Canada Pre-World Cup "friendlies" thread: news, gossip and speculation.

[sose]

10 minutes ago, Corazon said:

Well, I think that all but confirms that Doneil will be in Qatar which I think we all expected.

yea.. he will be in Qatar, but maybe he goes as a "coach" / hype man.... instead of on the roster lol

[WestHamCanadianinOxford]

5 minutes ago, Unnamed Trialist said:

We have a culture that is not hindered by accents or origins, so it makes no sense for our football culture to be so mono.

I just find it narrow and uncharacteristic for Canadian football commentary to be so dominated by English-Scottish accents and to have so little presence of other football cultures and knowledge--even when those people speak impeccably well, gramatically accurately, barring accents.

You are talking ex-players, so co-commentating or doing colour.  Personality and footballing experience goes a long way there.  However, actually calling the game - commentating - is the skill that combines, if done well, that personality and knowledge with crystal clear communication. 

Canadian football commentary in English, you mean. Pretty narrow view. There is football being covered and even being given commentary in other languages in Canada.  

[nfitz]

1 hour ago, Unnamed Trialist said:

How many foreigners with a 1st language other than English are doing sports commentary in Canada?

Just above someone was saying that Reed came from Liverpool. 😄

But also - define "foreigner"?

[Unnamed Trialist]

12 minutes ago, WestHamCanadianinOxford said:

You are talking ex-players, so co-commentating or doing colour.  Personality and footballing experience goes a long way there.  However, actually calling the game - commentating - is the skill that combines, if done well, that personality and knowledge with crystal clear communication. 

Canadian football commentary in English, you mean. Pretty narrow view. There is football being covered and even being given commentary in other languages in Canada.  

In far lower proportion to the cultures represented by those playing, by our complex plural ethnic heritage--I know you want to talk it away, in the end it is some sort of "splaining", thanks though for talking down to me.

it is essentially denying that people who have a hell of a lot to say are being silenced, which has been the case for decades. Even One Soccer is locked into this mode, which is odd because it is new, supposedly progressive, Media Pro is not even Canadian. But then, Kurt Larson, say no more.

The reality of our programme is far richer than those in the media covering it.

[Kingston]

Osorio is out for the next round of friendlies:

https://www.mlssoccer.com/news/jonathan-osorio-to-miss-canada-s-pre-world-cup-friendlies

[WestHamCanadianinOxford]

1 hour ago, Unnamed Trialist said:

In far lower proportion to the cultures represented by those playing, by our complex plural ethnic heritage--I know you want to talk it away, in the end it is some sort of "splaining", thanks though for talking down to me.

it is essentially denying that people who have a hell of a lot to say are being silenced, which has been the case for decades. Even One Soccer is locked into this mode, which is odd because it is new, supposedly progressive, Media Pro is not even Canadian. But then, Kurt Larson, say no more.

The reality of our programme is far richer than those in the media covering it.

I have no idea what you are saying at the beginning but it feels like you trying to hoist some kind of politics on me.   

Just because someone speaks clear precise English, a requirement for the job, does not mean they must be excluded from a "complex plural ethnic heritage".  I could see Alexandre Gangué-Ruzic from the video above being a commentator at some point.  He communicates his knowledge well and, honestly, I enjoy his voice more that some on OneSoccer (or the BBC or BT.) Of course, he would need to get experience actually calling games.  That is difficult in Canada because the amount of games being commentated on any given week is quite small.  So yes Canadian football coverage in English relies on a pool that has been trained for over a half century and  is literally commentating on dozens, maybe hundreds of games a week.

It will change as we get better and more people want to watch and more people want to be football journalists. We have come full circle, so the last word is yours. 

Edited September 22, 2022 by WestHamCanadianinOxford

[Unnamed Trialist]

2 hours ago, WestHamCanadianinOxford said:

I have no idea what you are saying at the beginning but it feels like you trying to hoist some kind of politics on me.   

Just because someone speaks clear precise English, a requirement for the job, does not mean they must be excluded from a "complex plural ethnic heritage".  I could see Alexandre Gangué-Ruzic from the video above being a commentator at some point.  He communicates his knowledge well and, honestly, I enjoy his voice more that some on OneSoccer (or the BBC or BT.) Of course, he would need to get experience actually calling games.  That is difficult in Canada because the amount of games being commentated on any given week is quite small.  So yes Canadian football coverage in English relies on a pool that has been trained for over a half century and  is literally commentating on dozens, maybe hundreds of games a week.

