2020 Voyageurs Cup Format

[Ansem]

9 minutes ago, RS said:

So you think the CSA should call up MLS now and start making demands, even though they've had all summer to get their **** together regarding the V's Cup?

Take off your anti-MLS goggles for one second and point the blame at the correct party.

It's COVID times -  MLS had all summer to get a full schedule and have been pretty last minutes too so spare me the anti-MLS comments when you have the "I love MLS no matter what" goggles yourself.

This is unprecedented times and if you dropped the "I love MLS" position, you'd see that TFC arguing that it should be playing a CPL club who's been on hiatus for over 3 months is crazy. I'd expect more, really, as some of those clubs will lose players and/or loan some of them.

Furthermore, this is a CSA tournament, they can ask MLS to move around some dates which they are EASILY capable of doing IF they want too and there are precedents to that. TFC can ask MLS too.

Should they refuse, then either

1. Play the finals right before the 2021 CCL if CPL has at the very least restarted by then (whenever that is as 2020 tournament has no schedule yet ) "CCL should have their shit together", but MLS always does right?
2. If delaying up until later next year when BOTH clubs had a few games under their belts than the sooner the better. Show up or forfeit

Edited September 17, 2020 by Ansem

[RS]

1 minute ago, Ansem said:

It's COVID times -  MLS had all summer to get a full schedule and have been pretty last minutes too so spare me the anti-MLS comments when you have the "I love MLS" goggles yourself.

This is unprecedented times and if you dropped the "I love MLS" position, you'd see that TFC playing a CPL club on hiatus for over 3 months is crazy as some of those clubs will lose players and/or loan some of them

Furthermore, this is a CSA tournament, they can ask MLS to move around some dates which they are EASILY capable of doing IF they want too and there are precedents to that. TFC can ask MLS too.

Should they refuse, then either

1. Play the finals right before the 2021 CCL if CPL has at the very least restarted by then (whenever that is as 2020 tournament has no schedule yet ) "CCL should have their **** together", but MLS always does right?
2. If delaying up until later next year when BOTH clubs had a few games under their belts than the sooner the better. Show up or forfeit

Nothing about what I said fits into your bogus "I love MLS" narrative that you're trying to pin on me because I rightly called you anti-MLS.

I fully agree that it's unfair for the CPL winner to wait around for 2-3 months, which is why I've repeatedly stated (before today) that the CSA should've scheduled the Cup final for a week after the CPL final. It makes the most sense with the three MLS teams still in the country, and all three could have easily accommodated that even if it took some some creative scheduling for their U.S. "home" dates (for instance: they could have all scheduled their first "home" U.S. game for the first week of this next phase, then only one team would need to re-schedule an MLS match to accommodate the Vs Cup if the need arised).

The CSA is the entity that controls soccer in this country, so in this instance it needed to act as such and dictate when the Cup final was happening. There was a huge stretch of time where we knew exactly when the MLS clubs would be in the country, and it's then that the national federation needed to publicly step up and say "this is when our final is being played."

Instead, nothing happened, time went on, and MLS had to get the next phase of the schedule underway. You're telling me about how these are unprecedented times as if that somehow makes it reasonable for the CSA to wait until MLS announces an unprecedented set of games for its Canadian clubs before making demands that it changes things around for a Cup final that should have been announced ages ago.

Comparing this situation to the CCL is disingenuous, because as you say these are unprecedented times. It's far easier to move around league matches at the beginning of a season (when the world is normal and there's no things as border restrictions) than it is at the end of the summer when the one of the teams in question is forced to be based out of an entirely different country.

TL; DR: Cut the crap and acknowledge that the logistics of this situation required action on this long ago. The leagues aren't responsible for the Cup, the CSA is.

[Ansem]

8 minutes ago, RS said:

I rightly called you anti-MLS.

100% wrong. I'm not anti-MLS, that's ridiculous but I don't believe that the results justifies having clubs in MLS forever. If that makes me anti-MLS, than I accept that title

24 minutes ago, RS said:

I fully agree that it's unfair for the CPL winner to wait around for 2-3 months, which is why I've repeatedly stated (before today) that the CSA should've scheduled the Cup final for a week after the CPL final. It makes the most sense with the three MLS teams still in the country, and all three could have easily accommodated that even if it took some some creative scheduling for their U.S. "home" dates (for instance: they could have all scheduled their first "home" U.S. game for the first week of this next phase, then only one team would need to re-schedule an MLS match to accommodate the Vs Cup if the need arised).

