2020 Voyageurs Cup Format

[Ansem]

1 hour ago, SpursFlu said:

There must be a large indoor complex in the gta that can host the finals. Those indoor fields are popular out there aren't they? I've only ever been in a bubble full field out here in BC but there must be an actual large structure in Ontario that can host this game

Since it will be a 1 off game and there will be no fans, neutral ground would make more sense. Westhills stadium or BC Place should definitely be at the top of the list for the CSA

[SpursFlu]

1 hour ago, Ansem said:

Since it will be a 1 off game and there will be no fans, neutral ground would make more sense. Westhills stadium or BC Place should definitely be at the top of the list for the CSA

I'm not sure flying 2 Ontario teams to Victoria to play in front of no fans makes 1 ounce of sense

[Ansem]

6 minutes ago, SpursFlu said:

I'm not sure flying 2 Ontario teams to Victoria to play in front of no fans makes 1 ounce of sense

You'd have them play in January or February at minus 20?

[SpursFlu]

4 minutes ago, Ansem said:

You'd have them play in January or February at minus 20?

Doesn't Ontario have a bunch of indoor facilities?

[Kent]

4 hours ago, SpursFlu said:

Doesn't Ontario have a bunch of indoor facilities?

I am not an expert, but I don’t think there is much in terms of being big enough for a full field game plus camera crew filming from a decent angle for TV/OneSoccer (I forget who has the rights).

Different subject, I feel like the date hasn’t been set yet because they want to see if Forge and TFC get eliminated from CONCACAF League/MLS playoffs early so the game can happen before mid December.

[BradMack]

I wonder if the Rogers center would be more or less viable than flying to BC or Montreal to play in a suitable stadium? 

[nfitz]

If they can play at BMO in February, then they can play at BMO in mid-December, when it's typically warmer.

 

 

[gator]

18 hours ago, nfitz said:

If they can play at BMO in February, then they can play at BMO in mid-December, when it's typically warmer.

 

 

Or they could play at Tim Hortons Field, it is used year round if I'm not mistaken!

[nfitz]

2 hours ago, gator said:

Or they could play at Tim Hortons Field, it is used year round if I'm not mistaken!

I'd think so. Though top seed normally gets home field advantage - and I'd think they'd prefer to be playing on grass.

 

[gator]

44 minutes ago, nfitz said:

I'd think so. Though top seed normally gets home field advantage - and I'd think they'd prefer to be playing on grass.

 

I would think with no fans in the stadium giving up the home field is less of an issue, as far as the grass goes I have no idea of the state of  the BMO Field pitch presently but if you go back a couple of seasons ago when TFC played a CCL match in the winter it was horrendous, they probably would consider the THF plastic a better option!

[narduch]

According to Rollins on Twitter the match won't even be played if Forge quality through Concacaf league 

[nfitz]

7 hours ago, gator said:

...I have no idea of the state of  the BMO Field pitch presently but if you go back a couple of seasons ago when TFC played a CCL match in the winter it was horrendous, they probably would consider the THF plastic a better option!

It looked beautiful for the last match. Very low use this season.

It was poor for that February CCL game because it had been frozen for the winter, and hadn't had time to come to life properly after they turned the heating back on. It shouldn't have frozen by mid-December ... and if it gets that cold, then leave the heating system on. But it's looking like a warm winter, and then the ground doesn't freeze until New Years or so, if no heating system.

[Kent]

Yeah, the November/December before that February game included TFC’s MLS CUP run including hosting the final, plus the Grey Cup for CFL. I might be wrong but I believe they have made the surface a hybrid since then didn’t they? Or is it still grass?

[Daniel]

Surprised there's not more outcry about this decision. The VCup is more than just a ticket to the CCL.

 

[RS]

6 hours ago, Daniel said:

Surprised there's not more outcry about this decision. The VCup is more than just a ticket to the CCL.

 

The CSA backed itself into a corner when the final wasn't held in September immediately following the Island Games (the MLS teams could've stayed in Canada for 3-4 more days before going stateside). Now the prospect of playing a "dead rubber" V Cup in the middle of winter in front of nobody looms large.

