CPL Power Rankings

[Copes]

1 hour ago, dyslexic nam said:

What will actually be interesting is to compare the projections with the table about 8 to 10 weeks into the season.  To me, ranking them right now is basically throwing darts given how little we know about many players and how hard it is to compare some of their current/past levels - so it will be interesting to see how accurate (or not) people are.

I agree. I think at this point Power Rankings are just for fun - and for comparison in the future. 

It's also interesting to see how different people's projections are. 

For me, I'm currently ranking my expectations as follow:

1. Forge FC
2. York 9 FC
3. Pacific FC
4. Valour FC
5. HFX Wanderers FC
6. FC Edmonton
7. Cavalry FC

This is of course subject to change once full rosters are out and some pre-season news / streams start being released. I agree with the group that the Ontario teams look like some of the strongest. Pacific has also impressed me with a combination of a veteran in Harber but strong young players with chemistry all from the same area / development programs. I struggle with ordering 4, 5, and 6. Valour I know a few more of the players so that gives them the edge, but I like what HFX has done by bringing in players that Hart already has a relationship with and in many cases (Trinidad Trio in particular) already have a relationship with each other. Cavalry... I don't know. I feel like their team is being built from PDL, but I'm expecting CPL to be closer to USL quality and so I think Cavalry will struggle.

[Unnamed Trialist]

On 2/1/2019 at 4:41 PM, Copes said:

For me, I'm currently ranking my expectations as follow:

1. Forge FC
2. York 9 FC
3. Pacific FC
4. Valour FC
5. HFX Wanderers FC
6. FC Edmonton
7. Cavalry FC

I am calling it identical but with Pacific and Valour above York. Based on signings so far, on technical ability of coaches, on the mentality shown as well. 

For example, I seriously mistrust Brennan, and have doubts about how York9 will be run. I'm ignorant about Valour. I think HFX just does not have the local talent to be able to draw. I was not sure about Pacific but they've convinced me with signings and I think they'll be tough at home. 

On the other hand, I have a lot of faith in Wheeldon but I think they may be underestimating the talent level needed. If Cavalry surprises us, because they have a good coach, are the group most used to playing together, and are feisty as a sort of underdog from the start, all power to them. But I think they may need over half the season to get there. 

 

[Senorpopps]

Here are my rankings given this week's signings:

1) Pacific FC - Fisk pushes them over the top with the other 2 signings very good additions. MDJ signing would only stake this claim even more. 

2) Forge FC - Another solid Sigma signing - a little more diversity will be needed to push them over the top. Why not go for an International with experience on the cheap, like a Kevin Parsemain? This would push them to Number 1. Oh yah, and they need a GK!

3) York 9 FC - Goggarty will not be the most skilled nor best 1 vs 1 defender in the league but he's a warrior and should add depth and competitiveness to a solid looking York back line.

4) Valour FC - Still the dark horse IMO with players from a variety of backgrounds. How well Gale can get them to gel will determine their success.

5) HFX Wanderers - Halifax's two additions show that Hart's team is going to be quick and athletic, which should contribute to his relatively direct style of play. The lack of an out-n-out striker (which I recognize few teams in this league have) and my belief that they will have a hard to time possessing the ball when up against the styles of play of the other teams (think how possession-oriented Smyrniotis is) contributes to their low ranking. 

6) Edmonton FC - Despite their low ranking, I don't think they'll get pummeled in the league with respect to the score line. However, their roster is more extensive than any other team's at this point and I don't see a goal scorer a part from Ameobi nor a midfield general who can control the play. That, and they have a young GK crew which I predict will let in a few unnecessary goals due to a lack of experience. Hopefully, one of these young lads can prove me wrong. 

7) Cavalry FC - Too many PDL players and I don't see anyone to help them grow. Not hating on Joel Waterman, but I don't see him adding anything huge to Cavalry FC's defence, granted I've rarely seen him play. Wheeldon Jr will have to make these last few signings count b/c I don't think Brown's academy history is enough to go on ... 

 

 

Edited February 7, 2019 by Senorpopps

[matty]

@Senorpopps i feel pfc are being overrated right now mainly because everyone thinks mdj is gonna sign, they have a pretty inexperienced team (a lot of guys didn't do all that much last year), and no real back line or #1 keeper. until that happens they're #3 for me. mdj signing would boost em but they are not over forge currently.

