Canada vs. Honduras In-Game Thread (R)

[The Beaver]

Yup. We needed six. I don't see us getting anything from Panama or away to Honduras. A win at home to Cuba and away should be expected. But seven points in this group won't be worth much.

Bravo Toronto. We are DECADES away from a smiliar showing in Vancouver. Decades.

I think a win and a couple of ties is in store for us yet, which should get us very close.

[trueviking]

Yup. We needed six. I don't see us getting anything from Panama or away to Honduras. A win at home to Cuba and away should be expected. But seven points in this group won't be worth much.

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somebody will lose to cuba....we will take something from panama or honduras....we wont lose both away games....i dont believe that winning away is as impossible as its made out to be.

[grigorio]

Just got back and my two cents without reading through everything.. We have no one to blame but ourselves for dropping two key points. Our sheer lack of skill, ability, creativity etc was the worst I've seen in a while. So many blown passes, unnecessary offside... I'm sure the strong wind had something to do with it but God d*mn... D-Ro and Johnson made many poor plays and I think only occean had a respectable game up front. Subs were ridiculously late and looks like mr glass -Atiba- is hurt some more? The last three games I've been to at BMO have been 0-0 ties ffs... Need to start rewarding these home crowds and boy could we ever use someone who knows how to find the net instead of f*cking up gloriously... (mmhmmmm hoilett)

Now, on a positive note.I was in mtl for Honduras in 2008 and feared much the same. Big props to TO and the organized support tonight. Felt fantastic being in 113 and if only we could find a way to finally fill that upper deck with 5k more people we'd be in heaven. Fun night, albeit tremendously frustrating...

[lazlo_80]

People are talking on this like Honduras was a breeze and Panama is way tougher competition. Guys, it's a blur at the top right now. Panama and Honduras was a closer game then the score dictates, plus Panama only beat Cuba by 1 at home. I'm tired of people crowning Panama here.

[Free kick]

We have to take something positive from these three games and build on that. The formation and the approach is working well. We need to finish our chances and we need more creativity, but I feel that will come, especially when Hutch is 100%. (When does Simpson get back?) We are still very much in the hunt. There is much work yet to do, but our fate is in our hands. 4 points from 2 games is a decent start. Of the six games we are to play, these two games were the second and third easiest--ostensibly--so we have some heavy lifting yet to do, but nobody on this team, player or coaching staff, are deluded about any of this. They are focused, cohesive, and growing in confidence etc.

Its now three hours since the game ended and i am more and more accepting of the draw. Initially i was thinking we need six pts in the first two matches no matter what. They did play well and the fact that we have conceded no goals in two games is certainly some to build on. What changed for me since the start of this round is that initially i thought that we would have to be rooting against Panama. But now, it looks like we will have to root against Honduras. Can Cuba manage at least a draw agains these guys? We gotta hope so.

Somehow, we have to find goals somehow. Hart has about 10 weeks to figure it out. He will have ten weeks to figure something that canadian NT coaches havent been able to figure out in fourty years.

[nolando]

There's no way in a MILLION years that Honduras would celebrate a scoreless tie against us at home in WCQ, even in their current transitional state. Why should we? In fact, I think their coach might get sacked in such circumstances.

It's only our past abysmal failures that make this seem like success.

You know what? We are supposed to have the majority of the crowd cheering for us AT HOME. It's very easy to get into the, "Well, in 2004 we would have been happy..." kind of discussion but it's straight up loser's talk.

If we are going to get out of this group we have to see this for what it is - two dropped points as opposed to one gained, and I hope to hell Hart emphasizes this with the players too because we are sunk if they are shrugging their shoulders saying, "not bad," like half of the people on this forum.

The Hondurans threw bottles and coins at their OWN national team Friday. Much much worse is in store for us there. Same goes for Panama. Dodgier reffing, in part influenced by the mayhem of the crowds will ensue. We haven't seen half of the playacting and dirty futbol coming our way.

We will have to be very very lucky to get more than seven points in this group now.

I will cheer to the bitter end but I'll be damned if I'm sitting around smelling roses with the rest of you.

[Gian-Luca]

Yup. We needed six. I don't see us getting anything from Panama or away to Honduras.

Really? All hope of even getting a draw at home against Panama is gone, never mind a win? Keep in mind they managed a 1-0 win over Cuba (the same score we beat them by - only we did it on the road).

[tarnado1555362291]

Well said from the captain, pretty much echoes my sentiments, results are the only thing that matters :

[lazlo_80]

There's no way in a MILLION years that Honduras would celebrate a scoreless tie against us at home in WCQ, even in their current transitional state. Why should we? In fact, I think their coach might get sacked in such circumstances.

