Canadian Premier League

[Diamondium]

17 minutes ago, baulderdash77 said:

Toronto is as big as #5 Edmonton to #14 Oshawa combined.  It's a massive market for TFC to have all to themselves.

Theoretically, it should be possible, especially if the CPL is able to sustain on relatively low attendances. I imagine there would be a fair share of TFC fans who would be happy to take up a 2nd team since they won't conflict with each other.

Scheduling to avoid overlapping though would be essentail for it though. Toronto II would get wrecked on any head-to-head scheduling conflicts, at least for the first while.

One must remember though that there is a bit of a diminishing returns when it comes to population and teams one can support. Just because a city has population 10x the size of another doesn't necessarily mean it could support even 3x the teams. Just look at New York in the NHL for example. The Islanders and Devils have struggled financially since most of the population just latches on to the Rangers, despite the fact that the metro population of New York is like half of Canada.

[Macksam]

12 minutes ago, baulderdash77 said:

The 2016 Census came out today.  Interesting taking a look at the top 15 urban Centers in Canada (all in '000's)

Toronto 5,928k

Montreal 4,099k

Vancouver 2,463k

Calgary 1,393k

Ottawa 1,324k

Edmonton 1,321k

Quebec City 800k

Winnipeg 779k

Hamilton 748k

Kitchener-Waterloo 523k

London 494k

St Catherine's 406k

Halifax 403k

Oshawa 379k

Victoria 368k

There are some decent sized markets with no CPL rumours out there and it's easy to remember how big Montreal and Toronto are.  They should be able to support 2 pro soccer teams. 

 

The Niagara Falls region is definitely interesting.

[MrSabiondo]

40 minutes ago, baulderdash77 said:

The 2016 Census came out today.  Interesting taking a look at the top 15 urban Centers in Canada (all in '000's)

Toronto 5,928k

Montreal 4,099k

Vancouver 2,463k

Calgary 1,393k

Ottawa 1,324k

Edmonton 1,321k

Quebec City 800k

Winnipeg 779k

Hamilton 748k

Kitchener-Waterloo 523k

London 494k

St Catherine's 406k

Halifax 403k

Oshawa 379k

Victoria 368k

 

 

Where is Mississauga???

[Alex D]

20 minutes ago, Macksam said:

The Niagara Falls region is definitely interesting.

As a native of Niagara and a soccer dork here are my scattered thoughts on this:

Niagara's economy is shit. Niagara tourism had its best year ever last year but that provides mainly low paying seasonal work. 

Corporate support would be weak. Outside of a few resorts the only other large public company in the area is Meridian. Meridian isn't exactly a juggernaught either and they already have a naming rights deal with the new arena in St. Catharines. 

There is no suitable venue. Brock doesn't have a football stadium and there is nothing else viable in the region. I can't even think of a good place to build a stadium to be honest, unless they year down the old arena in downtown St Kitts. 

That being said, sports have never been tried on the national stage in Niagara (CBL doesn't count). If the Niagara Falls tourism board sees this as an opportunity to gain back some prestige from losing our New Years show who knows. 

Morale of the story, I'd love to see it but I won't get my hopes up. 

[baulderdash77]

1 hour ago, MrSabiondo said:

Where is Mississauga???

It's based on CMA so Mississauga is part

of Toronto.  It's a bit of my case in point regarding the size of Toronto.

Inside of Toronto's 5,928k you have the following large suburbs:

Mississauga- 721k

Brampton- 594k

Markham 328k

Vaughn -308k

Inside Montreal is Laval with 423k

Inside of Vancouver is Surrey with 518k

So there are definitely sub markets within the big cities with large and semi distinct populations.

[GuillermoDelQuarto]

3 hours ago, Alex D said:

As a native of Niagara and a soccer dork here are my scattered thoughts on this:

Niagara's economy is shit. Niagara tourism had its best year ever last year but that provides mainly low paying seasonal work. 

