Steven Vitória

[Bison44]

Sure Vitoria is older, and mb done with the CMNT, but Miller might be better now then when he was then.  McGraw cant be judged completely on his first cameos, he is mid 20's same as Miller and is also maturing and getting better. Fudge rolls/Bombito are in the wings, Waterman has now been a MLS starter for 3 years and should be hitting his prime.  Yeah it sucks the guy who anchored the back 3 will be gone, but you adjust, adapt to the next gen of guys in their mid-late 20's for the next cycle.   

Kadenge said we would need better to compete for top 3, Even if you say our CB's now are a lot worse (I wouldnt say a lot) we should still be in the mix for a top 3 if the other positions pull their weight.  I would argue we've dropped more at Keeper, Borjans play is going down almost as fast as Vitorias and all we have to replace him is a good MLS keeper (take your pick), not a guy with champions league experience like Borjan.    

[Olympique_de_Marseille]

3 hours ago, Olympique_de_Marseille said:

Vitória started for GD Chaves and was subbed out at the 65th minute in a 0 - 3 loss to Sporting CP.

Good moment from him ⬆️

 

The three Sporting goals:

 

 

 

Edited January 14 by Olympique_de_Marseille

[Ruffian]

On 1/12/2024 at 11:36 PM, Bison44 said:

Fudge rolls/Bombito are in the wings,

*Fig Rolls

[Bigandy]

On 1/13/2024 at 9:23 PM, Olympique_de_Marseille said:

Good moment from him ⬆️

 

The three Sporting goals:

 

 

 

That left back is brutal. Didnt track his runner on the second goal and heads the ball to the top of the box on the 3rd..... amateur level stuff

[Olympique_de_Marseille]

9 hours ago, Kadenge said:

Vitoria starting for Chaves vs Rio Ave

Played a full match.

Should he have scored on that rebound shot from the penalty (first vid)?

https://www.abola.pt/futebol/noticias/chaves-rio-ave-em-tras-os-montes-mandou-jhonatan-2024012116362816346

His control was very good; mayyybe he could have put a little more pace on it but the keeper's save was fantastic.

 

 

 

Edit:

Also, Transfermarkt has been updated. As you'd expect for a player of his age, his contract expires at the end of June.

Edited January 22 by Olympique_de_Marseille

[jordan]

Goal today 

https://x.com/vsports_pt/status/1752818476803092765?s=46&t=KtwBDROwUH8sPUlYu2GlIA 

[Olympique_de_Marseille]

39 minutes ago, kacbru said:

and he scores in the 64'.  Ends 1-1 after 90+15.

Yellow in 70', second yellow in 90+10'.

Goal off a corner: 

 

And as @kacbru said, a red card right at the death, so he will miss the next match.

[kacbru]

1 minute ago, Olympique_de_Marseille said:

And as @kacbru said, a red card right at the death, so he will miss the next match.

Just proves he knows how to manage his 37-year old legs.

[Olympique_de_Marseille]

1 minute ago, kacbru said:

Just proves he knows how to manage his 37-year old legs.

Probably thinking to himself, another 90 min on Sunday?

[Unnamed Trialist]

14 minutes ago, Olympique_de_Marseille said:

And as @kacbru said, a red card right at the death, so he will miss the next match.

Geez the teammate he jumps with is even taller than him. 

Can hear the Chaves fans chanting in the background.

Very bad result for Braga trying to catch the top 3.

[Obinna]

World Cup veteran Steven Vitoria with the goal vs Braga.

Every season it seems he's good for at least one goal against a big Portuguese club, it seems. 

[Obinna]

Just taking a peek at Vitoria's stats and it has me wondering.....where does he rank in terms of All-time Canadian CBs?

Now, obviously this would be subjective and people will have different ways to grade this, but here are some of my thoughts...

• World Cup 
  • He played 3 games, with the most successful team we've had in the tournament (by virtue of scoring a goal).
• Caps
  • 46 ...with 5 goals. Similar stats to guys like Jason DeVos, David Edgar, Andre Hainault, and Dejan Jakovic. 
    • But below Kevin McKenna and surely a few others I am not familiar with (can the OGs help out here?)
• Club
  • At this point Vitoria has played well over 100 games in the Primeria Liga, along with over 30 games in the Ekstraklasa for what that's worth
    • How do we feel that ranks compared to some of the other candidates?

