Vancouver Whitecaps - 2023 Season Thread

[Watchmen]

Whitecaps first road win in over a calender year. Naturally, it came against LAFC. As we all knew it would. Gauld starting to find his form.

Edited June 25, 2023 by Watchmen

[Ozzie_the_parrot]

 

 

[narduch]

 

 

[Footyeh]

3-0 down for almost 40 minutes and still zero young players/homegrowns saw the pitch... Not even a run out for a few minutes but rather brining on 25 year old players from the 2nd team.  Elsewhere, CFMTL started with 3, TFC featured 6 including a 16 year old CB...  It's not even like this team is competing at the top end of the table.  You don't know what you have until you play them... just like the other clubs in the league are doing.  

[Soro17]

57 minutes ago, Footyeh said:

3-0 down for almost 40 minutes and still zero young players/homegrowns saw the pitch... Not even a run out for a few minutes but rather brining on 25 year old players from the 2nd team.  Elsewhere, CFMTL started with 3, TFC featured 6 including a 16 year old CB...  It's not even like this team is competing at the top end of the table.  You don't know what you have until you play them... just like the other clubs in the league are doing.  

Who is Giovanni Aguilar and why is he getting minutes? Really, a 25 y/o nobody over your homegrown guys? 
 

Just saw Vanni’s quote: he refers to his 24 and 25 year old subs (Ngando and Aguilar) as ‘young guys’.  Bleh. 

Edited July 2, 2023 by Soro17

[Footyeh]

8 minutes ago, Soro17 said:

Who is Giovanni Aguilar and why is he getting minutes? Really, a 25 y/o nobody over your homegrown guys? 
 

Just saw Vanni’s quote: he refers to his 24 and 25 year old subs (Ngando and Aguilar) as ‘young guys’.  Bleh. 

Yup.  I’ve yet to see a single reporter ask the club about these decisions, I’ve yet to see anyone even advocate for playing the young players.  The fans don’t speak up.  It’s just all bad.

This is a club who had the first ever residency in North America club football.  The only program in Canada with a residency.  They should in theory be fielding the most young talents.  Zero players from BC produced.  They’ll eventually release the homegrown players and tell us “they weren’t good enough” and 99% of the fan base will just baselessly accept it.  Time for them to be held accountable.  

[Ozzie_the_parrot]

 

[Watchmen]

If you're disappointed Habibullah didn't see the pitch in this one, sure. Vanni can be questioned on that. On the other hand, Johnson played 30 min and I was happy to see it. Thought he looked alright.

[Footyeh]

1 hour ago, Watchmen said:

If you're disappointed Habibullah didn't see the pitch in this one, sure. Vanni can be questioned on that. On the other hand, Johnson played 30 min and I was happy to see it. Thought he looked alright.

Or Campagna.  He barely completed a pass in 30 mins if we want to be real.  Was dispossessed 2-3 times, tried to dribble closed spaces etc.  

I like the player and believe he has value but To suggest Whitecaps did good to bring him on is strange, he’s not a kid.  He’s 24 years old.  

[Watchmen]

8 minutes ago, Footyeh said:

Or Campagna.  He barely completed a pass in 30 mins if we want to be real.  Was dispossessed 2-3 times, tried to dribble closed spaces etc.  

I like the player and believe he has value but To suggest Whitecaps did good to bring him on is strange, he’s not a kid.  He’s 24 years old.  

Campagna has struggled this year at the WFC2 level.  So, maybe we need to hold some of the academy players accountable for not stepping up? It goes both ways.

[Footyeh]

21 minutes ago, Watchmen said:

Campagna has struggled this year at the WFC2 level.  So, maybe we need to hold some of the academy players accountable for not stepping up? It goes both ways.

I’m which areas has he struggled?  I’m genuinely curious.  I’m not saying he’s been amazing by any means.

It’s another player that the club invested in and TOLD US he’s a good player who can be involved soon.  I remember Axel telling us that.  So what’s gone wrong, why is it every player under the clubs watch all of a sudden “regresses”?.  

[Watchmen]

20 minutes ago, Footyeh said:

I’m which areas has he struggled?  I’m genuinely curious.  I’m not saying he’s been amazing by any means.

It’s another player that the club invested in and TOLD US he’s a good player who can be involved soon.  I remember Axel telling us that.  So what’s gone wrong, why is it every player under the clubs watch all of a sudden “regresses”?.  

https://thethirdsub.ca/2023/05/11/wfc2-stock-up-stock-down/

WFC2 has done fairly well as a team, but they've been poor defensively at times.  And to be clear, I'd like to see him succeed.  But if he's struggled to impose himself in MLS Next Pro (against similar aged players), then I just think he'd struggle as much (or worse) against a full MLS team.

I'm sure the club really did/does believe he's a good player, just like I think they believe it for other players.  And it's a good question on why some aren't taking a step forward.  But I think it's less straight forward than it being just the Whitecaps.  Everyone screamed 2 years ago to play Habibulah, they loaned him out to Pacific last year, he barely played there, and now he's back.  So, is that on the Whitecaps?  Pacific? The player?  The Whitecaps signed Lowell Wright out of the CPL and everyone was thrilled, and then he showed up to camp heavily overweight.  Is that on the Whitecaps? York? The player?

I'd like more younger players to be progressing, as would everyone.  But the club seems to be at least demonstrating that if a player does well in WFC2 they'll be given a fair chance with the main club.  Ahmed, Becher, and now Johnson.  That's at least some progress.

