tyler453 Posted December 2, 2011 Share Posted December 2, 2011 (edited) This brings me back to FIFA's rules on eligibility. So you apparently NEED a citizenship to play for a country? Well, I'm pretty sure he wouldn't have one for Canada, England, the States and Jamaica all at once. I'm pretty sure Jamaica doesn't even give citizenship to children of parents who have emigrated to another country. So why is it if JDG2 rennounces his citizenship, he would have to get it back? Don't mean to change the subject, but I've never been able to wrap my head around this flaw. Edited December 2, 2011 by tyler453 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex Posted December 2, 2011 Share Posted December 2, 2011 No OH (the Englishman) was not and English citizen but probably had an English passport and bloodlines to them. Personally my mom is a German citizen, a landed immigrant living here for 30 years and therefore I have a German passport but am not a German citizen as I was born here and have always lived here. But I believe I would be eligible to represent Deutschland, but I won't I'm holding out for a call from Stephen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tyler453 Posted December 2, 2011 Share Posted December 2, 2011 No OH (the Englishman) was not and English citizen but probably had an English passport and bloodlines to them. Personally my mom is a German citizen, a landed immigrant living here for 30 years and therefore I have a German passport but am not a German citizen as I was born here and have always lived here. But I believe I would be eligible to represent Deutschland, but I won't I'm holding out for a call from Stephen. I was just clarifying though because in FIFA rules, it says that the player must be a citizen of the country they are representing. This is where I'm lost. Passport and citizenship are two different things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alberta white Posted December 2, 2011 Share Posted December 2, 2011 No OH (the Englishman) was not and English citizen but probably had an English passport and bloodlines to them. Personally my mom is a German citizen, a landed immigrant living here for 30 years and therefore I have a German passport but am not a German citizen as I was born here and have always lived here. But I believe I would be eligible to represent Deutschland, but I won't I'm holding out for a call from Stephen. OH's mother is Welsh and is one of his brothers. His father is English as is his other Brother. In fact I think OH is the Only Cnadian born member of his family. Makes you wonder how Canadian he actually felt before skipping out. I once heard an interview with Arsenal's Bob Wilson, the English born Scotish goalkeeper, refer to himself as a Scot born in England (again his parents were Scots, living and working south of he border). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bertuzzi44 Posted December 2, 2011 Share Posted December 2, 2011 OH's mother is Welsh and is one of his brothers. His father is English as is his other Brother. In fact I think OH is the Only Cnadian born member of his family. Makes you wonder how Canadian he actually felt before skipping out. I once heard an interview with Arsenal's Bob Wilson, the English born Scotish goalkeeper, refer to himself as a Scot born in England (again his parents were Scots, living and working south of he border). I'd say since he was born and raised in Canada, and never lived in England, he probably didn't "feel English". I mean, how could he? He had never lived there and all his friends and schooling was in Canada. I never buy the "I don't feel Canadian" from born and raised Canadians. I know tonnes of people with parents from China, Japan, Vietnam, Taiwan, etc, and if they were born in Canada, they of course consider themselves Canadian ('ethnic' Chinese, etc, though). As an extreme example: how easy would it have been for 2nd-generation Japanese-Canadians whose parents were born in Japan to not "feel Canadian". The government actively discouraged their presence, it was an extremely racist environment, and after the war they were only given two options - sent out east or back to Japan. And yet every 2nd generation Japanese Canadian who lived through internment I have ever talked to still said they felt Canadian. Hard to believe and white kid from Calgary somehow didn't. I don't buy it. (a good watch!): http://www.nfb.ca/film/Minoru-Memory-of-Exile /tangent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul-collins Posted December 2, 2011 Share Posted December 2, 2011 I'd say since he was born and raised in Canada, and never lived in England, he probably didn't "feel English". I mean, how could he? He had never lived there and all his friends and schooling was in Canada. There is also a certain amount of "individuality" being expressed by the person when they claim to feel heritage other than Canadian. My wife (born in Holland, moved here as a pre-teen) thought of herself as Dutch until she went back her third (I think) time. While there, she realized that she really was no longer Dutch, but rather, Canadian - she had absorbed the culture in her teens, the geography, etc over time. It's easy to say (and believe) that you are some other nationality than the one surrounding you, especially in a country that makes space for that sort of exceptionalism. The question