Without known much about guys like Samuel (was he a CB) who amassed 82 caps and seems to have had a similar career to Vitoria clubwise, if you replace Benfica with PSV and Primeria Liga with Eredivisie, I would need some help filling in the gaps, but just based on the players I do know, I would say he should be ahead of Edgar, Hainault, Jakovic for sure.

McKenna and De Vos? I am more hesitant. Neither played in the World Cup, but both arguably had better club careers, especially McKenna given his time in the Bundesliga. De Vos also won the Gold Cup. 

So what do you guys think?

Also......funny going back to the first pages of this thread.....some of the comments were quite entertaining to read:

• I could never support him. ever.
• No thanks. We're good.
• Surely being docile little bovines for a player as mediocre as Vitoria will just increase the contempt decent players feel for us
• He's a scumbag and I would likely shout very bad things at him even in a Canada shirt if he was called

I wonder if the guys who said those things still hold his decision to play for Portugal at the U20s against him, despite all the good he's done for Canada since then. And if so, do they factor that into their ranking? It's subjective after all. 

[The Real Marc]

He's done well for us. I am happy he came around. But do I still hold choosing Portugal against him? Yeah, sure I do. He turned us down multiple times. Represented Portugal at tournament we hosted. Those weren't youthful flights of fancy. He only chose us when all other paths were at an end. It's not the be all and end all, but does it cloud? Compared to those that wouldn't or couldn't play footsie with other nations, yes.

Edited February 28 by The Real Marc

[Alex]

Kevin McKenna played many games at striker, hence his goal total.

Edited February 28 by Alex

[Obinna]

9 minutes ago, The Real Marc said:

He's done well for us. I am happy he came around. But do I still hold choosing Portugal against him? Yeah, sure I do. He turned us down multiple times. Represented Portugal at tournament we hosted. Those weren't youthful flights of fancy. He only chose us when all other paths were at an end. It's not the be all and end all, but does it cloud? Compared to those that wouldn't or couldn't play footsie with other nations, yes.

Thanks for sharing.

Everyone is different, so I can't argue your feelings on it, but I am curious about the bolded part.

True he chose us when all other paths came to an end, but how do you know those weren't youthful flights of fancy when he was under 20 years of age? And he always could have just opted not to play for Canada when his Portuguese road came to an end. 

[rkomar]

He is also an important leader on the team.  If the players respect him, then he's okay in my books.

[BearcatSA]

He'll be starting against T&T, along with Larin, David, Buchanon, Davies, Eustaquio, Koné, Johnston, Laryea, Miller, and Borjan (if all are healthy). 

I really don't see any surprises here.  Hopefully, these guys (plus the usual subs) will deliver the goods on Frisco.

 

[SthMelbRed]

I'm 49 years old. The two best Canadian CBs, for me, are Randy Samuel and Jason DeVos, even if Vitoria's club career did peak higher than JDV's did.

[nolando]

2 hours ago, SthMelbRed said:

I'm 49 years old. The two best Canadian CBs, for me, are Randy Samuel and Jason DeVos, even if Vitoria's club career did peak higher than JDV's did.

Agreed. McKenna also Top 5

[costarg]

15 hours ago, BearcatSA said:

He'll be starting against T&T, along with Larin, David, Buchanon, Davies, Eustaquio, Koné, Johnston, Laryea, Miller, and Borjan (if all are healthy). 

I really don't see any surprises here.  Hopefully, these guys (plus the usual subs) will deliver the goods on Frisco.

 

Please say it ain't so.  If this does happen, it means we need to play at Copa - against even tougher competition - with the exact same lineup and formation.  There will be no time or matches to try new combinations and tactics.  Is that really our best option to regain some competitiveness?

Like it or not, we need to try new stuff now vs lesser competition.  Doing the same again would be proof Biello is just holding on for dear life and not the man we need moving forward.  

- Borjan and Vitoria need to be on the bench, but not on the field. 

- We know 2 strikers is not ideal vs better teams, our midfield has been getting walked all over.  4-5-1 is the way.

- We don't have much choice but to use the T&T match to warm up for Copa.  We "should" still manage to win, but we need to show progress.

