jonovision Posted January 9, 2018 Share Posted January 9, 2018 32 minutes ago, Jith12 said: OZ quoted the latter post on his Twitter. He's probably pretty sour about this whole thing. When is this press conference he speaks of? Possibly a double feature next Monday after Trump announces his fake news awards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gian-Luca Posted January 9, 2018 Share Posted January 9, 2018 20 minutes ago, Marc said: Floro? Yes. Zambrano. No. I mean, it's not like Sam Piette is going to not roll his eyes at some crazy instructions because he suddenly is in awe of zambrano's time playing indoor with the Lasers or the great four months Zambrano spent in charge at Delfin. Well we'll have to agree to disagree on that. I think most of the players, if not all, would have been aware that Zambrano had successful MLS coaching experience, a long resume in the men's game and that he had a reputation for playing attractive attacking soccer (particularly important after the "let's play six centre backs a game" defensive strategy that Floro had which obviously the players would have been aware of). That doesn't mean that they were in "awe" with Zambrano but I think that would have put him in better stead than Herdman will be in if things go sour on the field from the get go. We'll never know because in the small sample size we have Zambrano was largely successful and the play improved from his predecessor, so we never had a period of sustained losses (like we did with Floro) and hopefully we don't find out under Herdman either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marc Posted January 9, 2018 Share Posted January 9, 2018 Yeah, I think we will have to disagree. I think you might be mixing up fan knowledge with player knowledge. I think few of today's national player pool - guys located overseas, people who didn't follow early MLS like us nerds did - would have even known who Zambrano was before his appointment. They would have had to check Wikipedia. Just on name rec alone, I'd have easily bet that more would have known who Herdman was, respect for him issue aside. Zambrano's non-existent pro career and journeyman coaching resume (one 2.5 year stint, everything else less than 1.5, places like Moldova, Hungary, Ecuador, not hot spots) honestly, few of them know and fewer care. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gian-Luca Posted January 9, 2018 Share Posted January 9, 2018 Kristian Jack the latest journalist to say that even thought this is stunning news, those in the media were told by the people in the CSA that nobody was happy with Zambrano: https://www.tsn.ca/soccer/video/jack-csa-and-herdman-taking-enormous-gamble~1299428 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuzzAndSting Posted January 9, 2018 Share Posted January 9, 2018 2 hours ago, BCM1555362349 said: Sorry mate, the title is "reporter" so the job is to "report". Sometimes it's a rumour, and it's okay to say so. But to hide, then crawl out and say "everyone knew of the whispers", "he's been under review three times" and "wasn't out of the blue" is total BS - no one heard and it is out of the blue if reporters don't do their job. When I lived in Canada, I heard of unsubstantiated rumours all the time of NHL/MLB coaches being on the hot seat, of potential trades, of trade requests, etc. In politics, we all hear the same thing on a daily basis. For every so-called and self-proclaimed soccer reporter to roll out the same company line and hide behind some "ethical code" is either laughable or disgusting, I'm not sure which at this point. But it is pathetic. Maybe you’ve been gone a long time or maybe you never knew but this type of stuff happens all the time in the NHL. The Pronger trade our of Edmonton, the Heatley situation in Ottawa, the Brindamour trade out of Philly, the Carter and Richards situation in Philly, anything to do with Fleury, Corson in Toronto, Comrie’s problems all over the place. There’s ample examples of situations that were never reported on by the media despite guys having knowledge because if they had their access would have been cut off. Then once the situations took major changes, whispers and rumours started to circulate as to why. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matty Posted January 9, 2018 Share Posted January 9, 2018 So how is everyone feeling about this today? -Herdman is a politicking dickwad -OZ went out there and fucked up everything with everyone Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fort York Redcoat1555362293 Posted January 9, 2018 Share Posted January 9, 2018 Oz didn't get enough time. Glad for Herdman. Good timing for the Womens side. Let's hope for friendlies to prove everybody right or wrong or in between. