola

[jordan]

4 minutes ago, narduch said:

This was at LB though 

Some of it was

[BearcatSA]

In the TSN pregame, I felt JDG was quite frank with his assessment of Akinola:  no excuses given for his performance since signing his bigger money deal.

.

[narduch]

San Jose officially announced they won't pick up the buy option on his loan from TFC

[dyslexic nam]

Man I had high hopes for this guy.  

I can’t shake the feeling that he checked out a bit when he got a good pro contract with TFC.  It just seemed like he lost that competitive edge - he wasn’t in the kind of shape he needed to be in and he didn’t seem to have the level of hunger and drive required.  

Maybe that is harsh.  It is possible that he could never fully recover from the ACL injury and just couldn’t get back to where he needed to be.  But that doesn’t jive with the fact that he wasn’t in game shape when he came back. You can get fully fit after an ACL recovery - even if it limits your top end or ability to shift direction quickly.  

[Jack1997]

Kinda sad that commiting to Canada may have ended this guys career

[Obinna]

Things don't look great, but maybe all is not lost with Akinola just yet? For all we know he's starting for TFC and manages to score early. Like many forwards, he just needs one for the goals to start flowing. What he needs though is opportunity and I never thought he played enough minutes with SJ to get that goal to break things open.

What is concerning is that he has a similar resume to a guy like Jordan Hamilton at this point of his career and chances are his career will end up the same if something doesn't change.

[Dominic94]

1 hour ago, Obinna said:

Things don't look great, but maybe all is not lost with Akinola just yet? For all we know he's starting for TFC and manages to score early. Like many forwards, he just needs one for the goals to start flowing. What he needs though is opportunity and I never thought he played enough minutes with SJ to get that goal to break things open.

What is concerning is that he has a similar resume to a guy like Jordan Hamilton at this point of his career and chances are his career will end up the same if something doesn't change.

There’s about a 2 year recovery on these however and it’s very tough to recover from in general. Time will tell, I haven’t lost hope yet.

[BearcatSA]

1 hour ago, Dominic94 said:

There’s about a 2 year recovery on these however and it’s very tough to recover from in general. Time will tell, I haven’t lost hope yet.

I have had both my knees done, when I was 33 then at 49, injuries during matches.  The more recent one was nine years ago and though I was much older, the recovery was faster because the surgery and physio protocol is much better now.  People recover at different rates, definitely:  based on his current movement and agility, you wouldn't know highly mobile QB Kyler Murray of the NFL's Cardinals had an ACL rebuild eleven months ago.  That's one end of the recovery spectrum, others need more time.

 

 

[toontownman]

Might have been the same or worse but I wonder "what if" he had have moved to Vancouver when they wanted him instead or re-signing with TFC. He would have got more playtime but maybe injuries have been his biggest problem.

[Dominic94]

59 minutes ago, BearcatSA said:

I have had both my knees done, when I was 33 then at 49, injuries during matches.  The more recent one was nine years ago and though I was much older, the recovery was faster because the surgery and physio protocol is much better now.  People recover at different rates, definitely:  based on his current movement and agility, you wouldn't know highly mobile QB Kyler Murray of the NFL's Cardinals had an ACL rebuild eleven months ago.  That's one end of the recovery spectrum, others need more time.

 

 

I think to play it can be 6-8, but for full physical recovery it’s up to 2 years where you can still see improvement. Thought it was a crazy stat but yeah nope 

[jordan]

4 hours ago, Jack1997 said:

Kinda sad that commiting to Canada may have ended this guys career

What?

[BearcatSA]

2 minutes ago, Dominic94 said:

I think to play it can be 6-8, but for full physical recovery it’s up to 2 years where you can still see improvement. Thought it was a crazy stat but yeah nope 

Sometimes you never get that full recovery back but that's where the other areas of your game carry your play.  If you have good technique, craft, and savvy while not just relying on your pure athleticism, you can adjust your game and perform.

[johnyb]

On 12/1/2023 at 11:46 PM, jordan said:

What?

