Stefan Mitrovic

[rydermike]

45 minutes ago, P-O said:

Isn't what we are trying to do with Kolosho?

 

Well, we'll see if we actually cap tie him. My gut feeling is Herdman invited Kolosho to camp, promising he wouldn't try to play him. Flores and Sali got called up, played as a late sub, then not back in the squad.

[WestHamCanadianinOxford]

2 minutes ago, rydermike said:

Well, we'll see if we actually cap tie him. My gut feeling is Herdman invited Kolosho to camp, promising he wouldn't try to play him. Flores and Sali got called up, played as a late sub, then not back in the squad.

As per your helpful understanding of the FIFA rules, we can't cap-tie Kolosho until the World Cup.  And then it would be for good, correct?

As far as the original comment, let's see what they do with Mitrovic.

We brought Corbeanu on for 13' up 4-1 to Bermuda for his first cap.  

[rydermike]

14 minutes ago, WestHamCanadianinOxford said:

As per your helpful understanding of the FIFA rules, we can't cap-tie Kolosho until the World Cup.  And then it would be for good, correct?

As far as the original comment, let's see what they do with Mitrovic.

We brought Corbeanu on for 13' up 4-1 to Bermuda for his first cap.  

Yeah, he wouldn't be officially cap tied without a non-friendly appearance. The "one-time switch" rules are a little fuzzy though. If he played in a friendly, and then wanted to play for the US at the U20 World Cup, could he come back to Canada after? The rule book I cited in the Halbouni thread kind of made that seem okay, but was super unclear and I haven't seen any precedence for another player like that before, so I think the safest thing if he is thinking about the U20 WC is not to play him for Canada at the friendly.

Corbeanu had already filed his one-time switch to join Canada by that point, so it was all good. He couldn't go back to Romania anyways. Koleosho doesn't have any caps (I'm pretty sure his US U15 caps don't count since its too young and unofficial games), which makes it a slightly different situation (more like Halbouni than Corbeanu)

Edited September 25, 2022 by rydermike

[WestHamCanadianinOxford]

25 minutes ago, rydermike said:

Yeah, he wouldn't be officially cap tied without a non-friendly appearance. The "one-time switch" rules are a little fuzzy though. If he played in a friendly, and then wanted to play for the US at the U20 World Cup, could he come back to Canada after? The rule book I cited in the Halbouni thread kind of made that seem okay, but was super unclear and I haven't seen any precedence for another player like that before, so I think the safest thing if he is thinking about the U20 WC is not to play him for Canada at the friendly.

Did Halbouni ever play for Canada at youth level?  Is that the difference?  

Edit: I thought I remember Tomori doing stuff with lower age England groups but that does not seem to be the case. 

Edited September 25, 2022 by WestHamCanadianinOxford

[WestHamCanadianinOxford]

34 minutes ago, rydermike said:

Corbeanu had already filed his one-time switch to join Canada by that point, so it was all good. He couldn't go back to Romania anyways. Koleosho doesn't have any caps (I'm pretty sure his US U15 caps don't count since its too young and unofficial games), which makes it a slightly different situation (more like Halbouni than Corbeanu)

ART. 5

18. A player is tied to a “sporting nationality” where they have:

18.1 participated in a match (in full or part); and

18.2 that match was in an official competition, regardless of age category or type of football.

 

ART. 9 CHANGE OF ASSOCIATION

1. A player may, only once, request to change the association for which he is eligible to play to the association of another country of which he holds the nationality

 

So if Koleosho doesn't have to file a switch, (your understanding on the u-15 caps) to play in a friendly for us, then playing him now has no bearing on him coming back after the u20 World Cup.  He wouldn't have to "change" until coming back to us.  

 

No idea if TSN knows more or less than we do:

From 20 September

"Suiting up for Canada in friendlies would not cap-tie Koleosho to the CanMNT going forward. A player who has appeared in a friendly for one nation can still represent another in competitive play. Things are even more lenient for a player in Koleosho's situation. A player under the age of 21 can appear in up to three competitive fixtures for one nation and still have the ability to switch national allegiance"

https://www.tsn.ca/joel-waterman-luca-koleosho-canada-world-cup-qatar-2022-canmnt-cf-montreal-espanyol-1.1851231

They don't mention the 3 year wait though. 

