Herdman new head coach

[Joe MacCarthy]

Lots of good new stuff in this interview.  For instance, I never knew they "took over" the academies for a week introducing and integrating the NT program.

Some say he's a great salesman (as a pejorative) and he is, literally, but it sounds like most of this stuff was planned from the very beginning.  If I was the CSA I would have did what they did because in no way do I think any of the previous coaches were going to go into this depth or even had the personal means to.

[Joe MacCarthy]

He speaks of the training camp "fight" at 40:30, you can hear the excitement in his voice.  It's the same thing that I posted about singing the anthem, it's important, it matters, it means something.  I've always thought this stuff was important, he does and now the team finally does.  These are all small but importance parts in team building.  Seems to be working so far.

[EdmPhonzieFan]

7 minutes ago, Joe MacCarthy said:

He speaks of the training camp "fight" at 40:30, you can hear the excitement in his voice.  It's the same thing that I posted about singing the anthem, it's important, it matters, it means something.  I've always thought this stuff was important, he does and now the team finally does.  These are all small but importance parts in team building.  Seems to be working so far.

Nothing wrong with a few tussles on the training ground, it keeps things intense, in check for when it matters. All that matters is that it does no go overboard. 

[Joe MacCarthy]

^it's fine if they can shake hands and move on, if they don't have the mental maturity to do that, it's no good. 

I posted earlier about this team seeming like level headed, mature guys and at the end Herdman spoke about in the past, anytime the team faced adversity, they crumbled. So far they haven't and seem unlikely to, evidenced by the comebacks from being behind (a trait I wish they would cure)

[CanadianSoccerFan]

Octavio Zambrano tweet storm incoming

[Free kick]

6 hours ago, red card said:

Herdman does a podcast with Athletic Football Business of Sport. In hindsight, he prequelled a lot of what he said in his October 15th presser posted on the previous page.

Only thing really new for me is that he named Scott Arfield as one who pushed back with "this is men's football" line when confronted about fights and dsyfunctionality of the team. Other newish content is that he interviewed 40 people past & present of the national teams to understand what he was getting into. And there was some pushback in playing teenagers from the veterans. He appears to also want something more meaningful than a high profile Euro club managerial job.

https://podcasts.google.com/feed/aHR0cHM6Ly9mZWVkcy5tZWdhcGhvbmUuZm0vVEFNQzE5NzkwMDE4NTk/episode/YzM3ZWI2ZDYtMjQ0MS0xMWVjLWExMDItZmYyZWUyMTdiNDEw?sa=X&ved=0CAUQkfYCahgKEwiQwLy6qO3zAhUAAAAAHQAAAAAQ81M

Herdman is bidding to qualify for men’s World Cup in Qatar next year for the first time since 1986, having previously seen success with Canada's women's team at the Olympics, winning two bronze medals. Listen to his story and the way that he's been able to transform a nation's prospects, whilst not always receiving the best support out there.

Thanks for posting that.  That is a good interview, an insightful interview and you do indeed learn new things from that podcast.  He does have good insight into the culture surounding the game in Canada.  
 

He mentioned that just qualifying for Qatar means $15 Million for the program.  Which would be very significant as this would cascade to the larger amounts that come with hosting in 2026.  Also, yes, as mentioned in another post, we learn of the integration with the academies. I never new about that.  
 

He talks about the past struggles of getting players to commit to canada instead of other countries and what he has done to overcome this struggle.  He talks about canada versus New zealand and how one sport dominates the sporting culture and the challenges it presents.  I am sold more than ever on what this guy can do for Canada.  I hope we dont lose him before 2026 because i can see some vultures scooping in with attractive offers.  

The last 10 mins of the podcast reveal a lot.

 

PS:  i just went back to read the first 7-8 pages of this thread, when he was hired.  From what he said in that podcats,  he must have been reading it 😄

 

Edited October 29, 2021 by Free kick

[Bison44]

Ughhh.  Still seems like a very big cop out for him to say most of the opposition he got was sexism/misogany from hardcore CMNT fans.  He makes it sound like no one had any problems with how and what he did with the womens program, and it was normal as pie to sack Zambrano (who they just hired) and bring him over.  He might be as good a coach as he tells you he is but I hope he didnt dislocate his arm clapping himself on the back.

[Free kick]

16 minutes ago, Bison44 said:

but I hope he didnt dislocate his arm clapping himself on the back.

Yes,  there was a little bit of that.  But i think anyone of us would have said and felt the same if it was us who faced that kind of critcism.
 

And, since we are playing devil’s advocate here. It must also be said that Osieck, Mitchell, Yallop & Hart didnt have players like Davies, TB and David at their disposal.  
 

But again,  he has earned the right IMHO to say :” i told you so”.

Edited October 29, 2021 by Free kick

[Sal333]

3 minutes ago, Bison44 said:

Ughhh.  Still seems like a very big cop out for him to say most of the opposition he got was sexism/misogany from hardcore CMNT fans.  He makes it sound like no one had any problems with how and what he did with the womens program, and it was normal as pie to sack Zambrano (who they just hired) and bring him over.  He might be as good a coach as he tells you he is but I hope he didnt dislocate his arm clapping himself on the back.

What did he do with the woman's program? If I remember correctly they were at a physically, spiritually and emotionally terrible place when he took over from the Italian coach - I forget her name. And every player off of that woman's team have had only great things to say about him.

