CPL TV Contract

[BringBackTheBlizzard]

20 minutes ago, Ams1984 said:

...Are you suggesting:

1) that Hamilton had a greater interest in scheduling the game than York 9 and that therefore concerns about a conflict with TFC didn’t enter into the equation? If so, I don’t think that one club would’ve been given more consideration than another in the scheduling of the inaugural game. 

2) that fans in Hamilton would rather have TFC as their primary rival than York 9 because York 9 is like a minor league team whilst Hamilton are not?

On the first one it's Hamilton's home game, so I think they alone would get to decide and my guess would be that they weren't too worried about the TFC angle as they probably think they have their own separate market. On the second one I think Hamilton people very much like to see their city as being Toronto's equal rather than as an outer 905 suburb, so for the general sports fan in Hamilton if the Ticats go to BMO Field when visiting the GTA in the CFL, it probably looks a bit odd for a soccer team based at Tim Horton Field to be playing a York Region branded team based in a significantly smaller athletics stadium at York U. I am not sure how that will play out in the months and years ahead. Time will tell, basically.

[BenFisk'sBiggestFan]

I think people are being a little to zoned into the Soccer world when they look at the “scheduling issue”. To state this logically, my first assumption is that the league wants the first game to be an event for all sports fans, not just fans of soccer. My second assumption is that they are focussed on who can watch across the whole country, not just in Hamilton.

To make sure it is an event for all sports fans accross the country, the CPL had to try and avoid big games across all sports on TV. 

1. Premier league ends in May, so they need to try and avoid most times in the morning. Not to mention morning games suck.

2. Blue jays play at 3

3. TFC plays at 3

4. Stanley cup playoffs will be happening all evening as it would be Saturday night and the first round. And the Leafs will likely be in the playoffs.

5. NBA playoffs also start in April and will likely be held in the evening, and the Raptors will likely be in the playoffs.

So, looking at all this, what time seems like the best time to play a game without major conflicts? 1:00 pm! To me, I see the CPL aiming high for their launch. They want Canada wide attention. They seem to have put the game at a great time! The only people who will struggle will be the people who want to watch 2 live soccer games in one day, which is not many people.

 

[Ams1984]

27 minutes ago, BringBackTheBlizzard said:

On the first one it's Hamilton's home game, so I think they alone would get to decide and my guess would be that they weren't too worried about the TFC angle as they probably think they have their own separate market. On the second one I think Hamilton people very much like to see their city as being Toronto's equal rather than as an outer 905 suburb, so for the general sports fan in Hamilton if the Ticats go to BMO Field when visiting the GTA in the CFL, it probably looks a bit odd for a soccer team based at Tim Horton Field to be playing a York Region branded team based in a significantly smaller athletics stadium at York U. I am not sure how that will play out in the months and years ahead. Time will tell, basically.

Ah ok, thanks for the clarification.

[KW519]

@BenFisk'sBiggestFan Well considering the Raptors almost always get the early game in the Playoffs (12 or 1 pm) that could potentially put a dent in your assumption. Even if it's not the Raptors involved in the early tip off there will still be 2 east coast teams playing 

[toontownman]

13 hours ago, matty said:

CPL pres admitted the schedule was a work in progress after the MLS dates were up.

Also you're third paragraph is bad, like do you deny there are optics linked to having your first game going head to head locally with the established brand? It's a bold fuck you move if there ever was one.

Aye maybe the full schedule wasn't finalized. You make it sound like they just conjured this fixture out of their arse last week. I think you are being naive if you think they didn't know their starting day and teams eons ago. It was rumoured on here months ago before the MLS season had finished. This game is one of the biggest moments in Canadian football history, seems like somewhere they might have started planning rather than finished. I get the argument and completely understand the frustration for TFC fans. Toronto is however where the league HQ is based out of and these are the two founding teams,  again I think this something that would have been a vision from the start. There is only a small group of people that can fully answer that though. 

Maybe.. part of that schedule being a work in progress was to make sure there weren't reoccurring clashes with the MLS season. Doesn't seem to be that benefit of doubt. In fact seems to be a working notion that they can't clash with MLS but also shouldn't be pandering to them. Either way the CPL looks bad.

