CPL Season Schedule

[matty]

18 minutes ago, dsqpr said:

With 8 teams, everybody would have played everybody else twice at home and twice away. It would have been a normal league doubled. That would have been perfect -- with 8 teams.

28 in a normalish format still would have been a very tight season given we're looking at only 26~ weeks (it's a higher game per week average than most Euro leagues and even MLS) but yea it would be preferable to what we might be facing here.

[Guest]

24 minutes ago, matty said:

28 in a normalish format still would have been a very tight season given we're looking at only 26~ weeks (it's a higher game per week average than most Euro leagues and even MLS) but yea it would be preferable to what we might be facing here.

If we say 27 weekends minus 3 for international breaks, that is 28 matches into 24 weeks which means 4 midweek matches over 6 months. In a wildly optimistic scenario, Voyageurs Cup could add 10 midweek matches, but a max of 6 is much more realistic. Giving us a realistic total of 10 midweek matches over the 24 week season (net of international breaks).

Yes, the presumably unexpected CL thing adds to the pressure but even there the finals are in November (so post CPL season) giving an unlikely max of 8 additional matches to squeeze in. And we end up with an unlikely total of 18 midweek matches in a 24 week season (and a MAXIMUM of 22 midweek matches). Tight, but doable and the international weeks will serve as rest breaks for most players (those not selected by their country).

Just to reiterate, I think the potential 8 extra CL matches came as a surprise to CPL, after the regular season had been decided upon in principle and announced. And it is those extra matches that make it tight. Let us also not forget that CPL players get a very long post season break.

My ideal scenario is a 16 team division with 30 matches per team. Which would be even worse!

As usual, a good team will require a good squad.

[CDNFootballer]

4 hours ago, BringBackTheBlizzard said:

What will being spring champion lead to? A seeding in the Voyageurs cup? Think all it does is provide two Supporters Shield type winners that nobody gets particularly excited about at the time or remembers a couple of years down the road.

Spring Champion would get hosting rights to a one off final between each seasons champion.

As a fan of FC Edmonton in the NASL time, I hate that system. It works if your season is long, but the season in Canada is going to be barely 6 months. Each individual season is way to short, and teams can just streak their way into winning a “season”. It is also possible for the best team overall in the whole year not to win a “season” and be screwed over. Not the right way to go. 

And I have found it actually makes the games less interesting, not more interesting. In a 12 game season, if you lose your first 3 games, you are essentially out of the running right there. In a 24 game season you can come back from a bad start.

Wasn't sure of the split season idea at the time NASL implemented it, but it grew on me over time.Was more competitive with most clubs still in the race late in each season, made things more interesting and exciting.

Hopefully CPL has a one off championship game at the end with the spring and fall champions facing off.

 

[Ivanovski94]

The Norwegian Eliteserien runs from March 30 - Nov 30th. This first season is a bit of a wash in regards to full scheduling etc etc, but for next season and afterwards, one must assume we are looking at an Late March/early April start, with a mid-late october finish.

[Guest]

17 minutes ago, Ivanovski94 said:

The Norwegian Eliteserien runs from March 30 - Nov 30th. This first season is a bit of a wash in regards to full scheduling etc etc, but for next season and afterwards, one must assume we are looking at an Late March/early April start, with a mid-late october finish.

Can't start in Winnipeg in March. Third week of April is the earliest. I guess Valour could start on the road but for 3 weeks would be too much.

[Ivanovski94]

12 minutes ago, dsqpr said:

Can't start in Winnipeg in March. Third week of April is the earliest. I guess Valour could start on the road but for 3 weeks would be too much.

They are somehow playing in Russia during March....

[Guest]

Just now, Ivanovski94 said:

They are somehow playing in Russia during March....

In Siberia?

Maybe we could put you in charge of getting the stadium ready and getting frost bitten Winnipeggers out to watch! ?

[Cheeta]

^ Now, now.  I remember more than once kicking it about 1st week of April.  In long sleeves and toques.  On hard, brown, grass.  Feeling the temperature drop like the a stone along with the sun.

And in truth IGF is a very sheltered venue.  Things they could have done better but overall a good design for harsher weather.  However,  also think you have a 10x easier job getting people out when the weather is being pissy, in October, after a fine Winnipeg summer than you would have getting people to come in April, after a typical Winnipeg winter.  Generally speaking they're just not in the mood.  Not at all.

When's that damned schedule coming out?  

[Kent]

I think I am starting to understand how things work now. So we get a spring champion (say Pacific FC), then a fall champion (say York 9), then after all that Valour will play against Edmonton for the right to play against Forge in the Super Cup. Right? This is how we do things now?

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Cheeta said:

^ Now, now.  I remember more than once kicking it about 1st week of April.  In long sleeves and toques.  On hard, brown, grass.  Feeling the temperature drop like the a stone along with the sun.