Edited February 7, 2019 by matty

[Obinna]

Pacific FC have to be at the top for me. Not only in terms of the players and coach, but also the logo and stadium. Hell, they even have a team store, don't they?

I have no connection to Victoria, or Vancouver Island for that matter. My local team is Cavalry. 

That said, it is really hard to dislike what PFC are doing. I am very impressed.

Edited February 7, 2019 by Obinna

[matty]

9 minutes ago, Obinna said:

Pacific FC have to be at the top for me. Not only in terms of the players and coach, but also the logo and stadium. Hell, they even have a team store, don't they?

I have no connection to Victoria, or Vancouver Island for that matter. My local team is Cavalry. 

That said, it is really hard to dislike what PFC are doing. I am very impressed.

no they have a boring logo. i asked a designer pal what he thought and he was like "that's a sports team? what the fuck is that?" which i found funny...he liked hfx, a logo i find busy

[Obinna]

26 minutes ago, matty said:

no they have a boring logo. i asked a designer pal what he thought and he was like "that's a sports team? what the fuck is that?" which i found funny...he liked hfx, a logo i find busy

Lol that is pretty funny.

I actually like their alternative logo more, but their primary one, I think, is still one of the best. It's all subjective though.

Speaking of secondary logos and Halifax, that is another club who's secondary logo is better - much better.

That one should be the primary imo!

 

Edited February 7, 2019 by Obinna

[BenFisk'sBiggestFan]

Good thing logos don’t matter to much:

 

[matty]

46 minutes ago, BenFisk'sBiggestFan said:

Good thing logos don’t matter to much:

 

yea this one threw me when they reached epl.

[Obinna]

I never understood what's going on there. Is that hair?

[youllneverwalkalone]

I think it's like a merman medussa.

[kacbru]

Looks more like the prow of a boat in the process of sinking...

[matty]

1 hour ago, Obinna said:

I never understood what's going on there. Is that hair?

 

1 hour ago, youllneverwalkalone said:

I think it's like a merman medussa.

 

9 minutes ago, kacbru said:

Looks more like the prow of a boat in the process of sinking...

i think it's supposed to be 80s cool. like new coke, max headroom, things that would become floral shoppe and eccojams

Edited February 8, 2019 by matty

[Unnamed Trialist]

On 2/7/2019 at 8:40 PM, matty said:

no they have a boring logo. i asked a designer pal what he thought and he was like "that's a sports team? what the fuck is that?" which i found funny...he liked hfx, a logo i find busy

Yes, but about logos: I wear all of HFX, Calvary and Forge shirts around Barcelona, along with Pacific FC, and the only one that gets a reaction is the latter. I think the Forge alternative logo on grey is the nicest, and it happens to be comfortable, but people are intrigued by that odd Pacific logo. I think it may be because it is like a lot of techno or electronic music scene logos, it has cool tones, is abstract, and maybe a bit spacey. I think it needs serious adjustments (the letters are way too small), but with various iterations and alterations there is a lot to work with there. 

I know that some people know this, but I teach university-level design, not to say I know more (though I better know some things more than most), and there is no arguing with taste. I am more saying this in relation to you asking a designer friend: fortunately even in the professional realm there is difference of opinion.

If you create a design that the majority recognise as good, you should automatically consider this: you are not ahead of the game, you are just with it. A degree of estrangement, of slightly incredulous reactions, should be present if you are pushing at the limits. This is what Pacific and Forge do better than all the others.

Anyways, unlike with many company logos or registered trademarks, sports teams tend to have their logos evolve to enable merchandising iterations. They are not heraldic (with old clubs in Europe they almost do have heraldic status and can't be overly tweaked without major complaints), so you can make corrections and do shifts to keep the merchandising fresh. But shirt sponsors have taught this to football, not the designers of logos. 

[matty]

1 hour ago, Unnamed Trialist said:

Yes, but about logos: I wear all of HFX, Calvary and Forge shirts around Barcelona, along with Pacific FC, and the only one that gets a reaction is the latter. I think the Forge alternative logo on grey is the nicest, and it happens to be comfortable, but people are intrigued by that odd Pacific logo. I think it may be because it is like a lot of techno or electronic music scene logos, it has cool tones, is abstract, and maybe a bit spacey. I think it needs serious adjustments (the letters are way too small), but with various iterations and alterations there is a lot to work with there. 

That's the point of my comment. It doesn't ring as an athletic logo.

