Obinna Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 At the end of that article it says we will hopefully find out in a week or so if he can play for us or not! Thank god, this waiting game sucks. If he can play for us I think the red tape will be cleared before next round. Also, it says the CSA has been researching for several weeks already. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbailey62 Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 See and hear Julian's comments here. http://youtu.be/xhxqH9Wu-Ks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grigorio Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 I see someone's taken it upon themselves to change JDG2's FIFA status on his wikipedia page to Canadian... Funny seeing a little Canadian flag on the Villareal foster and seeing his Canada career on his own page start at 2012... Seems a taaaaad premature Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThiKu Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 Just a tad!!! haha, unless it was him or his mgt who changed it! haha... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RamR Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 See and hear Julian's comments here. http://youtu.be/xhxqH9Wu-Ks That video is freaking awesome!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Brethers Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 Let's not tempt fate! But this is very exciting news, come onnnnnn JDG2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unnamed Trialist Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 Okay, so Jono has not had a great year, especially since the team is suffering. I think it is a blip and with their budget and recent history they'll get back, so frustrating. But good for us. If Villareal had done anything in Champions he'd still be in the Dutch picture, but as they haven't and that means he cannot touch Holland for the Eurocup and is probably out of the start of WC qualifying for Holland (Villareal could only get results that would vindicate him next year, and not until the season was well advanced). Hart and Fonseca conveniently pick the weak Jono plays Barça at home to take a "look" at him. Just by chance though, wouldn't you say? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dyslexic nam Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 I am not letting myself get excited about this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
finchster Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 This is one instance I will be 100% happy to be incorrect about. Even though it isn't certain I will be amazed at how much red tape was taken care of. Pulling strings for JDG2 to regain Canadian citizenship (bypassing laws). Pulling strings on the Dutch side for JDG2 to obtain dual citizenship (not allowed in most cases). To put it in perspective, looking at all the things that need to go right for this to happen almost undoes all the wrong in the CMNT. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keegan Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 This is one instance I will be 100% happy to be incorrect about. Even though it isn't certain I will be amazed at how much red tape was taken care of. Pulling strings for JDG2 to regain Canadian citizenship (bypassing laws). Pulling strings on the Dutch side for JDG2 to obtain dual citizenship (not allowed in most cases). To put it in perspective, looking at all the things that need to go right for this to happen almost undoes all the wrong in the CMNT. It would be a lot of red tape for the average person but it would be a pretty dick move for the Dutch to revoke his citizenship after he represented them, not to mention the fact that he's Canadian and has lived there since he was 12. The Canadian side of things is a no brainer really from our government. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villus Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 Canadian gov't calling in a favor to the Dutch, WW2 cred one time! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trueviking Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 havent been following JDG2 this year but noticed he didnt make the pitch against barca and has not had a start at villareal in a long time.....what happened? no wonder he has found his Canadian roots....a bench player for a relegation candidate in spain will not make the dutch midfield. whatever it takes...welcome aboard! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Dave Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 OK I'm pretty excited about this too, but one word of caution... I think that those of us with mainstream media contacts should NOT be pushing this too much into the media. It's best if this is kept AWAY from the attention of the non-soccer pubilc and the mainstream media until it is a done deal. Why do I feel that way? Well, consider this: The more airplay this gets, the more Joe Six-Pack and his redneck buddies start to raise a stink about JDG2 being given "special privelages" re his citizenship due to him being a pro athlete. If the Don Cherries of the media world pick up on that, it may reach the attention of good ol' Stevie Harper. And I'm pretty sure Harper isn't above putting the screws to this for percieved short term political gain. Yeah, maybe I'm paranoid. Supporting Canada does that too you after a while. Anyway, I do really believe that Jono will suit up for his real nation, Canada, and as I said i'm excited about the possibility - I just hope we don't get our hopes dashed... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
