USA National Team Watch

[RS]

11 hours ago, jonovision said:

Arguably the kid has shown the most class and maturity of anyone involved in this situation (apart from Mrs. Berhalter).

Except for the part where a large portion of his teammates didn't actually want him at the World Cup.

[JamboAl]

This is one time where the decision to keep this thread in here and not in the World Soccer forum has been vindicated (somewhat through laziness and indecisiveness).  
Can’t wait for the palpable tension from the players and staff the first time Reyna is back at a USMNT camp.

[Shway]

2 minutes ago, JamboAl said:

This is one time where the decision to keep this thread in here and not in the World Soccer forum has been vindicated (somewhat through laziness and indecisiveness).  
Can’t wait for the palpable tension from the players and staff the first time Reyna is back at a USMNT camp.

Wow I was about to say the same thing....

Go ahead and do your thing....it's time for this thread to get the boot.

[Bigandy]

5 minutes ago, RS said:

Except for the part where a large portion of his teammates didn't actually want him at the World Cup.

I was just thinking this. He had a bad attitude and he created this situation. 

Berhalter had a convo about an unnamed player where he thought it was off the record. Thats a mistake but not immature. 

Claudio is upset but didnt really do anything other than speak with friends. 

I dont know if i believe it was clear blackmail. Danielle claims she called up earnie and said that when Greg was 18 he did so much worse than sulk like Gio. That implies she was badmouthing him but I don't know if it was a clear and intentional aim to blackmail him.  

[Acid-Tone]

8 minutes ago, Bigandy said:

Berhalter had a convo about an unnamed player where he thought it was off the record. 

 

If you have a one on one with a reporter, you can both agree that what you say is "off the record".

If you are speaking to a room full of random people but say this is "off the record", and then you actually believe that what you say won't get leaked out, you are showing yourself to be off the charts naive/dumb.

[Bigandy]

13 minutes ago, Acid-Tone said:

If you have a one on one with a reporter, you can both agree that what you say is "off the record".

If you are speaking to a room full of random people but say this is "off the record", and then you actually believe that what you say won't get leaked out, you are showing yourself to be off the charts naive/dumb.

I should clarify what i meant by off the record as I dont think what i said reflects what happened.

Berhalter was speaking to a room full of people (i believe on the topic of leadership) and not directly to reporters. He used the world cup as an example and didnt name names. To release this info so close after the world cup could be viewed as a mistake (if you believe it is a mistake to talk about an unnamed player in a negative light publicly. I am not conviced this is a mistake as many top managers do this. Mourihno did this with Karsdorp not very long ago).

I dont think Berhalter was expecting no one to hear his talk. He obviously said it for a reason. It doesnt appear that he would use his talk on leadership as a way to attack an 18 year old who he didnt even name. I think he was trying to show the difficulties of being a leader. 

My original point which wasnt as clear as it should have been is that I dont think its immature to talk about the struggles of having a player with a terrible attitude. Its immature to have a bad attitude if you dont play. Its immature to call someones boss if you dont like how your son is treated. 

[Acid-Tone]

Did you just bring up Mourinho (and other "top managers") in the same breath as Gregg Berhalter?  My man, give your head a shake.

Gregg got the job because his brother was a top executive with the USMNT.  This hire had potential train wreck written all over it from the day they announced him as manager.

That Gregg chose to light the fuse to this dumpster fire at a "leadership conference" is the kind of shit Alanis wrote a song about years ago!

[Unnamed Trialist]

Comment I liked the best is how endogamic, suburban and old boys the entire system is in the US. No one is really badass, there's hardly any edge, even this comes back to literally soccer moms and wives and daddy with his patronage appointment. They all know each other, they bottom feed off each other.

Then the discussion focuses down and we're all left wondering: doesn't what happens when you're shit faced on the campus of UNC, stay in the campus pub at UNC?

Edited January 5, 2023 by Unnamed Trialist

[Bigandy]

5 minutes ago, Acid-Tone said:

Did you just bring up Mourinho (and other "top managers") in the same breath as Gregg Berhalter?  My man, give your head a shake.

