2024 Voyageurs Cup

[Watchmen]

7 hours ago, themodelcitizen said:

Um. Why? Don't we want those kids playing at the highest level available in the summer? I'm guessing a lot of them are back from uni for a few months living at home rent-free. If not for, say, L1O, they'd be working somewhere FT while playing on a buddy's team in the Peel Halton district men's league. Sounds great right. There's a reason Dino Rossi recognized the need to accommodate teams that rely on those players when scheduling the playoffs

Yeah, pretty much what Ozzie says. L1 BC runs a short season with multiple teams relying almost exclusively on university players. I don't think that's ultimately beneficial. Run a full season, and if university players are able to join for only part of the season that's fine. But don't build a league solely to accommodate them.

[themodelcitizen]

Not building a schedule to accommodate players sounds like not building a schedule to accommodate the weather. These guys needs games, we can imagine a fictional summer league like USL2 but it doesn't really solve anything (and CSA didn't want FC London piggybacking off that existing structure).

I don't know how many summer teams are relying on uni kids almost exclusively, but L1O has got creative with their U19s having a summer and fall season. Some teams only participate in one depending on if they're relying more on local kids or those who are home for the summer. It's a lot, but the type of creative solution that's better than just punishing those teams. Could also have a league cup take over for the second half of the season when teams' rosters radically change

Edited December 15, 2023 by themodelcitizen

[Watchmen]

12 hours ago, themodelcitizen said:

Not building a schedule to accommodate players sounds like not building a schedule to accommodate the weather. These guys needs games, we can imagine a fictional summer league like USL2 but it doesn't really solve anything (and CSA didn't want FC London piggybacking off that existing structure).

Not in BC, where L1 runs a short season and 3 or 4 of the 7 teams are basically university squads. It was fine to get the league going. It's not fine longer term.

[Aird25]

I hope this doesn't lead to Canadian MLS teams backing out of the Voyageurs cup

 

[SpursFlu]

22 minutes ago, Aird25 said:

I hope this doesn't lead to Canadian MLS teams backing out of the Voyageurs cup

 

That's interesting because doesnt US Open Cup qualify 1 team to Concacaf Champions Cup?

Edited December 15, 2023 by SpursFlu

[narduch]

There's really no point for the 3 Canadian MLS teams to back out of the Voyageurs Cup.

CSA already makes it super easy for them and bends over backwards for them.

It's essentially a 33% chance of a CCC spot.

Why would they give that up?

Edited December 16, 2023 by narduch

[SpursFlu]

I definitely get the fixture congestion argument from Garber now that they're doing the Leagues Cup but saying that USL stadiums/environments are not worthy of MLS teams or whatever he was getting at is just kinda lame. That's a bit of the whole point of an open cup competition 

Edited December 16, 2023 by SpursFlu

[themodelcitizen]

8 hours ago, Watchmen said:

Not in BC, where L1 runs a short season and 3 or 4 of the 7 teams are basically university squads. It was fine to get the league going. It's not fine longer term.

So we force them to change their entire roster strategy? I'm guessing some teams use it for players at the top of their own youth structure so they would just withdraw instead of putting together a semi-pro roster on top of all their other operations

[Kent]

14 minutes ago, themodelcitizen said:

So we force them to change their entire roster strategy? I'm guessing some teams use it for players at the top of their own youth structure so they would just withdraw instead of putting together a semi-pro roster on top of all their other operations

I don't know how feasible this is, but perhaps the roster is still involving lots of university guys, but before they are able to join the team you fill in the gaps with your youth team's best players. It can be their audition for more playing time in the rest of the season, otherwise they are back to playing with the youth team.

[Shway]

4 hours ago, SpursFlu said:

That's interesting because doesnt US Open Cup qualify 1 team to Concacaf Champions Cup?

That's exactly the point they are making. They are willing to give up 1 measly berth out of the 9 they already could have.

Every year this league loses a bit of my attention.

[Watchmen]

2 hours ago, themodelcitizen said:

So we force them to change their entire roster strategy?

Yes.  Long-term, the L1s shouldn't be focused on catering to the university players.

2 hours ago, themodelcitizen said:

I'm guessing some teams use it for players at the top of their own youth structure so they would just withdraw instead of putting together a semi-pro roster on top of all their other operations

These BC L1 teams don't have a "youth structure".  They're solely catering to the university player.  And long-term, that's not what L1 should be.

[themodelcitizen]

Yeah I didn't realize teams like Unity were basically a summer program for the Spartans. Meh, if we can find 8+ teams that don't operate like that I might agree with you, at the moment the league is dropping teams so I'd still advocate catering to the uni teams for now. Maybe we could have a Commissioner's Cup or something for the rest of the teams that takes a month or two at the end of the season (it would only be them playing in that time anyway)

[Unnamed Trialist]

On 12/14/2023 at 5:08 PM, Watchmen said:

Yeah, pretty much what Ozzie says. L1 BC runs a short season with multiple teams relying almost exclusively on university players. I don't think that's ultimately beneficial. Run a full season, and if university players are able to join for only part of the season that's fine. But don't build a league solely to accommodate them.

