Justin Smith

[Olympique_de_Marseille]

On 9/10/2023 at 8:36 PM, Footyeh said:

Without knowing why the player didn't take it, I think there's also still a lot of arrogance

Because he got an offer in Ligue 2!

He probably thought he was going to get playing time back then. He doesn't strike me as the arrogant type.

[InglewoodJack]

No one can access that interview I posted? Damn… perhaps it went into his decision making on why he didn’t take a loan with CFM….

 

(kidding, I’m just curious what they wrote about)

[InglewoodJack]

On 9/10/2023 at 2:27 PM, Footyeh said:

CF Montreal apparently offered him a loan last season but the player rejected it.  Who knows if it would've went well, but playing MLS is certainly better than having not played in Ligue 2 and now finding himself in the 3rd tier.

Someone reading your posts?

https://x.com/charlesdancause/status/1701389895053230365?s=46&t=spIaqlQfufAO3HreB1455Q

On 9/10/2023 at 8:36 PM, Footyeh said:

Without knowing why the player didn't take it, I think there's also still a lot of arrogance from players in Europe about coming to MLS at a young age when they are attached to such big clubs like Nice. 

https://x.com/charlesdancause/status/1701409244950491435?s=46&t=spIaqlQfufAO3HreB1455Q

[Ruud]

Avoiding Saputo by reputation?

[Dominic94]

1 hour ago, InglewoodJack said:

Someone reading your posts?

https://x.com/charlesdancause/status/1701389895053230365?s=46&t=spIaqlQfufAO3HreB1455Q

https://x.com/charlesdancause/status/1701409244950491435?s=46&t=spIaqlQfufAO3HreB1455Q

Weak stuff wow

[InglewoodJack]

1 minute ago, Dominic94 said:

Weak stuff wow

I've always wondered how much speculation and rumors on twitter are directly cribbed from posts here, whether it's posters with insider info or just people here speculating on stuff and then having someone on twitter take it as a legitimate rumor. It's happened a few times where we've had a discussion on a player here, and then you flip over to Twitter later in the day, and some bigger CAMNT accounts are talking about the exact same thing.

[Unnamed Trialist]

23 hours ago, InglewoodJack said:

I've always wondered how much speculation and rumors on twitter are directly cribbed from posts here, whether it's posters with insider info or just people here speculating on stuff and then having someone on twitter take it as a legitimate rumor. It's happened a few times where we've had a discussion on a player here, and then you flip over to Twitter later in the day, and some bigger CAMNT accounts are talking about the exact same thing.

One Soccer does it too. I was sure Josh and Alex were cribbing from my and others' posts about Larin before he signed with Valladolid, it was a bit desperate frankly.

[InglewoodJack]

2 minutes ago, Unnamed Trialist said:

One Soccer does it too. I was sure Josh and Alex were cribbing from my and others' posts about Larin before he signed with Valladolid, it was a bit desperate frankly.

None of JDD's specific tweets come to mind, but I've definitely read things he's posted right after they've been discussed here. I feel like a lot of rumours around Jonathan David's transfers and how serious those rumours are are based on how much it's being talked about here.

[blueseeka]

Starting line. Looks like CB #6

 

Live Link to game that starts at 1:30 EST

 

[El Diego]

23 minutes ago, blueseeka said:

Starting line. Looks like CB #6

 

Live Link to game that starts at 1:30 EST

 

Thanks for the link. I just started watching around the 14th minute. Smith has already made one nice forward pass through the lines -- this is what I am looking for from him.

I've only been watching for a few minutes, but this level is low. Clearly below CPL, for instance. If Smith doesn't play regularly and stand out I will have lots of questions.

[InglewoodJack]

These teams are terrible lol. Smith just had a nice clearance in front of his net that else to a breakout where his striker who should’ve easily scored sent it into the 14th floor of the apartment building behind the field.

[Bigandy]

4 minutes ago, El Diego said:

Thanks for the link. I just started watching around the 14th minute. Smith has already made one nice forward pass through the lines -- this is what I am looking for from him.

I've only been watching for a few minutes, but this level is low. Clearly below CPL, for instance. If Smith doesn't play regularly and stand out I will have lots of questions.

The level does look low but its weird to think that the better prospects from CPL try to make ligue 2. Surely that would indicate the average CPL team is at or below ligue 3...? 

[Bigandy]

soooo many turnovers.

[InglewoodJack]

You ever watch a game and you’re like *I* could probably play for these teams? Yeah…

 

at least Smith is clearing balls to his teammates, most clearances the guys just try and kick it into the stands 

 

*(I would certainly get washed in this league) 

[El Diego]

1 minute ago, Bigandy said:

The level does look low but its weird to think that the better prospects from CPL try to make ligue 2. Surely that would indicate the average CPL team is at or below ligue 3...? 

I always struggle comparing leagues/divisions so take what I say with a grain of salt. Sounds like you're watching too, so I'd be interested to see what you and others think. After all, this is literally the first Championnat national (French div 3) match I've watched.

