red card Posted May 9 Share Posted May 9 18 hours ago, Watchmen said: I'm guessing they're looking ahead at some of their possible attendance numbers and thinking they can weather any blow back. Because yeah, announcing during the season that you're moving a home game to another city is sort of...amateur. PWHL has done the same with little lead time to scope out expansion cities & too see if there is bigger interest within the current cities. They have played games in Detroit (with 2 Canadian teams) and Pittsburgh. NY team has rotated their games between Connecticut & Brooklyn. Toronto has played in 3 city arenas. Montreal has played in Verdun & Laval. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mihairokov Posted May 9 Share Posted May 9 1 hour ago, red card said: PWHL has done the same with little lead time to scope out expansion cities & too see if there is bigger interest within the current cities. They have played games in Detroit (with 2 Canadian teams) and Pittsburgh. NY team has rotated their games between Connecticut & Brooklyn. Toronto has played in 3 city arenas. Montreal has played in Verdun & Laval. A lot of this was because PWHL teams were going to venues far too late into a normal season looking for ice-time and dates. This was out of necessity more than interest in spreading the games around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
red card Posted May 9 Share Posted May 9 (edited) 1 hour ago, Mihairokov said: A lot of this was because PWHL teams were going to venues far too late into a normal season looking for ice-time and dates. This was out of necessity more than interest in spreading the games around. That basically only happened with Minnesota as they played in a NHL rink. So, they had at least a game at a college rink. NY did schedule on playing in 2 rinks. Canadian teams had little issues as they were in non-NHL arenas. Toronto passed on Coca-Cola Coliseum because the rental costs was too high given what they projected for attendance. But now using it for playoffs since they can get sellouts at higher ticket prices. So the out of home base games came up during the season as rumours/leaks after PWHL saw Minnesota getting over 10k, Ottawa breaking an attendance record and consistent sellouts in Toronto/Montreal. Montreal did their Bell Centre game after they saw Toronto sell out their Scotiabank game. Similar to Kelowna, Pittsburgh was considered as a site for a team. And I didn't see any fans complaining they were missing out on seeing a game. Instead, some Toronto fans even drove to Pittsburgh to see the game. Edited May 9 by red card Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mihairokov Posted May 9 Share Posted May 9 2 minutes ago, red card said: That basically only happened with Minnesota as they played in a NHL rink. So, they had at least a game at a college rink. NY did schedule on playing in 2 rinks. Canadian teams had little issues as they were in non-NHL arenas. Toronto passed on Coca-Cola Coliseum because the rental costs was too high given what they projected for attendance. But now using it for playoffs since they can get sellouts at higher ticket prices. I won't beleaguer this point any further other than to say that there are tenants in these arenas that aren't NHL teams who already had set schedules and couldn't be moved, to say nothing of other events those arenas might hold. PWHL came in late when these schedules are already mostly settled and had to take lame dates, and/or move games elsewhere. That's all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BearcatSA Posted May 9 Share Posted May 9 5 hours ago, Footscray said: Okanagan FC went on hiatus from PCSL this year.... To be honest while I'm glad to see this event coming here, I'm kind of shocked its going to be at the Apple Bowl in its current state and I'm afraid the way this is being set up will not result in the best possible crowd. I'll be doing what I can to get all my players and families out but it's basically a crumbling high school level stadium with limited parking and a track between the fans and the field - also on a sunday in June - all the Interior BC rep leagues (TOYSL) and many of the most engaged soccer families have games every sunday. Our leagues all wrap for the summer on the 27th, it's such a shame this wasn't just a bit later as probably half the soccer community in town with older players will be in kamloops, vernon, salmon arm, penticton etc. I know if we want to be in the league we have to be able to draw on a sunday regardless of youth soccer schedules but just seems like a bit of a shame if you just wanted to do one day and game to sell the community to investors that you couldn't have waited two weeks. I'm guessing that's probably 200-300 of your most hardcore members of the soccer community who will have a hard time getting to the game. Seems like they're feeling out the market but I would be (pleasantly) surprised if they drew more than 2k at that site