The CSA is the entity that controls soccer in this country, so in this instance it needed to act as such and dictate when the Cup final was happening. There was a huge stretch of time where we knew exactly when the MLS clubs would be in the country, and it's then that the national federation needed to publicly step up and say "this is when our final is being played."

Instead, nothing happened, time went on, and MLS had to get the next phase of the schedule underway. You're telling me about how these are unprecedented times as if that somehow makes it reasonable for the CSA to wait until MLS announces an unprecedented set of games for its Canadian clubs before making demands that it changes things around for a Cup final that should have been announced ages ago.

Comparing this situation to the CCL is disingenuous, because as you say these are unprecedented times. It's far easier to move around league matches at the beginning of a season (when the world is normal and there's no things as border restrictions) than it is at the end of the summer when the one of the teams in question is forced to be based out of an entirely different country.

TL; DR: Cut the crap and acknowledge that the logistics of this situation required action on this long ago. The leagues aren't responsible for the Cup, the CSA is.

This is where I end your argument

June 10

 

So you're going to tell me that the 3 MLS clubs and MLS had no clue and were blindsided?

But you can't say that because MLS acknowledge that a V Cup tournament would take place at the end of the CPL season which under normal circumstances would have been in October

 

July 28th

Words comes out that CPL will have a tournament and the V Cup will be right after and that it starts in August. So you're telling me MLS and the 3 clubs had no clue back in July?

 

 

July 31st

DUDE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

As early as July 31st, MLS and the 3 clubs KNEW this would play out like this. Are you telling me that the CSA still acted  incompetently just because they didn't know the date and the place yet due to constant COVID restrictions being changed from one province to the next?

 

 

August 13

The CSA announce the 2020 Canadian Championship Format

From the memo:

• Details for the Canadian Championship Final will be announced at a later date. As always, Canada Soccer will continue to closely monitor all COVID-19 developments in consultation with the Public Health Agency of Canada and relevant governing bodies through the Canada Soccer Sport Medicine Committee to ensure the safety of all players, staff and officials.

TRANSLATION: We need to be CLEARED by government organizations before announcing dates and locations. Sorry pal bu you're message is as disingenuous as it comes because I know you're a smart man and you knew that this was how it worked on this side of the border. This isn't Florida who deemed pro-wrestling "essential services" at one point.

So MLS and the clubs knew in advance the timeline...yet

 

September 17, 2020

Bill Manning acts like a clueless moron and says that he thought that the finals would be played AFTER THE MLS season. My friend THAT'S  A LIE! The F'er knew that this was not how the CSA planned this

Looks like MLS made sure to schedule it's clubs right after the Island Games when it knew IN ADVANCE when they would end. To me that's undeniably acting in bad faith and this borderline screams intent

 

 

57 minutes ago, RS said:

TL; DR: Cut the crap and acknowledge that the logistics of this situation required action on this long ago. The leagues aren't responsible for the Cup, the CSA is.

How about you remove your biased glasses and cut the crap.

Yes, the CSA is responsible for its cup and did what it could under the circumstances and it looks like MLS didn't give an F***. So yes, move the F'n games.

If I'm the CSA, this is the date, show up or forfeit.

Thank you!

 

 

 

[RS]

10 minutes ago, Ansem said:

If I'm the CSA, this is the date, show up or forfeit.

Thank you!

I'm not even going to bother responding to all that other stuff because it's not as "gotcha" as you think it is, and what I've quoted is what I've repeatedly said the CSA should have done all along.

[Ansem]

2 minutes ago, RS said:

I'm not even going to bother responding to all that other stuff because it's not as "gotcha" as you think it is, and what I've quoted is what I've repeatedly said the CSA should have done all along.

Seriously, don't bother responding - the level of your MLS bias has been exposed

[RS]

Just now, Ansem said:

Seriously, don't bother responding - the level of your MLS bias has been exposed

Right. You've gone to ridiculous lengths to avoid even partially implying that the CSA dropped the ball on this, and I'm the biased one.

[Ansem]

Just now, RS said:

Right. You've gone to ridiculous lengths to avoid even partially implying that the CSA dropped the ball on this, and I'm the biased one.