It's only our past abysmal failures that make this seem like success.

You know what? We are supposed to have the majority of the crowd cheering for us AT HOME. It's very easy to get into the, "Well, in 2004 we would have been happy..." kind of discussion but it's straight up loser's talk.

If we are going to get out of this group we have to see this for what it is - two dropped points as opposed to one gained, and I hope to hell Hart emphasizes this with the players too because we are sunk if they are shrugging their shoulders saying, "not bad," like half of the people on this forum.

The Hondurans threw bottles and coins at their OWN national team Friday. Much much worse is in store for us there. Same goes for Panama. Dodgier reffing, in part influenced by the mayhem of the crowds will ensue. We haven't seen half of the playacting and dirty futbol coming our way.

We will have to be very very lucky to get more than seven points in this group now.

I will cheer to the bitter end but I'll be damned if I'm sitting around smelling roses with the rest of you.

no one disagrees that it was two points lost, especially not the players judging by the post game interviews. What I disagree with you is in thinking we're sunk. I don't hold Panama in the same high regard as you.

[BearcatSA]

More dynamism out of the entire team is necessary. There were many occasions where I thought guys like Occean and Johnson should've recognized where an open passing lane was and slid in there so that they could receive a through ball. Instead they didn't and the guy who should've had the oppurtunity to thread a through ball was forced to either take a long shot or send a cross into the box and hope that Occean or whoever could bring it down.

This is pretty defensively inclined team: compact midfield, hard to break down, err on the side of caution and be aware of defensive responsibilities and not get caught out on the counter. Our mids are at there best in that defensive supporting role. There were a couple of times in the second half when a cross was cleared by the Honduran back line and landed in what looked like a good area for us not far outside the box but we had no one in there to win it. There were a few moments of quick inventiveness up the middle that didn't quite come to fruition, but most of the time the offensive stuff comes off the counter (like involving De Ro 1 v 1 in this match, but unfortunately shooting over) or set plays (which we need to bury), not unlike Euro sides such as Greece or Denmark.

I think this is the best we get with this particular group of players. And with that, we are second place in the group and in the hunt. But I also believe we, in the words of Dennis Green, "let 'em off the hook" tonight.

[villus]

Panama has shown they are a good side in a few outings over the last few years, bottom line is that **** does'nt matter. We have to raise our game, not hope our opponents get worse, defensively we look very good, best in the group probably but offensively we have a lot of room to improve, our midfield really needs to pass and move a lot better. We need to focus on everything we can do to improve and if we do we can go out and be in contention in any game in this round, be it in Central America or at home.

None of these teams are Mexico or the US, they just are'nt but we should not look down on them because they don't have a bunch of players playing in europe, sure we have a lot of players playing in europe, but the passing and off the ball runs is not there for us. We raise our level, we respect the competition and we will have a great chance at qualifying but we absolutely must find some more creativity and must create more chances from open play, if not we are going to be relying on slim margins on set pieces or poor defending from our opponents.

[Canada1]

I am proud of our players, coaching staff and especially the fans at BMO field tonight. Our Mens National Team may have come up short on getting the 6 pts but the team has improved immensley from a kick and run team in the 90's to a team which can now play the ball up the field through possession. It has made our team much more exciting and way more dangerous in the CONCACAF.

With regards to our fans. I have never seen the backing given to our CMNT as I have over the past couple of weeks. I remember when my wife and I traveled to the Gold Cup back in 2000 to watch Canada beat Mexico, Trinidad and Columbia with virtually no fan support but this was the first time fans organized a trip carried out last week to Cuba. You guys rule. Amazing.

Soccer is changing in Canada and for the better. I am pretty sure the team was dissapointed not coming away with the full 3 pts but from watching the interviews it is starting to mean something in this country.

We have 4 games remaining and if we continue to show up like we did the past couple of weeks we will be successful. All these teams in our group are beatable weather on our field or away.

We just need goals.

[The Beaver]

There's no way in a MILLION years that Honduras would celebrate a scoreless tie against us at home in WCQ, even in their current transitional state. Why should we? In fact, I think their coach might get sacked in such circumstances.

It's only our past abysmal failures that make this seem like success.

You know what? We are supposed to have the majority of the crowd cheering for us AT HOME. It's very easy to get into the, "Well, in 2004 we would have been happy..." kind of discussion but it's straight up loser's talk.

