Next CanMNT manager (Herdman to TFC)

[Obinna]

11 minutes ago, Watchmen said:

I think in someways, Marsch is actually a higher profile target than Canada could normally get: a manager who knows the region and has high profile managerial experience. I'm not really sure he was given enough time at Leipzig, and he was at least a bit unlucky at Leeds. And let's be clear: he was probably quickly dismissed from both positions at least in part because he was an American trying to manage in much more traditional football countries.

At the same time, Marsch is a bit stuck with his career. There's probably not enough interest in him from the "big 5" leagues, but he also probably doesn't want to drop too far either. But the chance to manage a guaranteed WC/Copa participant is probably appealing to him, even if the salary we could provide is below what he might normally want.

The part I'm not sure on is what he's like tactically. Because that was ultimately Herdman's problem, I think it's Biellos problem, and it's why I wouldn't be taking Wheldon or Smyrniotis right now.

Good post. I think you've nicely described why a coach like Marsch is even interested.

Indeed, he's a bit stuck career wise, I believe, and hence this post would be a good way to get back onto the scene.

And for us, it's indeed a higher profile target than usual. How many Canadian managers have coached in the EPL, Bundesliga, and Champions League, and who also knows the language, the region and even has experience coaching in Canada. He's young as well, so on paper it'd be a really strong appointment for Canada.

For Marsch it would be a chance to coach at the World Cup, a rare opportunity for someone who flamed out of two European club jobs back-to-back. This works for both parties, I think.

BUT I share your reservations on the tactical side. Despite having one of the best, if not the best, coaching resumes for an American, the Americans by and large don't want him in the role, as they fear he'd be tactically inflexible. Maybe though his time away would see him try a new approach.....be it with Canada or another Country/Club. 

[GasPed]

1 hour ago, Obinna said:

Obviously we want coaches with achievements and not failures, but consider me someone unconcerned that Marsch flamed out in the Bundesliga and the prem. 

It's interesting - I thought I'd take a look at Marsch's records in both BuLi and EPL, with a view towards the performance of his teams both before and after he arrived:

RB Leipzig: (W-D-L)

• 20/21 Nagelsmann 28-8-12 (1.92 PPG)
• 21/22 Marsch 7-4-9 (1.25 PPG)
• 21/22 Tedesco 17-5-5 (1.87 PPG)

Leeds: (W-D-L)

• 21/22 Bielsa 7-8-15 (0.97 PPG)
• 21/22 & 22/23 Marsch 11-10-16 (1.16 PPG)
• 22/23 Assorted coaches 3-4-12 (0.68 PPG)

Clearly the dip in form for Leipzig while Marsch was at the helm is a big concern.  I really don't know what exactly transpired there but there were lots of rumours about Marsch's focus on a high press just not being suited to Leipzig's personnel and he kept trying to fit his square peg into the round hole.

That said, I was also under the impression that his time at Leeds was an even worse tire fire, but the numbers don't seem to bear that out.  In fact it looks like he fared reasonably well relative to his predecessor and successors.  Maybe someone with more insight could comment on it.  

[toontownman]

I wonder if the roles were reversed and Christiansen was American and Marsch Danish, the latter would be the sexy choice? Likewise if they just switched resumes.

I think we also need to stop downplaying the job and how attractive we are tbh. 

- World Cup hosts 

- Incredible generation of talent 

- Copa 

- top line friendlies and more likely in the pipeline.

- a continent that is only growing and improving. 

While the pay likely won't be the highest it's clearly not going to be the lowest. 

Again, I don't think he is the worst choice but I fervently believe we could do better than Marsch and find someone more inspiring that this moment deserves to help take our program forward and get fans and players excited again.

It's a very big hire, given all the other pieces already coming together are so big and positive.

[One American]

12 hours ago, Sal333 said:

He's a bad fit for the USMNT because you don't want to lose.  Marsch must be one of the most overrated coaches in the last decade.

What I mean is that the US didn't raise a generation of players with Champions League level skill only so that we can feast on hustling, pressing and turnovers. HIs antipathy towards Gio is point 1. Sooner or later, he was going to bench Gio in favor of Brendan Aaronson. And that was just going to set off new drama.

But I could see his style possibly working for Canada, which has a few piano players and a fair number of piano movers. Plus Canada has a lot of speed and can cover a lot of ground.   Not saying Canada should go that way and hire Marsch, or that Canada fans should want to go that way, But I do think it might be a better fit. 

Edited April 24 by One American

[Ivan]

29 minutes ago, One American said:

What I mean is that the US didn't raise a generation of players with Champions League level skill only so that we can feast on hustling, pressing and turnovers. HIs antipathy towards Gio is point 1. Sooner or later, he was going to bench Gio in favor of Brendan Aaronson. And that was just going to set off new drama.

