Concacafs North America Leagues Cup

[Shway]

In reading an excerpt from the release of the League’s Cup 2023 iteration….

[quote]– Major League Soccer (MLS) and LIGA MX, with the support of Concacaf, announced today important competition details, including dates, format and hosting process for the inaugural edition of the historic and highly-anticipated Leagues Cup 2023.

In a monumental new chapter for North American soccer, beginning in 2023, MLS and LIGA MX will pause their respective league seasons each summer and all 47 first division clubs in Canada, Mexico and the United States will compete in the World Cup-style tournament. [/quote]

Sooo the CPL isn’t considered first division in Canada or what?

I strongly think they should be included in this tournament. It would be massive , and I feel since this has Concacafs blessing….more opportunities should’ve been given considering the new CCL format.

[SpursFlu]

I dont know it's possible for this tournament to co exist with the Concacaf Champions league

Somethings up

[Ansem]

1 hour ago, SpursFlu said:

I dont know it's possible for this tournament to co exist with the Concacaf Champions league

Somethings up

The League Cup will serve as CCL qualification.

[Ansem]

1 hour ago, Shway said:

Sooo the CPL isn’t considered first division in Canada or what?

MLS has no interest in giving CPL any clout and it's mostly MLS in control of that cup with CONCACAF sanctioning it most like so they stop talking about a merger/super league

[Ozzie_the_parrot]

The initial plan from CONCACAF for a North American qualifying competition had CanPL clubs involved in a group stage format AFAIR. Direct entry into the CCL for at least two CanPL clubs each season seems to have been the quid pro quo for not being in the Leagues Cup and missing out on the associated revenue streams.

Given that means no CONCACAF games during the regular season in future and playing against very strong  opponents in a two leg knockout format in late February when CanPL rosters are depleted and home games in many cities would be highly problematic that was a bit of a raw deal from a CanPL standpoint.

Edited October 7, 2022 by Ozzie_the_parrot

[narduch]

Even with CCL spots up for grabs the Leagues Cup is stupid and convoluted. 

MLS fans should be offended by it.

Wondering what happens when the novelty wears out.

[Shway]

3 hours ago, narduch said:

Wondering what happens when the novelty wears out.

…Or when 2026 comes around and the tournament is played during the same time as the World Cup.

[narduch]

Just now, Shway said:

…Or when 2026 comes around and the tournament is played during the same time as the World Cup.

Thought about that too.

There's a Gold Cup next year from June 26 to July 16. So you can bet MLS will need to play through that.

And I'm guessing this will require more mid-week MLS games to fit it into the schedule.

It is possible to over-saturate the market too.

[RJB]

I'm guessing the Leagues Cup will be played all in the USA?

[Ozzie_the_parrot]

No games in Mexico certainly. Haven't seen anything to suggest there will be no games in Canada

[Unnamed Trialist]

This is the Concacaf SuperLeague. It serves no other purpose than a SuperLeague, reinforce the strong and deny other clubs the chance to compete openly and freely with other major clubs. 

Funny how guys who just crap on the SuperLeague in the European context and write it off, are here so enthusiastic, or interested, or become profoundly skilled commentators on the thing. Seems contradictory. 

The whole point, in my opinion, should be to find a way to encourage those leagues close to MLS and Liga MX, or those clubs who have proven able to compete with them, to rise in quality and continue to seek ways to match them. Without being naive about it, but a level playing field.

The whole deal seems lame to me, as with so much of what Concacaf does (Gold Cup, discredited in so many ways).

[Unnamed Trialist]

3 hours ago, Ozzie_the_parrot said:

No games in Mexico certainly. Haven't seen anything to suggest there will be no games in Canada

 

5 hours ago, RJB said:

I'm guessing the Leagues Cup will be played all in the USA?

I read that all MLS teams would have games in their stadiums. 

[narduch]

6 hours ago, RJB said:

I'm guessing the Leagues Cup will be played all in the USA?

The Canadian MLS teams will host 1 or 2 group stage games depending on where they are seeded.

 

[Kent]

I hate the idea of the Leagues Cup so much. I hope I don't end up getting sucked into watching it.

MLS claims they can't take time off for the Gold Cup, but they can for the Leagues Cup.

MLS claims that it's too many games to have a group stage in the CONCACAF Champions League, but they can have a group stage in the Leagues Cup.

