TFC 2021 Season

[Ivan]

17 minutes ago, Bison44 said:

Well there is one vote of confidence in Armas ^^^^.  

Make that two. Agree completely with what Freekick said above.

[Big_M]

Chris Armas named Toronto FC Head Coach

[Gian-Luca]

An underwhelming choice on the face of it, but

NYRB fans said one of his problems was playing players out of position and not playing star players. While the former doesn't sound promising, the latter actually does if those star players are Altidore & Bradley. The latter should be rested while the former tends to rest himself by not being healthy, mind you...

[Gian-Luca]

I see that Luke Wileman is pronouncing his name as "Arm-Ass" with the emphasis on "Ass" - I don't think that is how most of the Americans pronounce his name (and it's not hard to figure out why). I hope that isn't a foreboding for his tenure as coach.

[Dominic94]

Listen the kids need to play and we need CB’s so I don’t see why Nelsen can’t learn.

[gator]

I'm not real excited about this choice but if he helps the young Canadians develop I will be pleased!

[SpursFlu]

18 hours ago, Gian-Luca said:

I see that Luke Wileman is pronouncing his name as "Arm-Ass" with the emphasis on "Ass" - I don't think that is how most of the Americans pronounce his name (and it's not hard to figure out why). I hope that isn't a foreboding for his tenure as coach.

We thought Alphonso Davis was annoying

[Dominic94]

So I looked at some of the quotes and stuff out on Twitter:

The youth movement is underway, the team will get younger and faster and be a more in your face team. I think this is great and it shows why Vanney left. Clearly they want the kids playing more and that’s a great thing because there’s a lot of them and some really good ones who do need to play.

I think we can expect the club to move on from a Bradley or an Altidore sooner than later. I think a lot of the vets on this team should be worried and probably are.

The fact is that TFC has a monopoly on Toronto and can easily extend that into anywhere in Canada. They haven’t used this and some good players have fallen by the way side. 
 

MLSE should want to recoup its investment and it has young assets that can go for 10M+ If developed.  
 

The Red Bulls haven’t won it’s true, but they’ve always been good and smart. MLSE will clearly still authorize 3 dps but maybe not spending to the cap and using the youth instead. 
 

I don’t think I’d ever say this but it looks like this is going to be great for Canadian soccer as we will see them push fo develop their academy talent, which is something they’ve never done and should have been the best at awhile ago. The Red Bull model has produced some good young players and let’s be real here Caden Clark looks legit and they never would have thrown him in at TFC under Vanney and this is a kid who’s moving to Europe for a solid to big fee shortly. 
 

Most are tired of seeing Bradley, zavaleta and Delgado start over Priso, Dunn and Fraser. When your best player says the kids need a shot, it’s probably true. Also, some believe that the current crop of TFC youngsters might be the best in MLS. Let’s see them prove it.

in the words of John, more Osorios, more often.

[Gian-Luca]

Watching this interview:

makes it difficult to see how Bradley and Altidore can possibly fit into Armas' professed preferred style of pressing and higher intensity, despite all of Bradley's public praise & alleged past bonds with his new coach. Bradley doesn't have the legs for that anymore and Altidore won't last more than 45 minutes in any game that he is healthy in playing that style. That presumably is going to mean a lot more minutes for the likes of Priso & Okello (not necessarily for Fraser, though I see Matt Doyle is again suggesting he should be moved to CB).

[Dominic94]

2 hours ago, Gian-Luca said:

Watching this interview:

makes it difficult to see how Bradley and Altidore can possibly fit into Armas' professed preferred style of pressing and higher intensity, despite all of Bradley's public praise & alleged past bonds with his new coach. Bradley doesn't have the legs for that anymore and Altidore won't last more than 45 minutes in any game that he is healthy in playing that style. That presumably is going to mean a lot more minutes for the likes of Priso & Okello (not necessarily for Fraser, though I see Matt Doyle is again suggesting he should be moved to CB).

I don’t see how much of the current core can stay and play this way

[Unnamed Trialist]

We saw in Vancouver that the apparent pressure of CPL, however minor (and with Fraser Valley not panning out at all), and a general opinion that we had to have more Canadians (which I believe was derived from their polls of fans, which they do regularly), led to a positive response in terms of Canadian players. Having a Canadian coach helps that, but no reason a non-Canadian could not execute it. 

Were Whitecaps being preemptive? Was their move unnecessary? Were bad results also a factor in fans wanting more Canadians, thinking that if we have to put up with hard times at least do it developing our youth?

So I wonder if the York rebranding and the clear intention to go for the Greater Toronto fan has caused a reaction inside TFC/MLSE. Hard to say. Even if they perceive they could lose 10-15% of their in-stadium fans, is that enough to push them to make a new commitment to young Canadian players? I am not sure. 