1 hour ago, Unnamed Trialist said:

I know that some people know this, but I teach university-level design, not to say I know more (though I better know some things more than most), and there is no arguing with taste. I am more saying this in relation to you asking a designer friend: fortunately even in the professional realm there is difference of opinion.

You're not really saying it's a difference of opinion with the point. He's reaction was that it didn't look like something for a sports team and you've said people seem to agree. I'd be curious to see someone do this in like Regina or Windsor and see what they think it's a logo for.

My friend actually felt for the designers as he felt, given the name and location of the team, they had to work with something somewhat confused and gave props to them for that.

1 hour ago, Unnamed Trialist said:

If you create a design that the majority recognise as good, you should automatically consider this: you are not ahead of the game, you are just with it. A degree of estrangement, of slightly incredulous reactions, should be present if you are pushing at the limits. This is what Pacific and Forge do better than all the others.

Not really, doing when something on bleeding edge is done in design you can usually tell and generally the reception is fairly positive (at least contemporary). Nothing Pacific is doing is on the edge design wise, neither is Forge (Forge less so but Forge's tone is awesome).

1 hour ago, Unnamed Trialist said:

Anyways, unlike with many company logos or registered trademarks, sports teams tend to have their logos evolve to enable merchandising iterations. They are not heraldic (with old clubs in Europe they almost do have heraldic status and can't be overly tweaked without major complaints), so you can make corrections and do shifts to keep the merchandising fresh. But shirt sponsors have taught this to football, not the designers of logos. 

THIS IS SO TRUE. The sponsor sells a lot of kits.

[T_Bison]

On 2/9/2019 at 10:05 AM, matty said:

 

Anyways, unlike with many company logos or registered trademarks, sports teams tend to have their logos evolve to enable merchandising iterations. They are not heraldic (with old clubs in Europe they almost do have heraldic status and can't be overly tweaked without major complaints), so you can make corrections and do shifts to keep the merchandising fresh. But shirt sponsors have taught this to football, not the designers of logos. 

This. If you look at the logos of the original MLS teams from the mid-90s they are almost all horrible. Many have actually changed their names.

TBH I'm not a huge fan of Pacific's primary logo and I can see the secondary logo becoming the primary fairly quickly. I can also see substantial tweaks to Cavalry & York 9 within a few years. But that's the thing - few logos stand the test of time. In North America very few teams have kept their logos from 75 years ago until now. (Montreal Canadiens, New York Yankees, San Francisco Giants are the ones I can think of and even the Giants changed due to moving to SF in the mid-50s)

I expect in 10 to 15 years most if not all the current logos will have undergone a substantial revision

[Senorpopps]

I feel that given almost a month's worth of quality signings (especially relative to the previous ones), this thread deserves a rebirth. Here are my current predictions:

1) Pacific FC - 3 biggest names in the league push them to the top. Issey, Haber and De Jong provide unrivalled quality and leadership from back to front!

2) Valour FC - Great diversity, especially with the international signings, push them to 2nd. A forlan signing would have them as near guaranteed 1st unless Pacific FC keep pulling rabbits out of the hat

3) Forge FC - Found a quality GK in Roberts with the rest of their signings fitting the quality seen with Bobby's earlier signings. Lack of big names keep them away from top spot .

4) Cavalry FC - Hard to choose at this point but I like how Wheeldon built his foundation on chemistry from Foothills and then has carefully selected his next signings.

5) HFX FC - Less proven chemistry than Cavalry and no apparent "threat" up front; However, strong leadership from the Trinidadian group and an experienced coach could prove me wrong in this assessment 

6) FC Edmonton - I see the chemistry they have on the field and while it should count for something they still have several holes in the team despite having signed the most players. Despite their chemistry, it still didn't get them close to winning a title like Cavalry FC (albeit in a stronger league - but winning championships does great for one's confidence, especially when stepping up a level) and yah now I'm just talking out my %$% but I just don't see it. Does anyone else?

7) York 9 FC - I originally had them a lot higher but I haven't been too impressed by their recent signings (or lack there of) and I just don't see that much leadership on the field required to be successful in the inaugral professional season for many of its players .

 Nevertheless, I don't think there is much of a gap between the bottom and top team in this league as there are in other leagues, which makes these Power Rankings all the more difficult ... and interesting!

Edited March 6, 2019 by Senorpopps

[Copes]

1 hour ago, Senorpopps said:

I feel that given almost a month's worth of quality signings (especially relative to the previous ones), this thread deserves a rebirth. Here are my current predictions:

1) Pacific FC - 3 biggest names in the league push them to the top. Issey, Haber and De Jong provide unrivalled quality and leadership from back to front!

