2017 Toronto FC season (aka the 2017 MLS Cup clinching thread)

[Unnamed Trialist]

28 minutes ago, Free kick said:

I really dont think believe that Andre Pierre Gignac is of the quality of Giovinco.  Gignac has a few caps as a sub for France.  He is good but much more of the kind of player that might see in MLS and that might not require DP money to sign.  He is more past his prime than Giovinco.  Laurent Robert also played in MLS. 

A few years ago, before Giovinco signed with TFC,  the Guardian and l'Equipe (I think it was l'equipe) ran a list of the top 100 players in the world and Giovinco made that list.  Honestly, I don't believe that there is a player of Giovinco' s ability in CONCACAF.  I might get an argument and concede that he is not the same player that he was last year or two years ago.  

Funny how you are touting Giovinco when he is year is notably worse, and his play too, in comparison with last season. He has been injured, sure, but less consistent, less flashy, and probably less effective. But fine, get all excited about a player in a slight decline being better and this or that in Mexico. 

[Free kick]

52 minutes ago, Unnamed Trialist said:

Funny how you are touting Giovinco when he is year is notably worse, and his play too, in comparison with last season. He has been injured, sure, but less consistent, less flashy, and probably less effective. But fine, get all excited about a player in a slight decline being better and this or that in Mexico. 

I am not disputing anything you said.  If he regains the form that he is capable of, i still maintain that the there isnt that kind of quality on any club In mexico.  What the mexican sides have is better rosters. And thats because there isnt a salary cap in mexico.  A cap means that a typical good side in MLS will have 2-5 first division players. Another 6-10 second divsion player and the rest would be lower levels.  Thats because when you spend a majority of your money on 4-5 players, there is no way you are going to get first div talent with the money thats left.  Is there any question that a player like David Villa could start for any number of clubs in la liga?

I’ll bet that if someone tried to come up with similar list as the Guardian but for concacaf, many if not a majority of the top ten might be MLS players.    I’m thinking Villa, Almiron, Piatti, Valeri and a few others. But then the vast majority of the rest of the top 100 might be players playing in mexican clubs. 

this was the 2015 list that i am referring to. 

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1E2ULi3F1r33VKcFSl5E5K_P_m98OswJMbcMTFRGqhtg/htmlview#gid=3

[Unnamed Trialist]

16 hours ago, Free kick said:

I am not disputing anything you said.  If he regains the form that he is capable of, i still maintain that the there isnt that kind of quality on any club In mexico.  What the mexican sides have is better rosters. And thats because there isnt a salary cap in mexico.  A cap means that a typical good side in MLS will have 2-5 first division players. Another 6-10 second divsion player and the rest would be lower levels.  Thats because when you spend a majority of your money on 4-5 players, there is no way you are going to get first div talent with the money thats left.  Is there any question that a player like David Villa could start for any number of clubs in la liga?

I’ll bet that if someone tried to come up with similar list as the Guardian but for concacaf, many if not a majority of the top ten might be MLS players.    I’m thinking Villa, Almiron, Piatti, Valeri and a few others. But then the vast majority of the rest of the top 100 might be players playing in mexican clubs. 

this was the 2015 list that i am referring to. 

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1E2ULi3F1r33VKcFSl5E5K_P_m98OswJMbcMTFRGqhtg/htmlview#gid=3

My you was not actually a "you" you but a plural trolling you.

I am just to get some of the mojo working so Whitecaps can play and win the MLS Cup final at BC Place. So sticking pins in Gio is part of that. Atlanta losing last minute yesterday too.

But it is all in fun. My feeling is that Caps are not at all entertaining but have resolve and that is fine, and that since winning anything is so damn hard, I'll take anything we can get, playoffs being what they are. In no way will I believe, if Caps win the Cup, that we are anywhere near the best team in the league. But since there is no possibility we will be in the near or even mid future, why not keep setting traps for TFC and hope they stumble and we pull off the unexpected.

[BenFisk'sBiggestFan]

On October 4, 2017 at 6:44 PM, Free kick said:

I am not disputing anything you said.  If he regains the form that he is capable of, i still maintain that the there isnt that kind of quality on any club In mexico.  What the mexican sides have is better rosters. And thats because there isnt a salary cap in mexico.  A cap means that a typical good side in MLS will have 2-5 first division players. Another 6-10 second divsion player and the rest would be lower levels.  Thats because when you spend a majority of your money on 4-5 players, there is no way you are going to get first div talent with the money thats left.  Is there any question that a player like David Villa could start for any number of clubs in la liga?

I’ll bet that if someone tried to come up with similar list as the Guardian but for concacaf, many if not a majority of the top ten might be MLS players.    I’m thinking Villa, Almiron, Piatti, Valeri and a few others. But then the vast majority of the rest of the top 100 might be players playing in mexican clubs. 

this was the 2015 list that i am referring to. 

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1E2ULi3F1r33VKcFSl5E5K_P_m98OswJMbcMTFRGqhtg/htmlview#gid=3

I get that MLS has maybe 5-6 players that could play on a top Liga MX team. But the reality of the fact is, they don't. When top players play against weak defence they start to loose their touch a bit. When an MLS team plays a Liga MX team, the MLS stars don't look like stars. They aren't used to playing against top level defenders. That definitely contributes to Liga MX's win rate.

[Club Linesman]

Can't wait for those games to start.  If we can hold the current team and improve in a couple more spots, I believe they will be able to compete with the Mexican teams.  I expect teams will have more funds to spend (TAM, total cap,..) and TFC is always willing to spend to improve.  

[Mike Thompson]

Just give them the MLS Cup already!

[Moldy9]

Guess TFC will do well next summer considering Altidore and Bradley won't be tired from playing in the World Cup. 