Gregg got the job because his brother was a top executive with the USMNT.  This hire had potential train wreck written all over it from the day they announced him as manager.

That Gregg chose to light the fuse to this dumpster fire at a "leadership conference" is the kind of shit Alanis wrote a song about years ago!

I brought up mourihno as an example of calling out players publicly. I didnt compare the coaching ability of both of them. I am acknowledging that when mourihno calls out players publicly, he is not called immature or that it is a mistake. Therefore, i dont think its fair to assume that berhalter speaking publicly about a player is automatically a mistake either. 

I am not defending Gregg as a coach or his appointment. Just a part of his involvement on this particular issue.  

To extrapolate that him talking at a leadership conference is the fuse, seems a bit short sighted. He benched mckennie and talked about him publicly and that was fine. If the reynas dealt with this situation properly, then it would have likely been similar to what happened with mckennie.  

[solsous]

20 hours ago, SpursFlu said:

So Reyna's wife was in college with Berhalter's wife so she knew in 91 he kicked her in a night club when they were 19. They've been together 35 years with 4 kids but because he won't start his son in a world cup he sends this information out to what? Either play his son or else? Get him fired and or tarnish his reputation?

Yup.. thats blackmail 

Pretty pathetic behavior if you ask me. And I thought hockey parents were bad. Your son is 21 playing in the Bundesliga and in the World Cup. Take a chill pill

Does Claudio Reyna think he's Chuck Rhoades or something?

You are 100% correct.  That behavior is indefensible.

[Acid-Tone]

34 minutes ago, Bigandy said:

I brought up mourihno as an example of calling out players publicly. I didnt compare the coaching ability of both of them. I am acknowledging that when mourihno calls out players publicly, he is not called immature or that it is a mistake. Therefore, i dont think its fair to assume that berhalter speaking publicly about a player is automatically a mistake either. 

I am not defending Gregg as a coach or his appointment. Just a part of his involvement on this particular issue.  

To extrapolate that him talking at a leadership conference is the fuse, seems a bit short sighted. He benched mckennie and talked about him publicly and that was fine. If the reynas dealt with this situation properly, then it would have likely been similar to what happened with mckennie.  

Did Mourinho have very long and close personal relationship with the Karsdorp family? Was Karsdorp's dad the best man at Mourinho's wedding? No, and no.

You are attempting to shoehorn a very different scenario of a manager speaking publicly about a player, and compare it to a situation in which the facts are very different. And very messy.

The Reyna's took Gregg unnecessarily publicly trashing their kid (to take the heat off of himself), personally. As I imagine most people with that shared history would. You don't have to agree with how they chose to handle it to understand that part of it.

 

[Bigandy]

27 minutes ago, Acid-Tone said:

Did Mourinho have very long and close personal relationship with the Karsdorp family? Was Karsdorp's dad the best man at Mourinho's wedding? No, and no.

You are attempting to shoehorn a very different scenario of a manager speaking publicly about a player, and compare it to a situation in which the facts are very different. And very messy.

The Reyna's took Gregg unnecessarily publicly trashing their kid (to take the heat off of himself), personally. As I imagine most people with that shared history would. You don't have to agree with how they chose to handle it to understand that part of it.

 

Gregg didnt publicly trash their kid. He publicly talked about how their was 1 player who didnt comply with the standards. I dont think he said anything that wasnt true as evidenced by the split in the lockerroom. What heat was he trying to deflect at that point. Surely he would have used names if he was looking for a scape goat. 

If you look at it from a managers perspective, he really didnt do much wrong here. Could he have played it out a bit bettter, sure! But calling out a player publicly is not neccesarily a mistake.  

I am not shoehorning this scenario. I am looking at it from a player-manager-team perspective. You are talking about personal relationships and how they impact greggs managerial ability. I dont believe personal relationships between coaches and parents should be considered when reviewing managerial ability.