Corporate support would be weak. Outside of a few resorts the only other large public company in the area is Meridian. Meridian isn't exactly a juggernaught either and they already have a naming rights deal with the new arena in St. Catharines. 

There is no suitable venue. Brock doesn't have a football stadium and there is nothing else viable in the region. I can't even think of a good place to build a stadium to be honest, unless they year down the old arena in downtown St Kitts. 

That being said, sports have never been tried on the national stage in Niagara (CBL doesn't count). If the Niagara Falls tourism board sees this as an opportunity to gain back some prestige from losing our New Years show who knows. 

Morale of the story, I'd love to see it but I won't get my hopes up. 

I think I'll put this in the "hopefully before I die" column

[Gopherbashi]

THE NEW CENSUS IS OUT

REWRITE ALL OUR PREDICTIONS

[grasshopper1917]

We had to delay our first get together a 24 hours due to bad weather but we still had a decent turn out. Some great ideas were exchanged. We had a rep from the local management group join us - very in touch with the sport, the fans and the city. Gained some great insight to what the league will look like and what our team and stadium will look like. Great night in Halifax.

 

[Soccerpro]

What will the league look like?

[Pottsy3]

5 hours ago, Alex D said:

As a native of Niagara and a soccer dork here are my scattered thoughts on this:

Niagara's economy is shit. Niagara tourism had its best year ever last year but that provides mainly low paying seasonal work. 

Corporate support would be weak. Outside of a few resorts the only other large public company in the area is Meridian. Meridian isn't exactly a juggernaught either and they already have a naming rights deal with the new arena in St. Catharines. 

There is no suitable venue. Brock doesn't have a football stadium and there is nothing else viable in the region. I can't even think of a good place to build a stadium to be honest, unless they year down the old arena in downtown St Kitts. 

That being said, sports have never been tried on the national stage in Niagara (CBL doesn't count). If the Niagara Falls tourism board sees this as an opportunity to gain back some prestige from losing our New Years show who knows. 

Morale of the story, I'd love to see it but I won't get my hopes up. 

As another resident of St. Kitts, I'm going to have to say that Jack Gatecliff Arena isn't going anywhere and wouldn't be an ideal place for a field either. Gale Crescent is littered with heroin addicts and hookers. I agree that it would be quite surprising if we were to get a team. The field would definitely have to be made from scratch and I have no clue where they would put it. The population in Niagara is aging, and industries are lacking with GM leaving. We also might simply be too close to Hamilton. Once the league has established itself, maybe an expansion to Niagara is possible, but at least not in the beginning.

[SuperCanuck]

On 07/02/2017 at 7:17 PM, LSM said:

(For those who don't know, vis-a-vis SuperCanuck's above comment, the "Original Six" were not the founding members of the NHL. They were just the six "original" teams before the '67 expansion.

The five teams who formed the NHL were:

1. Club Athletique Canadien (who became Club de Hockey Canadien, aka Montreal Canadiens)
2. Toronto Hockey Club (who became the St. Patricks, then the Maple Leafs)
3. Ottawa Senators (who became the St. Louis Eagles before folding)
4. Quebec Hockey Club (who became Quebec Athletic Club or 'Bulldogs', then Hamilton Tigers before folding)
5. The Montreal Wanderers (who only played four games in the inaugural NHL season before their arena burned down and they folded)

Other teams in the NHL before the Original Six era include: Montreal Maroons, Pittsburgh Pirates (then Philadelphia Quakers), New York Americans (then Brooklyn Americans), and... the Red Wings were previously the Detroit Cougars and Falcons.)

Club de Hockey canadiens, Montréal Wanderers, Québec Bulldogs and Ottawa Senators were the four teams that formed the league.  The Bulldogs didn't play in the first season (sort of like PEI hosting the Charlottetown Conference and not joining confederation until a few years later).  The league added Toronto Arenas (St. Pats, Leafs) to start the first season.  The Bulldogs only came back after the Wanderers' arena burned down.