[costarg]

22 hours ago, Obinna said:

Just taking a peek at Vitoria's stats and it has me wondering.....where does he rank in terms of All-time Canadian CBs?

Now, obviously this would be subjective and people will have different ways to grade this, but here are some of my thoughts...

• World Cup 
  • He played 3 games, with the most successful team we've had in the tournament (by virtue of scoring a goal).
• Caps
  • 46 ...with 5 goals. Similar stats to guys like Jason DeVos, David Edgar, Andre Hainault, and Dejan Jakovic. 
    • But below Kevin McKenna and surely a few others I am not familiar with (can the OGs help out here?)
• Club
  • At this point Vitoria has played well over 100 games in the Primeria Liga, along with over 30 games in the Ekstraklasa for what that's worth
    • How do we feel that ranks compared to some of the other candidates?

Without known much about guys like Samuel (was he a CB) who amassed 82 caps and seems to have had a similar career to Vitoria clubwise, if you replace Benfica with PSV and Primeria Liga with Eredivisie, I would need some help filling in the gaps, but just based on the players I do know, I would say he should be ahead of Edgar, Hainault, Jakovic for sure.

McKenna and De Vos? I am more hesitant. Neither played in the World Cup, but both arguably had better club careers, especially McKenna given his time in the Bundesliga. De Vos also won the Gold Cup. 

So what do you guys think?

Also......funny going back to the first pages of this thread.....some of the comments were quite entertaining to read:

• I could never support him. ever.
• No thanks. We're good.
• Surely being docile little bovines for a player as mediocre as Vitoria will just increase the contempt decent players feel for us
• He's a scumbag and I would likely shout very bad things at him even in a Canada shirt if he was called

I wonder if the guys who said those things still hold his decision to play for Portugal at the U20s against him, despite all the good he's done for Canada since then. And if so, do they factor that into their ranking? It's subjective after all. 

Ranking him as a CB and overall caps is kinda difficult.  But for his contribution and presence, I put him down as one of the most important guys in the run up to WC 2022, so he's pretty high up on my all-time CANMNT list.

That being said, sticking around longer will create resentment and tarnish his rep.  We're there now, time to move on.

Edit: feel I need to add the importance of his unique skillset.  A pillar at the back, dominates the air space, calm and organized.  Also a potent goal threat.  He was exactly what we needed for WCQ.  Just wish we could rewind another 10 years and find the ideal partner in a 2 CB system.

Edited February 29 by costarg
Addition

[The Real Marc]

22 hours ago, Obinna said:

Thanks for sharing.

Everyone is different, so I can't argue your feelings on it, but I am curious about the bolded part.

True he chose us when all other paths came to an end, but how do you know those weren't youthful flights of fancy when he was under 20 years of age? And he always could have just opted not to play for Canada when his Portuguese road came to an end. 

Some guys showed when it suited them. Some showed up from when they were needed.

Vitoria is somewhere in the middle, joining us at age 28(?) after multiple rejections, when his big club career was toast and his stint in MLS was a failure.

I think it's rational for players with options to consider them; similarly, I think it's rational (but not mandatory, of course) to give the guys that have been with us the whole way through just a bit more credit.

 

[BrennanFan]

Randy Samuel was technically a more well rounded CB.  Vitoria, given he anchored us to a world cup, I'd put second all time, above deVos and McKenna.  Those 2 built their reputations on being passionate vocal leaders and captains, but they both had their limitations and Vitoria is/was simply better on the ball and in the air than they were.  Jakovic, Edgar, Menezes, Watson would be third tier for us - and they'd all be starters for us today easily.  

[Obinna]

2 hours ago, The Real Marc said:

Some guys showed when it suited them. Some showed up from when they were needed.

Vitoria is somewhere in the middle, joining us at age 28(?) after multiple rejections, when his big club career was toast and his stint in MLS was a failure.

I think it's rational for players with options to consider them; similarly, I think it's rational (but not mandatory, of course) to give the guys that have been with us the whole way through just a bit more credit.

 

Do you feel this way about Junior? 

[InglewoodJack]

On this note, where do we think Kamal Miller ends up in our all time CBs when it’s all said and done? I feel like he’s going to leave an underrated legacy and only really get appreciated years after he hangs them up.