2017 CONCACAF U-17 Championship

[Olympique_de_Marseille]

51 minutes ago, shermanator said:

To me, losing to Costa Rica at this level is expected. But losing to Cuba? That's just an embarrassing result.

Less embarrassing than at the U-20 and U-23 level where player development has more time to do its thing. Fitness, experience playing in humid conditions, strength, can all play a role; but the U17 level it's more of a toss up because none of these guys are playing regular games at a high level like at the U-20 or U23s.

[Big_M]

None of them is better than Davies, had a good laugh at that one though

[The Beaver]

Did not see the game, but is our coaching a bit naive here? Love Paul, but I suspect our single greatest downfall is coaching--across all levels--is it not?

[Ottawafan74]

2 minutes ago, Big_M said:

None of them is better than Davies, had a good laugh at that one though

 

David has higher upside. Much better on the ball skills and a better understanding of the game. Can play east west. Davies is more north south. 

Lots of time left in their development. 

[Dominic94]

5 minutes ago, Big_M said:

None of them is better than Davies, had a good laugh at that one though

Someone said there's a kid going to Belgium who's better than Davies ?

[Offside]

7 minutes ago, Dominic94 said:

Who's the guy who's better than Davies lol ?

Number 9 , didn't see anything that special

[Ed_S]

12 minutes ago, The Beaver said:

Did not see the game, but is our coaching a bit naive here? Love Paul, but I suspect our single greatest downfall is coaching--across all levels--is it not?

You can't coach character. Selfish slap costs us a point in 1st game. Selfish attempted dribble out of the back costs us a result today.

[Levi Oakey]

6 minutes ago, Ed_S said:

You can't coach character. Selfish slap costs us a point in 1st game. Selfish attempted dribble out of the back costs us a result today.

They are 16 years old. Can it man. Some of these kids probably read this board, some of their parents do too.

I am as disappointed in the result as any thing but telling a bunch of u17s they are shit won't do anything.

[Ottawafan74]

27 minutes ago, Offside said:

What else is new , it's a joke most of these kids have been in tfc academy for years and on nation youth team and they lose to Cuba 

TFC moves kids in and out of their program all the time. I wonder how many of the current group of 2000 kids have been with their program more than two years. 

TFC doesn't really go out and beat the bushes to see kids. Just cherry pick them out of the OSA provincial program. Impact hold an open try out over three days for 500 kids at $70 a pop. How serious do you take evaluation if you don't really know the kids coming?  What can you see from 500 kids over a 3 day period?  Sounds more like a straight cash grab. 

Vancouver at least makes the effort to get out there and look at kids. But they are very cautious in their selections for the residency. Davies had to go for 3 evaluations before they selected him. 

[Ivan]

Wow.  Seems we cannot be Cuba in the youth championships.  How many U20 and U17 losses in a row to them is that now?  Didn't see any of this one so can't comment, but this is shocking after a pretty good display against CR.

[1996]

2 hours ago, Ottawafan74 said:

TFC moves kids in and out of their program all the time. I wonder how many of the current group of 2000 kids have been with their program more than two years. 

TFC doesn't really go out and beat the bushes to see kids. Just cherry pick them out of the OSA provincial program. Impact hold an open try out over three days for 500 kids at $70 a pop. How serious do you take evaluation if you don't really know the kids coming?  What can you see from 500 kids over a 3 day period?  Sounds more like a straight cash grab. 

Vancouver at least makes the effort to get out there and look at kids. But they are very cautious in their selections for the residency. Davies had to go for 3 evaluations before they selected him. 

You nailed it my friend , you know that word scouting it's fucken non existent with TFC Academy and the provincial teams and even the youth national teams, these academies and even the CSA need to pay some scouts to scout players instead of paying these coaches that are producing fucken nothing , get off your fat asses and go out there and scout players, don't just wait to see who fucken shows up!

[1996]

We have all these coaches in Canada now who are payed good money, we have youth clubs who have technical directors making six figure salaries , we have all these different academies be it MLS or private ones and still we can't produce shit, parents spending a shit load of money that goes to pay the salaries of coaches at youth clubs and private academies but still we can't even qualify for any of these age group World Cups, we still are no better off from the days where every coach was a volunteer, something is terribly wrong here and I don't know what the answer is right now, all I know is that there are a lot of people making money off of kids playing youth soccer but yet are producing nothing diddly squat!

[Kent]

I remember back in 2012 after that soul crushing day, I thought we wouldn't make it to the 2018 World Cup (correct), but I thought that the MLS academies were going to usher in a new era and we would have a good chance to make it to 2022 World Cup. The youth results since then aren't exactly reinforcing that prediction.

[1996]

2 minutes ago, Kent said:

I remember back in 2012 after that soul crushing day, I thought we wouldn't make it to the 2018 World Cup (correct), but I thought that the MLS academies were going to usher in a new era and we would have a good chance to make it to 2022 World Cup. The youth results since then aren't exactly reinforcing that prediction.

Let's not make this a MLS Academy thing my friend, yes they have are a lot at fault as well as you can see in my previous post, but there is more to this than just that, I'm starting to think it has more to do with the majority of coaches coaching our kids that are only in it to make a quick buck and run, like I said before we have all these coaches that are now getting paid to coach in youth clubs and all these academies , but have we started to produce anymore players than when most coaches were volunteers actually it seems that our results have been worse since all these payed coaches and club youth technical directors came into being.