If we are going to get out of this group we have to see this for what it is - two dropped points as opposed to one gained, and I hope to hell Hart emphasizes this with the players too because we are sunk if they are shrugging their shoulders saying, "not bad," like half of the people on this forum.

The Hondurans threw bottles and coins at their OWN national team Friday. Much much worse is in store for us there. Same goes for Panama. Dodgier reffing, in part influenced by the mayhem of the crowds will ensue. We haven't seen half of the playacting and dirty futbol coming our way.

We will have to be very very lucky to get more than seven points in this group now.

I will cheer to the bitter end but I'll be damned if I'm sitting around smelling roses with the rest of you.

I get your point, but our fate remains in our hands and we are far from being done here. I realize that emotions are still running high, but I have never seen anything good come from melodrama. The sky is not falling. We have more work to do. Panama will be tough, but we can still beat them. Nobody is smelling roses. Most of us are just trying to be realistic about where we are at and where we need to get to. And I highly doubt any of the players feel we achieved a whole lot tonight. We have work to do, but we are also not dead in the water by a long shot. No need for histrionics.

[Watchmen]

People are talking on this like Honduras was a breeze and Panama is way tougher competition. Guys, it's a blur at the top right now. Panama and Honduras was a closer game then the score dictates, plus Panama only beat Cuba by 1 at home. I'm tired of people crowning Panama here.

I recall reading somewhere today (though can't remember where...too many articles read) that historically speaking no team has failed to qualify for the hex after taking 6 points in the first 2 games. So while Panama might still miss, the odds are on their side and they've probably already had their toughest game (away to Honduras). Realistically, at this point Canada's battling Honduras.

[madmonte]

Starting in September of last year, Canada has allowed 4 goals in it's last 10 games. 3 of those were a bad outing against Armenia. Other than that, it was 8 clean sheets. 8 clean sheets in 10 games. Why is noone talking about that? You'd think that would be a stat SOMEONE would pick up on?

Anyways, AWESOME job at the back Canada! MORE than awesome, it's been practically amazing! Keep up the great work on defense!

[lazlo_80]

I recall reading somewhere today (though can't remember where...too many articles read) that historically speaking no team has failed to qualify for the hex after taking 6 points in the first 2 games. So while Panama might still miss, the odds are on their side and they've probably already had their toughest game (away to Honduras). Realistically, at this point Canada's battling Honduras.

I don't disagree with that. And "Crowning" isn't the right term. What I meant was that I didn't think Panama was impossible to get points against. We are very much in this.

[ditty]

Just watched the game. My thoughts:

- I liked how we set up to play and how we kept our shape. We were nice and compact and other than one massive gaffe late in the 1st half where we were let off the hook, I liked our game plan and what it gave us. Ledgerwood obviously doesn't have as much to offer going forward as the guys left on the bench but I thought he justified his place tonight. Could Ricketts do the same job defensively and the offer more attacking? Maybe. De Guzman was very good tonight.

- When I saw the 4-5-1 lineup, I was praying that Hutch would be given a free role and he pretty much was, with good results.

- Occean was a horse again tonight. We haven't had a guy lead the line like this since...... Gerba? Hahhaha! His ability to win balls all on his own and hold up the ball and link up allows us to stay so compact. I feel for Simeon Jackson but he's a CF sub right now in this set up.

- I saw a few comments about us not pushing up enough and not making earlier, more aggressive subs. This is a double edged sword. I'm still conflicted now over wanting to have seen Jackson get in earlier but not knowing who should come out. Occean worked his socks off but tired or not, he seemed the most likely to score tonight. When he did come out, I was surprised to see Hume and not Jackson. Personally, I would have gone Jackson for Dero at 80 mins, then if we were struggling to get service into the box, Hume for Occean to create some overloads. Of course we would have been hooped when Atiba got hurt.

- Our set pieces, particularly in the 1st half, were tragic. Not so much the two free kicks on goal, though they were poor, but the corners and longer free kicks. We didn't get a decent delivery til virtually the last minute when McKenna's header came close. This team will not get where it needs to go without converting some set pieces.

- This Honduras team was there for the taking. They are clearly out of sorts, particularly going forward. They created one glorious chance (capitalizing on that big mistake), but not a whole lot else. Had our final pass, let alone our finishing, been better, we would have won this match.

- The referee was in over his head tonight. I remember a FIFA ref here in Calgary teaching me that typically, a card or two needs to come out as the game heats up after 30 mins or so to let the players know you're in control. But I thought this lead to him overreacting on some incidents, dishing out a flurry of cards, then putting his whistle in his pocket when there were some clear, match altering fouls. You and/or your assistant simply have to give that rugby tackle on Hainault in the box. That clearly prevented Hainault from attacking the ball. It's a penalty, no questions asked.