[Ruffian]

11 hours ago, Moldy9 said:

Guess TFC will do well next summer considering Altidore and Bradley won't be tired from playing in the World Cup. 

As a TFC fan I hope their failure at the international level does not hurt their play with TFC. Hopefully it drives them to make sure they win the MLS Cup this year. They probably will never get another chance to play in the World Cup and winning the MLS Cup, CONCACAF Champions League and playing in the Club World Cup may be the top goals they realistically have now in their playing careers.

[Ruud]

wow - anyone else happy our USA players don't have a home and away against Australia during the playoffs? 

 

Shame that they are out - will have plenty of time to analyse what happened - too many MLS players?  Not the right players (hello Morrow?)  Not the usual hard work and team play that has defined the US over the years.  I guess the value of all that money that FOX has spent for broadcasting rights has taken a dive - sure hope they locked in all their advertisers without any clauses on US games, although that sounds unlikely.

This is likely to be the last fun WC before things get loopy crazy (Qatar and then 48 teams).

 

 

 

 

[Jith12]

I'm worried that the USA's botch up of WCQ's will stunt Bradley's and Altidore's momentum. I hope that they do use this as more of reason to win MLS Cup rather than get discouraged.?

[Dub Narcotic]

Reyna will miss the Conference finals for Vancouver if they get that far and he gets called by Peru again.

[mtroads]

2 hours ago, Jith12 said:

I'm worried that the USA's botch up of WCQ's will stunt Bradley's and Altidore's momentum. I hope that they do use this as more of reason to win MLS Cup rather than get discouraged.?

Yeah, I was wondering if maybe they get Sunday off to get some time to re-focus on the MLS season. With Cheyrou back, maybe Bradley gets a break.

[Ruud]

For a meaningless game, resting key players is a no-brainer....so long as the team can turn it on again once the weather cools down.

I'm worried about how good Atlanta looks lately.

[Keegan]

On 2017-10-04 at 7:42 PM, Free kick said:

I really dont think believe that Andre Pierre Gignac is of the quality of Giovinco.  Gignac has a few caps as a sub for France.  He is good but much more of the kind of player that you might see in MLS and that might not require DP money to sign.  He is more past his prime than Giovinco.  Closer to a Laurent Robert than Thiery Henry who both also played in MLS. 

A few years ago, before Giovinco signed with TFC,  the Guardian and l'Equipe (I think it was l'equipe) ran a list of the top 100 players in the world and Giovinco made that list.  Honestly, I don't believe that there is a player of Giovinco' s ability in CONCACAF.  I might get an argument and concede that he is not the same player that he was last year or two years ago.  

 

Edit:  i found the list that i was refering to: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1E2ULi3F1r33VKcFSl5E5K_P_m98OswJMbcMTFRGqhtg/htmlview#gid=3

That list was after giovinco joined tfc. 

Also Gignac is no bum and would destroy mls. Laurent Robert was my favourite player when he was at Newcastle but he's never been at that level.. the guy is a French international.  Robert played what 7 games in mls? Sorry but that's just way off.  I'd argue that gignac would be just as effective if not more effective than Henry was here.

[Unnamed Trialist]

I take comfort in the fact that this thread, with that thread title, and TFC being what it is, is only 25-30% longer than the Whitecaps thread. With Caps playing pretty awfully all year. With way more TFC fans on the board and all.

I makes you think, in terms of what it gets you from fans, that it is not even really worth it to be the best team in the history of the MLS, the dividends are hardly noticeable. 

[jpg75]

Yes, because thread length on the V's board is a great measure of either clubs seasons...

[Bison44]

If we are talking length of threads, dont negative complaining discussions usually go on the longest?  

[jpg75]

23 minutes ago, Bison44 said:

If we are talking length of threads, dont negative complaining discussions usually go on the longest?  

Wouldn't that mean the Impact thread (11 pages) should be the longest and ours the shortest? 

[Free kick]

5 hours ago, Unnamed Trialist said:

I take comfort in the fact that this thread, with that thread title, and TFC being what it is, is only 25-30% longer than the Whitecaps thread. With Caps playing pretty awfully all year. With way more TFC fans on the board and all.

But thats because people who dont support TFC are much more likely to jump into the TFC thread than the opposite situation.  Thats just the way it is in Canada.

[jpg75]

1 hour ago, Free kick said:

But thats because people who dont support TFC are much more likely to jump into the TFC thread than the opposite situation.  Thats just the way it is in Canada.

That would make the TFC thread even bigger, which is the opposite of his argument.

[AvroArrow]

Is Unnamed Trialist honestly asking us to all get out our rulers and see whose thread is longer? 

[Unnamed Trialist]

6 minutes ago, AvroArrow said:

Is Unnamed Trialist honestly asking us to all get out our rulers and see whose thread is longer? 

What was that old Chinese proverb?

"A short thread that ties many knots, is not as short as you think"

[dyslexic nam]

If thread length is also the most reliable metric for determining importance, Hoilett is a god-damn rock star of world footy.

[Jith12]

Playoff time! Looks like we will probably play Atlanta again in the conference semis. Highly doubt they will lose at home in front of 72 k vs the Crew. If we do play Atlanta we've gotta play shutdown D away and take it to them at home. If we really want this we need to make BMO a fortress.

[Gian-Luca]

I wouldn't write off Columbus just yet. They are a bit of an under-rated team in the East and would have finished first in the West even though they are only 5th in the East (have the top 5 teams in the league all been from the same conference before in this league? I doubt it).

Also, NYRB are overdue to upset a team in the playoff rather than be upset, so it wouldn't shock me if they beat the Fire and become TFC's opponent in the first round. Which is probably want the West is cheering for because NYRB have to win the East in order for any of the teams in the West to have a chance to host the MLS Cup final.