Luca Koleosho

[Canadian Chuck]

Every player on the USA teams that won the CONCACAF U20 and that made it to the CONCACAF U17 final were developed in the USA, except for Keyrol Figueroa but even he spent a few years in FC Dallas academy where he obtained citizenship. They needed foreign-raised players to win the last Nations League Final, but they also won the last Gold Cup Final with only players born and raised in the USA.

It is both true they are recruiting foreign-developed players at senior level, and that without them, their domestic development is still ahead of others in CONCACAF. Their development has indeed improved regardless of the recruiting.

[Shway]

Is this the new Flores thread?

[Sechat23]

41 minutes ago, Canadian Chuck said:

Every player on the USA teams that won the CONCACAF U20 and that made it to the CONCACAF U17 final were developed in the USA, except for Keyrol Figueroa but even he spent a few years in FC Dallas academy where he obtained citizenship. They needed foreign-raised players to win the last Nations League Final, but they also won the last Gold Cup Final with only players born and raised in the USA.

It is both true they are recruiting foreign-developed players at senior level, and that without them, their domestic development is still ahead of others in CONCACAF. Their development has indeed improved regardless of the recruiting.

I don't think this is the place to talk about all of this. MLS is losing good young players like Luca. NYFC just lost one yesterday. If Canada was a melting pot then no one would care.

If Luca only has Italy and USA in his mind is that bad for Canada that pretty much says I'm not ready for this national league? Take this as a relationship that starts with dating (youth tournament) and depending on how everything goes next is marriage (Senior games).

 

[toontownman]

51 minutes ago, Shway said:

Is this the new Flores thread?

 

[Canadian Chuck]

20 hours ago, Sechat23 said:

Yes, I agree with everything you say.

You also have to look at it another way.

If Canada had an elite player that was born in Canada but was rise abroad would you say NO to him? That's what the US is doing and has been doing. MLS has not been good at developing players, but that's changing. The Roman empire was not built overnight. Last, we are not England, Argentina, Spain, etc we have to use the players we can reach.

Programs like England, Argentina, Portugal, Croatia are also trying to steal youth players fully developed in the USA who have been with US youth teams first, such as Christian McFarlane and Benjamin Cremaschi. It would be silly for Canada to disregard Koleosho or to make fun of the US for doing it when big/elite programs are doing it too.

[Sechat23]

2 hours ago, Canadian Chuck said:

Programs like England, Argentina, Portugal, Croatia are also trying to steal youth players fully developed in the USA who have been with US youth teams first, such as Christian McFarlane and Benjamin Cremaschi. It would be silly for Canada to disregard Koleosho or to make fun of the US for doing it when big/elite programs are doing it too.

Yes, agree but I think most of them wanted to get a passport from them in order to move at the age of 16. When a player gets a cap tie from counties like England, Argentina, Spain, Germany, and many more at the youth tournaments it is easier to do a one-time switch. That's why you wanted to get the best player you can get aka Folarin Balogun he may or may not be good enough for England.

Unlike those counties USA and Canada, we can't afford a player like Luca without having been at. We really don't know what his future will look like. 

[SirBobsaget]

11 hours ago, Shway said:

Is this the new Flores thread?

Koleosho is passed Flores already. Flores has been on the bench for months then finally got a start but only lasted 57 mins. Did nothing, was subbed out and his team lost again. He can't get playing time on a Spain 2nd division relegation level club.

[Unnamed Trialist]

3 hours ago, SirBobsaget said:

Koleosho is passed Flores already. Flores has been on the bench for months then finally got a start but only lasted 57 mins. Did nothing, was subbed out and his team lost again. He can't get playing time on a Spain 2nd division relegation level club.

It's still a big club, and a great one at that. In a beautiful city. At his age it's isn't that bad a first stint at a pro level.

[Sechat23]

3 hours ago, Unnamed Trialist said:

It's still a big club, and a great one at that. In a beautiful city. At his age it's isn't that bad a first stint at a pro level.

Both of them are on the same level. In the next few years, both of them need to have more pro minutes.