It sure will be fun for the 15 teams that get knocked out of the group stage and their fans can sit around and twiddle their thumbs for a few weeks while they wait for their season to resume.

MLS is trying to act like they want to test themselves against the best league in the region, but only if they get to host every game.

I've seen it mentioned that there are 4 regions for this. East, West, South, and Central. But what does this even mean? What region are the Mexican teams in? Plus the same release also mentioned that MLS and Liga MX champions get a bye past the group stage, and then teams 2 through 16 in each league are then paired up with their opposite seed from the other league (so 2 from MLS vs 16 from Liga MX, etc.) so what do the regions mean? Is the third team in the group hand picked based on how close they are to the seeded MLS team in the group?

I hope there are some terrible attendances for a bunch of games. Like, there's gotta be some MLS cities that don't have big Mexican populations (what about Montreal? Would a Liga MX vs Liga MX game be a draw there?) Or are they going to say even though Montreal is the seeded team in their group next year and get to host their own games, they'll put the other fixture in whatever city they think they will make the most money?

Such a transparent money grab and so disrespectful to every other league in the confederation (CPL included). Don't make this monstrosity. Try to make CCL better.

[Shway]

@Kent brings up so many questionable points. And with 29 teams next season, I suspect MLS will convert their regular season schedule to only conference play to suffice for the break. And then will say everyone can have the chance to be drawn against eachother in the leagues cup. 

Canadian teams won’t have any home games, because they’ll end up playing Touluca, Tigres, or Pumas in some Texas state. 

Every l year I get a little more turned off of MLS. I pray presidente Vic forces the Canadian MLS teams into the CPL one day sooner rather than later. 

I can’t keep up or care to like I used to…I can’t be the only one.

[Ozzie_the_parrot]

1 hour ago, Shway said:

....Every l year I get a little more turned off of MLS. I pray presidente Vic forces the Canadian MLS teams into the CPL one day sooner rather than later....

This whole episode shows why that is in realm of fantasy. MLS and Liga MX have the money and did not want CanPL treated as a peer in the new North American qualifiers for the CCL. CONCACAF and FIFA are corrupt organizations that will continue dancing to their tune regardless of whether Victor Montagliani is president. 

[nfitz]

On 10/6/2022 at 10:55 PM, Shway said:

I strongly think they should be included in this tournament. 

This is part of the multi-year effort between MLS and Liga MX to work together. Concacaf isn't organizing it - they've simply blessed it (the same way they've blessed CPL and the Canadian Championship).

I'm not sure why CPL teams, or USL teams, would be included. They still have access to the Champions League.

[Cheeta]

Couldn't care less.

Might be great fun for those involved, or a dud.  Guess we'll see.

Odd interrupting the regular season.  That is suppose to help with fixture congestion?  A good way to elevate the tourney I suppose but I don't know.  Nothing happens in a vacuum.  Regular season isn't de-valued enough already?

Points for trying something new.  See whether it was worth the effort or not soon enough.

[Kingston]

On 10/8/2022 at 5:19 AM, Unnamed Trialist said:

This is the Concacaf SuperLeague. It serves no other purpose than a SuperLeague, reinforce the strong and deny other clubs the chance to compete openly and freely with other major clubs. 

Not really.  It's a way for MLS and LMX to financially capitalize on games between leagues.  I'm not a big fan but there's a large segment of the MLS fan base, especially in the southern US, for whom these games are a big deal and therefore lucrative.

On 10/8/2022 at 5:19 AM, Unnamed Trialist said:

The whole point, in my opinion, should be to find a way to encourage those leagues close to MLS and Liga MX, or those clubs who have proven able to compete with them, to rise in quality and continue to seek ways to match them. Without being naive about it, but a level playing field.

That's what the CCL is for.

[Ansem]

3 hours ago, Cheeta said:

Odd interrupting the regular season.  That is suppose to help with fixture congestion?  A good way to elevate the tourney I suppose but I don't know.

Just further proof that their complain about CCL group stage was BS. I believe they are making the case to CONCACAF that they can play in more games and at some point, they will reimpose the Group Stage.

They'll have to either deal with "true fixture congestion" or tone done the scope of the League Cup.

Why? There's money to be made in club competition and that's an area where CONCACAF hasn't done well. You use the League Cup to raise more eyes on cross-country competition and then you impose a group stage in the hopes of getting those fans over to your own competition.