But I could see his style possibly working for Canada, which has a few piano players and a fair number of piano movers. Plus Canada has a lot of speed and can cover a lot of ground.   Not saying Canada should go that way and hire Marsch, or that Canada fans should want to go that way, But I do think it might be a better fit. 

The US "raised" a generation of Champions League players?  Surely you mean "recruited".  😏

[WestHamCanadianinOxford]

55 minutes ago, toontownman said:

I wonder if the roles were reversed and Christiansen was American and Marsch Danish, the latter would be the sexy choice? Likewise if they just switched resumes.

Not sure I understand this.

Americans are certainly not considered sexy in football, are they?   Look at Pulisic.  (Maybe I just remember Super Jonny Spector being always called out as the nerdiest player at West Ham)

And if they switched resumes, they would be different coaches with different histories.  How do you not judge on that?

 

But on resumes - Christiansen has coached at a level lower than Marsch, consistently through his career. 

In fact they coached the same team, for almost the same number of games before being sacked.  The difference being Leeds were in the Championship with Christiansen.  

And UAE, Cyprus and the Belgian second division ( USG did amazing the year after he left) are lower levels than MLS, Austria and Bundesliga.

But the biggest thing to me is that his style suits our players less than Marsch's. 

 

Curious,who would be a big hire in your mind?

[Vasi]

How funny would all of this Marsch debate be if he is not the American candidate?  

I'm expecting some news to leak by friday. 

[gator]

1 minute ago, Vasi said:

How funny would all of this Marsch debate be if he is not the American candidate?  

I'm expecting some news to leak by friday. 

It's going to be Vanney isn't it?

[JAVIERF]

Neill Lennon. Is the front runner according to La Red 

[JAVIERF]

The problem is had a thing for mistresses as any Irishman of good will.

[Atlantic]

1 hour ago, Vasi said:

How funny would all of this Marsch debate be if he is not the American candidate?  

I'm expecting some news to leak by friday. 

I doubt it but outside shot of it being Hugo Perez exists 

[toontownman]

3 hours ago, WestHamCanadianinOxford said:

Not sure I understand this.

Americans are certainly not considered sexy in football, are they?   Look at Pulisic.  (Maybe I just remember Super Jonny Spector being always called out as the nerdiest player at West Ham)

And if they switched resumes, they would be different coaches with different histories.  How do you not judge on that?

 

But on resumes - Christiansen has coached at a level lower than Marsch, consistently through his career. 

In fact they coached the same team, for almost the same number of games before being sacked.  The difference being Leeds were in the Championship with Christiansen.  

And UAE, Cyprus and the Belgian second division ( USG did amazing the year after he left) are lower levels than MLS, Austria and Bundesliga.

But the biggest thing to me is that his style suits our players less than Marsch's. 

 

Curious,who would be a big hire in your mind?

Mine was Badly worded. I think both are similar, as you say Marsch has a better club record but no international experience like Christiansen. However from what I have seen here and on twitter Christiansen is the romantic and sexy choice while there is more skepticism with Marsch. If Marsch was Danish or to be more blunt just not American, I think he would be the sexier choice of those two.

More simply put I guess I'm asking is Christiansen really a better choice than Marsch or is the red white and blue mist taking hold. You answered that question well even while being confused by my general grasp of basic English and oafish questioning lol 

 

 

[Joe MacCarthy]

 

[gigi riva]

42 minutes ago, Joe MacCarthy said:

 

Will be a interesting pick if Marsch gets the job. I am sure he will motivated to stick it to the Yanks .  Like the guys said he is not the most flexible manager out there and that kind of concerns me .

[Unnamed Trialist]

Dies Marsch have a group of assistants he usually works with?

[Shway]

https://www.standard.co.uk/sport/football/canada-solskjaer-manager-mourinho-lampard-b1153814.html

Mourinho is a "name" I would've like to see because of his prestige and his style of play that I think would benefit our players.

Ole....welp, I'll take him over Marsch is all I'll say about that.

[Sal333]

8 hours ago, Joe MacCarthy said:

 

I respect Herc's take on most things soccer but I disagree with him when he says Marsch will be good for Canada. And the funny thing is I disagree because of the reason he uses to justify us hiring J.M. Marsch is a one trick pony. He only knows how to play one way. Herc contrasted him with Herdman who he called a chameleon. Herdman would adapt to the opponent. Marsch wants the opponents to play his way. That approach would work if he had France, or Argentina but not Canada. The real strength of the Canadian players is they are adaptable. They can switch systems.

Edited April 25 by Sal333

[PastPros]

I get "Toronto Blue Jays chasing big name free agent" vibes whenever there are stories like this.

Leak some big names and settle on Biello or Smyrniotis. Throw up your arms and say "We tried! Market is competitive, yadda yadda..."