Thing with the CPL, it is too young. I find it hard to imagine it would be a threat and could alter an MLS team policy. The more reasonable approach would be to wait and only if fan support drops, respond. However, clearly in its first year York9 was one of the weakest presences in any market. If they alter that radically, and their ticket prices are clearly below TFCs, along with a better in-stadium experience, then for sure they could cut into a piece of that TFC pie. 

We might also ask if Impact's apparently absurd insistence on rebranding has to do with preparing for competition in Montreal?

So the hypothesis: CPL promises competition for soccer fans in Canadian MLS markets, and the MLS teams are reacting earlier rather than later. 

Edited January 15, 2021 by Unnamed Trialist

[El Hombre]

16 hours ago, Unnamed Trialist said:

So the hypothesis: CPL promises competition for soccer fans in Canadian MLS markets, and the MLS teams are reacting earlier rather than later. 

I'd be surprised if CPL is even a blip on the MLS teams' radar.  I think each team has different reasoning:

Vancouver: MDS was perceived to be the best coaching candidate available at the time.  He always plays Canadians, no matter where he goes.  The fact that so many Canadians have seen the pitch under him is not a surprise.

Montreal: Joey loves his European football.  It was only a matter of time before the Impact name was tossed aside for the sake of legitimacy.  (Note: this is complete speculation based on nothing on my part)

Toronto: Again, pure speculation (with a healthy dose of optimism), but I am moderately hopeful that Toronto has a new approach because it is looking into a new revenue stream.  With Davies emerging last year, particularly over the summer, and David being sold for such an exorbitant amount, I don't think it would be too far of a stretch for Curtis to look at his club and not at least consider that they might be sitting on a couple sales.  Will they be 30 million Euro sales?  No.  But you put together 4 or 5 pretty good sales over the next 4 years and you'll be doing alright.  Again, this is based on absolutely nothing, but I could see it being a possibility.  Also, having your best player go to the press and tell everyone that the club should be playing more kids doesn't hurt.

All that to say that I would bet that competition from CPL is pretty far down the pecking order in terms of perceived threats to the MLS teams.

[SoccMan]

I think they hire Armas for a few reasons, Covid played a factor no money coming in, Ali has worked with Armas at Red Bulls , Armas has coached in MLS and did fairly well, TFC probably finally are seeing some good young players with a lot of potential coming through so they want to give these players a chance and Armas has shown when at New York RB he can work with young players from the academy. Armas is not the sexy choice for an organization that TFC projects to be but I guess under the circumstances was probably a choice that makes some sort of sense I guess.

[Dominic94]

When Curtis was hired it was mentioned that a shift was coming and that they wanted to get more out of the academy. I’m not sure TFC has been profitable ever overall given the massive investments MLSE has poured into the team.

they can’t keep spending 20M a year on Altidore, Giovinco and Bradley types, it was time.

at the same time, they believe they have multiple Davies’s coming up through the academy, Mbongue and Rutty are something else it seems. Priso and Nelsen are rated, at a point these guys have to get minutes. We talked about making sales and euros, the reality is that in 2 years these 4 should all have been sold for about 40 million cad, and heck it could top that if they can develop Okello whom is also highly rated. At a point you can’t keep wasting these players careers given that the Can PL is in your area and making players think twice and it’s about to flood your area. They didn’t get David because he felt that he wouldn’t get minutes, that’s an eye opener. Akinola wouldn’t have played if it were not for a break and now he’s shown he can move up and will do so.

if you’re a kid in that area, you need minutes and hey why not try your luck at Athletico (this will happen sooner than later btw) or Forge or York instead of TFC where you can’t play.

they’ve put so much into this team and the academy it’s about time they do it. NYCFC and NYRB are really pumping out players, less City but they’re shifting too. When you’re sitting on that much talent you’re literally losing money, and bleeding it by not playing them. LA’s academy under Vanney isn’t getting better. TFC’s under Curtis is about to skyrocket, and it’s not like MLSE won’t poor the resources into great DP’s who will carry the load while the youngsters can play and grow pressure free.

They might find 2 more Pozuelos but use the kids to patch holes, that’s more than enough to win trophies. (Piatti and Pozuelo were insane when on their game it was something) I wouldn’t be shocked at this point if Altidore is moved and from what I’ve watched and read this is a real possibility.

Bradley is likely to retire at TFC, I’d imagine a Delgado or DeLeon could be on the move, maybe Osorio ? Anyone who can’t play the press is going to get phased out, changes are coming.

