Player ratings - a post mortem

[BCM]

A little busy at work to post my comments with the ratings now, but thought a new thread with thoughts on overall player ratings for the tournament would be nice...

 

5	GK	Maxime Crépeau
5	DF	Fraser Aird
6	DF	Manjrekar James
6.5	DF	Sam Adekugbe
6	DF	Dejan Jakovic
7	MF	Samuel Piette
6	MF	Russell Teibert
6.5	MF	Scott Arfield
6	FW	Lucas Cavallini
6	MF	Junior Hoilett
NA	FW	Tosaint Ricketts
6.5	MF	Alphonso Davies
NA	MF	Raheem Edwards
5	MF	Mark-Anthony Kaye
NA	DF	Adam Straith
5	FW	Anthony Jackson-Hamel
6.5	DF	Marcel de Jong
6.5	GK	Milan Borjan
6	DF	Steven Vitória
6	MF	Patrice Bernier
6	MF	Jonathan Osorio
NA	GK	Jayson Leutwiler
7	MF	Michael Petrasso
6	FW	Cyle Larin

[Free kick]

I saw nothing noteworthy from Two of the players that you gave a 6.5 (the maximum grade). 

Plus you gave 5 to both AJH and Kay.  AJH made acrucial play to create a goal. 

[Free kick]

Just noticed that you gave two sevens. To Petrasso and Piette. But i dont know why. What about the guy who scored three goals in the tournament?

[BCM]

Thanks for replying - maybe some were skewed by expectations. Overall, Piette played extremely well IMO, and Petrasso exceeded expectations, and played every minute. He made mistakes, and even cost at least one goal (but also saved one off the line against Honduras, and saved the match with it), but when viewed against what was expected of him as a right back...he's a 7.

As for Davies, yeah he scored and is the revelation for the tournament, but the last two matches he disappeared for large stretches and showed his naivety and inexperience in trying to take on too many players, incorrectly thinking he can rely on speed, and not making the wisest of choices. I'd like to rate him a 7 or even 7.5 based on age, but really am not sure it is warranted after the last two matches.

Junior had a great second half tonight, but that doesn't justify a nigher overall tournament mark. Likewise Borjan made some great saves but too often (at least once a match) makes a gaffe that could seriously cost us.

AJH - didn't do much in the first match and we rarely saw him after that - one nice assist, but what else? People will more likely remember that boneheaded play on the touchline tonight. Maybe it's a 5.5, but below average.

I don't think we had a superstar deserving a higher mark than 7 - feel free to disagree.

[Big_M]

Man of the match doesn't need to be stated anymore unless it is not Arfield. His level is much higher than others so it's normal that it's almost always him

[BCM]

2 hours ago, dsqpr said:

Scott Arfield!  On the MOTM shortlist in every match, IMHO.

Fair enough, but I made the post too soon  after the match - his service was a little underwhelming. But agree he's our engine and a class above (unless and until Junior turns it on).

Our main disagreement is on Sam A. A four is a bit low, no!? He's tactically naive and a little slow to catch on to what OZ is trying to do, but I saw potential there. I also give him credit for playing more meaningful minutes this tournament than all of last season. I don't think he played before average.

[Guest]

I'm not even touching this with a 50 foot pole

[theaub]

Cyle Larin: -3

 

[David C.]

I would give Stalteri a 9. He looks like he could still play.  :-)

[Keegan]

Yea not sure about Adekugbe getting so much credit. I think a lot of people are just pleased he didn't suck but he didn't stand out either.. wasn't as involved as petrasso going forward and was seemingly at fault for Costa Ricas goal. Unless he starts playing first team football he shouldn't be called. Not because I don't like him but we have other players who probably deserve a shot too. 

[Addona]

29 minutes ago, Keegan said:

people are just pleased he didn't suck

I feel like this is how A LOT of player evaluation has gone for CMNT players in the past ... hopefully we can leave that in the past and look for / expect more.

[BearcatSA]

Petrasso a 7 seems too high. I thought he did better than expected in the group games and showed upside in that position but I thought he was really poor in the QF in the areas which should be his strength:  play on the ball. 