is really whether that person would feel that nationality strongly while living there... Maybe we should force the fence-sitters to go live for 6-8 weeks by themselves where they claim their alternate nationality, and see what they feel after that. *Especially* those who have never lived there... (Granted, that would not prove anything to Jono, but it is consistent with how I feel about his divided allegiance anyway) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ssk Posted December 2, 2011 Share Posted December 2, 2011 (edited) Some reasons I don't understand the discussion at hand: - it is entirely possible for a person to feel different nationalities at the same time or at different times over the course of a day, without any particular identity conflicting with any other - For most people I know, even for Voyageurs who yell "show us your passport", nationality is never their preeminent, overarching, all-encompassing identity. Edited December 2, 2011 by ssk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alberta white Posted December 2, 2011 Share Posted December 2, 2011 I'd say since he was born and raised in Canada, and never lived in England, he probably didn't "feel English". I mean, how could he? He had never lived there and all his friends and schooling was in Canada. I never buy the "I don't feel Canadian" from born and raised Canadians. I know tonnes of people with parents from China, Japan, Vietnam, Taiwan, etc, and if they were born in Canada, they of course consider themselves Canadian ('ethnic' Chinese, etc, though). Hard to say all his friends were in Canada, unless you are one of them, but I understand where your coming from. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ivan Posted December 2, 2011 Share Posted December 2, 2011 Let's face it. All of this discussion is probably moot. Athletes only "feel" they are the nationality that will earn them the most money and advance their professional careers. Some may say rightfully so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alberta white Posted December 2, 2011 Share Posted December 2, 2011 Wo ho! don't get me started on athletes travelling under FLAGS OF CONVENIENCE! Gran Larsoneers of the sports world from day one (well when they officially junked their amature status anyway). At least Pro-ball and Hockey players earn their money through legimate means. Ticket money season tickets Sponsorship deals etc. Athletes who gain their money from grants are in effect Public servants paid out of mine and your taxes. Didn't see any off them Marching in London on thursday? No you didn't! too busy getting a massage off some slip of a thing in weights room somewhere, sipping herbal enffusions of some sort, whislt contemplating Meddeling. MEDDLING!? Meddeling in my state Pension thats what there doing!! Oh! athletes? your refering to the term given to anyone undertaking a sporting endeavor? ...sorry... Still, runners eh? Scoungers off the state that's what they are! Throw 'em in the army! 'ave done 'wi em! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanadianSoccerFan Posted December 2, 2011 Share Posted December 2, 2011 Let's face it. All of this discussion is probably moot. Athletes only "feel" they are the nationality that will earn them the most money and advance their professional careers. Some may say rightfully so. There were an amazing number of Brazilians playing in Euro 2008. I'm wondering how many there will be this time around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alberta white Posted December 2, 2011 Share Posted December 2, 2011 There were an amazing number of Brazilians playing in Euro 2008. I'm wondering how many there will be this time around. Just wait till you see the Qatari Nats in 2022. Qatari Nats? now that a good name for a band. Move over Arcade Fire the Qatari Nats are coming! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alberta white Posted December 13, 2011 Share Posted December 13, 2011 Not totally related to the topic but is probably...Importance TO Jr. Hoillet http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/football/16169359.stm May herrald his movement out of Ewood Park. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJones Posted December 14, 2011 Share Posted December 14, 2011 Just wait till you see the Qatari Nats in 2022. Qatari Nats? now that a good name for a band. Move over Arcade Fire the Qatari Nats are coming! I would say so... As part of that vision, in 2004 the [Qatari) royal family funded the Aspire Academy project to train Qatari athletes with the best technology and resources that money could buy. Shortly after, as an offshoot of the academy's soccer program, the Aspire Football Dreams program was launched to uncover youth soccer talent hidden in the farthest-flung villages and outposts in the world. (So far 500, 000 boys 1994 and younger have been scouted and trialed according to 442 magazine) But there's the gray issue of national allegiance for those accepted to the program in Qatar. With riches to spare, Qatar has created a bit of a niche for itself in terms of importing world-class athletes. Generally Qatari citizenship is nearly impossible to acquire -- foreigners must live in Qatar for 25 years, speak Arabic and relinquish other citizenship to be eligible for consideration for a Qatari passport. But the monarchy is free to grant citizenship