It will change as we get better and more people want to watch and more people want to be football journalists. We have come full circle, so the last word is yours. 

I just feel some posters get their backs up if you state the obvious: English-Scottish footie announcer have a default "in" that is not justified in Canadian sports media, and it's been going on for decades.

But as I demonstrated: the mere fact of being many does not make the average good. Argentines are excellent, perhaps the best soccer narrators in the world; Mexicans are rather poor, and they far outnumber the former. 

I personally find far more merit in specialised sports authors from Britain, book writers, and of course the context of British sports publishing, thinking of some I've met like John Carlin. In Spain no one cares about a good biography or chronicle of a cinderella team, in England they do, and the quality is there--imo much more clearly than their game narration tradition.

[red card]

8 hours ago, WestHamCanadianinOxford said:

A whole lot, I would guess in French, Spanish, Italian, Mandarin and other languages that exist in Canada.  It makes Canada less diverse because there are broadcasts of sport in different languages? 

I do still watch Canadian news a little bit.  The presenters are very diverse but in the big English language broadcasts, they speak with clear English diction because the base requirement of their job is being understood by the English-speaking people that is their audience.   

Football commentary is much quicker and more improvised.  If the Spanish football media prioritise something else, I would find that pretty strange and silly. 

The American networks have been much progressive in getting non-British voices and also beyond the football world on air.

For the Euros last year, ESPN had former players from non-English countries as studio analysts including Del Piero & Khedira, 

For Russia 2018, Fox used a Latino PxP announcer for Mexico and most of the other Latin American nations group stage matches. He had a heavy accent, used Latino futbol idioms and had a bombastic announcing style. Given the reactions to Wheeler, many on this forum wouldn't have liked him since they can't seem to tolerate non-British ways of consuming football. But in the US, since Hispanics drive football interest, the English/American/Latino voices co-mingling is very much on trend.

The American networks also bring in non-soccer people to upgrade their broadcasting team, For the Euros, ESPN main studio host was the face of College Game Day. For Qatar, Fox is bringing in former NFL/CFL player Chad Johnson (who is apparently good at EA FIFA).

Edited September 23, 2022 by red card

[SthMelbRed]

1 minute ago, red card said:

The American networks have been much progressive in getting non-British voices and also beyond the football world on air.

For the Euros last year, ESPN had former players from non-English countries as studio analysts including Del Piero & Khedira, 

For Russia 2018, Fox used a Latino PxP announcer for Mexico and most of the Latin American nation group stage matches. He had a heavy accent, used Latino futbol idioms and had a bombastic announcing style. Given the reactions to Wheeler, many on this forum wouldn't have liked him since they can't seem to tolerate non-British ways of consuming football. But in the US, since Hispanics drive football interest, the English/American/Latino voices co-mingling is very much on trend.

The American networks also bring in non-soccer people to upgrade their broadcasting team, For the Euros, ESPN main studio host was the face of College Game Day. For Qatar, Fox is bringing in former NFL/CFL player Chad Johnson (who is apparently good at EA FIFA).

This is a very weird take. People don't like Wheeler because he's straight up shit at his job. It has nothing to do with an innate need to hear a British voice commenting on football, or even a non-British voice commenting in a British style. Get a Canadian voice in that's good at his job and isn't a massive dickhead, and you won't get many people complaining.

[red card]

35 minutes ago, SthMelbRed said:

This is a very weird take. People don't like Wheeler because he's straight up shit at his job. It has nothing to do with an innate need to hear a British voice commenting on football, or even a non-British voice commenting in a British style. Get a Canadian voice in that's good at his job and isn't a massive dickhead, and you won't get many people complaining.

Just in the past week, Joshua Kloke in promoting his book on various podcasts and Herculez Gomez of Futbol Americas in a podcast interview both expressed similar sentiments. 

Not suitable for all ages but being a dickhead is actually a sports media style. It's the basis of Latin American futbol shows like Futbol Picante. OneSoccer honchos have said they deliberately incorporated pundit styles seen in other countries that aren't normally seen in Canadian sports media.