[TRM]

11 hours ago, dsqpr said:

Borjan: 7.5
Petrasso: 5.5
James: 6.5
De Jong: 7.5
Piette: 7.5
Arfield: 8.0  -- POT Tourney.
Davies: 6.0

I like your numbers better than the original ones with a few exceptions.

Borjan was great but mishandled quite a few. Almost POT.
Petrasso? Maybe I'm letting the Jamaica game influence me too much but we are still looking for a RB.
James played out of the back very well and was able to get back.
De Jong was excellent both ways.
Piette was excellent but not quite an 8.
Arfield seemed tired in the last game but definitely POT.
Davies scores so he can finish but way too many errors.

 

[matty]

So noticing AJH is getting lower ratings than Larin. Am I right to guess the "AJH>Larin" era of fandom is dead?

Also shocked with de Jong. Comeback Player of the Year?

[Ruffian]

21 minutes ago, matty said:

So noticing AJH is getting lower ratings than Larin. Am I right to guess the "AJH>Larin" era of fandom is dead?

I think we have 3 good strikers who get the start based on future form. Cavallini is the best fit for the team right now as the team was able to keep the ball on the ground in the attack with him. When Larin was in, Arfield and De Jong changed their game and were launching crosses thinking Larin would eventually put one in. The team needs to learn to play with Larin before he can be the top option at the lone striker spot.

[paul-collins]

12 hours ago, dsqpr said:

Your ratings are much too low! And EVERYBODY else uses a scale of 1-10, not 5-7!

*ahem* 4-8.5

[dyslexic nam]

Gotta pass the time somehow...

[Free kick]

22 hours ago, BCM1555362349 said:

Thanks for replying - maybe some were skewed by expectations. Overall, Piette played extremely well IMO, and Petrasso exceeded expectations, and played every minute. He made mistakes, and even cost at least one goal (but also saved one off the line against Honduras, and saved the match with it), but when viewed against what was expected of him as a right back...he's a 7.

As for Davies, yeah he scored and is the revelation for the tournament, but the last two matches he disappeared for large stretches and showed his naivety and inexperience in trying to take on too many players, incorrectly thinking he can rely on speed, and not making the wisest of choices. I'd like to rate him a 7 or even 7.5 based on age, but really am not sure it is warranted after the last two matches.

Junior had a great second half tonight, but that doesn't justify a nigher overall tournament mark. Likewise Borjan made some great saves but too often (at least once a match) makes a gaffe that could seriously cost us.

AJH - didn't do much in the first match and we rarely saw him after that - one nice assist, but what else? People will more likely remember that boneheaded play on the touchline tonight. Maybe it's a 5.5, but below average.

I don't think we had a superstar deserving a higher mark than 7 - feel free to disagree.

Regarding your point in the fourth paragraph.  I have seen a number of similar references in the past week stating:  So and so "played well but he a made mistake on so and so play so i downgraded him".  Seen this regarding several players.  

My view, if i have choose between 1) a player who plays well but may have been dispossed on one or two occasions or had one or two balls miss their target attempting a challenging/difficult play or 2) a player who makes no mistakes all game but you dont notice him or he doesnt demostrate the skills to make game changing plays,   I will take the the player who fits the description of point number 1 any day.   Because, if we are going to go with point number 2,  then we might as well just pick only second divsion players (like the USL) for our national team.  Its much much easier to play mistake free than it is to make game changing plays.   Difficult plays, like the passes that yield to goals, are difficult and require the kind of skills that distinguish players who play at higher levels from those who play at lower levels of this game.  Wanna avoid a mistake?  Just pass the ball back to the keeper all the time and when your team doesnt have the ball,  just stay out of the way, dont get your nose dirty and leave it to others to do things. That way you will never make a miskake and no one will ever point the finger at you.

What we need is more players who play well.  Thats what the program has been needing throughout its history.   Players who can deliver those good balls and make the plays that often will miss most of the time but that, when successfull, will create goals all the while maintaining as much team ball possesion as possble.   Those plays have the lowest success rate rate.

