CPL new teams speculation

[BringBackTheBlizzard]

The group that has been adamant about not having ties with MLS is CanPL. Pacific FC being a Whitecaps affiliate rather than Fresno would be the common sense solution.

Edited December 23, 2018 by BringBackTheBlizzard

[Cblake]

I really don't see the CSA allowing the MLS teams to place their reserve team outside there respective market's footprint. No way they would let a potential CPL opportunity fall apart because of a MLS team moving in with the second team.

When TFC was in talks with Hamilton, it was the Lynx moving there and moving back up from the PDL to the USL. It was after that deal fell apart that they moved forward with TFC2 playing out of Vaughn. 

I would not be surprised to see the Whitecaps and Impact re-starting their reserve teams now that there is the cheaper option in USL League One. It would not get in the way of what the CPL is doing in my eyes. Laval and Montreal are one in the same, so only see one of them from a CPL standpoint.

[BringBackTheBlizzard]

The Lynx to THF thing had a letter of support from the OSA and possibly the CSA from what I remember. It was the City of Hamilton that turned it down. I'd be surprised if the reserve teams were ever outside the three metro areas but the possibility of an Impact reserve team in Quebec City was mentioned alongside CanPL in a media report from there a few months back from what I remember and Joey Saputo has a lot of influence in Quebec soccer.

Edited December 23, 2018 by BringBackTheBlizzard

[Bison44]

So the CPL are building the rosters, signing players, people are buying season tickets, big announcement upcoming from Bunbury, all the Ottawa excitement and somehow the conversation gets turned back to MLS reserve teams??  Did I miss something??  Did we just move about 2 years backwards in the CPL conversation??  

[Macksam]

5 minutes ago, Bison44 said:

So the CPL are building the rosters, signing players, people are buying season tickets, big announcement upcoming from Bunbury, all the Ottawa excitement and somehow the conversation gets turned back to MLS reserve teams??  Did I miss something??  Did we just move about 2 years backwards in the CPL conversation??  

I thought we were well past that conversation but a certain junkie relapsed and is hitting the USL bottle hard for some reason.

[mtlsab]

Impact having a reserve team in Quebec city will never happen, it was a huge failure in Trois-Rivières. A reserve team in an other city isnt't a good idea at all.

Since the CanPl doesnt want any MLS reserve teams and wants to limit the loans from MLS teams. I think the MLS teams will loan as much players as possible to CanPL.

Do you think it would be possible that MLS teams have a reserve team in the upcominbg CanPL D2 if CanPL doesnt allow them to be promoted in D1? I think it will be a good deal, a win-win deal

[Cblake]

With the 7 CPL teams all set to kickoff in 2019 why Ottawa is such a concern /point of contention. If they don't want in the CPL don't concern yourself with them, focus on those who do. 

In dont some reading, even if the the Fury were to shutdown, it might not be ideal for a perspective CPL team to play there as OSEG runs the faculty and as such a lease would have to be negotiated with them. I could see it being very similar to what the Argos had at the dome where they got very little of the concessions, parking etc.

[Cblake]

Has the CPL actually said they wanted to limit loans from MLS teams? I can't see why they would care where loans came from.

[Ansem]

32 minutes ago, Cblake said:

Has the CPL actually said they wanted to limit loans from MLS teams? I can't see why they would care where loans came from.

I think the overall message is that they will treat MLS as any other league around the world... certainly not as a parent league.

So CPL would logically accept loans that makes sense for them and for their system, not because they would have too or because MLS would be doing them a favor

If I'm CPL, unless a buyout clause is attach to the loan, I'm not interested... that's just me though

[matty]

17 minutes ago, Ansem said:

I think the overall message is that they will treat MLS as any other league around the world... certainly not as a parent league.

So CPL would logically accept loans that makes sense for them and for their system, not because they would have too or because MLS would be doing them a favor

If I'm CPL, unless a buyout clause is attach to the loan, I'm not interested... that's just me though

You're York 9, Toronto FC offer you a 20 year-old Canadian defender on a half season loan, no real interest in selling him to you. Your backline is pretty solid but lacking depth. Do you accept?