and with those facilities on this kind of 5 week lead time unless there is some kind of massive promotional budget. Had really been hoping for the next news to come in our community that we're finally funding a proper stadium somewhere close to downtown or for an event like this to be planned for months with some new temporary stands and a beer garden added and plenty of time for those of us in the soccer community to hype it up, so feel a bit mixed about this. Anyway, will be doing what I can to get as many people out as possible... hopefully we can make this a success! This goes back to my early post about this seemingly being spur of the moment. Believe me, from my contacts in the local business/tourism/chamber, there was no buzz around CPL or such an event. The things you've mentioned about the timing of the match suggest that not much (if any?) consultation with the local soccer community took place. However, we'll see how it goes ans hopefully it goes over really well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
masster Posted May 9 Share Posted May 9 Unnamed Trialist, johnyb and MtlMario 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Footscray Posted May 9 Share Posted May 9 This is great to read... it sounds like something is cooking again in Kelowna for sure, hearing the city is playing ball is huge as that's such a big piece of the puzzle: “Especially the Okanagan Valley — and Kelowna, in particular — has been on the CPL radar for some time,” Allison said. “The circumstances were that the first group that looked at it wasn’t able to put the puzzle together. But it’s had a bit of a rising from the ashes and the city seems to be on board. And with the Apple Bowl out there, there’s a venue that has hosted our sport in the past. Indeed, the Vancouver Whitecaps have played a neutral-site game there — or many of them there — so we know it’s a great soccer community. “We already have a concentration of teams in the area where there’s Ottawa, York and Forge,” continued Allison. “So it would be a great benefit if all the stars aligned to have a team on Vancouver Island, a team in Vancouver, a team in Calgary and maybe in the Okanagan. And presumably one day again, we’ll be able to look at Edmonton again and do all that. johnyb, NVsoccer and Aird25 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpursFlu Posted May 9 Share Posted May 9 (edited) When it comes to Montreal and maybe even Edmonton. When it comes to ripping out a track nobody has done it better than River Plate. The new design has made for one of the coolest atmospheres in World Football. Helps when you have an amazing supporters culture and enormous fan base but still a stadium built to accommodate track and field can be saved Edited May 9 by SpursFlu jdheid, rkomar and johnyb 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnyb Posted May 9 Share Posted May 9 20 hours ago, Footscray said: Okanagan FC went on hiatus from PCSL this year.... To be honest while I'm glad to see this event coming here, I'm kind of shocked its going to be at the Apple Bowl in its current state and I'm afraid the way this is being set up will not result in the best possible crowd. I'll be doing what I can to get all my players and families out but it's basically a crumbling high school level stadium with limited parking and a track between the fans and the field - also on a sunday in June - all the Interior BC rep leagues (TOYSL) and many of the most engaged soccer families have games every sunday. Our leagues all wrap for the summer on the 27th, it's such a shame this wasn't just a bit later as probably half the soccer community in town with older players will be in kamloops, vernon, salmon arm, penticton etc. I know if we want to be in the league we have to be able to draw on a sunday regardless of youth soccer schedules but just seems like a bit of a shame if you just wanted to do one day and game to sell the community to investors that you couldn't have waited two weeks. I'm guessing that's probably 200-300 of your most hardcore members of the soccer community who will have a hard time getting to the game. Seems like they're feeling out the market but I would be (pleasantly) surprised if they drew more than 2k at that site and with those facilities on this kind of 5 week lead time unless there is some kind of massive promotional budget. Had really been hoping for the next news to come in our community that we're finally funding a proper stadium somewhere close to downtown or for an event like this to be planned for months with some new temporary stands and a beer garden added and plenty of time for those of us in the soccer community to hype it up, so feel a bit mixed about this. Anyway, will be doing what I can to get as many people out as possible... hopefully we can make this a success! I remember the first year that local clubs were not supposed to book games or practices during CPL games. This year almost all of Valour's home games conflict with my daughter's games. 