Wow! Keep talking

[RS]

Just now, Ansem said:

Wow! Keep talking

Ok. Here's how this conversation has gone so far:

Me: Wow. The CSA really dropped the ball on this. They had plenty of time to figure this out with the co-operation of all the clubs.

You: This is all TFC's/MLS' fault because I hate them.

Me: That's ridiculous. It's the CSA's job to make sure the Cup is awarded.

You: You're so biased towards MLS. Here's a bunch of tweets that don't actually prove my point, including this CSA tweet from a month ago.

The CSA: Here's a tweet from yesterday where we still don't say when this Cup is supposed to actually happen. But it's still totally happening, guys.

Bill Manning: It's our understanding that it'll happen after our season.

Me: That's unfair to the CPL team.

You: Stop your anti-CPL bias! 

[Ansem]

29 minutes ago, RS said:

Ok. Here's how this conversation has gone so far:

Me: Wow. The CSA really dropped the ball on this. They had plenty of time to figure this out with the co-operation of all the clubs.

You: This is all TFC's/MLS' fault because I hate them.

Me: That's ridiculous. It's the CSA's job to make sure the Cup is awarded.

You: You're so biased towards MLS. Here's a bunch of tweets that don't actually prove my point, including this CSA tweet from a month ago.

The CSA: Here's a tweet from yesterday where we still don't say when this Cup is supposed to actually happen. But it's still totally happening, guys.

Bill Manning: It's our understanding that it'll happen after our season.

Me: That's unfair to the CPL team.

You: Stop your anti-CPL bias! 

Manning is lying... period 

We disagree on how incompetent the CSA actually was at getting the finals date and location pinned down. You're saying, they should just make it happen while im saying, it's not that simple and they can't do it unilaterally without public health approval from federal, province AND cities*

*Quebec had approved Impact training together but this was delayed because the CITY didn't want too.

So the CSA putting a date in advance has NO GUARANTEE that it happens due to COVID.

*I think Ontario just reduced the # of people who can gather outside cannot exceed 25 (sporting events included). 

So had the CSA scheduled anywhere in Toronto, Ottawa or Peel, it would have been cancelled and you'd call them incompetent... so they can't win...really

OK

However, either MLS was in total darkness and decided to schedule the teams when the Island games would end (when the CSA clearly wanted to hold the finals) or they simply didn't care about it. 

Can't be neither - which one is it?

*Fyi, not caring about the CSA doesn't make them evil - it makes them Americans as all the major leagues in the US thinks and act like they are bigger than sporting bodies (which they are in most cases)

Yes, I did say thaf the CSA should set a date and tell the teams to show up or forfeit but you ignored my other option about delaying it late spring if that was possible allowing both teams to have games under their belts.

December / January is simply unacceptable 

You can't see past "CSA is incompetent & you're anti-MLS", fine

I demonstrated that Manning is lying and that organizing events in Canada during COVID isn't that easy having to deal with 3 level of governments having their own sets of restrictions. 

There, is that a more leveled answer to your liking?

Edited September 17, 2020 by Ansem

[RS]

5 minutes ago, Ansem said:

So the CSA putting a date in advance has NO GUARANTEE that it happens due to COVID.

 

5 minutes ago, Ansem said:

Yes, I did say thaf the CSA should set a date and tell the teams to show up or forfeit

This is dumb.

You say in one paragraph that there's no guarantee the final happens due to COVID (and you include a ready-made list of excuses for it not to happen, despite the fact that there have been several dozen soccer games that have already taken place in this country — including Quebec — during the pandemic), then in the next paragraph you say that the CSA should just set a date and TFC needs to show up or risk forfeit. 

So instead of engaging in your circular logic, or your obsessive need to "prove" that Manning is lying, I'll just discuss the matter at hand.

Here's my incredibly valuable opinion on this mess, in bullet point:

• December/January is ridiculous for the Cup final. It's unfair for the CPL winner to have to wait that long, the weather will be terrible, etc.
• Next year is also ridiculous for the 2020 Cup final. It should've happened next week.
• If both MLS and the CPL are capable of organizing multiple soccer matches in this country during a pandemic, then the CSA should also be capable enough to organize a single soccer match featuring an MLS side vs. a CPL side in this country. If the CSA needs help, ask the leagues. They seem to have figured it out just fine.
• MLS has an obligation to its own clubs. CPL has an obligation to its own clubs. No more, no less. The CSA is the body responsible for ensuring the Vs Cup tournament gets played, and that has yet to happen. That's ridiculous given how many games have already taken place on Canadian soil over the past two months.
• You've taken issue with Manning's comment, but had IMFC won the berth in the final Montreal would have been the same situation. The MLS clubs seemed to be operating under the assumption that the Vs Cup would happen after they're done their season, but because it was Bill Manning who said it instead of Olivier Renard, we get to hear the same boring cliché about TFC's American FO not caring about Canadian soccer. I'm positive that that narrative would never have (re)surfaced from you had it been Renard in this position today instead of Manning, which Renard would've been if not for Rudy Camacho.