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kent Posted January 9, 2018 Share Posted January 9, 2018 12 hours ago, Ansem said: I'll say the same thing I said earlier..We can debate whether Herdman is the right guy or not, but this putting Zambrano on a pedestal is exaggerated. We lost the Jamaica game do to poor planning and questionable choices for players. We should have won that game This. I mean, I wasn't asking for him to be fired or anything, and from the outside I would say he needs more time to prove himself, but it's not like he did something like beat a non-Caribbean team. He didn't even (get the chance to) get a proper away result. We got drawn against French Guiana in the Gold Cup, and otherwise in terms of results he was replicating what Floro did. Gold Cup draws against Costa Rica and another Central American team (granted, Honduras for Zambrano and only El Salvador for Floro) and a Gold Cup loss to Jamaica and a friendly win vs Jamaica. Those are his miraculous results that people are so worried about losing. So yes, if you asked me 24 hours ago I'd say of course Zambrano deserves more time, and I was hopeful he could improve the team, but he hadn't really improved results yet. Getting goals in the Gold Cup was lots of fun, but it wasn't some magical run we went on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shway Posted January 9, 2018 Share Posted January 9, 2018 28 minutes ago, Gian-Luca said: Kristian Jack the latest journalist to say that even thought this is stunning news, those in the media were told by the people in the CSA that nobody was happy with Zambrano: https://www.tsn.ca/soccer/video/jack-csa-and-herdman-taking-enormous-gamble~1299428 Why would they, he was calling it as it was. The system was shit, coaches are shit, and we needed a complete overhaul from youth to adult. With LoN coming up soon, I'm scared....really scared we might either end up in the lower division or continually struggle against the tier one teams. Herdman isn't the answer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Califax Posted January 9, 2018 Share Posted January 9, 2018 It seems to me there is more to this. Do they really rate Herdman? Why isn't it: "Hey I got the England women's job, I'll stay if I can have the Canada men's job." "No." "All right, later." -end scene- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shway Posted January 9, 2018 Share Posted January 9, 2018 4 minutes ago, matty said: So how is everyone feeling about this today? -Herdman is a politicking dickwad -OZ went out there and fucked up everything with everyone Whats sad is the fact that the CSA bought it from John. Who care's if England WNT was calling...let him go. I'm sorry but its going to be extremely hard for him to earn his respect. Irregardless of him taking Canada Womens from 12-4 (which is not much - Zambrano took us from 120- 100) it's a drastically completely different cookie then the mens situation. A 5'2 Womens coach who's never played the game and never coached men is the leader of how future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Bob Posted January 9, 2018 Share Posted January 9, 2018 4 minutes ago, Jahinho Guerro said: Whats sad is the fact that the CSA bought it from John. Who care's if England WNT was calling...let him go. I'm sorry but its going to be extremely hard for him to earn his respect. Irregardless of him taking Canada Womens from 12-4 (which is not much - Zambrano took us from 120- 100) it's a drastically completely different cookie then the mens situation. A 5'2 Womens coach who's never played the game and never coached men is the leader of how future. OH MY GOD YOU'RE RIGHT HE'S SO SHORT WE'RE FUCKED Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fort York Redcoat1555362293 Posted January 9, 2018 Share Posted January 9, 2018 5 minutes ago, Jahinho Guerro said: Whats sad is the fact that the CSA bought it from John. Who care's if England WNT was calling...let him go. I'm sorry but its going to be extremely hard for him to earn his respect. Irregardless of him taking Canada Womens from 12-4 (which is not much - Zambrano took us from 120- 100) it's a drastically completely different cookie then the mens situation. A 5'2 Womens coach who's never played the game and never coached men is the leader of how future. That math is great if one hasn't seen the difference between teams rated at the top or closer to bottom of the FIFA standings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shway Posted January 9, 2018 Share Posted January 9, 2018 7 minutes ago, Kent said: This. I mean, I wasn't asking for him to be fired or anything, and from the outside I would say he needs more time to prove himself, but it's not like he did something like beat a non-Caribbean team. He didn't even (get the chance to) get a proper away result. We got drawn against French Guiana in the Gold Cup, and otherwise in terms of results he was replicating what Floro did. Gold Cup draws against Costa Rica and another Central American team (granted, Honduras for Zambrano and only El Salvador for Floro) and a Gold Cup loss to Jamaica and a friendly win vs Jamaica. Those are his miraculous results that people are so worried about losing. So yes, if you asked me 24 hours ago I'd say of course Zambrano deserves more time, and I was hopeful he could improve the team, but he hadn't really improved results yet. Getting goals in the Gold Cup was lots of fun, but it wasn't some magical run we went on. Wow I'm shocked that this is an actual sentiment to say "He didn't do much".....there's so many basic stats that show upward trends. We scored goals in the Gold Cup, first time in what 2-3 tournaments? We qualified to the quarterfinals, first time in what 4-5 tournaments? You can't talk about who were drawn into our group when we've been having "easy opponents" draw into our group all the time. It's not to act as if OZ was the messiah, but its to not be complacent with the reality that John Herdman isn't an adequate or experienced enough to be the CMNT coach. This is a joke, and now were back to the UK style ball. Haber will get called back