CPL General

[Rheo]

1 hour ago, Complete Homer said:

Oh come on, clearly a joke. 

I must be on the ignore list since he posted the Vocal Minority link right under me doing it lol

[Macksam]

16 hours ago, Gopherbashi said:

Why am I liking so many of your posts these days?

He's changed his tune from "this proposed league is deluded nationalism to appease the Totera types if they don't include the USL Pro teams," to "this league will work if they scale back the proposed budgets and ambition," so he can delude himself into thinking he was right this whole time.

When another thing happens in this league that contradicts his predictions, expect some more revisionist history from his side.

Edited July 12, 2017 by Macksam

[dyslexic nam]

I suspect you just made the list.

[Macksam]

I made that list along time ago. ??

[BringBackTheBlizzard]

16 hours ago, Gopherbashi said:

Why am I liking so many of your posts these days?

Paul Beirne has provided a very clear picture of the vision of the way ahead on that podcast of a CPL with 20, 40 or 60 teams emerging based on a significantly smaller budget approach than MLS so it can work in markets like Halifax, Moncton, Kelowna and Penticton with scope for multiple teams in the larger markets eventually. That's what is actually worth discussing along with what supporters groups can do to help facilitate it.

[mpg_29]

33 minutes ago, BringBackTheBlizzard said:

Paul Beirne has provided a very clear picture of the vision of the way ahead on that podcast of a CPL with 20, 40 or 60 teams emerging based on a significantly smaller budget approach than MLS so it can work in markets like Halifax, Moncton, Kelowna and Penticton with scope for multiple teams in the larger markets eventually. That's what is actually worth discussing along with what supporters groups can do to help facilitate it.

One thing stays constant though...travel costs. Almost every team would have to bake in ~$500,000 to operating costs before salary is even considered.

Edited July 12, 2017 by mpg_29

[Complete Homer]

1 hour ago, Macksam said:

He's changed his tune from "this proposed league is deluded nationalism to appease the Totera types if they don't include the USL Pro teams" to "this league will work if they scale back the proposed budgets and ambition"

He still thinks "it's scary" to expect a city like KW to average 5000 people....

To be fair, I think there is a kernel of truth to that, I think Beirne is really emphasizing being sustainable in both small and large markets...

But you're right, the consistent portrayal of part of the picture (above post) without the other part (Beirne saying they aren't going to targeting lower tier players) to fit his narrative gets tiring, and I don't think his behaviour over the past year has earned the benefit of the doubt in terms of taking his discussion points at face value 

At the end of the day, it doesn't matter. It was more important to confront the negativity a year ago when it was the dominant narrative and stood in the way of generating the enthusiasm that would spur the creation of supporters groups, etc. I feel like that negativity has already been washed out by this point

Edited July 12, 2017 by Complete Homer

[m-g-williams]

I've had my issues with @BringBackTheBlizzard too, but there has been a fairly noticeable and positive shift which I think is great. There are still disagreements on certain issues, but that happens with every user on this forum. In that same spirit, can't we just try to be a bit more constructive and focus on the topic at hand?  I don't really see anything in the last few posts that couldn't have been included in a PM to BBTB for a private discussion.

[Complete Homer]

15 minutes ago, m-g-williams said:

I've had my issues with @BringBackTheBlizzard too, but there has been a fairly noticeable and positive shift which I think is great. There are still disagreements on certain issues, but that happens with every user on this forum. In that same spirit, can't we just try to be a bit more constructive and focus on the topic at hand?  I don't really see anything in the last few posts that couldn't have been included in a PM to BBTB for a private discussion.

Fair enough. It was more to explain the context of these exchanges to people who entered the discussion later on

But I do stand by the point that you can't expect people to take you at face value when you've spent the last year behaving in an antagonistic manner. Of course people will assume negativity and oppositional overtones

Edited July 12, 2017 by Complete Homer

[Macksam]

42 minutes ago, m-g-williams said:

I've had my issues with @BringBackTheBlizzard too, but there has been a fairly noticeable and positive shift which I think is great. There are still disagreements on certain issues, but that happens with every user on this forum. In that same spirit, can't we just try to be a bit more constructive and focus on the topic at hand?  I don't really see anything in the last few posts that couldn't have been included in a PM to BBTB for a private discussion.

PM? The guy is a one man ANTIFA, if you call him out on something or try to debate him by plugging holes in his argument, he'll ignore you.

[Rheo]

Besides if you're blocked how can you message lol

[Rheo]

Finally getting to the pod.  I'm only halfway through but really like what Beirne's saying.  Everything just seems so reasonable and measured.  Reinforces my belief that the people involved know what they are doing.

[Macksam]

I listened to part of the Podcast. One part that stuck out to me was how PB said he doesn't want to grow too fast and limit the type of markets that can get in. My interpretation is that they're fine with Hamilton and Winnipeg for example drawing a lot and bringing in a lot of revenue, but they won't let them outspend they're opponents and limit the type of cities that can get in this league. I think once they get to a stable 40 to 60 markets, they'll slowly transition to a more open market system and introduce promotion relegation.

[mpg_29]

Biggest thing I took away was he said at an avg ticket price of $25 teams would need to sell 4500-5500...

That's about double what I am expecting the average attendance to be in the first few years.. 

 

Edited July 12, 2017 by mpg_29

[Complete Homer]

1 minute ago, mpg_29 said:

Biggest thing I took away was he said at an avg ticket price of $25 teams would need to sell 4500-5500...