Gomez also said his show's style is just like all the screaming & yelling that Latin American families do when watching football. It's not the place where you never interrupt someone or miss a chance to dunk on someone for being off base.

A recent World Cup fandom report said 69% of Latam watch with friends & family. They describe it as the best days of their lives. You hug, you cry, you laugh. You remember who was late and who was drunk. In the US & Canada, 2x more people watch the World Cup on their own. 

 

Edited September 23, 2022 by red card

[VinceA]

I mean I would much rather see Jenkins do paly by play for Canada over Wheeler. Jenkins has grown leaps and bounds. His only issue and I think this was a directive from OneSoccer to wheeler-ize him a bit is his goal calls are sometimes a little annoying.

I will say I did not like Dunfield's colour commentary because early on he'd orgasm on mic which you can't do even if you're a homer (The 2019 USA game is a great example, grunting at David's missed chances and yelling "shoot!" and his laugh at the Cavallini goal) and his other issue was simply his nasally voice is kind of annoying.

[Redpunkfiddle]

2 hours ago, VinceA said:

I mean I would much rather see Jenkins do paly by play for Canada over Wheeler. Jenkins has grown leaps and bounds. His only issue and I think this was a directive from OneSoccer to wheeler-ize him a bit is his goal calls are sometimes a little annoying.

I will say I did not like Dunfield's colour commentary because early on he'd orgasm on mic which you can't do even if you're a homer (The 2019 USA game is a great example, grunting at David's missed chances and yelling "shoot!" and his laugh at the Cavallini goal) and his other issue was simply his nasally voice is kind of annoying.

I got a kick out of it when it first happened and was watching the highlights. But then the monster was unleashed, Onesoccer used Lucas Cavaleeeeneeee ad nauseum as a filler spot, and over the top became the norm, not a spontaneous one off.

Edited September 23, 2022 by Redpunkfiddle

[Ally McCoist]

3 hours ago, VinceA said:

I will say I did not like Dunfield's colour commentary because early on he'd orgasm on mic which you can't do even if you're a homer

[Unnamed Trialist]

1 hour ago, Ally McCoist said:

That toothless guy is Risitas, from Sevilla, who literally became famous as a comedian for his exaggerated stupid laugh. Died last year.

I agree that OneSoccer is exploring styles, a bit. Imo Josh Deming does far better work on his own at Jddtv than for OS, who shoehorn him into silly concepts (predicting this or that), you can see the editors being formulaic. Killing off his surprisingly natural communicative talent. 

[sose]

5 hours ago, red card said:

Just in the past week, Joshua Kloke in promoting his book on various podcasts and Herculez Gomez of Futbol Americas in a podcast interview both expressed similar sentiments. 

Not suitable for all ages but being a dickhead is actually a sports media style. It's the basis of Latin American futbol shows like Futbol Picante. OneSoccer honchos have said they deliberately incorporated pundit styles seen in other countries that aren't normally seen in Canadian sports media.

Gomez also said his show's style is just like all the screaming & yelling that Latin American families do when watching football. It's not the place where you never interrupt someone or miss a chance to dunk on someone for being off base.

A recent World Cup fandom report said 69% of Latam watch with friends & family. They describe it as the best days of their lives. You hug, you cry, you laugh. You remember who was late and who was drunk. In the US & Canada, 2x more people watch the World Cup on their own. 

 

Gomez has a Latam pundit style but he's not a dickhead.. Wheeler is a straight dickhead who is not very good at play by play.. if he was a dickhead but did a good job at play by play maybe i would cut him some slack lol.

 

 

[CanadaFan123]

4 hours ago, sose said:

Gomez has a Latam pundit style but he's not a dickhead.. Wheeler is a straight dickhead who is not very good at play by play.. if he was a dickhead but did a good job at play by play maybe i would cut him some slack lol.

 

 

Gomez is very much a dickhead. I think we just like him because he’s on our side but remember his “chicken wings and beer” comment years back? 

[Shway]

I wonder, a lot of you must not like Ray Hudson?

I think his style is entertaining.

[JAVIERF]

Is Tomasz Radzinski in estudio?  Could be very good.  

[Unnamed Trialist]

2 hours ago, Shway said:

I wonder, a lot of you must not like Ray Hudson?