[nolando]

35 minutes ago, Footyeh said:

I’m which areas has he struggled?  I’m genuinely curious.  I’m not saying he’s been amazing by any means.

It’s another player that the club invested in and TOLD US he’s a good player who can be involved soon.  I remember Axel telling us that.  So what’s gone wrong, why is it every player under the clubs watch all of a sudden “regresses”?.  

It's at this critical stage that the Caps have not been able to get the vast majority of their top prospects over the line into serviceable top division players.

[Watchmen]

52 minutes ago, nolando said:

It's at this critical stage that the Caps have not been able to get the vast majority of their top prospects over the line into serviceable top division players.

Yup.  Getting them playing somewhere happens on a decent basis.  Getting them on to their own roster, not so much.  Frustrating for all of us.  And I realize that the number of kids in a system who actually make the pro roster is always slim (regardless of league or team), but you would have hoped they'd have gotten a few more on to the team by now.

[Ozzie_the_parrot]

 

 

[El Hombre]

On 7/2/2023 at 12:35 PM, Watchmen said:

The Whitecaps signed Lowell Wright out of the CPL and everyone was thrilled, and then he showed up to camp heavily overweight.  Is that on the Whitecaps? York? The player?

That's entirely on the Whitecaps.  When you have young players, you need to teach them how to be professionals, especially when you are taking them out of their home environment.  If they really cared about his development, he should've been on a meal plan with an exercise regimen as any other professional environment would do.

[Watchmen]

22 minutes ago, El Hombre said:

That's entirely on the Whitecaps.  When you have young players, you need to teach them how to be professionals, especially when you are taking them out of their home environment.  If they really cared about his development, he should've been on a meal plan with an exercise regimen as any other professional environment would do.

And you know for a fact they didn't do this?  What absolute garbage.

Honestly, my comment that "it's Yorks fault" was a bit tongue-in-cheek; that seemingly every time a Whitecaps player fails it's the Whitecaps fault, never any other external factor. Once again, something that is almost certainly on the player is being pinned on the Whitecaps.

Do you want to know one of the actual reasons a number of the players failed? Because when they were pushed, they sulked. There was an excuse made on why they didn't go further, but it was never their fault. So this excuse of "the Whitecaps didn't put him on a meal plan" is exactly the kind of BS that let's young players off the hook, because they almost certainly did.

[gator]

49 minutes ago, Watchmen said:

 

Do you want to know one of the actual reasons a number of the players failed? Because when they were pushed, they sulked. There was an excuse made on why they didn't go further, but it was never their fault. So this excuse of "the Whitecaps didn't put him on a meal plan" is exactly the kind of BS that let's young players off the hook, because they almost certainly did.

Do you know that for fact? I watched a good part of the match last night and am baffled why Raposo came out, there could be a valid reason but the team looked weaker down his side after his exit, you don't think any of these failures could possibly be on the coaching?

[Watchmen]

Cordova is set to go down as possibly the biggest DP bust in Whitecaps history. He's contributing nothing and doesn't seem to even fit with how they want to play.  I have absolutely no idea what the scouts were seeing that made them think this was their striker.

[Watchmen]

10 minutes ago, gator said:

Do you know that for fact? I watched a good part of the match last night and am baffled why Raposo came out, there could be a valid reason but the team looked weaker down his side after his exit, you don't think any of these failures could possibly be on the coaching?

1) Yes.  Peter Schaad (their former play by play guy) used to openly talk about how a number of the academy players didn't like being pushed.  That too many of them had an attitude and a sense of accomplishment just from making the team.

2) I had no problem with Raposo being pulled last night.  He wasn't contributing anything going forward and he's a liability defensively.  He's incredibly easily pushed off the ball and he pulled out of a number of challenges when going in a bit harder would have at the very least disrupted Seattle's play a bit more.

3) Vanni is not a good coach, and you won't me defending him.  He's poor tactically, starts bizarre line-ups, makes bizarre substitutions at times, and still has them zonal marking on set pieces despite the fact it hasn't worked all year.  This team is in a playoff-spot (albeit barely) despite him, not because of him.  That's what makes this season so frustrating: it's legitimately one of the better and more entertaining squads they've had in quite a while, and they should be even better.

4) The conversation started specifically with Lowell Wright, a player who showed up to camp out of shape.  My defense was simply that that's not on the Whitecaps.

Edited July 9, 2023 by Watchmen

[BearcatSA]

Gotta find a way to get back to Van City this summer to watch more of the Ahmed Show.  

[saladroit]

[Watchmen]

Glad to see it. He's been a critical part of the team, and it's noticeable when he's either out or having the rare off game.

[El Hombre]

On 7/9/2023 at 11:49 AM, Watchmen said:

1) Yes.  Peter Schaad (their former play by play guy) used to openly talk about how a number of the academy players didn't like being pushed.  That too many of them had an attitude and a sense of accomplishment just from making the team.

And that's not indicative of a toxic development environment?  When one or two fail, you can blame those that fail.  When "too many" (your/Schaad's words) fail then there has to be something else at play.

[Watchmen]

1 hour ago, El Hombre said:

And that's not indicative of a toxic development environment?  When one or two fail, you can blame those that fail.  When "too many" (your/Schaad's words) fail then there has to be something else at play.

There's one player that showed up to camp so badly out of shape that they were unplayable, and that's Wright. Fitness has rarely been the issue with players. I don't know how you look at this and say it's on the club and not Wright.