[El Hombre]

On 3/3/2023 at 2:37 AM, Bertuzzi44 said:

Someone remind me how active Canada's U20 team is again?

 

On 3/3/2023 at 10:40 AM, Soccerpro2 said:

It doesn't exist.

 

On 3/3/2023 at 12:47 PM, RS said:

Ok. Here's a list of upcoming games:

Koleosho was already in contact with the CSA while our U20 team was active in May/June of last year.  Pretty sure he was on the provisional roster for the U20 championship as well.  He preferred instead to attend a camp with the senior team.

So, even if our U20 team was "active", it's incredibly unlikely that he would accept a call up.

[InglewoodJack]

20 hours ago, Shway said:

Is this the new Flores thread?

By all accounts, Koleosho can actually play. 
 

what happens first: Marcelo Flores’ next Mexico cap or his debut for forge? 

[Shway]

1 hour ago, El Hombre said:

Koleosho was already in contact with the CSA while our U20 team was active in May/June of last year.  Pretty sure he was on the provisional roster for the U20 championship as well.  He preferred instead to attend a camp with the senior team.

So, even if our U20 team was "active", it's incredibly unlikely that he would accept a call up.

 And why do you believe this sir?

[Shway]

1 minute ago, InglewoodJack said:

By all accounts, Koleosho can actually play. 
 

what happens first: Marcelo Flores’ next Mexico cap or his debut for forge? 

And by all accounts Flores can too. TBH I'm not bitter over a boys decision, me thinks his dad played a huge part. 
So because he didn't choose us, I'm not going to act like he can't play or that guys weren't clamouring over him.

But I will say, he is still 19....has a long time to turn things around for himself. We've had guys in similar situations who are now regulars in the CMNT.

[El Hombre]

13 minutes ago, Shway said:

 And why do you believe this sir?

Because he didn't when they had a competition.  Why would he if its a friendly?

[InglewoodJack]

18 minutes ago, Shway said:

And by all accounts Flores can too. TBH I'm not bitter over a boys decision, me thinks his dad played a huge part. 
So because he didn't choose us, I'm not going to act like he can't play or that guys weren't clamouring over him.

But I will say, he is still 19....has a long time to turn things around for himself. We've had guys in similar situations who are now regulars in the CMNT.

I'm exaggerating a tad there, and I think Koleosho is more of an unknown quantity than we'd like to admit, but what has Marcelo Flores actually done so far? He played at Arsenal's academy, didn't make a single app for their senior team, was sent to La Liga 2, just spent 2 months glued to the bench, despite Oviedo sliding down the table during that time, came back for a game, and barely made it passed half time. 

I'm over him and his family doing the whole thing they did with Canada and Mexico, ultimately it's his choice to do what he wants with his career, but he made it into this whole The Decision thing and then turned around and did a whole lot of nothing the following season. He's young and he'll grow, but at least Koleosho seems to be in the plans for a top division club in a very good league, while Flores is not.

[Sechat23]

24 minutes ago, InglewoodJack said:

I'm exaggerating a tad there, and I think Koleosho is more of an unknown quantity than we'd like to admit, but what has Marcelo Flores actually done so far? He played at Arsenal's academy, didn't make a single app for their senior team, was sent to La Liga 2, just spent 2 months glued to the bench, despite Oviedo sliding down the table during that time, came back for a game, and barely made it passed half time. 

I'm over him and his family doing the whole thing they did with Canada and Mexico, ultimately it's his choice to do what he wants with his career, but he made it into this whole The Decision thing and then turned around and did a whole lot of nothing the following season. He's young and he'll grow, but at least Koleosho seems to be in the plans for a top division club in a very good league, while Flores is not.

It all comes down to dual nat panic. That unknown quantity is what makes people panic because he could be the next Jonathan daviss or could he be the next JoGo. JoGo also has an unknown quantity but people still wanted to see him play for their country because of that.

Yes, the family does tell a player what country should they play for but it's up to the player. Luca's family might not tell him, he should be playing for Canada and or the USA.

[narduch]

Italy U19 roster trimmed down from 28 to 20 and Luca remains on it.