😡 Footscray, Cheeta and Obinna 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unnamed Trialist Posted May 9 Share Posted May 9 1 hour ago, SpursFlu said: When it comes to Montreal and maybe even Edmonton. When it comes to ripping out a track nobody has done it better than River Plate. The new design has made for one of the coolest atmospheres in World Football. Helps when you have an amazing supporters culture and enormous fan base but still a stadium built to accommodate track and field can be saved It's still extremely expensive doing it that way. The Mallorca stadium where Larin plays went through a similar transformation, also very expensive and slow, but they're building a new track on another site nearby. I'd keep and remake the main stand. Shift the field towards it centred. Build a Langley style stand on the other side. And one endzone. 15-20 million. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Watchmen Posted May 9 Share Posted May 9 (edited) A reminder that sports stadiums are rarely a good investment for the government. I'll concede the CPL is operating on a much smaller scale. https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2024/05/sports-stadium-subsidies-taxpayer-funding/678319/ Edited May 9 by Watchmen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mihairokov Posted May 9 Share Posted May 9 32 minutes ago, Watchmen said: A reminder that sports stadiums are rarely a good investment for the government. I'll concede the CPL is operating on a much smaller scale. https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2024/05/sports-stadium-subsidies-taxpayer-funding/678319/ This is more in reference to gridiron stadiums, mostly because they're only used up to a dozen times a season. The above article is based on US stadiums which, IMO, are far more onerous in their public deals than those in Canada, although we have our own share of questionable public funding for stadiums and/or arenas. Generally soccer and baseball stadiums are "better deals" based on home dates, usage, and design, but there's a lot of variables at play that it's difficult to pin them all down with a wide brush. For the CPL we're talking about high school-esque stadiums in some instances. Temporary stands aren't really a plight on the public dollar, or the private owner's dollar. Aird25 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpursFlu Posted May 9 Share Posted May 9 36 minutes ago, Watchmen said: A reminder that sports stadiums are rarely a good investment for the government. I'll concede the CPL is operating on a much smaller scale. https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2024/05/sports-stadium-subsidies-taxpayer-funding/678319/ Just reminder that rarely a good investment for our government would actually be considered an improvement based on the performance of our federal government and our BC government over the past whatever years. Honestly if we're going to waste money let's at least waste it on something that might actually bring some joy to people's lives masster and NVsoccer 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Watchmen Posted May 9 Share Posted May 9 22 minutes ago, Mihairokov said: This is more in reference to gridiron stadiums, mostly because they're only used up to a dozen times a season. The above article is based on US stadiums which, IMO, are far more onerous in their public deals than those in Canada, although we have our own share of questionable public funding for stadiums and/or arenas. Generally soccer and baseball stadiums are "better deals" based on home dates, usage, and design, but there's a lot of variables at play that it's difficult to pin them all down with a wide brush. For the CPL we're talking about high school-esque stadiums in some instances. Temporary stands aren't really a plight on the public dollar, or the private owner's dollar. I mean, Camden Yards is cited in it as an example of a stadium toted as "revitalizing an area" and then not actually doing that. I think I'm just a bigger believer in owners taking on the risk/expense themselves of building the stadium, but governments not constantly being such an impediment to it (see: Vancouver city council vs the Whitecaps). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