I don't also deny the optics of it being bad and far less than ideal situation. I said that in the previous paragraph in the quoted post. However I don't think its necessarily directly picking a fight, for the reasons above. It is optics as you say, it certainly can appear bold with how its played out as much as it would have appeared weak doing it the day later where people will complain they are pandering to the MLS and they missed the boat for getting people out who won't go to two games in a weekend. Thats optics, it can spin either way. They are damned if they do damned if they don't. Bold as fuck move.. again no, bold as fuck would have been putting it at 3 like the traditional format. If anything this makes it look like they did cede to the MLS. Picking a fight would be promoting it as the "Biggest match of the day in Canadian football" not the warm up act for TFC. 

I think it's possible potentially they gambled months ago that it wouldn't be the same day as a TFC home game (two months into their season) when they set up this opener, hence also accommodating an earlier start to counter that if the gamble did pay off. If their vision is to have Saturday matches as their focal point like most leagues, clashes are inevitable somewhere down the line. They also have to stand on their own two feet imo.  Invariably this will likely happen in Toronto throughout the season, I don't think that should be a surprise to anyone. That was always the reality the minute the team was announced and it is going to affect the same way a Laval team would affect the Impact and Langley the Whitecaps. It sucks for a small minority of MLS hardcore fans that would attend both teams all the time if the schedules clash. Long term I don't think that can be avoided and shouldn't be first priority for the CPL either imo. 

Bottom line they have to fill an 10000 stadium between two clubs supporters that are an hour drive a part in a population of over 7million. Thats discounting any neutrals or hardcore fans that want to be there for the inaugural game.  TFC have by this point played 4 home games in the MLS 5 if you count the champions league. The season is fully on the way. Should the CPL back down and cede to MLS if this is something they planned prior, arguably they already did by not having it mid afternoon, IMO. 

Obviously I am putting much bias on benefit of doubt but there is just too much information about the CPL we don't know yet (full schedule, Broadcast details, background details etc) to be throwing a hissy fit and mudslinging one way or the other. Maybe both leagues and clubs are fine with it and have spoken too.  

 

Edited February 3, 2019 by toontownman

[Watchmen]

15 hours ago, Winnipeg Fury said:

The only people complaining so far are TFC fans

Kristian Jack and Steven Caldwell complained about it on their podcast, stating that unfortunately they (and a number of other reporters) would be unable to attend the CPL game as they'd already be committed to covering the TFC game.  Fans complaining is one thing, but if it's impacting soccer reporters that you would want at the first game, it's another.

[matty]

15 minutes ago, Watchmen said:

Kristian Jack and Steven Caldwell complained about it on their podcast, stating that unfortunately they (and a number of other reporters) would be unable to attend the CPL game as they'd already be committed to covering the TFC game.  Fans complaining is one thing, but if it's impacting soccer reporters that you would want at the first game, it's another.

i didn't even know that and now i'm like oh shit. It's pretty likely John Molinaro won't be covering it either as he's Sportnet's TFC guy too.

[gator]

I think the impact of the timing of this match on attendance and coverage are being overblown, those who want to be at this historic match will be, simple as that and I fully expect a great crowd, hell we have people from all over the country coming to be part of it, how many of those same people would travel for a regular season MLS match? As far as Caldwell and Jack not attending, I would be very surprised if the CPL is much of a thing for either of these guys, obviously the more media coverage the better, my buddy Gaz Munro will be covering it for TSN that's for sure, I'm sure many other Canadian media that are truly interested in this league succeeding will be there!

[BringBackTheBlizzard]

3 minutes ago, matty said:

i didn't even know that and now i'm like oh shit. It's pretty likely John Molinaro won't be covering it either as he's Sportnet's TFC guy too.

As long as the Hamilton Spectator and CHCH are there along with the Hamilton radio stations everything is hunky-dory from a local Hamilton standpoint. Hamilton does have its own media outlets and that's where they have an advantage over York 9 because York Region team is much more in downtown Toronto's orbit. We'll know more about the wider media impact from coast-to-coast when we know who their broadcaster is going to be. If it's DAZN, having it so close to the TFC game and not having the Toronto based soccer media guys could be more problematic than if it's on a mainstream cable outlet.