[rydermike]

Yeah, the super young youth caps shouldn't have an impact (Eustaquio played a young Canada game before playing for Portugal U21 then coming back to Canada. 

Not sure how FIFA would react to going from senior friendlies to another nation then back to that country. By the letter of the rule it seems okay for him to do Canada senior friendly>US youth/senior friendly>Canada senior, but fifa might not want it making a mockery of their rules. Would make sense for Koleosho not wanting to take that risk if he's truly undecided for 20 minutes of play time

 

[WestHamCanadianinOxford]

1 hour ago, rydermike said:

Yeah, the super young youth caps shouldn't have an impact (Eustaquio played a young Canada game before playing for Portugal U21 then coming back to Canada. 

Not sure how FIFA would react to going from senior friendlies to another nation then back to that country. By the letter of the rule it seems okay for him to do Canada senior friendly>US youth/senior friendly>Canada senior, but fifa might not want it making a mockery of their rules. Would make sense for Koleosho not wanting to take that risk if he's truly undecided for 20 minutes of play time

However FIFA feels, they can't do much if people are bending their rules * (whether that is what this, is another debate) but not breaking them.  And I don't think according to their wording above the age of youth cap matters, just whether they are official or not.  I would guess that AGS Cup that Eustaqiuo played in when 15 was not official but the u17 Euros qualifying games that Corbeanu playing in when 16, were.  Both were u17 level teams.  That is if both could only switch once, which I think is true. 

If all Koleosho's games for the States were friendlies, then he is not "tied to a 'sporting nationality'" and still would not be if he played unofficial (friendly) games with us.  He would be after playing for the States in u-20 World Cup but then could switch because "was fielded in a match in an official competition at any level (with the exception of “A” international level)" and was already Canadian. 

Correct?

 

Edit: * I guess with the exception of changing the rules again. They don't want "nationality shopping" in theory.

Edited September 25, 2022 by WestHamCanadianinOxford

[rydermike]

Yeah, I agree with everything you said and that's my understanding too. But like you said in the edit the risk of them changing the rules is always there. More and more players have been playing for multiple senior national teams in the past couple of years that they might want to tighten the rules more. He might not want to risk it (and I wouldn't either) 

 

Edited September 25, 2022 by rydermike

[InglewoodJack]

Looks like he didn’t even make the bench for Serbia today.

[Bigandy]

I was just looking at that. Is he still eligible for us in 3 years time? I'd love to know Ivan's thoughts if this turns out to be a cynical cap-tie. 

[Markoaleks]

2 minutes ago, Bigandy said:

I was just looking at that. Is he still eligible for us in 3 years time? I'd love to know Ivan's thoughts if this turns out to be a cynical cap-tie. 

"Turns out to be a cynical cap-tie" ?  that was the 1000%  intent and it happened - hope SM enjoys his literal moment of international football - 

[InglewoodJack]

Scored today in Europa league. 

On 9/27/2022 at 4:38 PM, Markoaleks said:

"Turns out to be a cynical cap-tie" ?  that was the 1000%  intent and it happened - hope SM enjoys his literal moment of international football - 

Lol at the amount of time we spent debating whether cynical cap ties are the way to go, only for Serbia, a far more established team to toss in some random 18 year old in a single game to basically say fuck you to Canada.

Edited October 6, 2022 by InglewoodJack

[DeRo_Is_King]

15 hours ago, InglewoodJack said:

Scored today in Europa league. 

Lol at the amount of time we spent debating whether cynical cap ties are the way to go, only for Serbia, a far more established team to toss in some random 18 year old in a single game to basically say fuck you to Canada.

Sad, but definitely felt that way. 

Btw, it was a lovely first touch, turn and strike. Great goal. 

[SoCalTransport]

17 hours ago, InglewoodJack said:

Scored today in Europa league. 

