Joel Waterman

[CanadaFan123]

14 minutes ago, jonovision said:

Larin's 2021/22 season at Besiktas was terrific and that was the form he carried into WCQ. Hardly a waste.

I think you mean 20/21

Edited December 6, 2022 by CanadaFan123

[VinceA]

So many links now.

Adana Demirspor, Schalke, Besiktas, Koln, Salzburg

 

edit: AEK Athens and Panathinaikos too.

Edited December 8, 2022 by VinceA

[jordan]

6 minutes ago, VinceA said:

So many links now.

Adana Demirspor, Schalke, Besiktas, Koln, Salzburg

 

edit: AEK Athens and Panathinaikos too.

Anyone outside of Turkey pick these up? Or is it still just Turkish sites?

[InglewoodJack]

Some Turkish article is claiming he’s joining Adana Demispor:

https://www.fotospor.com/adana-demirspor/rakitsky-nin-varisi-kanada-dan-waterman-adana-ya-543253

 

Had to post this so I could translate it on my computer as my phone doesn't recognize turkish:

Quote

SPORTS NEWS | Adana Demirspor , who terminated the contract of Ukrainian defender Yaroslav Rakitsky , found its new target in Canada… It was claimed that he was on the list of the Adana team for Joel Waterman , the 1.88 stopper who attracted attention at the World Cup held in Qatar .

 

Sporstnet network reporter Peter Galindo reported on Saturday that Waterman 's profile was widely discussed in Germany, Turkey, Austria and Greece.

For Waterman, the names of Schalke and Cologne from the Bundesliga, Salzburg from Austria, AEK and Panathianakos from Greece, and Adana Demirspor from Turkey were included. 

The 26-year-old British Columbian has spent the last three seasons at CF Montreal, according to the report. Take it to the next level in 2022. He took part in 30 Major League Soccer (MLS) games, all in the starting 11. He scored 3 goals. He also made 2 assists.

they're third in Super Lig right now, so I guess there's the champions league angle, but I really wonder what the salary looks like. unless you're playing group stage, are champions league matches against like, tiraspol and nicossia really a step up from olimpia and santos? hope if this materializes joel secures a major bag.

Edited December 8, 2022 by InglewoodJack

[Obinna]

Seeing all the clubs linked to him gets me feeling all greedy, but the reality is that any Turkish Super Lig club would be a good move for Waterman, given his age and resume. It would also be the highest level yet that a CPL graduate has played. Isn't Demirspor the same club Balotelli played at recently? 

[VinceA]

2 minutes ago, Obinna said:

Seeing all the clubs linked to him gets me feeling all greedy, but the reality is that any Turkish Super Lig club would be a good move for Waterman, given his age and resume. It would also be the highest level yet that a CPL graduate has played. Isn't Demirspor the same club Balotelli played at recently? 

Yes, and they've become a good and stable club in the league. This season they're fighting for European places.

[WestHamCanadianinOxford]

Really hope some of these go somewhere.

That said most Turkish transfer stuff should be taken with Bonneville Salt Flats of salt.

[Obinna]

4 minutes ago, VinceA said:

Yes, and they've become a good and stable club in the league. This season they're fighting for European places.

Thanks Vince. That's what I recall as well, both about Balotelli and the club being high up the table. They are very similar to Hatayspor in the way they have found stability and are pushing upwards.

Great spot for Waterman, it seems.

Question - would you prefer a move to Fenerbahce (or equivalent) with Waterman playing more of a support role (let's say 3rd or 4th in the depth chart), or would you prefer a move like this where he is likely to be a regular starter (don't know if he actually would be, just guessing he would be in contention for such a role)?

[VinceA]

Just now, WestHamCanadianinOxford said:

Really hope some of these go somewhere.

That said most Turkish transfer stuff should be taken with Bonneville Salt Flats of salt.

I do agree for the most part, but I think factor in there being smoke to this is, of all the players to get linked to Europe, Joel Waterman sure feels random.

He's not the best CB at Montreal (Miller) and didn't appear at the WC (Miller did). So it's weird that out of everyone, he's the one that gets linked. Plus he's getting linked all over the place so there must be something going on.

[VinceA]

1 minute ago, Obinna said:

Thanks Vince. That's what I recall as well, both about Balotelli and the club being high up the table. They are very similar to Hatayspor in the way they have found stability and are pushing upwards.

Great spot for Waterman, it seems.