[CanadaFan123]

If Armas uses the youths I think he’ll be popular. There’s no reason not to anyhow and they are almost over stocked with young talent at this point. Tough to see a real future for Shaffelburg unless they went for a complete youth movement - would be great to see him loaned to HFX for a season. 

[Gian-Luca]

3 hours ago, Dominic94 said:

Bradley is likely to retire at TFC, I’d imagine a Delgado or DeLeon could be on the move, maybe Osorio ? Anyone who can’t play the press is going to get phased out, changes are coming.

Delgado won't be on the move, unless you mean on the pitch. If anything, a pressing style of play warrants giving him more playing time (although since he was starting every game under Vanney that will be difficult to do). Armas singled out Delgado, Pozuelo, Osorio & Laryea as being guys in their prime he will be relying upon so I will be surprised if Marky is headed anywhere unless Vanney tries to trade for him. De Leon however I agree is more likely to be in the same category as Bradley in terms of likely to be phased out. I can't see how playing those two, or even Justin Morrow (if he re-signs) will contribute to a higher tempo or more intensity in the style of play.

[Bison44]

Dc and Miami got their coaches..they went in the opposite directions we did.  A young Argentine coaching in Belgium (Losada) and a a big name (Neville) from England with little experience. 

I do hope Curtis makes some sort of move to clear out some underbrush.  I like Deleon but Vanney leaned on him way too much.  Fraser needs to go somewhere he'll play.  Dunn, Okello and Peruzza are all 20 now and we need to see if they are up for MLS or not.  If Achara can pick up where he left off, Altidore might b expendable sooner rather than later before his market value drops to nothing.    

[Mikmacdo]

6 hours ago, Bison44 said:

Dc and Miami got their coaches..they went in the opposite directions we did.  A young Argentine coaching in Belgium (Losada) and a a big name (Neville) from England with little experience. 

I do hope Curtis makes some sort of move to clear out some underbrush.  I like Deleon but Vanney leaned on him way too much.  Fraser needs to go somewhere he'll play.  Dunn, Okello and Peruzza are all 20 now and we need to see if they are up for MLS or not.  If Achara can pick up where he left off, Altidore might b expendable sooner rather than later before his market value drops to nothing.    

I agree, I really want to see what Perruzza can do, he had better numbers than Ayo in the USL. Dunn deserves to be at worst the 4th CB. Jozy already has no value, I would celebrate if they found a way to get rid of him. 

[Dominic94]

2 hours ago, Mikmacdo said:

I agree, I really want to see what Perruzza can do, he had better numbers than Ayo in the USL. Dunn deserves to be at worst the 4th CB. Jozy already has no value, I would celebrate if they found a way to get rid of him. 

I think it’s in the works or could happen, because I’ve seen Jack talking about if Jozy comes back.

[Dominic94]

So they just took another midfielder.... someone has to be on the outs

[Mikmacdo]

49 minutes ago, Dominic94 said:

So they just took another midfielder.... someone has to be on the outs

hes a leftback

[Dominic94]

4 minutes ago, Mikmacdo said:

hes a leftback

MLS listed him as M

[Bison44]

HAHA, Maryland lists him as a mid as well, but when you read his bio, its outside back this, left back...left wing etc etc.  

[narduch]

Can't make this stuff up.

 

[Macksam]

On 1/16/2021 at 10:23 AM, El Hombre said:

I'd be surprised if CPL is even a blip on the MLS teams' radar.  I think each team has different reasoning:

Vancouver: MDS was perceived to be the best coaching candidate available at the time.  He always plays Canadians, no matter where he goes.  The fact that so many Canadians have seen the pitch under him is not a surprise.

Montreal: Joey loves his European football.  It was only a matter of time before the Impact name was tossed aside for the sake of legitimacy.  (Note: this is complete speculation based on nothing on my part)

Toronto: Again, pure speculation (with a healthy dose of optimism), but I am moderately hopeful that Toronto has a new approach because it is looking into a new revenue stream.  With Davies emerging last year, particularly over the summer, and David being sold for such an exorbitant amount, I don't think it would be too far of a stretch for Curtis to look at his club and not at least consider that they might be sitting on a couple sales.  Will they be 30 million Euro sales?  No.  But you put together 4 or 5 pretty good sales over the next 4 years and you'll be doing alright.  Again, this is based on absolutely nothing, but I could see it being a possibility.  Also, having your best player go to the press and tell everyone that the club should be playing more kids doesn't hurt.

All that to say that I would bet that competition from CPL is pretty far down the pecking order in terms of perceived threats to the MLS teams.

I don't know how much of a perceived threat MLS teams think the CPL is but Y9/YU are clearly more than a blip on TFC's radar, especially when considering what was on last year's kit.