2) Valour FC - Great diversity, especially with the international signings, push them to 2nd. A forlan signing would have them as near guaranteed 1st unless Pacific FC keep pulling rabbits out of the hat

3) Forge FC - Found a quality GK in Roberts with the rest of their signings fitting the quality seen with Bobby's earlier signings. Lack of big names keep them away from top spot .

4) Cavalry FC - Hard to choose at this point but I like how Wheeldon built his foundation on chemistry from Foothills and then has carefully selected his next signings.

5) HFX FC - Less proven chemistry than Cavalry and no apparent "threat" up front; However, strong leadership from the Trinidadian group and an experienced coach could prove me wrong in this assessment 

6) FC Edmonton - I see the chemistry they have on the field and while it should count for something they still have several holes in the team despite having signed the most players. Despite their chemistry, it still didn't get them close to winning a title like Cavalry FC (albeit in a stronger league - but winning championships does great for one's confidence, especially when stepping up a level) and yah now I'm just talking out my %$% but I just don't see it. Does anyone else

7) York 9 FC - I originally had them a lot higher but I haven't been too impressed by their recent signings (or lack there of) and I just don't see that much leadership on the field required to be successful in the inaugral professional season for many of its players .

 Nevertheless, I don't think there is much of a gap between the bottom and top team in this league as there are in other leagues, which makes these Power Rankings all the more difficult ... and interesting!

Your rankings are very similar to mine. Looking at my last batch of rankings on February 1st, a lot has changed. 

For me:

1. Pacific FC
2. Forge FC
3. Valour FC
4. HFX Wanderers FC
5. Cavalry FC
6. FC Edmonton
7. York 9 FC

I'm not ready to put Valour ahead of Forge - although if they grab Forlan they jump to number 1 I think. I rate Halifax ahead of Calgary. I'm admittedly biased as a Wanderers fan, and one of my closest buddies being in Calgary, but I just think the Wanderers have more upside. A lot of unknowns, for sure. However, also the best coach in the league who has experience working with a large number of players on the team through his work with Canada and T&T. I thin hart pushed HFX ahead. I also disagree that there is no threat upfront - our attacking midfielder and striker have proven history playing (and scoring) together in Peru. I'm pretty stoked for them. I'm in agreement with you on the bottom two. Looking at Edmonton's 20 players, there are maybe 1 or 2 that excite me. As for York... I don't know. It's a combination of underwhelming signings after a couple of decent initial ones, and seemingly underwhelming team news and support. I also think that a lot of the talent I thought they'd get is going to Hamilton instead, I'm sad to say. 

 

[Initial B]

York 9 is Brennan's vanity project. Those never end well.

[matty]

1. forge 

2. pfc

3. york9

4. valour

5. hfx

6. fce

7. cavs

also to note i think most teams have had stronger non star signings than pfc. if those teams start introducing stars which i think they will in coming weeks pfc's top 2 ranking will fall unless they cast a wider depth net than they have been. sure hope pfc didn't blow their wad otherwise one or two injuries are they could outright be fucked.

Edited March 6, 2019 by matty

[ted]

On 3/6/2019 at 9:41 AM, matty said:

1. forge 

2. pfc

Forge?!?!  

[matty]

41 minutes ago, ted said:

Forge?!?!  

i wonnder how pfc will do if de jong gets hurt?

[Ansem]

My non scientific impressions so far

Pacific - Most experienced, most firepower, great leadership, Strong at every position. Will have to see what the keepers are made off. Need more signings for depth and coaching is a question mark but too talented for that to hold that team back. 

Prediction:

2019 CPL champions

wins Spring season

Will advance to face Vancouver Whitecaps. Equipped to upset them although not the favorites

 

Valour - Most Balanced team in my opinion with better coaching experience. If it wasn't for Issey, De Jong and Haber, Valour would be ahead

Prediction:

Wins the fall season

Represents Canada for the 2018 CONCACAF League

lose to Pacific in CPL Championship Final

They smack Ottawa Fury senseless

Gives TFC a challenge but are defeated.

 

Forge - Their strength is obviously Midfield. Best in the league on paper. Potentially best keeper. Great coaching with a proven track record a getting guys to the next level. Defense looks good and depth is on a good track. They seriously need to address offence though. With that midfield, it's worth spending more to find guys capable of converting opportunities from mid.