I think in the end it has to be the goal, I agree too.

For now, to start a L1, they needed the university teams to fill out the league. But the model going forward has to shift to teams that are rooted in existing club-academies, with multiple youth levels and decent facilities; or in alliances of clubs.

Ontario and Québec have at least 6-8 clubs each with the heftiness of TSS Rovers, the latter probably more. In BC, it is pretty well the only of its kind. But only because existing clubs with that potential have not chosen to join L1.

BC has the potential to be the place where aspiring players at L1 level go to play year round. Much like other national training programs like rowing are based in BC (BC historically has had a high % of national Olympic athletes, for example, above its % in Canadian population). Imagine a L1 BC going 9 months, you'd be able to draw L1 level players from all over Canada, as long as they were willing to uproot, rent together and find a job locally. 

Edited December 16, 2023 by Unnamed Trialist

[K Edgar]

https://northerntribune.ca/us-open-cup-cup-mark-noonan-comment/

[narduch]

This is funny. Were people even wondering that?

[Ozzie_the_parrot]

10 minutes ago, K Edgar said:

https://northerntribune.ca/us-open-cup-cup-mark-noonan-comment/

...because the question on everybody's minds on hearing the news about the USOC was going to be whether CanPL teams would still be in next season rather than whether the TFC and Whitecaps Next Pro teams would be making an appearance. Cutting edge stuff from Northern Tribune. Thomas Nef is badly missed in that context.

[RS]

7 minutes ago, Ozzie_the_parrot said:

...because the question on everybody's minds on hearing the news about the USOC was going to be whether CanPL teams would still be in next season rather than whether the TFC and Whitecaps Next Pro teams would be making an appearance. Cutting edge stuff from Northern Tribune. Thomas Nef is badly missed in that context.

They were just writing a story based on Noonan's quote. I don't think they were trying to be "cutting edge."

[Watchmen]

4 hours ago, Unnamed Trialist said:

Ontario and Québec have at least 6-8 clubs each with the heftiness of TSS Rovers, the latter probably more. In BC, it is pretty well the only of its kind. But only because existing clubs with that potential have not chosen to join L1.

I've heard that L1 Canada taking over L1 BC might re-open talks with some of these clubs.  A fresh start for everyone.  And I don't think L1 Canada will fixate so much on the silly nicknames like "Unity" or "Two Rivers" that L1 BC wanted, they'll allow the clubs to keep their historical names.

[SpursFlu]

1 hour ago, K Edgar said:

https://northerntribune.ca/us-open-cup-cup-mark-noonan-comment/

Lol I like this energy from Noonan. He should also clarify the CPLs stance on the European Super League 

"For those of you wondering.. No CPL teams will NOT be joining Real Madrid & Barcelona in a new breakaway European Super League"

[themodelcitizen]

1 hour ago, SpursFlu said:

Lol I like this energy from Noonan. He should also clarify the CPLs stance on the European Super League 

"For those of you wondering.. No CPL teams will NOT be joining Real Madrid & Barcelona in a new breakaway European Super League"

I'd also like to announce that I won't consider any nomination for People Magazine's Sexiest Man Alive 2024

[K Edgar]

4 hours ago, SpursFlu said:

Lol I like this energy from Noonan. He should also clarify the CPLs stance on the European Super League 

"For those of you wondering.. No CPL teams will NOT be joining Real Madrid & Barcelona in a new breakaway European Super League"

"Yes, ALL @cplsoccer clubs will be participating in the 2023 @TELUS Canadian Championship."

Or with the stress on the all Noonan is saying Valour will actually participate, as opposed to what they did last year.

[masster]

With the American MLS teams pulling out of the US Open Cup...have we heard definitive word either way whether the Canadian MLS teams will be pulling out of the Canadian Championship?

Scheduling the tournament will now be more difficult for those dates no longer being blocked off for cup play.

[MtlMario]

16 hours ago, masster said:

With the American MLS teams pulling out of the US Open Cup...have we heard definitive word either way whether the Canadian MLS teams will be pulling out of the Canadian Championship?

Scheduling the tournament will now be more difficult for those dates no longer being blocked off for cup play.

CPL commish said there are no changes for our championship.

[narduch]

16 hours ago, masster said:

With the American MLS teams pulling out of the US Open Cup...have we heard definitive word either way whether the Canadian MLS teams will be pulling out of the Canadian Championship?

Scheduling the tournament will now be more difficult for those dates no longer being blocked off for cup play.

I think the American MLS teams can play as much as 6 games in their Cup.

Whereas it's only 3 for the Voyageurs Cup.

Also I doubt the 3 teams want to give up what is essentially a 33% chance of being in the CCC

[Kingston]

There's also the fact that the Canadian MLS teams have always been enthusiastic about the Canadian Championship while the American MLS teams (with a couple of notable exceptions) have never been keen on the US Open Cup.