Question - would you prefer a move to Fenerbahce (or equivalent) with Waterman playing more of a support role (let's say 3rd or 4th in the depth chart), or would you prefer a move like this where he is likely to be a regular starter (don't know if he actually would be, just guessing he would be in contention for such a role)?

I think for him right now, playing time is key, especially if he wants to start for the NT. Fenerbache is most glamourous but at the same time Gala, Fener and Besiktas all seem to fluctuate in the top ten these days on a year to year basis so they aren't the same giants they used to be.

[Chad_Impact]

1 minute ago, VinceA said:

I do agree for the most part, but I think factor in there being smoke to this is, of all the players to get linked to Europe, Joel Waterman sure feels random.

He's not the best CB at Montreal (Miller) and didn't appear at the WC (Miller did). So it's weird that out of everyone, he's the one that gets linked. Plus he's getting linked all over the place so there must be something going on.

I'm not surprised because of his ball-playing ability. He's a true modern CB/RCB, and every team wants that capability at the back right now

[CanadaFan123]

The fact rumours are saying he attracted interest at the World Cup makes me wonder if something was lost in translation and these rumours are about Miller.

[Obinna]

4 minutes ago, VinceA said:

I think for him right now, playing time is key, especially if he wants to start for the NT. Fenerbache is most glamourous but at the same time Gala, Fener and Besiktas all seem to fluctuate in the top ten these days on a year to year basis so they aren't the same giants they used to be.

It's a good point about the big 3. I was wondering that as well. What those big 3 still have, however, is the pressure to win always. Our players can benefit from playing in environments where they are expected to perform in big games, which Ferner would provide to him, even if he's primarily a substitute. That said, I think I agree with you about the PT.

[InglewoodJack]

1 minute ago, Obinna said:

Thanks Vince. That's what I recall as well, both about Balotelli and the club being high up the table. They are very similar to Hatayspor in the way they have found stability and are pushing upwards.

Great spot for Waterman, it seems.

Question - would you prefer a move to Fenerbahce (or equivalent) with Waterman playing more of a support role (let's say 3rd or 4th in the depth chart), or would you prefer a move like this where he is likely to be a regular starter (don't know if he actually would be, just guessing he would be in contention for such a role)?

I think I would rather him at Fenerbahce. I don't think that playing for an MLS team vs. Demispor makes much of a difference for Canada, unless the plan is for him to leverage this transfer into another one, but at his age, he only has so many years left in his prime that his first move to Europe will likely be his biggest move ever. With Fenerbahce, sure he may get "Laryea'd", but he's already so far down the depth chart that he isn't playing for Canada already, so it isn't like he would fall even lower down if he was glued to the bench for a top team.

 

[Obinna]

1 minute ago, CanadaFan123 said:

The fact rumours are saying he attracted interest at the World Cup makes me wonder if something was lost in translation and these rumours are about Miller.

Could be. Maybe clubs were already interested and were attracted by his selection to the WC team (even though he didn't play)?

It's a stretch, I know, but it's not anymore odd than getting Kamal Miller's name wrong to this extent. Who knows though!

[CanadaFan123]

Just now, Obinna said:

Could be. Maybe clubs were already interested and were attracted by his selection to the WC team (even though he didn't play)?

It's a stretch, I know, but it's not anymore odd than getting Kamal Miller's name wrong to this extent. Who knows though!

There’s also the Montreal connection. Could be an easy mistake if someone said “the Canada central defender on Montreal” and someone made the mistake. Millers profile just seems much more likely as being linked to these clubs, particularly the bundesliga teams. 
 

Historically how many players with Waterman’s profile have transferred from MLS to the clubs in question? Seems far fetched.

[Obinna]

Just now, CanadaFan123 said:

There’s also the Montreal connection. Could be an easy mistake if someone said “the Canada central defender on Montreal” and someone made the mistake. Millers profile just seems much more likely as being linked to these clubs, particularly the bundesliga teams. 
 

Historically how many players with Waterman’s profile have transferred from MLS to the clubs in question? Seems far fetched.

It's true that signs point to something getting lost in translation. It's especially odd considering we haven't heaed a peep about Miller. That makes me suspicious. 

Curious to see if your theory pans out. It would be cool for Waterman to get a move, but for the NT it's probably more important that Miller steps up a level than Waterman.

[InglewoodJack]

8 minutes ago, CanadaFan123 said:

The fact rumours are saying he attracted interest at the World Cup makes me wonder if something was lost in translation and these rumours are about Miller.