 

 

[Canadian Chuck]

http://www.americansoccernow.com/articles/ahead-of-marbella-camp-varas-discusses-the-u-20-player-pool-and-challenges-of-the-world-cup-roster

 

USA U20 manager:

Quote

Luca has decided to play with Italy. I feel really good about the process that we went through to make sure that Luca understood how we value him and how badly we wanted him in our program. Everyone from talent ID to federation leadership to senior men's national team was involved in multiple calls with him and his family. And we laid out our process and our plan for him. And unfortunately, he decided to play with Italy in the current moment. And that's a choice that we have to respect because it's a choice he made.

 

[dyslexic nam]

I’d love to have him. And I hope Herdman tries to sell him on the program.   But the saving grace for me is that we have good young players in his position.   Not that he wouldn’t be a valuable addition if he turns out to be a La Liga calibre player - but I am not going to pine over him.   I will cheer him on rabidly if he commits to Canada but if not I won’t waste any mental energy on it.  

Of course someone can quote this back to me when I am bitching in 2025 after he decides to suit up for the US…
 

[toontownman]

Will be interesting to see where he goes. Very early days. 

Might play to our advantage. Quite possible the states will be hurt for pride and will snub him down the line.

[Shway]

On 1/13/2023 at 10:45 AM, dyslexic nam said:

Yeah I will give him the benefit of the doubt until there is a reason to do otherwise.  

I guess this came faster than expected eh lol

[dyslexic nam]

2 hours ago, Shway said:

I guess this came faster than expected eh lol

It is still just a youth call up so it doesn’t actually settle the issue (any more than Jebbison playing for the England youth teams settles it).   We don’t have a youth program to speak of so it is entirely understandable that he would continue to benefit from international youth exposure rather than commit himself to a senior national team as an 18 year old.  It is 3.5 years before the next opportunity to play in a huge tournament (assuming he would not get called into an Italian or Spanish Euro squad before the next WC).   At that time he could have his pick of two host countries.  Staying an uncommitted youth makes sense.  

Edited March 18, 2023 by dyslexic nam

[Kadenge]

13 hours ago, dyslexic nam said:

  But the saving grace for me is that we have good young players in his position.  
 

other than Tajon and Davies who are our starters at the attacking wide positions, do we really have good young players out wide? Hopefully Millar can bounce back next season, but Corbeanu's progression seems to have stalled a bit and Jayden appears to be better playing as a central mid based on his last year at TFC.

[dyslexic nam]

5 minutes ago, Kadenge said:

other than Tajon and Davies who are our starters at the attacking wide positions, do we really have good young players out wide? Hopefully Millar can bounce back next season, but Corbeanu's progression seems to have stalled a bit and Jayden appears to be better playing as a central mid based on his last year at TFC.

I agree that we could use more quality depth, but the two you listed will be starter-quality wingers potentially for the next 2 cycles.  And between Millar, Corbeanu, Nelson and Shaff I think we will have one or two others emerge into quality wingers (hell, Adekugbe can prob play that role as well).  

Koleosho would still be a great addition to the squad but I think this is probably the area where we have the most talent.  If he opts to play elsewhere I can deal with it without losing my shit.  
 

[Unnamed Trialist]

A little surprise in an article in the Espanyol news website La Grada, not belonging to the club. He has another nationality.

He was injured last weekend in a match with the B, had to be helped off the pitch early 2nd half, it looked like the same ankle that has plagued him for a few months. But then they explain that he's okay, he'll go with the Italy u-19s and can train and play. And that apart from being eligible for Italy, having gone to a US u-15 camp and a Canada senior camp, he also has Spanish citizenship and could still make a change for Spain as long as he is not cap-tied. 

First time I have ever seen that confirmed.

https://www.lagradaonline.com/dani-jarque/espanyol-b/luka-koleosho-lesion-italia-sub-19
 

Today the Italy u-19s beat Germany in Bremen 2-3, in a qualifier for the Euro u-19s, he did not get off the bench.

Edited March 22, 2023 by Unnamed Trialist