[Ansem]

1 hour ago, RS said:

You say in one paragraph that there's no guarantee the final happens due to COVID (and you include a ready-made list of excuses for it not to happen, despite the fact that there have been several dozen soccer games that have already taken place in this country — including Quebec — during the pandemic), then in the next paragraph you say that the CSA should just set a date and TFC needs to show up or risk forfeit. 

MLS had to sit down with all the different government bodies to set their dates for the Canadian series. They have locations and dates.

From what's been told, staying in Charlottetown an extra week was not possible, which would have facilitated hosting the finals in advance regardless of who wins. Furthermore, the MLS squad would have had to self isolate due to the Atlantic bubble, so that couldn't work

The finals being a "one off", the game would have to be in neutral site. Meaning that until you have a winner, you don't know where the game will be - which rule out CPL stadiums until the winner is determined and MLS stadiums until last night.

Where else could you play with broadcast capacity, not in Atlantic Canada and not hosting a CPL & MLS teams who would allow the event within their restrictions?

Good questions.

Logistics is MUCH more complex than you're oversimplification. It's not just venue and date but a crap of other stuff that comes with it. Those who work in Logistics would know that.

Perhaps neutral ground isn't as important when the place is empty - that might be overexaggerated 

Let go of the forfeit part, it's my opinion and I know it won't happen.

 

1 hour ago, RS said:

So instead of engaging in your circular logic, or your obsessive need to "prove" that Manning is lying, I'll just discuss the matter at hand.

It is a blatant lie. Agree to disagree

1 hour ago, RS said:

Next year is also ridiculous for the 2020 Cup final. It should've happened next week.

There's no timetable for the 2020 CCL yet. If the 2021 CCL starts late summer or fall, then having the qualifier late spring would cause no harm. Everyone have their full squads, everyone played games

1 hour ago, RS said:

If both MLS and the CPL are capable of organizing multiple soccer matches in this country during a pandemic, then the CSA should also be capable enough to organize a single soccer match featuring an MLS side vs. a CPL side in this country. If the CSA needs help, ask the leagues. They seem to have figured it out just fine.

The logistics isn't the same. Yes it's one single game but the location depends on who the finalists are. That complicates the logistics. 

I'd like to point out that the USSF just threw the towel and cancel their Open Cup. The CSA still wants to hold theirs in much harder circumstances than in the US yet you call them incompetent while I don't see you blasting the USSF who threw all their lower tiers under the bus.

1 hour ago, RS said:

MLS has an obligation to its own clubs. CPL has an obligation to its own clubs. No more, no less. The CSA is the body responsible for ensuring the Vs Cup tournament gets played, and that has yet to happen. That's ridiculous given how many games have already taken place on Canadian soil over the past two months.

Different sets of circumstances = different logistics. 

League games don't require neutral grounds and can be planned well in advance and lock down dates.

A one game finals doesn't require a bubble like MLS is back and Island games while cannot be held in one of the finalist grounds who weren't known until

MLS-Sept 17

CPL-Sept 19

Instead of just saying that the CSA is just "incompetent", a more reasonable criticism would be about the importance of neutral grounds when stadiums are empty. Now that's a valid criticism.

1 hour ago, RS said:

The MLS clubs seemed to be operating under the assumption that the Vs Cup would happen after they're done their season, but because it was Bill Manning who said it instead of Olivier Renard, we get to hear the same boring cliché about TFC's American FO not caring about Canadian soccer. I'm positive that that narrative would never have (re)surfaced from you had it been Renard in this position today instead of Manning, which Renard would've been if not for Rudy Camacho.

Renard wouldn't have said that having listen to enough of his press conferences. He'd just defer to the CSA and keep it moving. Manning has a history / pattern at being a prick regarding CPL related topics so yeah, I'm calling it out.