Pretty sure Jack was referring to him getting injured representing Canada. He was never the same since.

[Bertuzzi44]

That's just really bad luck. It is not like Canada tanked his career or something.

[VinceA]

4 hours ago, Bertuzzi44 said:

That's just really bad luck. It is not like Canada tanked his career or something.

He does join that depressing list where more often that not, dual nats who commit to us end up going on a downward trajectory in their careers.

[InglewoodJack]

On 12/1/2023 at 9:56 PM, Dominic94 said:

There’s about a 2 year recovery on these however and it’s very tough to recover from in general. Time will tell, I haven’t lost hope yet.

We see full recoveries happen more and more- NBA players like Kevin Durant and Klay Thompson were able to regain prime form after ACL (and in the latter’a case, an MCL tear as well), and these are guys that have well over a foot and typically 50+ pounds over your typical soccer player, so a lot more mass is being applied to the torn muscle, plus you’re running on hardwood, so my guess is that injury is even more healable for soccer players. The only issue is that it could severely reduce a player’s speed and abilities to pivot, make quick moves, etc.- all stuff that a striker needs to do. By now, Akinola should be fully recovered, but if he loses his speed and never regains it, he might just have to settle for a very strong career in CPL where he can use his natural talent and not worry about getting burned by opposing défenses.

 

To tie all of this back into Canada Soccer- both KD and Klay Thompson suffered their injuries while playing for the Golden State Warriors. Who was in charge of their (more specifically Klay, since he stayed with the team) recovery and clearing them to play? None other than former CANMNT legend and father of future #1 overall NHL draft pick Rick Celebrini, GSW’s head of physio.

[BearcatSA]

Legend?

[InglewoodJack]

28 minutes ago, BearcatSA said:

Legend?

Icon even

[Bertuzzi44]

5 hours ago, VinceA said:

He does join that depressing list where more often that not, dual nats who commit to us end up going on a downward trajectory in their careers.

There's a positive list there too though. Guys like Hoilett and Eustáquio for instance you could argue benefited from their Canada caps.

[Free kick]

On 12/1/2023 at 8:52 PM, Obinna said:

What is concerning is that he has a similar resume to a guy like Jordan Hamilton at this point of his career and chances are his career will end up the same if something doesn't change.

I am not of this at all.  Unlike Hamilton,  Akinola showed flashes that he can score and be an effective contributor for his MLS team.   Injuries derailed that for Akinola.  

[Obinna]

5 minutes ago, Free kick said:

I am not of this at all.  Unlike Hamilton,  Akinola showed flashes that he can score and be an effective contributor for his MLS team.   Injuries derailed that for Akinola.  

In 2020, Akinola got hot at the MLS is back tournament and uncharacteristically scored 5 goals in 3 games. We strip that out and we're left with 4 goals in 13 MLS regular season appearances. 

Stats wise, that is not much different than Jordan Hamilton scoring 4 goals in 14 MLS regular season apperances (2019).

I don't like saying this but maybe the MLS is back tournament was an anomoly for Ayo? 

I guess we could look at his 2021, before the injury, and see his 3 goals in 11 games, then argue that was on track for a statement year. Unfortunately we will never know if things played out that way.

Either way though, I hope he can rediscover his promise. I still think Hamilton was unfortunate that his Crew opportunities were limited. He had a good return in the USL following that before trying Europe. Ayo has/had a more interesting profile, but if we discount MLS is back, statwise Ayo was comparable to Hamilton pre-injury

[jdcyantsis]

16 hours ago, Obinna said:

In 2020, Akinola got hot at the MLS is back tournament and uncharacteristically scored 5 goals in 3 games. We strip that out and we're left with 4 goals in 13 MLS regular season appearances. 

Stats wise, that is not much different than Jordan Hamilton scoring 4 goals in 14 MLS regular season apperances (2019).

I don't like saying this but maybe the MLS is back tournament was an anomoly for Ayo? 