People keep saying that the region is "caving" to MLS & MX, I think they are trying to find a way to make CCL the ultimate club competition and they will use the League Cup to set the stage.

[vancanman]

On 10/9/2022 at 12:58 PM, Kent said:

I hate the idea of the Leagues Cup so much. I hope I don't end up getting sucked into watching it.

MLS claims they can't take time off for the Gold Cup, but they can for the Leagues Cup.

MLS claims that it's too many games to have a group stage in the CONCACAF Champions League, but they can have a group stage in the Leagues Cup.

It sure will be fun for the 15 teams that get knocked out of the group stage and their fans can sit around and twiddle their thumbs for a few weeks while they wait for their season to resume.

MLS is trying to act like they want to test themselves against the best league in the region, but only if they get to host every game.

I've seen it mentioned that there are 4 regions for this. East, West, South, and Central. But what does this even mean? What region are the Mexican teams in? Plus the same release also mentioned that MLS and Liga MX champions get a bye past the group stage, and then teams 2 through 16 in each league are then paired up with their opposite seed from the other league (so 2 from MLS vs 16 from Liga MX, etc.) so what do the regions mean? Is the third team in the group hand picked based on how close they are to the seeded MLS team in the group?

I hope there are some terrible attendances for a bunch of games. Like, there's gotta be some MLS cities that don't have big Mexican populations (what about Montreal? Would a Liga MX vs Liga MX game be a draw there?) Or are they going to say even though Montreal is the seeded team in their group next year and get to host their own games, they'll put the other fixture in whatever city they think they will make the most money?

Such a transparent money grab and so disrespectful to every other league in the confederation (CPL included). Don't make this monstrosity. Try to make CCL better.

I feel like I'm going to wake up one day and find out Gary Bettman's the new president of CONcaCRAP.  LigaMX and MLS will merge, and CF Montréal will move to Rodeoville, Oklahoma.  All future World Cup qualifiers will be played in a summer tournament in Texas.  All referees for international matches must be from a country further south than at least one of the countries involved.  

[narduch]

40 minutes ago, Ansem said:

People keep saying that the region is "caving" to MLS & MX, I think they are trying to find a way to make CCL the ultimate club competition and they will use the League Cup to set the stage.

But they`ve ruined CCL now.

Having as many as 8 teams in CCL from one country is stupid. That`s what could happen if Mexico sweeps all the Leagues Cup spots.

[Ozzie_the_parrot]

...and if they seed the draw they can keep those clubs apart for the first couple of rounds to try to get the Caribbean and CanPL clubs out ASAP then the Central American ones so it turns into Liga MX vs MLS from the quarter finals onwards.

[Kent]

4 hours ago, Ozzie_the_parrot said:

...and if they seed the draw they can keep those clubs apart for the first couple of rounds to try to get the Caribbean and CanPL clubs out ASAP then the Central American ones so it turns into Liga MX vs MLS from the quarter finals onwards.

They have already stacked the deck in Liga MX and MLS's favour with the most recent CCL format. Those leagues have an advantage in the CONCACAF Club Index that they use for seeding the CCL. Since Liga MX and MLS are guaranteed spots in the CCL, but Central American (and the CPL champion) teams have to qualify through CONCACAF League, so that means they don't necessarily have a representative to accumulate points every year. For example, if one year you have a team from each of CPL, Honduras, Costa Rica, El Salvador, Guatemala, and Panama each qualify for CCL, their countries gain points for their CONCACAF Club Index (there are 4 points minimum for participation). But then the following year maybe Costa Rica gets 3 spots and Panama gets 3 spots. That means Honduras, El Salvador, Guatemala, and the second Canadian spot all get 0 points that year, which hurts their Club Index. Further to that, any points gained by the 2nd and 3rd seeds of those countries would go to CRC2, CRC3, PAN2, and PAN3, which will only ever exist again if those nations have 2 or 3 representatives in the same CCL, so even if the CRC3 team goes on a miracle run and wins the whole tournament, those points are virtually flushed down the toilet for next year's tournament, unless Costa Rica has 3 qualified teams again.

[narduch]

7 hours ago, Ozzie_the_parrot said:

...and if they seed the draw they can keep those clubs apart for the first couple of rounds to try to get the Caribbean and CanPL clubs out ASAP then the Central American ones so it turns into Liga MX vs MLS from the quarter finals onwards.

Well the Caribbean and Central American champs get a bye to the 2nd round. So they will likely be seeded.