[Joe MacCarthy]

55 minutes ago, Free kick said:

PS:  i just went back to read the first 7-8 pages of this thread, when he was hired.  From what he said in that podcats,  he must have been reading it 😄

Or maybe some of us used a bit of reasoned thinking and could foresee the possibility.

[Joe MacCarthy]

16 minutes ago, Sal333 said:

What did he do with the woman's program? If I remember correctly they were at a physically, spiritually and emotionally terrible place when he took over from the Italian coach - I forget her name. And every player off of that woman's team have had only great things to say about him.

Oh no, you didn't read the thread.  La Morace was brilliant and should have been rehired, or so I was told.

[Joe MacCarthy]

22 minutes ago, Free kick said:

And, since we are playing devil’s advocate here. It must also be said that Osieck, Mitchell, Yallop & Hart didnt have players like Davies, TB and David at their disposal. 

And yet at the Gold Cup he was missing most of the core players and did alright so somebody on that staff is doing something right.

[dyslexic nam]

I find the regular recycling of self congratulation here since he has been successful (so far) to be a bit over the top.  The reality is that many of us were not the polarized caricatures of either progressive clairvoyants or misogynistic troglodytes.

I admit (and have admitted) that I was a bit of a skeptic at first.  But it wasn’t some narrow minded misogyny - it was reasonable hesitation that we were handing over the keys to our golden generation to a guy who had never coached the men’s game before.  For those of us looking at the chess pieces we had, or would have in the next couple of years after his appointment, that seemed like a risk and there was simply a concern that it might not be the best approach.

I am happy to admit that my skepticism was proven wrong and that he has so far done what we all hoped he would do.  But lets not injure ourselves with overly vigorous back-patting about how clairvoyant and progressive some were.  The fact is that most here didn’t live on the extreme other end of the spectrum and the debate was far more nuanced than many like to portray.  

[Joe MacCarthy]

Man, you sure can shovel the horse puckey

[nolbertos]

44 minutes ago, Joe MacCarthy said:

And yet at the Gold Cup he was missing most of the core players and did alright so somebody on that staff is doing something right.

Osieck had like Canadian C-D squad players compared to what Herdman has now.  That was a really dark time in Canadian soccer where most of our core squad were playing on fringe teams in the SPL and Eastern Europe.  If Osieck had the talented squad Herdman has now, we would’ve at least won 2-3 Gold Cups by now.  I give more credit to Osieck than Herdman for now because he made chicken soup and more outta chicken #%^^^ literally.

Edited October 29, 2021 by nolbertos

[dyslexic nam]

5 minutes ago, Joe MacCarthy said:

Man, you sure can shovel the horse puckey

I mean, that is one way to ignore everything I said.  

[Joe MacCarthy]

Just now, dyslexic nam said:

I mean, that is one way to ignore everything I said.  

Trust me, I got it.

[Joe MacCarthy]

15 minutes ago, nolbertos said:

Osieck had like Canadian C-D squad players compared to what Herdman has now.  That was a really dark time in Canadian soccer where most of our core squad were playing on fringe teams in the SPL and Eastern Europe.  If Osieck had the talented squad Herdman has now, we would’ve at least won 2-3 Gold Cups by now.  I give more credit to Osieck than Herdman for now because he made chicken soup and more outta chicken #%^^^ literally.

I don't think that is a fair or actually useful comparison, totally different times and situations.

[Bison44]

Shovel Joe...shovel............

[Joe MacCarthy]

???

[kacbru]

For me, the early skepticism had little to do with Herdman and more to do with the departure of OZ.  In hindsight, it is working out great and there's not much to criticize.  But the absolute lack of transparency of how it all went down certainly could have been handled better and might have reduced some of the completely inappropriate comments about his hire.

[Joe MacCarthy]

2 minutes ago, kacbru said:

For me, the early skepticism had little to do with Herdman and more to do with the departure of OZ.  In hindsight, it is working out great and there's not much to criticize.  But the absolute lack of transparency of how it all went down certainly could have been handled better and might have reduced some of the completely inappropriate comments about his hire.

Very true, but sometimes folks should have enough sense to wait for more information, evidence or the situation to clear before going off half cocked.  What am I saying?

Welcome to the Voyageurs Est 1996

[Sal333]

1 hour ago, dyslexic nam said:

.  But it wasn’t some narrow minded misogyny - it was reasonable hesitation that we were handing over the keys to our golden generation to a guy who had never coached the men’s game before.

Sorry, man, but you contradict yourself within the same sentence. You say it isn't misogyny but with the next breath you say he never coached a men's team. Let me ask you what's the difference between coaching men and women?

I can understand the uproar if Herdman had decided to play women on the men's team but when it comes to coaching the same principles apply to men and women.

Edited October 29, 2021 by Sal333

[Joe MacCarthy]

^ I thought Herdman explained it really well in the interview.

[Floortom]

2 minutes ago, Sal333 said:

Sorry, man, but you contradict yourself in back to back sentences. You say it isn't misogyny but with the next breath you say he never coached a man's team. Let me ask you what's the difference with coaching men and women?

Coaching the technical and tactical aspects for men and women is the same

Managing a men’s versus women’s National team is very different. That’s not to say it can’t be learned and picked up (clearly Herdman has) but you’re gambling.