[Kent]

8 minutes ago, 1996 said:

Let's not make this a MLS Academy thing my friend, yes they have are a lot at fault as well as you can see in my previous post, but there is more to this than just that, I'm starting to think it has more to do with the majority of coaches coaching our kids that are only in it to make a quick buck and run, like I said before we have all these coaches that are now getting paid to coach in youth clubs and all these academies , but have we started to produce anymore players than when most coaches were volunteers actually it seems that our results have been worse since all these payed coaches and club youth technical directors came into being.

Yeah, I didn't mean to exclusively blame the academies. I was just trying to say it was foolish to think they would solve all our problems.

We still have a fractured youth system, and people at all levels pulling in opposite directions, and the MLS clubs haven't been able to yield game changing players. Fingers crossed on the latest hopefuls (Davies, Tabla, Jackson-Havel, Hamilton), and we have seemingly made progress in other areas. PLSQ and L1O being the main ones I am aware of, and hopefully before too long CPL will be able to do it's part too.

[JDub]

3 hours ago, Levi Oakey said:

They are 16 years old. Can it man. Some of these kids probably read this board, some of their parents do too.

I am as disappointed in the result as any thing but telling a bunch of u17s they are shit won't do anything.

Unless I missed something I didn't read anything where Ed_S said they were shit.  He said selfish.  I can't say anything about the dribble he is talking about as I did not see the game today but the slap.....   Yes they are 16 but they are playing on a national team.  Clearly they have done something right to get to this point and the slap(or love tap) is selfish.   He let his team down.  Never do you make a motion like that towards an apposing player.  NEVER.  Especially against a concacaf opponent who we all know will do exactly what he did and roll around like he was sucker punched. At 16 playing on a national team this shouldn't be something still being taught to these kids.  Saying that, it is a massive learning experience for the kid and I am sure he won't do it again.   

[Stryker911]

Hopefully De Vos can start making some significant improvements.

[Offside]

First of all I think it's time to clean up some of the coaches at tfc that have been there for a few years not sure about the other coaches at impact or whitecaps, but tfc coaches a lot of politics and the players they choose that are friends with the parents, and also the mentally that tfc had but cutting a lot of players because they were small and not physical and relying on the bigger fast stronger kids , well haven't seen tfc teams doing great at the tournaments they enter. A lot of these kids have been together for 4-5 years. It's upsetting seeing the same kids picked to these camps or tournaments 

[Dominic94]

Am I alone in not being worried ? I don't care if you're good at 17, I want you to be at 22-23, that's what matter most.

 

there are a handful of 16 year olds in the world who can play pro now, and fewer for thier NT (Davies). Fuck the U-17, let's worry about the actual World Cup.

i watched a bit of this game and saw that our players were technically superior to Cuba's, to me that's the most important thing. They'll learn how to get results, and they'll grow up, but those tech skills, that previous generations didn't have, can't teach that at 20. 

Do we have work to do ? Yes, a lot. However work has been done, and there is hope and there's good players coming. 

[Northvansteve]

This is the worst performance I've seen from a Canadian youth team in a long time. By the end of the game, they were just kicking the ball down the field hoping the Cuban defenders would misplay it. Earlier, it was just a futile series of dribbles into groups of Cuban defenders. Absolutely no sign of team work or confidence in the attack. What a mess.

[Soccerpro]

Don't people remember last cycle where our game plan was boot it up to Tabla and hope he creates something on his own?

 

[One American]

I wouldn't be too worried because they aren't choosing Sigma kids, who always turn out the best.

[Romeo22]

1 hour ago, One American said:

I wouldn't be too worried because they aren't choosing Sigma kids, who always turn out the best.

About time they start. Something has to change

[Ottawafan74]

14 hours ago, 1996 said:

You nailed it my friend , you know that word scouting it's fucken non existent with TFC Academy and the provincial teams and even the youth national teams, these academies and even the CSA need to pay some scouts to scout players instead of paying these coaches that are producing fucken nothing , get off your fat asses and go out there and scout players, don't just wait to see who fucken shows up!

It's a system that isn't set up to succeed. The way things are done, it's like people in positions of power ( coaches/administrators ) are going thru the motions to maintain their positions, to not rock the boat  

OPDL was set up to help identify the kids. Yet the provincial coaches spend very little time evaluating players throughout the summer. How can you properly ascertain if a player would succeed at the next level?  Based on a few small sized scrimmages and training sessions?

The CSA won't take a look at players unless they are part of the provincial stream/academies. They don't want to disrupt the relationships with these other entities. As an example, Ottawa has two top flight teams at the 2000 age level. Last year 2 players for the Fury youth squad were brought into a national ID camp. Neither kid would have started for those two local clubs. How is that possible? Did the CSA not scout them?  Or if they did, what does that say about the coaches who decided to invite them?

There are many problems that need to be addressed. But getting someone from the CSA or a former player, Jason De Vos, is a waste of time. They will look to keep their "friends" happy. 

[Offside]

all I know is that parents spend thousands and thousands on their kids in soccer here and because of politics alot kids don't get anywhere here.