I guess we could look at his 2021, before the injury, and see his 3 goals in 11 games, then argue that was on track for a statement year. Unfortunately we will never know if things played out that way.

Either way though, I hope he can rediscover his promise. I still think Hamilton was unfortunate that his Crew opportunities were limited. He had a good return in the USL following that before trying Europe. Ayo has/had a more interesting profile, but if we discount MLS is back, statwise Ayo was comparable to Hamilton pre-injury

I mean it is pretty different from Hamilton considering Ayo was doing that at 20 versus Hamilton doing it at 23 and that's before considering you've completely thrown out a batch of games just because he did too well. Sure a run of 5 goals in 3 games probably isn't indicative of talent level of a striker anywhere in the world, but I'm not sure why you'd throw those goals out entirely. Big picture, he scored 9 goals in 16 games against MLS teams at age 20, a decently impressive feat. There's a difference between discounting and disregarding entirely.

[VinceA]

17 hours ago, Bertuzzi44 said:

There's a positive list there too though. Guys like Hoilett and Eustáquio for instance you could argue benefited from their Canada caps.

I feel the opposite on Hoilett. He was a Premier League player who was rejecting Canada calls, and then committed while in the Championship and then sort of just became a decent Champipnship player.

He had one season in the Premier with Cardiff but it was pretty forgettable.

 

My point is more it's the norm to go downward

We were so excited for so many guys who committed to us and then they just stopped getting better.

Aird turned into an decent CPLer after failing to make Ranger's team, Akindele went from ROTY in MLS to an average striker. Ugbo seems to be going in a bad direction too.

Those are just off the top of my head.

 

[Obinna]

1 hour ago, jdcyantsis said:

I mean it is pretty different from Hamilton considering Ayo was doing that at 20 versus Hamilton doing it at 23 and that's before considering you've completely thrown out a batch of games just because he did too well. Sure a run of 5 goals in 3 games probably isn't indicative of talent level of a striker anywhere in the world, but I'm not sure why you'd throw those goals out entirely. Big picture, he scored 9 goals in 16 games against MLS teams at age 20, a decently impressive feat. There's a difference between discounting and disregarding entirely.

You're right. I guess I put an asterisk next to it because it was a unique circumstance (tournament ball essentially) with all games played at the same venue, without no fans or travel, etc. I mean, goals are goals and he deserves credit for them, but clearly the consistency wasn't there since everything he did after was pretty average, right?  

Actually, taking a closer look, it was an explosion of 5 over 2 games, because the final group stage game and the knockout loss to NYCFC he went goalless.

And aren't we nitpicking a bit when we say doing it at 20 is entirely different than doing it at 23? It's slightly more impressive, sure, but we are talking about average numbers here. 

I will stick by my choice to compare Hamilton and Ayo the way I have, but I will also acknowledge that his goals at the MLS is back tournament were super impressive. He deserved all the hype he received at the time.

 

[Bigandy]

3 hours ago, VinceA said:

I feel the opposite on Hoilett. He was a Premier League player who was rejecting Canada calls, and then committed while in the Championship and then sort of just became a decent Champipnship player.

He had one season in the Premier with Cardiff but it was pretty forgettable.

 

My point is more it's the norm to go downward

We were so excited for so many guys who committed to us and then they just stopped getting better.

Aird turned into an decent CPLer after failing to make Ranger's team, Akindele went from ROTY in MLS to an average striker. Ugbo seems to be going in a bad direction too.

Those are just off the top of my head.

 

Interesting thought. If you expand it to duals and not just youth internationals switching

Up: 
Brym
staq
kone
david
spoony? - neutral maybe?

Down:
akindele
Aird- if he counts
ugbo
Akinola
 corbeanu
arfield
guti
sturing
tabla
busti

Neutral:
Hoilett
Vitoria

My big takeaway is that almost all of these guys ups or downs can be predicted with or without playing for CMNT. Guys at the end of careers or beginnings, prospects with low liklihood of making it as a star etc.. Are there any examples where CMNT really helped or hindered these guys... maybe staq and kone?