[WestHamCanadianinOxford]

1 hour ago, Shway said:

https://www.standard.co.uk/sport/football/canada-solskjaer-manager-mourinho-lampard-b1153814.html

Mourinho is a "name" I would've like to see because of his prestige and his style of play that I think would benefit our players.

Ole....welp, I'll take him over Marsch is all I'll say about that.

We know why.  

Solskjær is interesting, had some great and horrible moments at Man U but never really looked in charge, in my memory.  Not great at Cardiff and a did decently in 2 longish stretches at Molde, which is the only place he won senior trophies (not sure if we judge that the same as Marsch in Austria)

But certainly worked with some of the best in the world.  Whether that juice translate outside Man U circles, not sure.  It's been a long time since he coached and a very long time for his playing days to be a factor in garnering respect. 

Tactically? Can't say I remember much other than standard 4231, relying good to excellent mobile forwards and very good #10s.  

1 hour ago, Sal333 said:

I respect Herc's take on most things soccer but I disagree with him when he says Marsch will be good for Canada. And the funny thing is I disagree because of the reason he uses to justify us hiring J.M. Marsch is a one trick pony. He only knows how to play one way. Herc contrasted him with Herdman who he called a chameleon. Herdman would adapt to the opponent. Marsch wants the opponents to play his way. That approach would work if he had France, or Argentina but not Canada. The real strength of the Canadian players is they are adaptable. They can switch systems.

Respectfully its not a strength and has been a weakness.  Doing "whatever" with Davies is not what we need, for instance. We need a clear defined plan with what to do with our talented players.  The cart leading the horse is what made a road even tougher at the World Cup and saw us struggle afterwards.  

Edited April 25 by WestHamCanadianinOxford

[InglewoodJack]

I wonder what “contacted” in this scenario means. Did they send an email? Are they in talks and these guys haven’t said no yet? Is leaking this to the press the sports version of “kindly circling back on my previous email”?

[BearcatSA]

I am curious as to what terms for this contract will be (not that we'll every really find out).  I think if the contract concludes following completion of WC 2026, then a bigger name coach is going to be wanting more serious coin up front but also in severance should the program decide to go into a different direction with a new coach , say, six months before the tourney begins.  I wonder how a cash strapped organization navigates that.

[toontownman]

Of course there is nothing to say any of these "leaked" or reported names are who is being spoken to. Most likely it is not. However, the names mentioned so far are completely scatter gun if taken at face value. 

If Marsch and Ole are on the list but they also asked Mourinho..Thats quite the jump in experience and level. There are probably at least 50-100 other available managers out there that bridge the gap between the special one and Marsch and Ole. 

Quite possible they sounded out everyone at the top (like Mourinho)and worked their way down the list, now the level we have reached after the no's is Ole/Marsch/Karanka/Clement.

Marsch is the best option if thats the list imo. Clement has a really interesting career and experience but ultimately does do great on his own and was last assistant to Lampard who reportedly turned us down lol. Ole is a hard pass. Karanka falls out with high brass all the time and would likely last 5 minutes with the CSA!

We will hopefully be put out of our misery in a week or so and they can announce someone, (that isn't biello). The fact Canadian coaches being considered was a dropped narrative after KJ's last report gives me hope we will get someone at least a bit more succesful and experienced than Biello at the higer level.

[MtlMario]

The way it looks it won't be Mauro or any Canadian coach at this point. Too many international names out at this point. What's the CSA going to say " we interviewed all these coaches and  (any Cdn coach) is the most qualified. I think a Cdn coach would be good for us after the 2026 WC.

[Kadenge]

3 hours ago, PastPros said:

I get "Toronto Blue Jays chasing big name free agent" vibes whenever there are stories like this.

Leak some big names and settle on Biello or Smyrniotis. Throw up your arms and say "We tried! Market is competitive, yadda yadda..."

I think it's very unlikely that  Biello gets the permanent job and more unlikely re Smyrniotis. Kevin Blue will want to hire "his guy" and continue to make changes that moves the program upwards vs maintaining the status quo. It's a big decision and I'm sure he knows it.

 

[toontownman]

It's either press nonsense or a ton of spin from the CSA to make Marsch look like the best appointment. I like Clement as his experience coaching vastly out does everyone on the list but he has been poor anytime he has been the top guy and managing.

Zero chance we seriously sounded out Mourinho. If we did then there is absolutely no chance we end up with the shortlist that is being currebtly reported. If we were serious about paying the type of money needed for mourinho then there are surely much better qualified people out there that would take the job if mourinho type of money is there. 

I'm going with press nonsense (out of hope) as the names bandied around simply don't make much sense unless they asked the opinion of someone that's been asleep 6 years as to who is a hip up and coming manager that's available.