Just based on this snapshot I think it's totally fair to say the average CPL team is at least at this level. I am not sure if this is one of those situations where there is a big jump from div 3 to div 2. I think teams in the French div 3 can be semi-pro still.

[Bigandy]

2 minutes ago, InglewoodJack said:

You ever watch a game and you’re like *I* could probably play for these teams? Yeah…

 

at least Smith is clearing balls to his teammates, most clearances the guys just try and kick it into the stands 

 

*(I would certainly get washed in this league) 

In another thread, everyones posting about their long term injuries.... I figure we field a team of us on the board and squeak out a 1-0 win against either of these teams. 

[Bigandy]

1 minute ago, El Diego said:

I always struggle comparing leagues/divisions so take what I say with a grain of salt. Sounds like you're watching too, so I'd be interested to see what you and others think. After all, this is literally the first Championnat national (French div 3) match I've watched.

Just based on this snapshot I think it's totally fair to say the average CPL team is at least at this level. I am not sure if this is one of those situations where there is a big jump from div 3 to div 2. I think teams in the French div 3 can be semi-pro still.

I struggle as well with comparisons. 

Its certainly bad soccer. Tactically, I dont see a huge difference with CPL. The defensive shape is fine. Technically, the players are brutal under pressure with their passing being incredibly loose. First touches are not clean.

I find a real lack of intentional penetration. Alot of sideways passing then a dribble down the wing and hope for a cross or 1v1. Theres been very limited interplay amongst the midfielders in the attacking half. 

Goals look like they will come from quick transitions, mistakes or set pieces - not proper build up play. 

[El Diego]

2 minutes ago, Bigandy said:

I struggle as well with comparisons. 

Its certainly bad soccer. Tactically, I dont see a huge difference with CPL. The defensive shape is fine. Technically, the players are brutal under pressure with their passing being incredibly loose. First touches are not clean.

I find a real lack of intentional penetration. Alot of sideways passing then a dribble down the wing and hope for a cross or 1v1. Theres been very limited interplay amongst the midfielders in the attacking half. 

Goals look like they will come from quick transitions, mistakes or set pieces - not proper build up play. 

This is what is standing out for me. Losses of possession happening back and forth, sometimes with minimal pressure.

[dyslexic nam]

4 hours ago, Bigandy said:

In another thread, everyones posting about their long term injuries.... I figure we field a team of us on the board and squeak out a 1-0 win against either of these teams. 

I’m probably going to need a few weeks to get some wind back.  

Edited September 15, 2023 by dyslexic nam

[Aird25]

5 hours ago, Bigandy said:

I struggle as well with comparisons. 

Its certainly bad soccer. Tactically, I dont see a huge difference with CPL. The defensive shape is fine. Technically, the players are brutal under pressure with their passing being incredibly loose. First touches are not clean.

I find a real lack of intentional penetration. Alot of sideways passing then a dribble down the wing and hope for a cross or 1v1. Theres been very limited interplay amongst the midfielders in the attacking half. 

Goals look like they will come from quick transitions, mistakes or set pieces - not proper build up play. 

Are you paid to slag CPL? Truly baffling comments today 

[Unnamed Trialist]

10 hours ago, El Diego said:

I always struggle comparing leagues/divisions so take what I say with a grain of salt. Sounds like you're watching too, so I'd be interested to see what you and others think. After all, this is literally the first Championnat national (French div 3) match I've watched.

Just based on this snapshot I think it's totally fair to say the average CPL team is at least at this level. I am not sure if this is one of those situations where there is a big jump from div 3 to div 2. I think teams in the French div 3 can be semi-pro still.

Championat National is the fourth tier I think. He's in Ligue3. Only 1 team in that league has a recent top flight history of note, Sochaux, then I remember Martigues for a few years.

I posted on the Abzi thread that the difference between Ligue1 and Ligue2 is quite a bit greater than the spread between top divisions in the big 4 nations  Noone paid any attention, fine. But my argument is that in Ligue2 there are only 5-6 really strong teams then a big drop.

The third tier not being regional anymore in France might reduce the dropoff but it's still major. They have to subsidize travel for most of the clubs.

The strongest third tiers are in Germany and England because they are single divisions. Probably Germany is most competitive, but that's for another day. I remember when Spain's was 4 divisions, the drop-off was sharp too but those teams were far ahead of France third tier (recently in Spain it was converted into two divisions and is tougher). Serie C has 3 divisions.

France doesn't even have very good soccer infrastructure in smaller cities, far from the level even in Germany or Italy and even further from England of course.

[narduch]

8 hours ago, Unnamed Trialist said:

Championat National is the fourth tier I think. He's in Ligue3. Only 1 team in that league has a recent top flight history of note, Sochaux, then I remember Martigues for a few years.