So are you sure I'm anti-MLS? Maybe I really do dislike TFC FO, not the team itself or the league. You don't know me - I've been on record saying many times that if the roster rules was reciprocal even I wouldn't see a point for the 3 teams to ever leave MLS. Big difference

Edited September 18, 2020 by Ansem

[RS]

Holy shit, stop the excuses. 

People who work in logistics are familiar with planning for events that are fluid in nature, it happens all the time. There are several venues that can host the V Cup tomorrow as they're all sitting empty due to the pandemic. Are you seriously suggesting that they couldn't work out some kind of contingency plan to find a neutral site for the final, with venues just begging to be used instead of sitting empty?

And if it's not a neutral site match, which Manning seems to be implying, then there's even less excuse to not have this game scheduled for next week at BMO.

18 minutes ago, Ansem said:

I don't see you blasting the USSF who threw all their lower tiers under the bus.

Why would I do that? I don't care about the US Open Cup and it has literally nothing to do with this conversation. Are you going to keep moving the goalposts some more or are you ready to put even the tiniest smidge of responsibility on the CSA for this? Or do I have to condemn Ligue 1 for ending their season early last year, too?

[Ansem]

1 hour ago, RS said:

Holy ****, stop the excuses. 

People who work in logistics are familiar with planning for events that are fluid in nature, it happens all the time. There are several venues that can host the V Cup tomorrow as they're all sitting empty due to the pandemic. Are you seriously suggesting that they couldn't work out some kind of contingency plan to find a neutral site for the final, with venues just begging to be used instead of sitting empty?

Event planners and I know a lot of them would tell you that during COVID, it's been nightmarish having to conform with authorities shifting restrictions depending on the juridictions

Seriously let go of your anti-CSA crap - no fix dates, no locations provided = you don't have an event, let alone getting cleared by government officials who won't even know "where" and when

Yes, holy s**** - CPL owners and league said multiple times how HARD it was getting the Island games done... Are they making excuses too? 

Seriously, you have no clue - Montreal couldn't even train at their own training centre despite respecting social distancing because the city wouldn’t have it despite having the green light from the province.

What's obvious is that the CSA wanted to have the finals after the Island games and that MLS just went ahead and schedule their games starting on the day of the CPL finals when the schedule was known as early as August. 

Fine but not f'n way the game should happen after 3 months of CPL inactivity. Delay it to spring.

1 hour ago, RS said:

And if it's not a neutral site match, which Manning seems to be implying, then there's even less excuse to not have this game scheduled for next week at BMO

What does he knows anyways? He's just speculating. Logically, they aren't using BMO field any more than they would Wanderers Grounds or Tim Hortons Field if they want to go neutral. Ontario isnt an option anymore by the look of things. (Province announcement as)

Delaying the finals to next spring makes perfect sense

Having the game next week when TFC plays the same day as the CPL finals in the US? Try to keep up, they already left the damn country. 

1 hour ago, RS said:

Are you going to keep moving the goalposts some more or are you ready to put even the tiniest smidge of responsibility on the CSA for this? 

Did I not say that insisting on the neutral ground even when venues are empty is valid criticism?

But unless you're playing 2 legs, worst logistically taking into account the MLS season, neutral ground is logical but that painted them in a corner and it forced them to wait until the identity of finalists being revealed.

Edited September 18, 2020 by Ansem
withdrawing that he's worst than my ex

[RS]

22 minutes ago, Ansem said:

Having the game next week when TFC plays the same day as the CPL finals in the US? Try to keep up, they already left the damn country. 

The CPL finals are this week (less than two days from now) and TFC isn't leaving the country until tomorrow or even Sat. morning.  

I was implying that the CSA could've had some foresight and scheduled the match for Sept. 26 (ie. the "next week" you've struggled to understand). I've repeated this over and over. Try to keep up.

22 minutes ago, Ansem said:

Event planners and I know a lot of them would tell you that during COVID, it's been nightmarish having to conform with authorities shifting restrictions depending on the juridictions

Seriously let go of your anti-CSA crap - no fix dates, no locations provided = you don't have an event, let alone getting cleared by government officials who won't even know "where"

You keep trotting out this line of reasoning for why the V Cup cannot be played, but you starting this whole fucking argument by insisting that the CSA should now just go ahead and schedule the game on a whim — TFC availability be damned — because something Bill Manning said on a podcast pissed you off.