And in truth IGF is a very sheltered venue.  Things they could have done better but overall a good design for harsher weather.  However,  also think you have a 10x easier job getting people out when the weather is being pissy, in October, after a fine Winnipeg summer than you would have getting people to come in April, after a typical Winnipeg winter.  Generally speaking they're just not in the mood.  Not at all.

When's that damned schedule coming out?  

So, Sunday 7th April then? Where would you like to go? Assiniboine Park? We can kick the ball around for a bit and then make our feasibility report. I suggest we use an orange ball. And snow shoes. ?

[youllneverwalkalone]

My prediction is that any reference to A/C will be conceptual only, to explain how each clubs' last 4 games are determined.

For example, in the first half, Pacific will play Valour home and away (again) to get to 14 matches. In the second half, they will play FCE and Cavalry to get to 28.

There will be a single table showing everyone playing 28 matches.

[Initial B]

I think I just realized why they're going with an Apertura/Clausura system: With this system, they can have single table, but they don't have to have a balanced schedule.

Since they're set on 28 games, teams are going to play some clubs 5 times and others 4 times. As the league expands (hopefully), this number will fluctuate constantly, eventually becoming balanced when the league hits 15 Clubs. But in the meantime, the CPL will have a Spring and Fall champion that will probably require a 2-leg "Final Tie" (they'll call it anything but playoffs) in October. This will to determine which team was better over the whole season at the end of the year in order to mitigate complaints that one team was better than the other (though I did like the NASL's structure, which seemed more fair).

[Kent]

Is there anyone out here in Voyageur land that has a team they support that won an Apertura (that’s the first one right?)

I am wondering how motivated you feel in the Clausura season that follows. You are already in the super cup final or whatever it may be called. So it seems to me like it might be anticlimactic. Like if 8 games into the NFL season your team qualifies for the Super Bowl. The only thing your team has to gain in the next 8 games is to effectively cancel the Super Bowl and become champions without that championship game.

[mpg_29]

11 minutes ago, Kent said:

Is there anyone out here in Voyageur land that has a team they support that won an Apertura (that’s the first one right?)

I am wondering how motivated you feel in the Clausura season that follows. You are already in the super cup final or whatever it may be called. So it seems to me like it might be anticlimactic. Like if 8 games into the NFL season your team makes qualifies for the Super Bowl. The only thing your team has to gain in the next 8 games is to effectively cancel the Super Bowl and become champions without that championship game.

This is what I was thinking as well. The "spring champion" could completely bomb the fall season yet still be in a final? It would be kinda anti-climatic.

[Guest]

2 hours ago, Initial B said:

I think I just realized why they're going with an Apertura/Clausura system: With this system, they can have single table, but they don't have to have a balanced schedule.

Since they're set on 28 games, teams are going to play some clubs 5 times and others 4 times. As the league expands (hopefully), this number will fluctuate constantly, eventually becoming balanced when the league hits 15 Clubs. But in the meantime, the CPL will have a Spring and Fall champion that will probably require a 2-leg "Final Tie" (they'll call it anything but playoffs) in October. This will to determine which team was better over the whole season at the end of the year in order to mitigate complaints that one team was better than the other (though I did like the NASL's structure, which seemed more fair).

I'm going to have to save this somewhere so that I can easily find it to cut and paste at regular intervals:

1. All teams play each other twice home and twice away. This is a normal league times two. Totally fair and everybody has an equal chance to finish in the top 3. (24 matches per team).

2a. Championship Round: Top 3 play each other home and away. The team with the most points on the *entire season* are declared champions and the other two finish 2nd and 3rd. Note that the top 3 have all played EXACTLY the same schedule. (4 additional matches.)

2b. Placement Round: 4th plays 7th home and away and the other two teams once each. 5th plays 6th home and away and the other two teams once each. Teams finish 4th to 7th based on total points gained over the *entire season*. Bottom four do not play exactly the same schedule but who cares? The process is nevertheless fair. (4 additional matches.)

What is wrong with that 28 game season plan? It is effectively the split table they use in Scotland.

- It is completely fair in terms of declaring a champion.

- It avoids the arbitrariness of a playoff where one team has earned a lot more points.

- It has the advantage of a "playoff race" as teams fight to be in the top 3 after 24 games.

- It has a minimal 4 games at the end of the season for clubs who are eliminated from contention by the split table.

[youllneverwalkalone]

^I like your suggestion, my fear would be something similar but done on geography or "rivalry" to minimize travel after match day 24.

[Guest]

6 minutes ago, youllneverwalkalone said:

^I like your suggestion, my fear would be something similar but done on geography or "rivalry" to minimize travel after match day 24.

It beats the living crap out of apertura/clausura which is very arbitrary and unfair. So apertura/clausura it is then!