narduch Posted May 9 Share Posted May 9 1 hour ago, Watchmen said: A reminder that sports stadiums are rarely a good investment for the government. I'll concede the CPL is operating on a much smaller scale. https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2024/05/sports-stadium-subsidies-taxpayer-funding/678319/ Using this reasoning, you could also argue we shouldn't be hosting the World Cup either Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Watchmen Posted May 10 Share Posted May 10 32 minutes ago, narduch said: Using this reasoning, you could also argue we shouldn't be hosting the World Cup either And a significant number of people do. narduch 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mihairokov Posted May 10 Share Posted May 10 1 hour ago, Watchmen said: I mean, Camden Yards is cited in it as an example of a stadium toted as "revitalizing an area" and then not actually doing that. I'm guessing this is partly why sports franchise owners are now offering districts as opposed to just stadiums. Revitalize an entire area rather than just the stadium. Also a good reason to give them more funding. Lansdowne in Ottawa is essentially this. 1 hour ago, Watchmen said: I think I'm just a bigger believer in owners taking on the risk/expense themselves of building the stadium This we can agree on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aird25 Posted May 10 Share Posted May 10 4 hours ago, narduch said: Using this reasoning, you could also argue we shouldn't be hosting the World Cup either Or keeping parks narduch and Kent 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kingston Posted May 10 Share Posted May 10 There are a very large number of things in life where the government's investment can be debated. Largely speaking, there are two broad categories in which one can question the usefulness or validity of that investment. First, there is the question of whether the government should be involved in that area of life. There are only so many projects that the government can support, so should that support go to, say, sports or, say, a new airport. Second, there is the disconnect between investment and revenue. If someone invests $10 million in a CPL stadium, maybe that brings $100 million in overall economic activity but only $2 million of that finds its way directly back to whoever put up the $10 million to begin with. Is this a terrible investment that lost $8 million or a great one that made $90 million for the city? No private person is going to lose the $8 million but maybe the government can because of the overall net benefit. johnyb and masster 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BearcatSA Posted May 10 Share Posted May 10 On 5/8/2024 at 4:07 PM, Footscray said: also on a sunday in June - all the Interior BC rep leagues (TOYSL) and many of the most engaged soccer families have games every sunday. Our leagues all wrap for the summer on the 27th, it's such a shame this wasn't just a bit later as probably half the soccer community in town with older players will be in kamloops, vernon, salmon arm, penticton etc. I know if we want to be in the league we have to be able to draw on a sunday regardless of youth soccer schedules but just seems like a bit of a shame if you just wanted to do one day and game to sell the community to investors that you couldn't have waited two weeks. I'm guessing that's probably 200-300 of your most hardcore members of the soccer community who will have a hard time getting to the game. Seems like they're feeling out the market but I would be (pleasantly) surprised if they drew more than 2k at that site and with those facilities on this kind of 5 week lead time unless there is some kind of massive promotional budget. Maybe if they had this planned out much further in advance with feedback from area stakeholders involved (like regional youth soccer associations) and specifically wanted Cavalry to be the opponent for VFC, they could have had that particular match set for early July? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big_M Posted May 10 Share Posted May 10 would this be a bus trip or a flight for a team like calgary? around 9 hours by bus to kelowna Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Watchmen Posted May 10 Share Posted May 10 1 hour ago, Big_M said: would this be a bus trip or a flight for a team like calgary? around 9 hours by bus to kelowna I think if it's a group from Calgary going to Kelowna, legally jetskis have to be involved. kacbru, BearcatSA, nolando and 2 others 2 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shermanator Posted May 10 Share Posted May 10 Anyone who's actually done the drive from Calgary to Kelowna would argue it's better to fly... Unnamed Trialist 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kingston Posted May 10 Share Posted May 10 2 hours ago, Big_M said: would this be a bus trip or a flight for a team like calgary? around 9 hours by bus to kelowna I was going to suggest the train as a comfortable compromise but when I looked I realized Via doesn't even go to Calgary. What the heck? No wonder Alberta is looking at a provincial rail system! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BearcatSA Posted May 11 Share Posted May 11 6 hours ago, Watchmen said: I think if it's a group from Calgary going to Kelowna, legally jetskis have to be involved. Introduce Wheeldon and a few Cavalry players as they arrive on jetskis into the Kelowna yacht club harbour at the pre game presser! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Please sign in to comment
You will be able to leave a comment after signing in
Sign In Now