And no, my rightfully holding the CSA to blame for this doesn't mean I'm anti-CSA. That doesn't mean I'm going to fellate them when they get things wrong, though.

If you want anti-CSA BS go talk to Robert or one of his many sock puppets instead of wasting my time with your circular arguments.

[Ansem]

3 minutes ago, RS said:

I was implying that the CSA could've had some foresight and scheduled the match for Sept. 26 (ie. the "next week" you've struggled to understand). I've repeated this over and over. Try to keep up.

Where??? How are you going to get clear when you don't know where?

Even if they had the foresight to lock down BMO Field for Sept.26, the province just imposed restrictions again which would have cancelled that game on Sept.26. - yes try to keep up.

4 minutes ago, RS said:

You keep trotting out this line of reasoning for why the V Cup cannot be played, but you starting this whole fucking argument by insisting that the CSA should now just go ahead and schedule the game on a whim — TFC availability be damned — because something Bill Manning said on a podcast pissed you off.

Yeah, keep implying that NO ONE in MLS offices knew that the CSA wanted the finals right after the Island games. As Manning said, in his mind, December/January makes sense...knowing that CPL teams would have been inactive for 3+ months. Please...

10 minutes ago, RS said:

And no, my rightfully holding the CSA to blame for this doesn't mean I'm anti-CSA. That doesn't mean I'm going to fellate them when they get things wrong, though

I've had my share of critics of the CSA but this is COVID times. Thy could have done like CONCACAF announcing and canceling all the time, do like the USSF and drop it or not making announcements until they have certainty.

You and I don't know what work/talks have been held behind doors. Maybe they did nothing despite sources saying otherwise or maybe they are still in discussion or maybe it's simewhere in the middle 

All that's clear, is that MLS knew the timeline and went ahead and scheduled the games to be played in the US starting on the day of the CPL finals. You are utterly incapable of admitting that this doesn't look good and I'm excluding Manning bs in this.

This looks like a unaliteral decision and if true, you'd expect more from a partnership 

[Bison44]

How do you know that isnt exactly what happened?  CSA went to MLS and they didnt play ball for whatever reason..quarenteen...etc etc.  MLS didnt cook up what to do with the CDN clubs after this mini round robin until late...TFC announced games in Harford on the sept 11th...so it had to be sometime a week or two before that.  I stick with my original thought, what a cock up, but i doubt MLS worked very hard to find a solution with CSA.  Especially when they just shit canned their own US open Cup (announced mid August). 

And i dont need to hear MLS only needs to do whats best for MLS.....getting TFC into the champions league is good for MLS.  Hell the CDN clubs are the ones that really carry the the flag for MLS in that things anyway.  If it went south and Halifax went in their place because of scheduling problems, that would be bad for MLS...good for CPL.  

[RS]

3 minutes ago, Bison44 said:

stick with my original thought, what a cock up, but i doubt MLS worked very hard to find a solution with CSA.  Especially when they just **** canned their own US open Cup (announced mid August). 

I'm going to stop debating this until people in here:

a. Learn the difference been MLS (a league that doesn't run the US Open Cup) and the USSF (the federation that does run the US Open Cup).

b. Realize that booking venues based on results of games that happen weeks or even days earlier happens all the bloody time in every league in North America (seriously, how you think playoffs work?). And before the pandemic is trotted out again, realize that games have literally been played this week in two different provinces (and last week in a third province).

c. Consider the possibility that MLS scheduled this next set of games in the US after consulting with the CSA and finding out that there was nothing keeping them on this side of the border for the time being

Good night.

[Watchmen]

1 hour ago, Ansem said:

Where??? How are you going to get clear when you don't know where?

Even if they had the foresight to lock down BMO Field for Sept.26, the province just imposed restrictions again which would have cancelled that game on Sept.26. - yes try to keep up.

Yeah, keep implying that NO ONE in MLS offices knew that the CSA wanted the finals right after the Island games.

Wait.  It doesn't matter that the CSA wanted to the hold the finals right after the Island games if (as you say) they couldn't lock down a venue.  And if they could lock down a venue, then it's on them to make the announcement of the date.  I mean, the CSA has known weeks in advance what the schedule of the Canadian MLS teams in Canada was.  Further, the shift of the MLS teams down to the US wasn't announced until less than a week ago.  If the CSA couldn't get a venue and date organized in that time, that's on them.  