[Ansem]

15 hours ago, Alex D said:

As a native of Niagara and a soccer dork here are my scattered thoughts on this:

Niagara's economy is shit. Niagara tourism had its best year ever last year but that provides mainly low paying seasonal work. 

Corporate support would be weak. Outside of a few resorts the only other large public company in the area is Meridian. Meridian isn't exactly a juggernaught either and they already have a naming rights deal with the new arena in St. Catharines. 

There is no suitable venue. Brock doesn't have a football stadium and there is nothing else viable in the region. I can't even think of a good place to build a stadium to be honest, unless they year down the old arena in downtown St Kitts. 

That being said, sports have never been tried on the national stage in Niagara (CBL doesn't count). If the Niagara Falls tourism board sees this as an opportunity to gain back some prestige from losing our New Years show who knows. 

Morale of the story, I'd love to see it but I won't get my hopes up. 

I have to agree. Overall population is only one piece of the equation. You need strong corporate presence, hence always thinking that Kitchener-Waterloo was a no brainer, same as London

[Gopherbashi]

#miscellaneoushype

[Fullback]

22 hours ago, Alex D said:

As a native of Niagara and a soccer dork here are my scattered thoughts on this:

Niagara's economy is shit. Niagara tourism had its best year ever last year but that provides mainly low paying seasonal work. 

Corporate support would be weak. Outside of a few resorts the only other large public company in the area is Meridian. Meridian isn't exactly a juggernaught either and they already have a naming rights deal with the new arena in St. Catharines. 

There is no suitable venue. Brock doesn't have a football stadium and there is nothing else viable in the region. I can't even think of a good place to build a stadium to be honest, unless they year down the old arena in downtown St Kitts. 

That being said, sports have never been tried on the national stage in Niagara (CBL doesn't count). If the Niagara Falls tourism board sees this as an opportunity to gain back some prestige from losing our New Years show who knows. 

Morale of the story, I'd love to see it but I won't get my hopes up. 

You never know up at Brock they have a very ambitious new athletic director and the city is pushing for the Canada Summer Games in 2021 and combine that with a potential football team who knows? Could be a similar situation to TD Stadium in London which was built as a part of the summer games plan.

[Alex D]

58 minutes ago, Fullback said:

You never know up at Brock they have a very ambitious new athletic director and the city is pushing for the Canada Summer Games in 2021 and combine that with a potential football team who knows? Could be a similar situation to TD Stadium in London which was built as a part of the summer games plan.

I want nothing more than to be proven wrong about this. 

[Macksam]

19 hours ago, grasshopper1917 said:

We had to delay our first get together a 24 hours due to bad weather but we still had a decent turn out. Some great ideas were exchanged. We had a rep from the local management group join us - very in touch with the sport, the fans and the city. Gained some great insight to what the league will look like and what our team and stadium will look like. Great night in Halifax.

 

You are all soldiers. Keep fighting the good fight out there. 

With lots of love,

Macksam

3 hours ago, Gopherbashi said:

#miscellaneoushype

With who, about what and where?

[Macksam]

On February 8, 2017 at 5:39 PM, Alex D said:

As a native of Niagara and a soccer dork here are my scattered thoughts on this:

Niagara's economy is shit. Niagara tourism had its best year ever last year but that provides mainly low paying seasonal work. 

Corporate support would be weak. Outside of a few resorts the only other large public company in the area is Meridian. Meridian isn't exactly a juggernaught either and they already have a naming rights deal with the new arena in St. Catharines. 

There is no suitable venue. Brock doesn't have a football stadium and there is nothing else viable in the region. I can't even think of a good place to build a stadium to be honest, unless they year down the old arena in downtown St Kitts. 

That being said, sports have never been tried on the national stage in Niagara (CBL doesn't count). If the Niagara Falls tourism board sees this as an opportunity to gain back some prestige from losing our New Years show who knows. 