Also just to note, CPL and MLS (the Canadian teams at least) can't fully treat the other like just some other league. There are advantages (such as loans outside of windows) that can benefit both parties.

Edited December 24, 2018 by matty

[Cblake]

14 minutes ago, Ansem said:

I think the overall message is that they will treat MLS as any other league around the world... certainly not as a parent league.

So CPL would logically accept loans that makes sense for them and for their system, not because they would have too or because MLS would be doing them a favor

If I'm CPL, unless a buyout clause is attach to the loan, I'm not interested... that's just me though

Not being 100% sure how the CPL is approaching loans, would it not be handled at the team level? Loans are a personnel decision, so in my eyes it should/would be left in the hands of each individual team. So if say the Fury were in the league, I don't really see an issue with having Impact loans. Was that even an issue discussed during the so-called discussions with the CPL brain trust?

[Ansem]

That's why I said if it was me... but CPL arent me so they will handle the loans however they see fit

[Gopherbashi]

I doubt CPL will be too keen on MLS loans for the first season or two (they won't want to be seen as a reserve league right out of the gate), but I wouldn't be surprised at all to see some MLS loans come floating in after that hurdle gets cleared in a few years.

[dyslexic nam]

I can't see CPL being overly hostile to MLS and refusing good Canadian players on loan.  I totally get why they wouldn't allow MLS reserve/youth teams in (and I fully agree) but isolated loan arrangements wouldn't damage the league's rep.  Any in-the-know Camadian footy fan is going to know the initial step up to the 3 MLS squads anyway - no point refusing solid local talent.  Especially at the outset, I doubt CPL will seek to be too confrontational with MLS.  No point creating unecessary challenges.  If anyone has reason to try and limit the other one, it is probably MLS who are losing their exclusivity among proud national Canadian footy fans. 

Probably won't happen in year one, but I could see it happening pretty early on once everyone comes to grips with the fact that CPL will be a big part of the Canadian soccer landscape for a long time to come.  Might as well get on board. 

Edited December 24, 2018 by dyslexic nam

[mtlsab]

It has to be confirmed, but the information I had was that there will be a limit of loan from the same team so a CPL can't be an unofficial reserve team from MLS (or other league)

[Macksam]

5 minutes ago, mtlsab said:

It has to be confirmed, but the information I had was that there will be a limit of loan from the same team so a CPL can't be an unofficial reserve team from MLS (or other league)

A decision that imo is based on logic and sound reasoning. 

[matty]

1 hour ago, mtlsab said:

It has to be confirmed, but the information I had was that there will be a limit of loan from the same team so a CPL can't be an unofficial reserve team from MLS (or other league)

God I hope they don't make that an official rule CPL. Just be open but don't be over the top, if you actually write that down it would be really sad as there's only 3 teams you could possibly remotely have that sort of relationship with. It's a rule that really doesn't need to be written and would look wonky if it was.

Edited December 24, 2018 by matty

[BrennanFan]

14 minutes ago, matty said:

God I hope they don't make that an official rule CPL. Just be open but don't be over the top, if you actually write that down it would be really sad as there's only 3 teams you could possibly remotely have that sort of relationship with. It's a rule that really doesn't need to be written and would look wonky if it was.

CPL wants to own their best players so they can sell them. It's all about cashing in on the next Davies or Johnathan David.  They're in competition with MLS for that next big player, so their selling point to lure players in will be first team minutes in CPL / CMNT shop window vs rot on a low rent USL farm team.  

Loan deals with MLS teams will not be good for CPL's long term bottom line.

[Unnamed Trialist]

1 hour ago, BrennanFan said:

CPL wants to own their best players so they can sell them. It's all about cashing in on the next Davies or Johnathan David.  They're in competition with MLS for that next big player, so their selling point to lure players in will be first team minutes in CPL / CMNT shop window vs rot on a low rent USL farm team.  

Loan deals with MLS teams will not be good for CPL's long term bottom line.

That may be true, but it is a natural fit nonetheless. Every team in the world loans down and sells up if it can. Rosters need that kind of outlet during a season. 