Final point, one of the players that i have been the most critical of for his selection for this tournament, made no mistake all tournament.  He also rarely touched the ball so there is no mistakes to make.  I still have no idea why he was selected. 

 

[Unnamed Trialist]

In order of our best players overall, I'd say:

1-Arfield (I even rate him higher than most last game, he is the most positively participative player we have)

2-Davies (goals count)

3-Piette

4-Petrasso

5-Borjan

6-Cavallini

7-Hoillet

8-De Jong

9-Jakovic (our best CB by far, being a step off a couple times vs. Jamaica does not change that)

10-Bernier (realize now we could have used him last game)

For me our weak spots were Kaye. I did not like how Adekugbe played, I think folks have to watch how often we was beaten vs. Honduras. Don't like James, but get folks point about how he responded to the Jamaica challenge. Larin, who apart from missing sitters added nothing to our team and ended up in the +- department -2.

[Blackjack15]

On July 20, 2017 at 8:58 PM, BCM1555362349 said:

A little busy at work to post my comments with the ratings now, but thought a new thread with thoughts on overall player ratings for the tournament would be nice...

 

5	GK	Maxime Crépeau
5	DF	Fraser Aird
6	DF	Manjrekar James
6.5	DF	Sam Adekugbe
6	DF	Dejan Jakovic
7	MF	Samuel Piette
6	MF	Russell Teibert
6.5	MF	Scott Arfield
6	FW	Lucas Cavallini
6	MF	Junior Hoilett
NA	FW	Tosaint Ricketts
6.5	MF	Alphonso Davies
NA	MF	Raheem Edwards
5	MF	Mark-Anthony Kaye
NA	DF	Adam Straith
5	FW	Anthony Jackson-Hamel
6.5	DF	Marcel de Jong
6.5	GK	Milan Borjan
6	DF	Steven Vitória
6	MF	Patrice Bernier
6	MF	Jonathan Osorio
NA	GK	Jayson Leutwiler
7	MF	Michael Petrasso
6	FW	Cyle Larin

Why are you giving Scott Arfield a 6.5? He deserves a 7 1/2 at least for his performances! Also questionable rating with Cavallini & Hoilett. Harsh critic you are lol 

[Unnamed Trialist]

8 minutes ago, dsqpr said:

One thing about doing ratings is that it is extremely hard to evaluate every player accurately, particularly when you only see the game on TV. So props to all those who attempt it.

One player I watched very closely this tournament, with the QPR connection, was Petrasso. And I can say with confidence that I think you have him too high. He was very good going forward to be sure, but defensively he was suspect. He often did a pretty good impression of a headless chicken against Jamaica, rushing from one player to the next, never sure where he should be. And look at where their first goal came from -- down our right centre. Our defence is so chaotic that I can't say for sure what went wrong, but that was certainly an area where I would have expected the right back to be involved.

Good ratings though.

Ima gonna be real carefl from now on with my radings, gotcha. Spetially when talkin bout those Cue-Pee-Are players.

[Boominbooty]

SO , I am hoping that, aside from the moemntum the team sems to have begun to build, the solid play for some of our players really translates into new opportunities.

Moves so far:

Borjan -Red Star Belgrade

Adekugbe - IFK Goteburg

 

Moves to come:

Aird - ?? (somewhere in Scotland I imagine

Piette - ?? div 2 Germany, Spain , I don't thinkhe'll go to Montreal

Kaye - Maybe a higher level team takes a closer look at him (NASL?)

Cavallini - ?? 2nd Div Spain

Anyone else?

[jonovision]

3 hours ago, Boominbooty said:

 

Kaye - Maybe a higher level team takes a closer look at him (NASL?)

 

Just playing regularly with his current USL team would be a positive career step for Kaye.

[jonovision]

His cameo vs Honduras was a disaster but with a few prominent exceptions he did well (relative to expectations) in the Costa Rica match.

For what it's worth, he did start the first Louisville match upon his return from the Gold Cup and played 73 minutes in a 4-1 win.

[BCM]

I ranked him a 5, below average, for the tournament but I too have high hopes for him. But this is dependent on getting game time and eventually moving up the chain. It's easy to forget he's still a young man, only 22. The potential for growth is there...