Morale of the story, I'd love to see it but I won't get my hopes up. 

Meridian Credit Union?

[grasshopper1917]

18 hours ago, Soccerpro said:

What will the league look like?

Well regarding the league there was much discussed. So i'm not sure where to start. I will maybe hit a few main points that have been in dispute by some on here.

 

League:

1) Regarding MLS2 teams such as TFC2 or Whitecaps2. They will NOT be in the CPL in any way shape or forum. Everyone involved from both the financial side and the CSA seem very very in tune with the importance of perception of the league and do not want to see it a minor league (similar to USL).

2) The CSA and financial backers are both on the same page and working hard to make the league a reality. The CSA vision for the league and the financial backers vision for the league seem to be perfectly in line.

3) There is still tonns of work going on behind the scenes and it will be a little while before an official announcement is made. The few months are going to be crucial. The timeline for an announcement being made we should be looking at about April.

 

Halifax:

1) SEA has been working together with the local government to get the Wanderers ground up to top notch shape and are very very happy with the tender the government put forward to get the work done by September 1.

2) Nothing is set in stone but ticket prices may fall in the 15-40$ range.

3) Stadium is likely going to be in the 5000-7000 seat range. Stands running up both sidelines - a supporters stand behind one of the goals and one end opened with a beer garden in it.

  

[Alex D]

2 minutes ago, Macksam said:

Meridian Credit Union?

Correct

[Alex D]

6 minutes ago, grasshopper1917 said:

 

League:

1) Regarding MLS2 teams such as TFC2 or Whitecaps2. They will NOT be in the CPL in any way shape or forum. Everyone involved from both the financial side and the CSA seem very very in tune with the importance of perception of the league and do not want to see it a minor league (similar to USL).

  

But how will the league survive!!!

[Ansem]

4 hours ago, Alex D said:

But how will the league survive!!!

Deep pockets ownership willing and able to lose money at first for the long term gains

[Complete Homer]

4 hours ago, grasshopper1917 said:

Well regarding the league there was much discussed. So i'm not sure where to start. I will maybe hit a few main points that have been in dispute by some on here.

 

League:

1) Regarding MLS2 teams such as TFC2 or Whitecaps2. They will NOT be in the CPL in any way shape or forum. Everyone involved from both the financial side and the CSA seem very very in tune with the importance of perception of the league and do not want to see it a minor league (similar to USL).

 

Not that I think it will happen, but I wouldn't completely rule it out. Until we have an actual announcement, all we have is the line of best fit between the data points. If TFC keeps pitching, maybe they find an agreement. Who knows

[Ansem]

4 minutes ago, Complete Homer said:

Not that I think it will happen, but I wouldn't completely rule it out. Until we have an actual announcement, all we have is the line of best fit between the data points. If TFC keeps pitching, maybe they find an agreement. Who knows

If they are a minority partner in FC London with no say on operational decisions, there's no problem at all

But flat out putting a B Team in the league won't fly

[GuillermoDelQuarto]

1 hour ago, Complete Homer said:

Not that I think it will happen, but I wouldn't completely rule it out. Until we have an actual announcement, all we have is the line of best fit between the data points. If TFC keeps pitching, maybe they find an agreement. Who knows

I'm not sure if this has been discussed already, but I'm curious if TFC would consider being a minority stakeholder in a number of teams - it would protect them from the pitfalls of them losing some of the market share(which seems inevitable if CPL succeeds otherwise) but doesn't cause conflicts of interest in the sense that they'll be able to sway those teams to do anything directly to help them.

It also possible I've tried to make this point already and just forgotten, but such is the nature of a 260 page thread lol

[BringBackTheBlizzard]

7 hours ago, grasshopper1917 said:

League:

1) Regarding MLS2 teams such as TFC2 or Whitecaps2. They will NOT be in the CPL in any way shape or forum....

Who told you this?