[matty]

1 minute ago, BringBackTheBlizzard said:

As long as the Hamilton Spectator and CHCH are there along with the Hamilton radio stations everything is hunky-dory from a local Hamilton standpoint. Hamilton does have its own media outlets and that's where they have an advantage over York 9 because York Region team is much more in downtown Toronto's orbit. We'll know more about the wider media impact from coast-to-coast when we know who their broadcaster is going to be. If it's DAZN, having it so close to the TFC game and not having the Toronto based soccer media guys could be more problematic than if it's on a mainstream cable outlet.

i nearly mentioned thank god the spec and chch will be there but assumed that was apparent. i agree the carrier could decide how much and how serious national coverage is. losing molinaro's coverage (which seems like either way) would be bad as he's given the cpl a ton of ink

[toontownman]

45 minutes ago, Watchmen said:

Kristian Jack and Steven Caldwell complained about it on their podcast, stating that unfortunately they (and a number of other reporters) would be unable to attend the CPL game as they'd already be committed to covering the TFC game.  Fans complaining is one thing, but if it's impacting soccer reporters that you would want at the first game, it's another.

It would help everyone, not least all of us here if they hurry up and release the broadcast details and more information about the league set up. We are driving ourselves into insanity here!

Nothing to say if its TSN they wouldn't split their team and Jack and Caldwell being regular MLS'ers are assigned to TFC while others are assigned to the CPL game. Likewise Sportsnet have their own team and so would CBC. 

Also possible the CPL want their own branding in terms of who is the face of CPL on screen. Thats certainly unlikely to ever be Caldwell. De Vos though..more work for Herdman to fill his vacant "friendly planning time".  

All about the glass half full.. or clutching straws or whatever it is. 

[Macksam]

On ‎1‎/‎30‎/‎2019 at 9:05 PM, m-g-williams said:

 

I've also heard people here going on for ages about how Missisauga, Oshawa, Sarnia and a hundred other Hogtown suburbs I can never keep straight could each (eventually) support a club.  

 

[C2SKI]

I really don't understand what people expected. It was always going to be a Saturday afternoon game. It's the only time that makes sense. 

[matty]

10 minutes ago, C2SKI said:

I really don't understand what people expected. It was always going to be a Saturday afternoon game. It's the only time that makes sense. 

Sundays also make a lot of sense

[C2SKI]

24 minutes ago, matty said:

Sundays also make a lot of sense

I imagine there could be a game or two on Sunday as well, but you want your launch event to be at the best time possible and Saturday afternoons are the prime time for soccer around the world.

[BringBackTheBlizzard]

Sunday tends to be the big day for soccer in traditionally Roman Catholic countries in Europe like Italy, so that's not really true.

[Tigers]

The biggest two groups of people any game's kickoff day and time affects are

1. the home market for fans attending

2. TV viewers.

On the first point, Hamilton is it's own market with its own fans that can and will attend (this game in particular) in excellent numbers. And, in the Hamilton market, 1 pm on a Saturday at Tim Hortons Field is as ideal as you can get.

On the second, @toontownman in his post above laid out how this is likely the most open time slot of the day, possible Raptors game aside. So across the county, it's in the best position to attract viewers. 

Now, it just so happens, that York9 is in driving distance, and therefore is a good opportunity to have an extra attendance boost, for this extra special game. Anyone who makes it is a BONUS. 

Think of it like this. York9 has an AWAY game that day. While TFC is at HOME - that has to be the ideal situation scheduling wise. Is it not the best thing for York9 to have home games when TFC is away? Just because the away game they are playing is within driving distance, they have to avoid TFC both at home AND away? Seriously.

[C2SKI]

19 minutes ago, BringBackTheBlizzard said:

Sunday tends to be the big day for soccer in traditionally Roman Catholic countries in Europe like Italy, so that's not really true.

And yet I'd be surprised if the first game of the week is often on a Sunday. I wonder why...

Edited February 3, 2019 by C2SKI

[matty]

9 minutes ago, Tigers said:

The biggest two groups of people any game's kickoff day and time affects are

1. the home market for fans attending

2. TV viewers.

On the first point, Hamilton is it's own market with its own fans that can and will attend (this game in particular) in excellent numbers. And, in the Hamilton market, 1 pm on a Saturday at Tim Hortons Field is as ideal as you can get.

On the second, @toontownman in his post above laid out how this is likely the most open time slot of the day, possible Raptors game aside. So across the county, it's in the best position to attract viewers. 