I think his style is entertaining.

I like watching highlights after the fact of Messi with the Hudson gasps, as if someone's doing a snuff movie on him, but would not enjoy that on a daily basis, as permanent hyperbole ends up meaning nothing is really exciting at all. 

Same reason I dislike the Spanish overcalls, especially on the radio (or the guys on tv who call as if on the radio), which I think come from a sad and desperate period in Spanish history that has mostly been surpassed.

[CanadaFan123]

1 hour ago, JAVIERF said:

Is Tomasz Radzinski in estudio?  Could be very good.  

Wow - that’s actually a good call. McKenna has done bundesliga broadcasts as well.

[WestHamCanadianinOxford]

15 hours ago, red card said:

The American networks have been much progressive in getting non-British voices and also beyond the football world on air.

I appreciate the information and your points.  I only really disagree with one aspect but I think you are talking past what I was saying in others. 

15 hours ago, red card said:

For the Euros last year, ESPN had former players from non-English countries as studio analysts including Del Piero & Khedira, 

That is very normal in British tournament coverage as well.  Slavan Bilic jumping on the desk in Euro 2016 reminds me it was happening then at least.  Off the top of my head, I have seen Henry, Veira, Klinsmann, Cech and Fabregas to name a few, since. If Canadian broadcasters have the money to bring people like that in, I think people would not mind.  But remember my points were about commentators not pundits.

15 hours ago, red card said:

The American networks also bring in non-soccer people to upgrade their broadcasting team, For the Euros, ESPN main studio host was the face of College Game Day.

Skipping around a bit to continue to talk about overall tournament coverage , how is Andi Patrillo different than that? A professional, well-known broadcaster with a background in other sports.  

15 hours ago, red card said:

. For Qatar, Fox is bringing in former NFL/CFL player Chad Johnson (who is apparently good at EA FIFA).

That is the one thing you mention I would rather not have in my football broadcast.  Personal preference or not, it feels gimicky, like the FOX lines in hockey, back in the day, complete with a video game connection.  I think you do things around video games and the like to attract a younger audience but you can do them on online platforms where that audience is really growing.  Look at the Premier League Youtube channel and you will a lot of videos about players and FIFA - the game, for instance.  

15 hours ago, red card said:

For Russia 2018, Fox used a Latino PxP announcer for Mexico and most of the other Latin American nations group stage matches. He had a heavy accent, used Latino futbol idioms and had a bombastic announcing style. Given the reactions to Wheeler, many on this forum wouldn't have liked him since they can't seem to tolerate non-British ways of consuming football. But in the US, since Hispanics drive football interest, the English/American/Latino voices co-mingling is very much on trend.

I appreciate this because it gets into actual commentary - the focus of my posts but as you point out, you are talking about a specific Latin American-US soccer relationship that does not transfer to Canada. To me at least, there is not one ethnic group that "drives football interest" as you say.  We don't have one dominant group, so you work in and try to be very clearly understandable in the majority language of the audience - English.  Also, if look at our national team we have a number of players from ethnic groups that are not British but speak English as a primary language.  

We have such a limited sample size in Canada, so its hard but I want commentators that are (probably in this order): clearly understandable, highly knowledgeable and trained in the skill that is calling a game.  The UK has a massive resource there, I hope and think we will move beyond it in future, but if you are looking for good commentators, it is not surprising that today, we use it. 

Edited September 23, 2022 by WestHamCanadianinOxford

[scullion44]

Araujo injured for Uruguay so we wont be playing vs him.

[Corazon]

10 minutes ago, scullion44 said:

Araujo injured for Uruguay so we wont be playing vs him.

Barcelona taking a beating this International Break.

First Kounde, then Memphis & De Jong.  Now Araujo.

Rough window @Unnamed Trialist

Edited September 23, 2022 by Corazon

[Unnamed Trialist]

3 minutes ago, Corazon said:

Barcelona taking a beating this International Break.

First Kounde, then Memphis & De Jong.  Now Araujo.

Rough window @Unnamed Trialist

De Jong isn't too bad. Not sure what happened with Araujo. Koundé, that really sucks for us. 

I guess we'll have to play our highest paid player in the end.

[xabuep2]

Uruguay, Canada's next rival has just lost in an international friendly against Iran 1-0