CPL General

[matty]

Anyways back to the real talk, cpl detectives In Calgary find out what's going on there cause we've got Hamilton and Winnipeg, Halifax looks a lock, Edmonton is being forced aboard and the pressure is on Ottawa. There is only one city left fr that power point

[BringBackTheBlizzard]

Would be kind of ironic if the only stumbling block for a July 2018 launch wound up being Hamilton and the stadium ligation issue in a do they actually ever want to do more than just talk about it sort of way. If it were to be all systems go for next year with Edmonton, Winnipeg, Hamilton, Ottawa and Halifax, the only credible stadiums on that timeline where no permanent fieldturf gridiron markings would get in the way are McMahon in Calgary (think the markings are non-permanent anyway?), the OSA Soccer Centre in Vaughan, Moncton Stadium and King George V Park in St John's. Suspect you would probably get a GTA franchise if the Stampeders are steering clear for some reason as there is usually somebody in the Toronto area willing to pump money into something like this and the rental terms would probably be a lot more reasonable.

From what I am seeing elsewhere the NASL have two weeks to prove they have 12 teams in place for 2018:

as that's likely where they fell short, so it's not definitively all over for them at that level yet.

[TFC2017]

What are the odds on a Vaughan team right now? Sooner or later? Or not at all? 

[Rheo]

12 hours ago, dyslexic nam said:

I saw the NASL article, thought it would be interesting in terms of FCED to CPL, and of course you keeners have ripped to shreds of minutia.  I should have known lol

We collectively have too much time on our hands lol

[BringBackTheBlizzard]

I claim no inside knowledge but a GTA team has been rumoured on this for a long time.

[grande]

I was really hoping we'd get a flood of info after the initial official announcement, but we're still basically where we were months ago...

[BringBackTheBlizzard]

The announcement was probably more about keeping Victor Montagliani happy than anything else given a domestic pro league was very much his cause celebre and it was his last day as CSA president.

[Rheo]

11 minutes ago, grande said:

I was really hoping we'd get a flood of info after the initial official announcement, but we're still basically where we were months ago...

I wouldn't say that.  Definitely nothing concrete but lots of little nuggets whether concrete things like Halifax and Sask. or more general league philosophies (ie-Beirne dropping things like the possibility of pro/rel down the line and other things I can't think of because I haven't had coffee yet)  Not enough for what us CPL starved hardcores want but still quite a bit.

But with the circumstantial info out there (Beirne speaking at Footy Talks in Toronto soon, Rollins mentioned a magazine article he's writing on the league and interviewed Beirne) I suspect something substantial will be coming in the not too distant future.  That being said I am the eternal optimist and often wrong lol. 

[ironcub14]

Not sure why you keep mentioning the OSA Soccer Centre, did I miss something from Beirne about that? I don't think I've seen anybody else talk about that dump of a "stadium" except for you BBTB  

The OSA Soccer Centre would be one of the last places I would start with for CPL in the GTA. Since there seems to be very little concrete about CPL in the GTA besides the head office, I'll just leave it at that for today.

[BringBackTheBlizzard]

The OSA Soccer Centre isn't all that different from what is being planned in Halifax and there's space to do significantly more than has been done so far. It's easy to say that somewhere else in the GTA would be better until you start looking at what the other possibilities actually are. Permanently marked fieldturf and/or running tracks with no extra space left for soccer are involved at the smaller municpal and university stadiums and then you get into the question of how easy it would be to cohabit with MLSE at Lamport or BMO Field.

Edited September 6, 2017 by BringBackTheBlizzard

[ironcub14]

1 minute ago, BringBackTheBlizzard said:

The OSA Soccer Centre isn't all that different from what is being planned in Halifax. It's easy to say that somewhere else in the GTA would be better until you start looking at what the other possibilities actually are. Permanently marked fieldturf and/or running tracks with no extra space left for soccer are involved at the smaller municpal and university stadiums and then you get into the question of how easy it would be to cohabit with MLSE at Lamport or BMO Field.

Yep, I hear you on all that, the pop-up lookalike, the lack of good existing options in Toronto/GTA at the moment, TFCII, etc. I know we've talked about all the various stadium options in the Toronto thread many times already.

But can we also agree that there hasn't been much anything concrete from Beirne or anybody in CPL about anything happening for CPL at the OSA Soccer Centre, correct? That when you mention it, it's mostly your preference that's dictating what you're listing in your posts for potential CPL sites at the moment.

We can take this to the Toronto thread, but the OSA Soccer Centre is far down on my list for any potential Toronto/GTA sites at the moment for a number of reasons. You can list it if you like, but I don't think many people will be on board with that site at the moment.