If you are now going to bring into personal relationships into the critiquing of a manager, then i think you are now talking about nepotism. Sure, its messy because they are friends. Does that mean Gregg shouldnt talk about Gio how he would with every other player. Thats nepotism. 

Is it a shitty thing to do to a friend - yes. 
Is it a shitty thing to do as a manager - not entirely. - as evidenced by how many managers do this.  

Are you saying hes a bad manager because of this? Do you believe a good manager would not have treated Gio this way because of the family connections? 

[Unnamed Trialist]

21 hours ago, SpursFlu said:

So Reyna's wife was in college with Berhalter's wife so she knew in 91 he kicked her in a night club when they were 19. They've been together 35 years with 4 kids but because he won't start his son in a world cup he sends this information out to what? Either play his son or else? Get him fired and or tarnish his reputation?

Yup.. thats blackmail 

Pretty pathetic behavior if you ask me. And I thought hockey parents were bad. Your son is 21 playing in the Bundesliga and in the World Cup. Take a chill pill

Does Claudio Reyna think he's Chuck Rhoades or something?

It's even worse.

Reyna went to 4 World Cups but didn't play in his first. You'd think he'd have some perspective.

Then, the kid's been injured for months. He doesn't have a good argument.

Then, Mommy Reyna argues that what happened in 1991 was far worse than what Greg and his wife are saying, that they're lying basically. They're lying about the details of an attempted blackmail story who's purpose was for Gio to get more minutes.

Gio, the kid who basically had Berhalter as a sort of uncle since he was a baby.

[Unnamed Trialist]

13 minutes ago, Bigandy said:

Gregg didnt publicly trash their kid. He publicly talked about how their was 1 player who didnt comply with the standards. I dont think he said anything that wasnt true as evidenced by the split in the lockerroom. What heat was he trying to deflect at that point. Surely he would have used names if he was looking for a scape goat. 

If you look at it from a managers perspective, he really didnt do much wrong here. Could he have played it out a bit bettter, sure! But calling out a player publicly is not neccesarily a mistake.  

I am not shoehorning this scenario. I am looking at it from a player-manager-team perspective. You are talking about personal relationships and how they impact greggs managerial ability. I dont believe personal relationships between coaches and parents should be considered when reviewing managerial ability.

If you are now going to bring into personal relationships into the critiquing of a manager, then i think you are now talking about nepotism. Sure, its messy because they are friends. Does that mean Gregg shouldnt talk about Gio how he would with every other player. Thats nepotism. 

Is it a shitty thing to do to a friend - yes. 
Is it a shitty thing to do as a manager - not entirely. - as evidenced by how many managers do this.  

Are you saying hes a bad manager because of this? Do you believe a good manager would not have treated Gio this way because of the family connections? 

Your posts are far too long, you're like me on the Internet back in the year 1364.

[El Hombre]

1 hour ago, Unnamed Trialist said:

Comment I liked the best is how endogamic, suburban and old boys the entire system is in the US. No one is really badass, there's hardly any edge, even this comes back to literally soccer moms and wives and daddy with his patronage appointment. They all know each other, they bottom feed off each other.

This all boils down to a parent trying to get a coach fired because he didn't play their kid enough.  It's a perfect encapsulation of the North American soccer experience. 

[Unnamed Trialist]

Just now, El Hombre said:

This all boils down to a parent trying to get a coach fired because he didn't play their kid enough.  It's a perfect encapsulation of the North American soccer experience. 

This is why we need to expunge pay-to-play acadèmies from Canada as well. The talent, including coaching talent, is constantly stymied by privilege and clientalism.

[Bigandy]

23 minutes ago, Unnamed Trialist said:

Your posts are far too long, you're like me on the Internet back in the year 1364.

Sounds like your bitter from the other thread. You cant hold your own in debates so you just comment on the person.  Get some perspective. 
 

[Bison44]

2 hours ago, El Hombre said:

This all boils down to a parent trying to get a coach fired because he didn't play their kid enough.  It's a perfect encapsulation of the North American soccer experience. 