Now, it just so happens, that York9 is in driving distance, and therefore is a good opportunity to have an extra attendance boost, for this extra special game. Anyone who makes it is a BONUS. 

Think of it like this. York9 has an AWAY game that day. While TFC is at HOME - that has to be the ideal situation scheduling wise. Is it not the best thing for York9 to have home games when TFC is away? Just because the away game they are playing is within driving distance, they have to avoid TFC both at home AND away? Seriously.

Hamilton is actually NOT its own market (TV wise at least) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_television_stations_in_North_America_by_media_market#Canada

 Also is the CPL dependent on THE WHOLE NATION WATCHING on TV? Like I get this is historic but how many people are going to be tuning in? I've pointed out before social media numbers are fickle for the league and I am sure there are supporters of other teams that are following that team rather than the league. Like it'll also be about 10am in Victoria/Vancouver (another shared TV market). Were talking about hardcores here not casuals and maybe not even bars/restaurants in some major markets.

And again there is very fair reason to worry about THIS GAME.

[matty]

7 minutes ago, C2SKI said:

And yet I'd be surprised if the first game of the week is often on a Sunday. I wonder why...

cause you're trying to reinforce your point about saturdays being the bigger day. look either makes sense from a worldwide soccer perspective.

[C2SKI]

18 minutes ago, matty said:

cause you're trying to reinforce your point about saturdays being the bigger day. look either makes sense from a worldwide soccer perspective.

My point wasn't really that Saturdays are bigger or better than Sundays to watch soccer. It was simply that it makes sense to have the first game of the week/season on a Saturday afternoon, as it's one of the first big windows of the week to schedule a game, and it allows for the games following it to still be scheduled at other good windows. I really didn't think it was revolutionary or controversial. If your first game is on a Sunday than you're either playing all games in one day, or you're having midweek games. Is that what you'd prefer?

Edited February 3, 2019 by C2SKI

[matty]

7 minutes ago, C2SKI said:

My point wasn't really that Saturdays are bigger or better than Sundays to watch soccer. It was simply that it makes sense to have the first game of the week/season on a Saturday afternoon, as it's one of the first big windows of the week to schedule a game, and it allows for the games following it to still be scheduled at other good windows. I really didn't think it was revolutionary or controversial. If your first game is on a Sunday than you're either playing all games in one day, or you're having midweek games. Is that what you'd prefer?

I figured they would try and get as many games going on that first day to make a massive deal of it as DAY 1. Like a 6 hour marathon for the die hards. Also I fully expect a lot of mid week games as I've said before, it's 28 games in 26~ weeks.

I don't think the day matters between the two days really

Edited February 3, 2019 by matty

[Tigers]

33 minutes ago, matty said:

cause you're trying to reinforce your point about saturdays being the bigger day. look either makes sense from a worldwide soccer perspective.

Is the CPL dependent on THE WHOLE WORLD WATCHING on TV? 

  Like I get this is historic but how many people are going to be tuning in? I've pointed out before social media numbers are fickle for the league and I am sure there are supporters of other teams that are following that team rather than the league. Like it'll also be about 10am in Victoria/Vancouver (another shared TV market). Were talking about hardcores here not casuals and maybe not even bars/restaurants in some major markets.

Soooo.... it matters even less if no one else around the country is watching. 

Edited February 3, 2019 by Tigers

[C2SKI]

14 minutes ago, matty said:

I figured they would try and get as many games going on that first day to make a massive deal of it as DAY 1. Like a 6 hour marathon for the die hards. Also I fully expect a lot of mid week games as I've said before, it's 28 games in 26~ weeks.

Sure, I suppose that's an option they could have taken, or may be taking? Do we know yet when the other games will be? Edit: It looks like the Sunday on the Island. I can't wait!

Personally, I like hanging out before and after a game though. I'd rather not rush back and watch another one on TV. 

Edited February 3, 2019 by C2SKI

[matty]

10 minutes ago, Tigers said:

Is the CPL dependent on THE WHOLE WORLD WATCHING on TV? 

 

 

Soooo.... it matters even less if no one else around the country is watching. 

dude's that's the stupidest thing i've ever fucking read here. that point was about which day makes sense from a traditional soccer point of view. it wasn't a debate it was a conversation and no one was being acidic

also the reason i mention the whole country is because that's been a big thing for a lot of people arguing the conflict doesn't matter cause it's just one city.