The best time to do it was in September. Since that didn't happen, the next best time to do it is in the spring.

Hopefully this situation never happens again (the V Cup is usually awarded before CONCACAF League is far along). And yes, the V Cup is supposed to mean more than just a CCL spot.

[Kent]

1 hour ago, RS said:

Hopefully this situation never happens again (the V Cup is usually awarded before CONCACAF League is far along). And yes, the V Cup is supposed to mean more than just a CCL spot.

I pointed out this problem when Canada got a spot in CONCACAF League. Voyageurs Cup and CONCACAF League happen at the same time, plus the spot that is won through the Voyageurs Cup is a higher seed than the CONCACAF League qualifier. If the team that wins the Voyageurs Cup is also in CONCACAF League, there is a problem. At that point it is too late to send a different Canadian representative to the CONCACAF League.

Its not like the USA having the same team win the US Open Cup and MLS Cup. Because of the timing and all of their spots are going to the same competition, so it’s easy enough to choose a next best team to go for one of the spots.

Really I think the solution would probably have to be that the Voyageurs Cup winners of a given year don’t play in the next CCL, but rather the one after that. So 2020 Voyageurs Cup winners qualify for 2022 CCL, so if they also qualify for the 2021 CONCACAF League by winning 2020 CPL, we can just send the CPL runners up to CONCACAF League to avoid the situation.

[RS]

12 hours ago, Kent said:

I pointed out this problem when Canada got a spot in CONCACAF League. Voyageurs Cup and CONCACAF League happen at the same time, plus the spot that is won through the Voyageurs Cup is a higher seed than the CONCACAF League qualifier. If the team that wins the Voyageurs Cup is also in CONCACAF League, there is a problem. At that point it is too late to send a different Canadian representative to the CONCACAF League.

Its not like the USA having the same team win the US Open Cup and MLS Cup. Because of the timing and all of their spots are going to the same competition, so it’s easy enough to choose a next best team to go for one of the spots.

Really I think the solution would probably have to be that the Voyageurs Cup winners of a given year don’t play in the next CCL, but rather the one after that. So 2020 Voyageurs Cup winners qualify for 2022 CCL, so if they also qualify for the 2021 CONCACAF League by winning 2020 CPL, we can just send the CPL runners up to CONCACAF League to avoid the situation.

I don't know if the delayed spot would be the best solution, but there needed to be much more clarity from the CSA ahead of time given that this kind of situation can easily occur. Unfortunately that didn't happen and now it looks like they're making things up on the fly (which they are).

[gator]

It's a real shame that Forge vs TFC isn't a 2 legged tie in front of fans, I'm not implying fans should be allowed presently for those that think I might be a covid denier! A visit by TFC to Tim Horton Field in normal times would possibly have set an attendance record, there would be great atmosphere with all of the visiting supporters and the hardcore Forge fanbase!

[Ansem]

 

 

[narduch]

I'm pretty sure this is the 1st step to cancelling it altogether.

They should have found a way to make this work in September.

[SpursFlu]

I think this could be an opportunity to push it back and actually make some money on it

[CanadaFan123]

Yeah at this stage you may as well push it back to April/May 2021 and make it a two-legged affair.

[narduch]

40 minutes ago, CanadaFan123 said:

Yeah at this stage you may as well push it back to April/May 2021 and make it a two-legged affair.

I think if Forge qualifies through Concacaf league they will just cancel it altogether so that no tough decisions need to be made.

[gator]

1 hour ago, narduch said:

I'm pretty sure this is the 1st step to cancelling it altogether.

They should have found a way to make this work in September.

They should make TFC wait until Forge returns from the tropics and goes through the 14 day quarantine then play the match at THF!😀

[narduch]

5 hours ago, gator said:

They should make TFC wait until Forge returns from the tropics and goes through the 14 day quarantine then play the match at THF!😀

Its pretty obvious TFC told the CSA to fuck off and they aren't waiting around to play Forge.

Just like how they told the CSA they couldn't play during MLS season.