Lol at the amount of time we spent debating whether cynical cap ties are the way to go, only for Serbia, a far more established team to toss in some random 18 year old in a single game to basically say fuck you to Canada.

I do think Serbia has depth issues like Canada, so it might be a good call.  

Canada has a lot of killers in attacking positions, especially with the emergence of Kone, even if Ivan I mean Stefan moves to a bigger league, it still would be tough to crack Canada’s starting XI.

I wish the family had more loyalty to Canada. Especially being raised in Canada, and being accepted here.

[SthMelbRed]

For those who still care, he just scored a pretty good goal to level the score for Red Star in the Europa League.

[narduch]

Not really shocking news but he did not make Serbia's World Cup squad

[Stoppage Time]

5 hours ago, narduch said:

Not really shocking news but he did not make Serbia's World Cup squad

Maybe his dad will now go off on the Serbian Federation (They promised, Stef is better than _______, He played with them before, blah, blah, blah.)

Maybe The Mitrovic fellas got played. Maybe not. Anyway, so long, buster.

[InglewoodJack]

1 hour ago, Stoppage Time said:

Maybe his dad will now go off on the Serbian Federation (They promised, Stef is better than _______, He played with them before, blah, blah, blah.)

Maybe The Mitrovic fellas got played. Maybe not. Anyway, so long, buster.

He posted their 35 man roster with his son on it, said they're very deep, have a lot of great U20s, his time will come, great for the future, etc. A lot nicer than the things he said to the country that would've sent his son to the next two world cups at the very least, including one at home. Between Tomori, Mitrovic and Flores all not making the teams they turned their backs on Canada for, I hope some of our other dual nationals take notice.

[shermanator]

On 9/10/2022 at 11:19 AM, shermanator said:

Typically when a player uses Canada for leverage to suit up for the country they really want to play for, they haven't been good enough to play for that country in the first place. Hoilett wasn't good enough for England, Vitoria and Ferreira weren't good enough for Portugal, Bunbury wasn't good enough for the US, Bustos wasn't good enough for Chile, Tabla wasn't good enough for the Ivory Coast, Aird wasn't good enough for Scotland, etc. Not always the case, but at least in the 12 years I've paid attention it's the case more often than not.

Personally I'm glad Canada is not at a point right now where we have to suck off every dual national out of desperation to improve our squad. If you want to play for Canada, play for Canada. If not, that's fine we'll just make the World Cup with the players who want to be there. 

Maybe Mitrovic goes on to great things in his international career. Or maybe he has a solid club career and does nothing on the international stage. I'm not going to lose any sleep over it.

*ahem* 

[Stoppage Time]

Ivan, your Twitter said that dreams do come true. I think that the proud papa yearned for his son to play for Serbia and encouraged his son to do so. Your dream came true, almost. Stef was born and raised in Canada. It is almost funny that Stef was not called to the Serbian WC team. He had a very, very good chance with Canada to be at Qatar, but he missed out. He had almost no chance to be there with Serbia. Talent rich Serbia cap tied Stef as a hopeful investment in the future - fair enough - but he missed out playing for the country of his birth to try to play for yours. The allure of competing family cultures is strong.

We make our choices, and we all move on.

Good day to you, sir. Good luck to Stef with his professional career.

[rydermike]

On 11/12/2022 at 11:26 AM, Stoppage Time said:

Stef was born and raised in Canada. he missed out playing for the country of his birth to try to play for yours.

Technically, Stefan was born in Serbia. He was raised in Canada though, moved here when he was six months old

[Stoppage Time]

2 hours ago, rydermike said:

Technically, Stefan was born in Serbia. He was raised in Canada though, moved here when he was six months old

I stand corrected. 

[narduch]

He will probably have to transfer to a big 5 league to get further Serbia caps

[jordan]

https://arena-maxx.com/buducnost-reprezentacije-velikan-iz-portugala-zeli-igraca-crvene-zvezde/

This links him to Porto

[youllneverwalkalone]

Welp, they will need another midfielder when Eustaquio transfers to Madrid after this match.