And just to be fair its in plenty of other sports in Canada as well, but thats dead on.  

But I cant believe the takes on this.  Does anyone actually believe that after all the news stories and buzz about Reyna (and his attitude) etc that Berhalter went to that conference and hinted about a "anon problem player" with a bad attitude that he didnt know exactly what conclusions every person in there would take from that??  He is either dumb as a post or he was taking a shot at Reyna. And he underestimated the dirty shit the Reynas would pull to get PT for their kid...GEESHHH.   I thought our stuff was bad, this is like a little Peyton place going on down there.  

[GasPed]

11 minutes ago, Bison44 said:

 I thought our stuff was bad, this is like a little Peyton place going on down there.  

"Peyton Place"?  No offense but does your name refer to your birth year? 😀

[Bison44]

4 minutes ago, GasPed said:

"Peyton Place"?  No offense but does your name refer to your birth year? 😀

Listen here whipper snapper...I'll cut myself a switch and give you a hiding!!  I still say Puskas is the best player I ever saw in person.  

[Unnamed Trialist]

6 hours ago, RS said:

Except for the part where a large portion of his teammates didn't actually want him at the World Cup.

You have zero evidence of this. Stop trying to make it into some petty soap opera involving the players. The players are the least implicated in all this.

It is just inuendo created mistakenly in that dumb leadership speech by Berhalter, who has known him from birth and in some ways is like an "uncle" figure even. If you look at banter amongst players there was plenty supporting him when injured, when he's played he's been fine. Press is behind him, he was a sure call-up for everyone. He has plenty of USMNT friends on social media and personally. 

There is far more evidence that Arfield was subject to a current on the Canadian roster that was reticent about his presence, than any similar situation with Gio Reyna on the US team.

 

[Unnamed Trialist]

3 hours ago, Bigandy said:

Sounds like your bitter from the other thread. You cant hold your own in debates so you just comment on the person.  Get some perspective. 
 

You are just bitter because I called your threads too long. Or maybe it is just me. I can't read them, and I read the Count of Monte Cristo twice.

 

[Bigandy]

30 minutes ago, Unnamed Trialist said:

You are just bitter because I called your threads too long. Or maybe it is just me. I can't read them, and I read the Count of Monte Cristo twice.

 

This is getting out of hand. You didnt like that i provided evidence for my claims on soccer related matters. You've spent all day making little digs at me since.  I've never seen someone get so salty over an online forum debate between fans - just because they lost the debate/ cannot articulate their stance properly. 

No one wants to read our posts going back and forth.  This is now the 3rd time I have presented this to you. I will gladly debate soccer with you. The fact that you are getting personal as soon as you lose footing in the debate is not something anyone wants to be a part of. 

[RS]

39 minutes ago, Unnamed Trialist said:

You have zero evidence of this. Stop trying to make it into some petty soap opera involving the players. 

Ok. I'll be sure to tell Gio Reyna to not read my post lest he or his mom get their feelings hurt again.

1 hour ago, Bison44 said:

Does anyone actually believe that after all the news stories and buzz about Reyna (and his attitude) etc that Berhalter went to that conference and hinted about a "anon problem player" with a bad attitude that he didnt know exactly what conclusions every person in there would take from that??  He is either dumb as a post or he was taking a shot at Reyna. And he underestimated the dirty shit the Reynas would pull to get PT for their kid...GEESHHH.   I thought our stuff was bad, this is like a little Peyton place going on down there.  

My memory may not be perfect on this, but Gio Reyna himself confirmed that it was him by responding in an Instagram story very soon after the Berhalter speech went public. 

That started a cascade of reporting by some very credible American reporters on the USMNT's reaction to Reyna's sulking that I'm apparently not allowed to bring up.

[InglewoodJack]

4 hours ago, Unnamed Trialist said:

Your posts are far too long, you're like me on the Internet back in the year 1364.

Of everyone on this board, I think you and I are the only posters who are not allowed to criticize post length