killgod Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 OK I'm pretty excited about this too, but one word of caution... I think that those of us with mainstream media contacts should NOT be pushing this too much into the media. It's best if this is kept AWAY from the attention of the non-soccer pubilc and the mainstream media until it is a done deal. Why do I feel that way? Well, consider this: The more airplay this gets, the more Joe Six-Pack and his redneck buddies start to raise a stink about JDG2 being given "special privelages" re his citizenship due to him being a pro athlete. If the Don Cherries of the media world pick up on that, it may reach the attention of good ol' Stevie Harper. And I'm pretty sure Harper isn't above putting the screws to this for percieved short term political gain. Yeah, maybe I'm paranoid. Supporting Canada does that too you after a while. Anyway, I do really believe that Jono will suit up for his real nation, Canada, and as I said i'm excited about the possibility - I just hope we don't get our hopes dashed... I think it's just your paranoia speaking here because talking heads on TV, should they do that, would also be slagging olympic athletes who've had the same situation done. Can't imagine anyone on TV would want to say such a comment knowing how hard those athletes work without really being recognized for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redcoatsforever Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 I think it's just your paranoia speaking here because talking heads on TV, should they do that, would also be slagging olympic athletes who've had the same situation done. Can't imagine anyone on TV would want to say such a comment knowing how hard those athletes work without really being recognized for it. Soccer tends to hold a special place of derision among many Canadians in my experience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grizzly Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 Soccer tends to hold a special place of derision among many Canadians in my experience. There was a time when this was true but I personally do not find it the case anymore. There are some people who do not like soccer but I don't think the numbers are higher than those that don't like baseball, basketball or even hockey. In the US you can still read a lot of articles or hear commentators slagging soccer but in my experience we are no longer the whipping boys of Canadian sports. In the US the other major sports still feel threatened by soccer but here I think we have reached acceptance as a major sport. You might be able to find some individual examples of media people slagging soccer but I think you can find some individual examples for any sport. And anyone slagging soccer knows they are also going to face a backlash so most media are much more cautious about this than they were a decade or even 5 years ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SCF08 Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 This is one instance I will be 100% happy to be incorrect about. Even though it isn't certain I will be amazed at how much red tape was taken care of. Pulling strings for JDG2 to regain Canadian citizenship (bypassing laws). Pulling strings on the Dutch side for JDG2 to obtain dual citizenship (not allowed in most cases). To put it in perspective, looking at all the things that need to go right for this to happen almost undoes all the wrong in the CMNT. Does Jonathan not already have dual citizenship? He had a Canadian passport before moving to The Netherlands and you don't have to give up your passport in order to get Dutch citizenship. You can have as many passports as you want in The Netherlands (even politicians can have dual citizenship even though there are some camps that want to change this). It should not be a problem for JDG2 to become a CMNT player IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuzzAndSting Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 Does Jonathan not already have dual citizenship? He had a Canadian passport before moving to The Netherlands and you don't have to give up your passport in order to get Dutch citizenship. You can have as many passports as you want in The Netherlands (even politicians can have dual citizenship even though there are some camps that want to change this). It should not be a problem for JDG2 to become a CMNT player IMO. I believe if you read earlier posts you'll find that Jono had to give up his Canadian citizenship to obtain his Dutch citizenship. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LarsHirsch_fan Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 Im impatiently waiting for this one man. This would be a huge image boost for Canadian soccer in general without even taking in what we may be able to expect on the field as well... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obinna Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 I believe if you read earlier posts you'll find that Jono had to give up his Canadian citizenship to obtain his Dutch citizenship. Also recall that we still have no idea if he actually gave it up or not. We have only speculated that he has based on the research we have done (which does suggest he would have given up his citizenship). Jono has also been quoted as saying he is unsure whether he has given up his canadian citizenship, hence the meeting with Hart and Fonsaca to discuss what he exactly done, in order to decide what steps must be taken. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuzzAndSting Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 Also recall that we still have no idea if he actually gave it up or not. We have only speculated that he has based on the research we have done (which does suggest he would have given up his citizenship). Jono has also been quoted as saying he is unsure whether he has given up his canadian citizenship, hence the meeting with Hart and Fonsaca to discuss what he exactly done, in order to decide what steps must be taken. True, true, very true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peter_mtl Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 I apologize if I missed this at some point but why hasn't any reporter ever asked Stephen Hart (or Jonathan de Guzman) the most obvious question and reported the answer: What is his current status vis-a-vis Canadian citizenship and passport? We've been speculating for ages but none of us know for sure if he renounced his citizenship, if his passport simply expired, or what else may have happened. Why not just ask the question? All we get is general answers about them 'working on it'. Obviously we can figure out that it's more than a matter of renewing a passport because they've said repeatedly that it's a complex process. But at least let us know what his current status is. (That would make speculation about the future lot more fun) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tuscan Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 Something tells me if we did ask this, we'd get a "we don't believe it is appropriate to speak on this at the moment" response. Politics is such a fragile endeavor, and due to us being the pursuant, we've got to do everything possible to get through the process successfully without blabbing about the process too much. It's weird how simply talking about the specifics of a matter like this could have a drastic effect on its outcome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