There are lots of reasons to loan down:

-guy coming back from injury can handle the lower level

-promising young guy who can't get minutes

-relieving salary pressure, even partially

And to take a loaned player: 

-you get quality without having had to negotiate with the player in the conventional way, ie, he accepts to play for you because he realises he needs minutes or his club asks him to

-fill in a gap due to an injury that you do not want to risk on a lower tier player

-cost, since often you can pay a part of a salary and get short-term quality

This is the reason why teams have reserve sides, and it makes sense.

[Unnamed Trialist]

10 hours ago, BringBackTheBlizzard said:

The group that has been adamant about not having ties with MLS is CanPL. Pacific FC being a Whitecaps affiliate rather than Fresno would be the common sense solution.

Affiliates are overrated ideas and don't work, that is proven over and over again. In no case in soccer history has the relationship worked with any degree of exclusivity or to both teams benefit. Teams sign who they want, and loan where they want to, and go find players to cover gaps wherever they will. Caps could just as well sign a LB from Sweden as bring up a LB from Pacific, there is no natural reason to do otherwise.

Reserve or B teams are a different story, as the same entity holds the contracts.

If you analyse the relationship between Man City and its partner clubs, there is relatively little player movement, and it never represents more than a smaller % of players in movement: most come from where they find someone interesting, and go to wherever they can get minutes. I watch Girona closely (mind you, Girona is not a huge step down from Man City), and it has movement with 2nd division Spain teams, with some La Liga teams, all over the place in fact. Three players loaned from Man City, one is a Catalan who was basically never on the Man City roster anyways, and the others also young guys who never had any roster presence on Man City, to cover key long-term injuries.

Edited December 24, 2018 by Unnamed Trialist

[BringBackTheBlizzard]

5 hours ago, BrennanFan said:

CPL wants to own their best players so they can sell them. It's all about cashing in on the next Davies or Johnathan David.  They're in competition with MLS for that next big player, ...

...and their total budgets are probably going to be lower than what the MLS teams typically spend on their academy systems alone, so good luck with that unless they are willing to eliminate pay-for-play at the youth level and risk alienating the youth clubs they will be looking to for group sales by taking away their best players.

[shamrock]

10 hours ago, Unnamed Trialist said:

If you analyse the relationship between Man City and its partner clubs, there is relatively little player movement, and it never represents more than a smaller % of players in movement: most come from where they find someone interesting, and go to wherever they can get minutes. 

They have a sort of "partnership" with NAC Breda as well. What it basically comes down to is that Man City (and a lot of other EPL teams) just have accumulated way too many talents. They need to play somewhere so City sends them to whichever clubs want them.

PSV bought a nice Spanish fightback from them for I think 5 mil, he played in Breda last season. But you're right, the "partnership" entails mostly the mother club sending players to wherever they want and the smaller club happily accepting whatever's been thrown at it. 

[CDNFootballer]

On 12/23/2018 at 9:39 PM, mtlsab said:

It has to be confirmed, but the information I had was that there will be a limit of loan from the same team so a CPL can't be an unofficial reserve team from MLS (or other league)

This is good to hear, hope it comes to complete fruition.

No unofficial reserve teams or affiliate setups, good CPL is thinking ahead so Canada's D1 is not diminished in any way.

Edited December 27, 2018 by CDNFootballer

[BillyBob]

https://the11.ca/clanachan-canpl-is-zeroed-in-on-seven-teams-for-2019/

Old but just set the tone.

It seems like by 2020, you'll have Ottawa, K-W, Saska and Quebec. 

For those in the know, do you think Saska would eventually have one team or two for each city. I just now noticed how relatively small they are.

[Ansem]

36 minutes ago, BillyBob said:

https://the11.ca/clanachan-canpl-is-zeroed-in-on-seven-teams-for-2019/

Old but just set the tone.

It seems like by 2020, you'll have Ottawa, K-W, Saska and Quebec. 

For those in the know, do you think Saska would eventually have one team or two for each city. I just now noticed how relatively small they are.

If it's the Fury, those CPL videos will sure be awkward