[youllneverwalkalone]

As you've shown, I don't think A/C has any preferable outcome to get you to 28 matches. As I mentioned, it might just be a way to convey to the fans how the other 4 matches are allocated. (I'm picturing Valour swing to the west in the opening 14 and swinging to the east in the ending 14).

Or perhaps it's akin to what you are saying but two championship rounds. Which would be interesting, but impossible to schedule.

[matty]

59 minutes ago, dsqpr said:

I'm going to have to save this somewhere so that I can easily find it to cut and paste at regular intervals:

1. All teams play each other twice home and twice away. This is a normal league times two. Totally fair and everybody has an equal chance to finish in the top 3. (24 matches per team).

2a. Championship Round: Top 3 play each other home and away. The team with the most points on the *entire season* are declared champions and the other two finish 2nd and 3rd. Note that the top 3 have all played EXACTLY the same schedule. (4 additional matches.)

2b. Placement Round: 4th plays 7th home and away and the other two teams once each. 5th plays 6th home and away and the other two teams once each. Teams finish 4th to 7th based on total points gained over the *entire season*. Bottom four do not play exactly the same schedule but who cares? The process is nevertheless fair. (4 additional matches.)

What is wrong with that 28 game season plan? It is effectively the split table they use in Scotland.

- It is completely fair in terms of declaring a champion.

- It avoids the arbitrariness of a playoff where one team has earned a lot more points.

- It has the advantage of a "playoff race" as teams fight to be in the top 3 after 24 games.

- It has a minimal 4 games at the end of the season for clubs who are eliminated from contention by the split table.

Why do fans or even the teams care other than pride and maybe for near superficial rank for the VCup?

[youllneverwalkalone]

^It's how were going to allocate that billion dollar tv deal, obviously.

[Unnamed Trialist]

2 hours ago, Kent said:

Is there anyone out here in Voyageur land that has a team they support that won an Apertura (that’s the first one right?)

I am wondering how motivated you feel in the Clausura season that follows. You are already in the super cup final or whatever it may be called. So it seems to me like it might be anticlimactic. Like if 8 games into the NFL season your team makes qualifies for the Super Bowl. The only thing your team has to gain in the next 8 games is to effectively cancel the Super Bowl and become champions without that championship game.

Not football, but this system has an interesting twist in Cup competitions in European basketball. You play the first half of the season, and that half-season table determines seeds for the Cup. 

Then you have a final 8 long weekend a week or two after the teams are decided, quarters, semis and final. I thought of this because the Spanish basketball cup, which is a crazy intense competition, more than playoffs or Euroleague, is this weekend. 

I know it is different, but it does have the positive effect of benefiting your team for another trophy. But then you are right, you play a second half of the season only thinking about playoffs. 

It just occured to me that in Spanish women's football, the Cup is also decided on mid-season league table, the top 8 qualify and then you play it. For CPL, the only thing that would impede Voyageur Cup seedings to be decided by this is that we'd get to mid-season a bit too late, like late July. 

[nfitz]

2 hours ago, mpg_29 said:

This is what I was thinking as well. The "spring champion" could completely bomb the fall season yet still be in a final? It would be kinda anti-climatic.

The past is probably the best way to predict the future.

Looking at the NASL, Miami FC won the Spring in 2017, and then won the Fall too. 

In 2016 Indianapolis won the Spring, and finished number 2 in the Fall

In 2015 Cosmos won the spring, and were still number 3 in the Fall (which Ottawa won).

In 2014 Minnesota won the spring, and then were number 2 in the Fall.

Though how one seeds playoffs may help mitigate this as an issue.

But hang on - I haven't been following close enough ... I thought someone high-up had said this would be something that's new for North America ... and the split season certainly isn't! Do we know that it's a split season?


 

[BenFisk'sBiggestFan]

2013 Atlanta won the spring season and was 7th in the fall season. Meanwhile, Carolina was the best overall team all season and didn’t get to play in the final. (Also because of the cosmos joining and winning in the fall season)

 

[nfitz]

20 minutes ago, BenFisk'sBiggestFan said:

2013 Atlanta won the spring season and was 7th in the fall season. Meanwhile, Carolina was the best overall team all season and didn’t get to play in the final. (Also because of the cosmos joining and winning in the fall season)

Perhaps why afterwards, they went to semi's as well, and made sure the top overall team(s) were part of it too.

But there's always an exception if you dig far enough back. The question I suppose is why did Atlanta performance lag in fall 2013?

And as I said, it can be mitigated (with semi's, etc.).

[Guest]

1 hour ago, matty said:

Why do fans or even the teams care other than pride and maybe for near superficial rank for the VCup?

It makes sense for everybody to play the same number of league matches, not least for revenue. And in football, pride matters.