Prediction: 

2nd best record for the 2018 CONCACAF League.

 

Edmonton - This is actually a really good looking team with the latest round of signings. Experienced guys from NASL complemented by Academy players that the coach knows. I have a feeling that FCE wants to put out an NASL level team but how much the newer guys will integrate that pace will determine where this team goes. Deepest bench in the league so far.

Prediction

They win the Al Classico on aggregate 

They advance in the Voyageurs Cup to face Montreal Impact by defeating York 9.

They are defeated by Montreal

 

Halifax - Advantage in coaching, most likely one to put a strong team together faster than the rest despite flaws. Great signings to complement the defense mentality and transitioning it into a team capable of punishing you on the counterattack. Lots of unproven guys though on the pitch and bench...

Prediction:

Defeats Vaughan Azzuri decisively

Lose to Valour the following round

 

York 9 - So coaching...of course. Don't know if Brennan is the right guy to put a good team on paper together so they go out there and perform. I think they underperformed as they should be higher on paper. That being said, they have good players at all positions but nothing truly stands out for me. They will be a strong attacking team with a very capable midfield and decent defence. They need a STRONG signing/ leader/difference maker to push them higher. On paper they can "as is" but not convinced that's what will happen on the pitch.

Prediction:

Defeats AS Blainville who will flirt with the upset.

 

Calgary - Their are banking on chemistry and building from their PDL run / academy. That's great. They have interesting piece at all positions but not to the extand of clubs above them. How well that chemistry works by integrating PDL players with the stronger pieces will be key at exceeding expectation. Wheeldon knows exactly what he has so he could figure out a way to make it work but this will be a much harder challenge than last time. The bench is thin so I'm expecting inconsistencies... moments of brilliance and bad performances. Great keeper

Edited March 7, 2019 by Ansem

[Unnamed Trialist]

@matty is right about injuries, if you have more premium players and that means your non-starters are notably weaker, then you could suffer. It is a risk.

I voted PFC then Forge, and think it is still like that. Which is why I insist: these teams have to be in must-win mode in the early part of the season, esp at home. Both have to be thinking that they have to take a real shot at winning the Spring season by July 1. No other team has that kind of pressure based on signings. As PFC can be training outdoors now and have that advantage (including on the pitch at Westhills within a few weeks I'd say), and rivals have a tough travel to get there,  that strengthens their argument for the Apertura.

[Ams1984]

I’m now thinking it’s something like this:

Figthing for 1st will be:

Forge, PFC, and wait for it... York 9FC! 

Reasoning;

Forge- has a good looking mid. Midfield wins games IMO. They’ve got a good off-field setup, and a nice stadium to boot. I think they’ve also got solid fan buy-in, and buzz and support matter psychologically to a squad. 

PFC- IF, and it’s an “if” ladies and gentlemen... if they can avoid injuries to their big three players, and if those players actually commit wholeheartedly to the project, they’ll be a team capable of beating anyone in the league. That being said, I think they’re below Forge in terms of probabilities because Forge has a better overall roster IMO. 

York 9FC- Full disclosure, I’m biased, I’m a SSH... that being said, I legitimately feel that they could be a contender. Telfer and Porter will be among the better wingers in the league. Aparicio is an underrated young midfielder with good experience. Di Chiara is another guy who never quite panned out but who is used to high level stuff and could spark his career back to life here. Gasparotto is yet another in the same vein. Also, as much shit as Brennan gets, the man knows soccer. He’s played at the highest level, and he is a qualified (albeit inexperienced) manager. I’m also confident that one or two of the others in the squad could surprise us in a good way. 

Underperformer - FC Edmonton. 

Reasoning: the Eddies should be competing to win the league right? They’re an existing club, several of their players already have chemistry. That being said, they were pretty garbage in the NASL and I think that the CPL will be at least as good as the NASL was. They’ve also got potentially more pressure on them because their existing fan base could have expectation based on the fact that the Eddies aren’t a new club... they should be able to beat these untested groups of strangers right? If true, that might put undue pressure on the Eddies.

And I agree that Calgary may well struggle. Their roster seems subpar compared to the rest. 

I don’t know what to think about Winnipeg, I’m still not sure where they’ll end up compared to the rest. 

Dark Horse? Maybe Halifax. They’ve got a good coach, and like Hamilton there seems to be great fan buy-in. They’ve also got a few tittelating sounding foreign players that I just don’t know enough about to know if they’re any good. They sound like they might be though.