I posted on the Abzi thread that the difference between Ligue1 and Ligue2 is quite a bit greater than the spread between top divisions in the big 4 nations  Noone paid any attention, fine. But my argument is that in Ligue2 there are only 5-6 really strong teams then a big drop.

The third tier not being regional anymore in France might reduce the dropoff but it's still major. They have to subsidize travel for most of the clubs.

The strongest third tiers are in Germany and England because they are single divisions. Probably Germany is most competitive, but that's for another day. I remember when Spain's was 4 divisions, the drop-off was sharp too but those teams were far ahead of France third tier (recently in Spain it was converted into two divisions and is tougher). Serie C has 3 divisions.

France doesn't even have very good soccer infrastructure in smaller cities, far from the level even in Germany or Italy and even further from England of course.

Italy is pretty funny. You have teams playing in monstrous 30,000 seat stadiums in lower divisions.

Smith is playing 3rd tier. And yes it is not a regional league. The league below that (National 2) is when the regional leagues start.

One thing France is doing that I like is they cut back Ligue 1 to 18 teams. Ligue 2 will move to 18 teams after this season. This helps consolidate the better teams at the top. More leagues should consider similar moves

Edited September 16, 2023 by narduch

[Unnamed Trialist]

3 hours ago, narduch said:

Italy is pretty funny. You have teams playing in monstrous 30,000 seat stadiums in lower divisions.

Smith is playing 3rd tier. And yes it is not a regional league. The league below that (National 2) is when the regional leagues start.

One thing France is doing that I like is dropping they cut back Ligue 1 to 18 teams. Ligue 2 will move to 18 teams after this season. This helps consolidate the better teams at the top. More leagues should consider similar moves

The English model is to spread as much of the pie, or stew, around to as many clubs as possible. It could make sense because there are so many powerful clubs with decent stadiums. But it means their lower tiers are watered down.

That compared well vs the other major nations because no other had a nationwide third tier. They were all regionalized. So what's now League One was by far the best in the world.

But they choose to have 22, 24 team divisions. A huge glut of fixtures. Less recovery time which affects play, privileging endurance players, making it inconsistent. By February many teams are playing for absolutely nothing.

Not to mention 3rd tier quality teams in Championship, 4th tier quality in League One. What do I mean?

Now there is nationwide B3 in Germany and this in France, the English model could be questioned. In Germany the 37th best team in the tier is in B3. In England it's no. 45. In Championship 8 teams that'd be third tier in Germany get to boast 2nd tier status. Go down a tier and this is accentuated. B3 has nos. 37 to 54 in Germany. League One has nos. 45 to 68 in England.

The obvious counter argument is that England has more money, especially how tv income is trickled down. And sponsors for legendary lower league clubs. As if this somehow mitigates the quality discrepancy. And knowing England overpays, that money does not equal quality, not always and not here. It means lesser quality can get paid more. 

 

 

[The Real Marc]

I agree that the critical thing is how many clubs are in each league. And while true, money doesn't always equal quality, the influx of foreign players throughout all the English leagues has raised the level by attracting better talent and fostering more professionalism.

Are some clubs overpaying? Sure. But they're also attracting talent from second-rate top tiers, or B2/B3, Ligue 2/3, etc where the wages are lower reducing the edge those leagues have from having fewer clubs.

And the foreign players in tier one have pushed what would have previously been been first or second tier-worthy British players down into the lower leagues, reducing the watering down that naturally occurs with having too many clubs in each league.

Edited to add..

I watch a fair amount of lower-league English football - love the pyramid, and no other lower leagues have the same access online - and agree that some of it is very poor. What would be interesting would be to see just how crap the level of play was in tier three or four England 30 or 40 years ago, when a guy like Craig Forrest was an anomalous foreigner! Some of the old clips look like guys wearing matching shirts playing beer-league in a park.

Lower tier football is fascinating - from millionaires in the UK to practically part-timers in Portugal. So interesting.

Also - Maritimo down in the second tier after almost 40 years in the top. Never seemed to reach the heights they did during the Bunbury years.

Edited September 16, 2023 by The Real Marc

[Stoppage Time]

2 minutes ago, The Real Marc said:

I agree that the critical thing is how many clubs are in each league. And while true, money doesn't always equal quality, but the influx of foreign players throughout all the English leagues has raised the level. Are some clubs overpaying? Sure. But they're also attracting talent from those second and third tier leagues, attracting talent that otherwise would have been in second-rate top tiers, or B2/B3, Ligue 2/3, etc where the wages are lower. And the foreign players, particularly in tier one, has pushed what would have previously been been first or second tier British players down into the lower leagues.

And, how about MLS? There are presently 29 teams with expansion likely. The quality of teams varies widely. It is too bad that a promotion relegation system is not envisioned so there could be two divisions ("1A" and "1B") of eventually 16 to 18 teams each with two or three relegated/promoted each year.  I realize that the US market is not prepared for this, but it would be interesting. Would it sustain fan interest though? I wonder.