[BringBackTheBlizzard]

The context I mention it is that if there is going to be a July 2018 launch as is being speculated they have very few viable options beyond the five obvious ones because of the extremely tight timeline and PB has been adamant in recent times about needing six with two more in the pipeline from what I have heard. Anything that involves building something that doesn't have permission close to being sorted out like Halifax falls away. I suspect it's a lot easier to deal with the OSA as a potential landlord at very short notice than it would be with a local city council or a university.

[ironcub14]

14 minutes ago, BringBackTheBlizzard said:

The context I mention it is that if there is going to be a July 2018 launch as is being speculated they have very few viable options beyond the five obvious ones because of the extremely tight timeline and PB has been adamant in recent times about needing six with two more in the pipeline from what I have heard. Anything that involves building something that doesn't have permission close to being sorted out like Halifax falls away. I suspect it's a lot easier to deal with the OSA as a potential landlord at very short notice than it would be with a local city council or a university.

Got ya, that's understandable in the context of how to plan for a July 2018 launch.

Though if it requires OSA Soccer Centre or a stadium of a similar vibe and location in the GTA, plus all the other stuff going on discussed upthread, that to me just bolsters the argument of a 2019 launch over a 2018 launch.

[matty]

I think BBTB is fairly safe thinking OSC for a few reasons.
1. There's some strong evidence the first GTA team will not be in Toronto proper.
2. Both Vaughn and Mississauga have been mentioned as possible sites for the Toronto team before by credible CPL sources
3. Between the two cities OSC is the only venue right now that could be used for CPL with minor renos realistically
4. As Toronto wasn't listed as a launch city. The renos could be done over the first season
5. You're not dealing with a city or outside party, you're dealing with the OSA who likely see eye to eye with the CSA on this project
6. TFC left town

Edited September 6, 2017 by matty

[ironcub14]

24 minutes ago, matty said:

I think BBTB is fairly safe thinking OSC for a few reasons.
1. There's some strong evidence the first GTA team will not be in Toronto proper.
2. Both Vaughn and Mississauga have been mentioned as possible sites for the Toronto team before by credible CPL sources
3. Between the two cities OSC is the only venue right now that could be used for CPL with minor renos realistically
4. As Toronto wasn't listed as a launch city. The renos could be done over the first season
5. You're not dealing with a city or outside party, you're dealing with the OSA who likely see eye to eye with the CSA on this project
6. TFC left town

Interesting that you'd say that haha. I'll leave that as is.

I think the OSC would only be feasible with an absolute ton of add-ons and renos, and some ownership group that's willing to hype up the Vaughan crowd to something at the level of Sauga or greater.

As a TFCII SSH and a Toronto resident, I personally hate the current OSC's facility and location, either for TFCII or CPL. But I'll see what time tells.

[matty]

Just now, ironcub14 said:

Interesting that you'd say that haha. I'll leave that as is.

I think the OSC would only be feasible with an absolute ton of add-ons and renos, and some ownership group that's willing to hype up the Vaughan crowd to something at the level of Sauga or greater.

I don't think the add-ons are all that radical (1500 more seats, some concessions, some bathrooms). It'd be a shithole but then again it's likely the nicest shithole of anyone of the GTA stadiums the CPL could possibly use.

BTW what is Saugua level? Does Sauga have a level I have not heard about?

3 minutes ago, ironcub14 said:

As a TFCII SSH and a Toronto resident, I personally hate the current OSC's facility and location, either for TFCII or CPL. But I'll see what time tells.

I fully agree. It's a terrible location (I've biked there a few times and it is not fun). I'm curious if there's going to be a new bus route that runs near it with all the new subway stops going in not overly far from it.

[Initial B]

With all the brouhaha going on down south, I could see FCE staying NASL (D3 or bust!) for their spring season, then switching to CPL for the summer, assuming they start in 2018. If the Fury stayed in USL for another year, but declared that they'd be moving to the CPL after 2018, that could help build momentum for the new league to make it enticing for new teams.

 

So 2018: Hamilton, Winnipeg, FCE, Halifax, Burnaby, Mississauga (6 teams)

 

In 2019: the above plus Ottawa Fury, Saskatchewan, K-W, Calgary (10 teams)

 

In the near Future: The above plus a combination of any of Vaughan, Toronto (@ Lamport), London, Quebec City, Laval (Montreal), Saskatchewan II, Victoria, Kelowna, Moncton, St. John's? (16 teams?)

 

By 2030: Two 10-team East/West Conferences with a 28 game season?

 

Beyond: 10 team single table first division with Pro-Rel between two East/West 10+ team second divisions with a 28 game season?

[matty]

1 minute ago, Initial B said:

With all the brouhaha going on down south, I could see FCE staying NASL (D3 or bust!) for their spring season, then switching to CPL for the summer, assuming they start in 2018. If the Fury stayed in USL for another year, but declared that they'd be moving to the CPL after 2018, that could help build momentum for the new league to make it enticing for new teams.