as it pleases, and in recent years a diverse group of athletes has been nationalized to compete under the Qatari flag, including Kenyan steeplechasers, Chinese chess players and Bulgarian weightlifters. Although nationalizing soccer players under FIFA rules is far more complicated than changing national allegiance in many other sports, suspicion has followed that Football Dreams could mask a talent search meant to boost the Qatari national soccer team, currently ranked 113th in the world. Simple math reveals that if the classes of 13-year-old to 15-year-old prospects pan out, those players would be in their primes come 2022. http://espn.go.com/sports/soccer/news/_/id/5933045/how-qatar-became-player-world-soccer http://fourfourtwo.com/blogs/fourfourtwoview/archive/2011/10/05/the-battle-of-manchester-football-trafficking-amp-a-trip-to-the-seaside.aspx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest uno Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 http://www.fifa.com/worldfootball/clubfootball/news/newsid=1567609.html Players to watch in 2012 Junior Hoilett Winger, 21, Blackburn Rovers Blackburn may be languishing at the foot of the Premier League table, but their dynamic wide-man has become one of the division’s hottest prospects, with Liverpool and Tottenham Hotspur among a host of clubs reportedly keen on signing him this month. Though born and raised in Canada, the as-yet uncapped Hoilett is also eligible for both USA and Jamaica, so is likely to be just as sought-after at international level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gator Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 I'm not sure if this is the thread to put this in but Hart was on Soccer Saturday this morning and Dobson asked him about Hoilett and he reiterated that nothing had changed and that Junior wanted to get his club situation sorted before deciding on a national team! To me this doesn't sound good, there really shouldn't be an international decision to make, we'll see! He also mentioned that work is being done with Canada Immigration and FIFA for JDG2 and that they will be meeting face to face soon! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dyslexic nam Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 The longer Hoilett delays, the less optimism I feel. At this point I consider him (and JDG2) to be pretty much lost to the Nats. If I am proven wrong, I will consider it a wonderful bonus... but I am not holding my breath. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheeta Posted January 15, 2012 Share Posted January 15, 2012 I'm not sure if this is the thread to put this in but Hart was on Soccer Saturday .... He also mentioned that work is being done with Canada Immigration and FIFA for JDG2 and that they will be meeting face to face soon! Just because there's smoke doesn't mean there's fire but WOW! Like I wrote, just because they're getting together doesn't necessarily mean there is a way forward (as far as we're concerned) but this wouldn't be happening without Dutch's okay. Just the effort, no matter how casual or informal at this point, speaks volumes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bertuzzi44 Posted January 16, 2012 Share Posted January 16, 2012 Just because there's smoke doesn't mean there's fire but WOW! Like I wrote, just because they're getting together doesn't necessarily mean there is a way forward (as far as we're concerned) but this wouldn't be happening without Dutch's okay. Just the effort, no matter how casual or informal at this point, speaks volumes. Agreed. This is a very nice development... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obinna Posted January 16, 2012 Share Posted January 16, 2012 Agreed. This is a very nice development... Wasn't this the plan all along? To meet up and discuss playing for Canada, while working with Canadian Immigration? Doesn't sound like much of a development, just sounds like everything is moving along fine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanadianSoccerFan Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 According to Hoillett's dad/agent he'll likely remain at Blackburn until the end of the season. http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/articles/282456/20120116/exclusive-t-see-both-leaving-agent-clarifies.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bertuzzi44 Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 According to Hoillett's dad/agent he'll likely remain at Blackburn until the end of the season. http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/articles/282456/20120116/exclusive-t-see-both-leaving-agent-clarifies.htm Ughh... never liked the "Dad/agent" combo :/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villus Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 Any family member as an agent is almost always a recipe for disaster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Alphonso Applegate Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 Any family member as an agent is almost always a recipe for disaster. Absolutely Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul-collins Posted January 18, 2012 Share Posted January 18, 2012 I don't know what you're talking about! -signed, Bonnie Lindros Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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