That's about double what I am expecting the average attendance to be in the first few years.. 

 

I believe that's what he said it needs to be sustainable, I'm not sure that necessarily implies it is necessary year 1. But I did only half listen while commuting, so I could be mistaken 

[BringBackTheBlizzard]

28 minutes ago, Rheo said:

Finally getting to the pod.  I'm only halfway through but really like what Beirne's saying.  Everything just seems so reasonable and measured.  Reinforces my belief that the people involved know what they are doing.

The stated break even is still a bit ambitious but they probably know that and are only expecting to build up to it in an FC Edmonton sort of way. PB seemed to state that was the case at one point in terms of sustainability over the first 5 to 7 years or something like that. The big thing is that they realize that there simply aren't enough large million plus markets available to shoot for the stars and compete with MLS head-to-head, so having something that PDL-sized markets like Halifax, Moncton, K/W, London (fingers crossed), Saskatoon and Victoria can reasonably aspire to is the way to go in terms of building a league that is geared towards Canadian players in an original CSL sort of way.

[GuillermoDelQuarto]

4 reel 

[rob.notenboom]

https://t.co/WFKDWsIuvx?amp=1

Article on Sask team. 

[Complete Homer]

1 hour ago, rob.notenboom said:

https://t.co/WFKDWsIuvx?amp=1

Article on Sask team. 

Holy cow...15 to 20 million dollar stadium. That's commitment. BMO was 60. Still a modular stadium, and they are not certain they would be in their own stadium for 2018

Also looks like his business partner, Grant McGlauglin is also coming from a mining/high finance background

Edited July 13, 2017 by Complete Homer

[Ansem]

The Saskatchewan franchise is planned for either Regina or Saskatoon, expected to be treated as a provincial team like the Roughriders and Rush.

 

Can't say I like the fact they view the whole province as theirs but nothing prevents:

• another group to set up shop in the next city (Regina or Saskatoon) after the success of that group
• Regina or Saskatoon could be a potential D2 team

Edited July 13, 2017 by Ansem

[rob.notenboom]

25 minutes ago, Complete Homer said:

Holy cow...15 to 20 million dollar stadium. That's commitment. BMO was 60. Still a modular stadium, and they are not certain they would be in their own stadium for 2018

Also looks like his business partner, Grant McGlauglin is also coming from a mining/high finance background

Yes, Grant's a business lawyer. Also played high school Bball with Leboldus here in Regina and then played several years with the U of R Cougar Men's Bball team. 

In terms of the stadium cost, it is a large sum of money. But juxtaposed against the $280 million stadium just across downtown from me, 15-20mil seems very cost effective.

[Complete Homer]

Just now, rob.notenboom said:

Yes, Grant's a business lawyer. Also played high school Bball with Leboldus here in Regina and then played several years with the U of R Cougar Men's Bball team. 

In terms of the stadium cost, it is a large sum of money. But juxtaposed against the $280 million stadium just across downtown from me, 15-20mil seems very cost effective.

Have to think they are looking for public money? It's not abundantly clear how much this ownership group is worth, but a cursory look makes me think that 20 million out of pocket is beyond their reach...

[rob.notenboom]

Just now, Complete Homer said:

Have to think they are looking for public money? It's not abundantly clear how much this ownership group is worth, but a cursory look makes me think that 20 million out of pocket is beyond their reach...

I don't think they are looking for public money.

[Complete Homer]

Just now, rob.notenboom said:

I don't think they are looking for public money.

That would be impressive...big boost to my perception of the team's financial backing if they can do that

[Macksam]

8 hours ago, BringBackTheBlizzard said:

The stated break even is still a bit ambitious but they probably know that and are only expecting to build up to it in an FC Edmonton sort of way. PB seemed to state that was the case at one point in terms of sustainability over the first 5 to 7 years or something like that. The big thing is that they realize that there simply aren't enough large million plus markets available to shoot for the stars and compete with MLS head-to-head, so having something that PDL-sized markets like Halifax, Moncton, K/W, London (fingers crossed), Saskatoon and Victoria can reasonably aspire to is the way to go in terms of building a league that is geared towards Canadian players in an original CSL sort of way.

You interpreting things that way is no big thing. I didn't hear anywhere in that video about competing with MLS or not. It's just a narrative you've conjured up in your own head. In fact, the only direct evidence we have of someone from the league relating themselves to MLS is John Mcgrane stating that within time, the Hamilton CPL club will be on par, if not better than TFC.

http://www.chch.com/professional-soccer-comes-hamilton/

It's clear that within time, some clubs in this league, most likely the bigger markets, will have ambitions of drawing crowds similar to those in the MLS cities. 

Also, four cities you mention, KW, London, Saskatoon and Halifax have been rumoured in the past for flirting with the idea of CFL franchises. These cities, while they would be considered PDL markets in a US context, they are very much significant markets for us that have the potential to garner major league support.

Anyhow, this is why people here, me especially, get annoyed with you. Despite your new found "support" for the league, you're still trying your hardest to push a narrative that makes this league subservient to MLS using evidence that's a stretch at best. Despite fooling others into thinking otherwise, your tune IMO hasn't changed and you still have a strange anti-CPL agenda.

Could someone, who he hasn't ignored, please quote this message so he can see. Although I'm sure he looks at my messages regardless, let's make sure he sees this.

Edited July 13, 2017 by Macksam