There's an article on the MLS site talking about both Miller and Waterman having interest from Turkey. Maybe all of these rumors come from a game of broken telephone from galindo's original tweet, but I think it would be... pretty hard to confuse Miller and Waterman. They also have Waterman's height, place of birth and MLS stats, so they definitely know who the guy is.

[CanadaFan123]

3 minutes ago, InglewoodJack said:

There's an article on the MLS site talking about both Miller and Waterman having interest from Turkey. Maybe all of these rumors come from a game of broken telephone from galindo's original tweet, but I think it would be... pretty hard to confuse Miller and Waterman. They also have Waterman's height, place of birth and MLS stats, so they definitely know who the guy is.

All it would take is for a mistake to be made at the source - those facts are all available online. 
 

Would be great if both can make moves.

I envision Waterman making more of a Kennedy type move to a bundesliga 2 side or mid table Austria team. 

Edited December 8, 2022 by CanadaFan123

[jonovision]

Another way of asking the same question is this: Is Sam Adekugbe better off at Hatayspor or Whitecaps? I know how most of us would answer.

Edit: quoted the wrong post. Someone above was asking whether matches against Limassol and Nicosia and the likes were a step up from taking on Olimpia and Santos with Montreal.

An upper table side in Turkey is a good move, in my books.

Edited December 8, 2022 by jonovision

[Obinna]

2 minutes ago, jonovision said:

Another way of asking the same question is this: Is Sam Adekugbe better off at Hatayspor or Whitecaps? I know how most of us would answer.

Edit: quoted the wrong post. Someone above was asking whether matches against Limassol and Nicosia and the likes were a step up from taking on Olimpia and Santos with Montreal.

An upper table side in Turkey is a good move, in my books.

All good. I think it was @InglewoodJack you meant to quote. Either way, I agree that playing-wise it's arguably a wash, but Europe has benefits that MLS doesn't have, namely chasing the European places and the pressure that comes with it. Chasing an MLS playoff spot isn't quite the same.

[Cicero]

Seems a wash playing wise. I can understand if he's having trouble negotiating a jump in salary how this might be attractive. Quite possible that's all this is about. Turkish teams, even the top ones, have performed abysmally in European competitions in the last few years. It's generally six-and-out at or near the bottom of the table. I guess it would be a different experience, but mostly in being manhandled by superior teams.

[Cicero]

Trying to think of any players who progressed to a better league from Turkey, aside from Larin, sort of, although even that is mostly a lateral move.

[InglewoodJack]

11 minutes ago, jonovision said:

Another way of asking the same question is this: Is Sam Adekugbe better off at Hatayspor or Whitecaps? I know how most of us would answer.

Edit: quoted the wrong post. Someone above was asking whether matches against Limassol and Nicosia and the likes were a step up from taking on Olimpia and Santos with Montreal.

An upper table side in Turkey is a good move, in my books.

I think Sam Adekugbe is a better player, he has been in europe since he was 21, and has theoretically shown enough to move on to a team in Belgium, or a top Turkish club, things of that nature. For Waterman, he'd be going to Turkey 2 years older than Sam was, and by the time he's established himself there, he'll probably be like 29 or so, and that's around the age that calibre of player returns to MLS (see: DeAndre Yedlin). Because of this, I think Waterman's next move will be his biggest, and if that big move is fairly lateral, I don't think that makes much of a difference as much as it will concern us.

When players move abroad, we care because they can theoretically end up in those top 5 leagues/top 50 clubs in the world, and one of those ways is by playing top european competition. Last year's third place finisher in Super Lig was Konyaspor who were in turn eliminated before Europa Conference League group stages by Vaduz FC, a team from Lichtenstein, a country who is too small to even have its own domestic league, so they award the spot to their domestic cup winner- Vaduz has won that cup every year but twice since 1994. Vaduz is a team that plays in the second swiss division, and would probably give a tough challenge, but ultimately lose, to a good CPL team, probably.

[CanadaFan123]

9 minutes ago, Cicero said:

Seems a wash playing wise. I can understand if he's having trouble negotiating a jump in salary how this might be attractive. Quite possible that's all this is about. Turkish teams, even the top ones, have performed abysmally in European competitions in the last few years. It's generally six-and-out at or near the bottom of the table. I guess it would be a different experience, but mostly in being manhandled by superior teams.

4/4 Turkish teams are in European knockouts. It’s a higher level - there’s no debating it.