finchster Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 Does Jonathan not already have dual citizenship? He had a Canadian passport before moving to The Netherlands and you don't have to give up your passport in order to get Dutch citizenship. You can have as many passports as you want in The Netherlands (even politicians can have dual citizenship even though there are some camps that want to change this). It should not be a problem for JDG2 to become a CMNT player IMO. I have been through this conversation enough and I am pretty sick of it, so I spent more time researching to this topic. I am 100% convinced by the evidence that De Guzman renounced his Canadian citizenship and like I stated numerous times, not everyone is allowed dual citizenship in the Netherlands. http://expat-apartments-amsterdam.com/articles/becoming-a-dutch-national/ This is the second method which can a foreigner is able to obtain Dutch citizenship and if the foreigner is not a resident in the country, they can make the naturalization application at a Dutch embassy or consulate. The application for naturalization will need to be completed by the applying foreigner, together with a civil servant who is employed by the municipal office or Burgerzaken. The submitting authority, the municipal office, embassy or consulate will scrutinize the application and forward it to the Immigration and Naturalization Service, who will be ultimately responsible for the final decision. If the Immigration and Naturalization Service (IND) approves the application, the Dutch Queen will verify and authorise the documentation and the applicant will be required to attend a mandatory naturalization ceremony. During this ceremony, the foreigner will receive written confirmation on Dutch citizenship and in most instances; the expat will be required to forsake their previous nationality. This is however, not always the case and the applicant should discuss renouncing their previous citizenship before completing their application. What exceptions exist? More on that later. Holland requires proof you renounced your previous citizenship. Effective enforcement of renunciation exists in Austria, Bulgaria, the Czech Republic, Denmark, Estonia, Germany (with the exception of citizens of other EU member states), Latvia, Lithuania, Slovenia (except for citizens of other EU member states where there is reciprocity) and the Netherlands (except for persons born in the Netherlands and spouses of Dutch citizens). http://eudo-citizenship.eu/docs/7-Naturalisation%20Policies%20in%20Europe.pdf Also from this article It is worth taking a closer look at the Netherlands, an interesting example where toleration of dual citizenship in case of naturalisation by foreign citizens has been reversed. With the objective of promoting immigrant integration and facilitating naturalisation as a means to that end, citizenship legislation was changed in 1991 to abolish the renunciation requirement for naturalisation. This policy was reversed in 1997 when the requirement was re-introduced. Also from this article The ongoing debates about dual citizenship have recently culminated in another amendment of the Dutch Nationality Act passed on 16 June 2010, which eliminated the previous renunciation exemption in the naturalisation procedure for persons residing in the Netherlands for at least five years before the age of eighteen (at the same time, a renunciation requirement was introduced for persons living in the Netherlands since the age of four who can acquire Dutch citizenship by declaration from the age of eighteen). After reading this, I am convinced 100% De Guzman renounced his Canadian citizenship as he became a Dutch citizen February 2008. At that time he was required to renounce his Canadian citizenship and to provide proof of renouncing it to the authorities. However this new law passed in 2010 is a potential loop hole of De Guzman to regain his Canadian citizenship and to be a dual citizen. This is why he has to work with the immigration authorities in Canada and Holland, this is a complex issue. I will state this one last time If De Guzman didn't renounce his Canadian citizenship, him playing for Canada would be as easy as applying for a new passport. He wouldn't need lawyers in Canada and Holland looking at the issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villus Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 If De Guzman didn't renounce his Canadian citizenship, him playing for Canada would be as easy as applying for a new passport. He wouldn't need lawyers in Canada and Holland looking at the issue. Even if he did renounce he would'nt need to be in touch with the Dutch side if he wanted to play for Canada at all costs. If Holland stated that he had to renounce his citizenship but did'nt follow up and he did'nt in fact or if he did and Dutch law requires that he not hold dual citizenship then he can of course represent Canada but he may be at risk of losing his Dutch citizenship which is most likely the issue that is holding all of this up, JDG2's Dutch passport is very valuable to his career, regaining Canadian citizenship should'nt be a major issue since their are programs in place to fast track athletes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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