in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ray Posted January 9, 2018 Share Posted January 9, 2018 John Herdman would not get a cup of tea with most men's professional teams, let alone the a full MNT. That he is so valued by the CSA as a technical director and coach for the men is scary. Given that the men's program is in desperate need of success, their judgement is highly questionable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shway Posted January 9, 2018 Share Posted January 9, 2018 6 minutes ago, Benjamin Massey said: OH MY GOD YOU'RE RIGHT HE'S SO SHORT WE'RE FUCKED Don't disregard perspective. The reality Canada's football has had for ages has been getting respectable coaches. Whether it was De Guzman complaining about training methods, or from fans questioning the experience. The reality is this is backwards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrennanFan Posted January 9, 2018 Share Posted January 9, 2018 Prediction: Herdman will go with a very young team, as those are the only players that will respect him. He will also hand out many new first caps for the same reason. He will say hes building a team for the future, and will use their youth to insulate himself from poor results. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuzzAndSting Posted January 9, 2018 Share Posted January 9, 2018 2 minutes ago, BrennanFan said: Prediction: Herdman will go with a very young team, as those are the only players that will respect him. He will also hand out many new first caps for the same reason. He will say hes building a team for the future, and will use their youth to insulate himself from poor results. Sooooooo... What OZ was saying and doing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shway Posted January 9, 2018 Share Posted January 9, 2018 2 minutes ago, BrennanFan said: Prediction: Herdman will go with a very young team, as those are the only players that will respect him. He will also hand out many new first caps for the same reason. He will say hes building a team for the future, and will use their youth to insulate himself from poor results. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shway Posted January 9, 2018 Share Posted January 9, 2018 Just now, BuzzAndSting said: Sooooooo... What OZ was saying and doing? who did he bring in that was young and wasn't deserving other than Kaye who was a surprise revelation? Cause I do recall him bringing in a 35+ yo back into the fold. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ruud Posted January 9, 2018 Share Posted January 9, 2018 I wonder how much we are mixing up roles here: 1. Role of coach of national men's team 2. Role of technical director for Canadian men's soccer (U23, U20, etc)* *(not sure of exact title) It would seem to me that the critique is perhaps mainly with his lack of progress on #2 above, or complaints about the intractable nature of working with technical directors in CSA and in provinces. Herdman might be a good person for this, given his ability to work things out on the women's side to the satisfaction of CSA and the provinces. Most people on this post have commented on Herdman's taking over both roles, but it seems what we are really questioning is #1 above and not necessarily #2 above. If that's the case, and OZ is unwilling to give up control of #2, and yet not progressing on it, this would mean that CSA would have grounds to let him go for the position as a whole. At the same time, some coaches since Holger Ocsiak with a good reputation have demanded to have a say in overall technical direction of men's soccer program. Why does Herdman get both roles #1 and #2. Why not hire someone new for role #1 and give role #2 to Herdman. Finally, here's another question - why would Herdman even want to take the job in this manner in the first place. Why wouldn't he want to just apply and get the job like any other candidate, to at the VERY least give appearances to transparency? In every hiring I know, this is how most people like to operate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shway Posted January 9, 2018 Share Posted January 9, 2018 13 minutes ago, Fort York Redcoat1555362293 said: That math is great if one hasn't seen the difference between teams rated at the top or closer to bottom of the FIFA standings. You would have to admit you are naive if you think the CWN team situation was the same as the CMNT. There's no other way to put it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ruud Posted January 9, 2018 Share Posted January 9, 2018 1 minute ago, Jahinho Guerro said: You would have to admit you are naive if you think the CWN team situation was the same as the CMNT. There's no other way to put it. but comparing apples and oranges....admittedly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lazlo_80 Posted January 9, 2018 Share Posted January 9, 2018 oooh the takes are so hot! I love it. gimme gimme gimme gimme gimme. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuzzAndSting Posted January 9, 2018 Share Posted January 9, 2018 6 minutes ago, Jahinho Guerro said: who did he bring in that was young and wasn't deserving other than Kaye who was a surprise revelation? Cause I do recall him bringing in a 35+ yo back into the fold. For the ES match, Petrasso, Cordova, Awuah, Aleman, Twardek, Beland-Goyette, Elva, Schweitzer... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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