- A late goal would have lifted the roof and given us so much confidence heading into the fall. But this is far from over, the same as it would have been even if we had won. It's going to be a 3 way race. I actually think we will beat Panama at home.

[madmonte]

^Was thinking the same about the double edged sword. If we had gotten too offensive minded and left ourselves too open at the back, then everyone would have changed their tune. In other words, they'd go from bitching about lack of offense; to bitching about lack of defense. You can't win.

[ditty]

^Was thinking the same about the double edged sword. If we had gotten too offensive minded and left ourselves too open at the back, then everyone would have changed their tune. In other words, they'd go from bitching about lack of offense; to bitching about lack of defense. You can't win.

Right. Look what Honduras did late in the first when they caught us out. A shockingly poor finish let us off the hook. We kept the Honduras attack very quiet tonight, so much so that some of us are questioning why we didn't take some chances and push more, which in a way is a good thing. The way we defend and the way Occean holds the ball up, I actually fancy our chances of taking another point on the road.

[villus]

Away teams are happy taking a point, its infinitely harder playing down in Central America. That means the impetus is on the home team to do their best to take 3 points, and that means attacking. Any decent team in the world plays more attacking at home and defensive on the road. Not only that this Honduran side is not very good, attacking leads to the opposition having to defend and sit back more, and attacking less, thus attacking gets 2 things accomplished it gives you the chance to score goals, get fouls and cards for the oppositon and it is it provides defense. Playing defensive does not lead to any of those benefits, its simple international soccer 101 Hart played not to lose, playing not to lose at home to teams like Honduras who are in a down moment is not the best strategy to qualify. If we played someone with a bit more defensive responsibility so be it, but we played Nik Ledgerwood wide on the right, who for all his battling qualities provided no danger at all going forward. On the road I can understand picking that squad, but the fact is we are going to be in tough against Panama and Honduras away to get wins so trying for a point or counter attacking or sset piece goals is a sound strategy, today it was not.

And its not like we were playing attacking wingbacks either, we played 2 relatively reserved players at FB which should give more ability to play attacking players ahead of them.

[Bertuzzi44]

I definitely agree with the sentiment here that Jackson should probably have come on earlier to help support Occean. Also, if you really wanted to take it to Honduras, it is Ricketts over Ledgerwood in the starting XI.

Hart a bit conservative with his tactics tonight, and IMHO 15-20 minutes late on his offensively-minded substitutions.

[ChrisB]

In a way I feel like I saw something different - We had plenty of opportunities to score but didn't take them. That is different to me than if we had no opportunities to score. I will not pin this result on Hart. It is on the players to convert. He set them up in a system that worked to both contain the Hondurans and provide possession. In the end, the players have to convert.

Maybe make your subs 5 or 10 minutes earlier? Whatever.

On the plus side, I cannot remember seeing DeRo working harder for the CMNT than the last few games. I sometimes wonder though i he doesn't add to the pressure on himself to score, which results in the misses?

[ray]

The nil-nil result an opportunity lost. A chance to come close to putting away a rival missed ... again. There are no excuses. We're at home, in front of a largely supportive crowd with a ref whose no worse than usual. Honduras were dangerous on a few occasions but nothing we could not handle. But the chances just weren't sufficient and the few we had not taken. The messed up free kicks in the first half were glaring.

Yeah, Canada are doing well not to concede much (Milan Borjan was not truly tested) but that is only half the job. Expect Honduras to take the game to us in Tegucigalpa. One goal in 3 matches (including USA) is poor. I read the latest info about JDG2. Too bad about his attitude but the kind of talent we needed. Frankly we need something different because there is not enough talent to produce goals in our current line-up. Hart has to look to someone like REB over the summer. </rant>

[ag futbol]

I think we did enough last night to win the game, but some poor finishing and wasted free kicks really hurt us. I can't find much fault with Hart. I can see some calling for a more attack minded lineup, but that's got to take defensive measures into account as well. Until we produce more players who can consistently possess the ball, the central american teams will attack and we will have to defend and look to counter.

Whatever the selection of players, I think defensive positioning has to be a pretty important criteria. That being said, we should look to inject some more speed where we can to improve our counter. We are moving at glacial speed out there at times.

[killgod]

I get the impression that some people think the only way you advance is with a 6-0-0 record. :S