Edited September 18, 2020 by Watchmen

[nfitz]

1 hour ago, Ansem said:

Even if they had the foresight to lock down BMO Field for Sept.26, the province just imposed restrictions again which would have cancelled that game on Sept.26. - yes try to keep up.

I don't think any new restrictions have been imposed on most of the province. And I don't that the impact soccer matches in empty stadiums ... they've exempted people going to cinemas and banquet halls for example. This is more about house parties. Or did I miss something in the last hour or two in this constantly changing world.

Not sure the big issue here ... this is CSA's choice. They could have scheduled it whenever.

And what's stopping them playing it in the next few months in Hartford? Obviously not happening, or someone wouldn't have already told Toronto FC that it's in December.

When is Forge playing Concacaf League 2020?

[Ansem]

8 hours ago, Watchmen said:

Wait.  It doesn't matter that the CSA wanted to the hold the finals right after the Island games if (as you say) they couldn't lock down a venue.  And if they could lock down a venue, then it's on them to make the announcement of the date.  I mean, the CSA has known weeks in advance what the schedule of the Canadian MLS teams in Canada was.

The winner of the MLS series was announced Sept.17

CPL winner will be known Sept. 19

If they want neutral grounds to hold the game the following week, they won't have a location until then.

Yes the CSA knew the MLS schedule but it's also true in reverse, MLS knew as early as August how the Island games were going to be set up and that the CSA wanted their finals right after.

MLS still went ahead and scheduled games in the US involving Canadian teams on the very same day of the CPL Finals being aware of the quarantine restrictions

One thing that painfully obvious, even if the CSA had that week blackout for the finals, MLS is under no obligation to comply. That's the reality of our teams playing in another association league, the league doesn't answer to the CSA.

Possible MLS thought that the CSA would just keep their heads down and reschedule at the end of the season so they just ignore them. Also possible that the CSA are as incompetent as some "hardcores" believe to the point of telling MLS that they would play the final game in December/January...in Canada of all places! You'll pardon my skepticism on this one!

All I'm saying is that winter is unacceptable and it should be delayed to next spring.

9 hours ago, Watchmen said:

If the CSA couldn't get a venue and date organized in that time, that's on them.  

As said earlier, even if they did have everything planned, MLS are under no obligation to comply

 

[Ruffian]

16 hours ago, Ansem said:

I'm not anti-MLS, that's ridiculous

[Ansem]

9 hours ago, nfitz said:

I don't think any new restrictions have been imposed on most of the province. And I don't that the impact soccer matches in empty stadiums ... they've exempted people going to cinemas and banquet halls for example. This is more about house parties. Or did I miss something in the last hour or two in this constantly changing world.

New restrictions have been announced

Ontario announces new restrictions and steep fines amid Covid-19 surge

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/sep/17/canada-ontario-new-restrictions-steep-fines-covid-19-surge

The new rules reduce the size of indoor gatherings to 10, down from 50, and outdoor gatherings to 25, down from 100.

It doesn't specify if sporting events will be exempt yet

9 hours ago, nfitz said:

Not sure the big issue here ... this is CSA's choice. They could have scheduled it whenever.

MLS doesn't have to comply

9 hours ago, nfitz said:

Obviously not happening, or someone wouldn't have already told Toronto FC that it's in December.

That's a massive contradiction to the CSA intentions of having the game played after the CPL finals. Hard to believe that the CSA would willingly want that game in the middle of winter...in Canada

9 hours ago, nfitz said:

When is Forge playing Concacaf League 2020?

October 20th if that still holds, which means they should probably leave a week earlier to get used to the climate wherever they are going so right after Thanksgiving. If they get back to Canada on the 21st, they have to isolate for 14 days , until at least November 4. Then allow a few days for practice and we're talking mid-November and that's if they haven't won and advanced in CONCACAF.

Would MLS interrupt their season for the V Cup in the middle of their season with Canadian teams having to isolate when they get back? Doubtful

[RS]

25 minutes ago, Ansem said:

MLS is under no obligation to comply.

 

1 minute ago, Ansem said:

MLS doesn't have to comply

 

I see we've found a new canard for today. Cool.

[Ansem]

6 minutes ago, Ruffian said:

I'm not a fan of it in Canada due to the roster rules. Had it been reciprocal, it would be different but it isn't so I don't have to like it

 

[Ansem]

Stephen Hart on The Canadian Championship