 

So 2018: Hamilton, Winnipeg, FCE, Halifax, Burnaby, Mississauga (6 teams)

 

In 2019: the above plus Ottawa Fury, Saskatchewan, K-W, Calgary (10 teams)

 

In the near Future: The above plus a combination of any of Vaughan, Toronto (@ Lamport), London, Quebec City, Laval (Montreal), Saskatchewan II, Victoria, Kelowna, Moncton, St. John's? (16 teams?)

 

By 2030: Two 10-team East/West Conferences with a 28 game season?

 

Beyond: 10 team single table first division with Pro-Rel between two East/West 10+ team second divisions with a 28 game season?

This is the most wishful thinking I've seen here yet as Mississauga has no stadium and Burnaby currently has zero buzz around it.

[BringBackTheBlizzard]

He does have a point about Swangard being another that could potentially be used quickly and there may not have been a buzz about Burnaby, but there has about the Fraser Valley. TSS Rovers have said they are not a factor as far as I remember, but would they have exclusivity there? Doubt it somehow when it is PDL that is involved.

[matty]

4 minutes ago, BringBackTheBlizzard said:

He does have a point about Swangard being another that could potentially be used quickly and there may not have been a buzz about Burnaby, but there has about the Fraser Valley. TSS Rovers have said they are not a factor as far as I remember, but would they have exclusivity there? Doubt it somehow when it is PDL that is involved.

I don't believe they do but you still need someone willing to pay to a team there. It seems like a down the road team, much like Montreal, as you're competing with MLS and, unlike Toronto, it's not essential to the league's image to be there.

[Gopherbashi]

I've always been intrigued by this site that they're building in Vaughan - it's supposed to open over the next couple of years and have a fair amount of seating at the main soccer pitch.  Closer to the central part of Vaughan than the OSC and may front onto some medium-density commercial so it wouldn't feel as complex-y as the OSC.

To be clear - I have no reason to think that this is being built with the CPL in mind, and the very upper limit I've heard on that seating is 1-2 thousand.  The plans as they presently stand would not be in line with what the CPL needs.  However, if they're looking for somewhere in Vaughan where they can engineer something CPL-worthy from the get-go and can find some support on city council, the location alone would make it something to look at.

[Futballer]

2 hours ago, Initial B said:

 

So 2018: Hamilton, Winnipeg, FCE, Halifax, Burnaby, Mississauga (6 teams)

 

In 2019: the above plus Ottawa Fury, Saskatchewan, K-W, Calgary (10 teams)

 

In the near Future: The above plus a combination of any of Vaughan, Toronto (@ Lamport), London, Quebec City, Laval (Montreal), Saskatchewan II, Victoria, Kelowna, Moncton, St. John's? (16 teams?)

 

1. Hamilton Steelers FC

2. Winnipeg  FC

3. Edmonton  (new Investor)  (11.  Plus FC Edmonton ( Fath Group)

4. Calgary  (New Group)

5. Quebec FC 

6. AC Moncton 

7. Halifax FC

8. Toronto  ( Not in Vaughan ) 

9. Ottawa Fury  

!0. Saskatchewan

12. GTA  TEam TBA   Prospect Kitchener, Sauga, Brampton, Markham .

The CPL will begin play with 12 teams, as the C.S.A  sanctioned a business plan with twelve teams as that will make the CPL financially viable.  

 

 

[Red Renaissance]

1 hour ago, Gopherbashi said:

I've always been intrigued by this site that they're building in Vaughan - it's supposed to open over the next couple of years and have a fair amount of seating at the main soccer pitch.  Closer to the central part of Vaughan than the OSC and may front onto some medium-density commercial so it wouldn't feel as complex-y as the OSC.

To be clear - I have no reason to think that this is being built with the CPL in mind, and the very upper limit I've heard on that seating is 1-2 thousand.  The plans as they presently stand would not be in line with what the CPL needs.  However, if they're looking for somewhere in Vaughan where they can engineer something CPL-worthy from the get-go and can find some support on city council, the location alone would make it something to look at.

Can you specify where in Vaughan this proposed stadium is? assuming close to the new downtown? any link?

Thanks

[matty]

1 hour ago, Futballer said:

The CPL will begin play with 12 teams, as the C.S.A  sanctioned a business plan with twelve teams as that will make the CPL financially viable.  

 

I don't believe you

[CDNFootballer]

20 hours ago, Dub Narcotic said:

I think that's true of most pro teams in North America, including FCE. I'm not saying FCE should be the Whitecaps affiliate in any sense (and I think it's pretty darn likely they will be in the CPL sooner rather than later) but why make up shit?

No its actually not true that most pro teams super inflate they're attendance but there are always some that do so like USL's RGV and the Bethlehem Steele who were mentioned.

 

NASL's FCE's attendance numbers are said to be close to the actual number of people in the stands and have done excellent this year increasing over 70% from last year.