BringBackTheBlizzard Posted January 13, 2017 Share Posted January 13, 2017 We will have to agree to disagree on this and the point is moot, because there is almost certainly going to be a joint bid with the United States and Mexico. If it was seen as CONCACAF's turn and the USSF was sitting out, then we had a very good chance given Mexico had already had it twice. Blatter fell from grace and FIFA politics changed and what looked like a strong possibility turned into a longshot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matty Posted January 13, 2017 Share Posted January 13, 2017 7 minutes ago, BringBackTheBlizzard said: We will have to agree to disagree on this and the point is moot, because there is almost certainly going to be a joint bid with the United States and Mexico. If it was seen as CONCACAF's turn and the USSF was sitting out, then we had a very good chance given Mexico had already had it twice. Blatter fell from grace and FIFA politics changed and what looked like a strong possibility turned into a longshot. Our odds went down but we were still the front runner and the us election likely did favour us. I do agree that the solo bid is likely dead and we should stop focusing on it but my issue is your opinion of the joint bids impact on the cpl. It's likely done much less to the plans than you think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rheo Posted January 13, 2017 Share Posted January 13, 2017 Do we really need to get in the pro/rel arguement again? It's never going to happen because the people putting the money in will never let it happen. They'll follow the MLS model. Also building 60k stadiums all across the country for a World Cup is a big waste of money. Canada has a lot bigger needs than stadiums that will sit mostly unused. Honestly a co-bid is the best thing. And before I get killed a-I'm pro-CPL, just realistic and b-much respect to all here, please be kind lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matty Posted January 13, 2017 Share Posted January 13, 2017 22 minutes ago, Rheo said: Do we really need to get in the pro/rel arguement again? It's never going to happen because the people putting the money in will never let it happen. They'll follow the MLS model. Also building 60k stadiums all across the country for a World Cup is a big waste of money. Canada has a lot bigger needs than stadiums that will sit mostly unused. Honestly a co-bid is the best thing. And before I get killed a-I'm pro-CPL, just realistic and b-much respect to all here, please be kind lol Yea I'm sick of the pro rel guys on here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
red card Posted January 13, 2017 Share Posted January 13, 2017 If the CPL doesn't at least say pro-rel is being considered 5-10 years out with even something where the advantage is clearly in favour of the CPL, this will become a wound that will fester. And for a segment of folks who won't give the CPL a chance, this will be cited as reason x of 10. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Macksam Posted January 13, 2017 Share Posted January 13, 2017 1 hour ago, Rheo said: Do we really need to get in the pro/rel arguement again? It's never going to happen because the people putting the money in will never let it happen. They'll follow the MLS model. Also building 60k stadiums all across the country for a World Cup is a big waste of money. Canada has a lot bigger needs than stadiums that will sit mostly unused. Honestly a co-bid is the best thing. And before I get killed a-I'm pro-CPL, just realistic and b-much respect to all here, please be kind lol Semi finals require 50000 and the final 65000 I believe (possibly 60000 and 80000 seats respectively). Everything else is 40000 minimum. I'm not so sure BBTB's remark about how temporary seating "won't cut it" is accurate as well. We have Commonwealth and BC Place for the semi finals, a new Toronto 65000 seater for the final, probably a new venue for Montreal, we have 40000 seater stadiums with temp seating available with Hamilton, Winnipeg, Regina, Ottawa and possibly BMO for the second city rule. That leaves three new venues for Calgary, Quebec City and KW maybe? Besides the final showpiece stadium, we'd need to only build four 40000 seater stadiums (or 30000 seats with temp seating) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dyslexic nam Posted January 13, 2017 Share Posted January 13, 2017 1 hour ago, red card said: If the CPL doesn't at least say pro-rel is being considered 5-10 years out with even something where the advantage is clearly in favour of the CPL, this will become a wound that will fester. And for a segment of folks who won't give the CPL a chance, this will be cited as reason x of 10. I don't give that argument a lot of weight. There is a shitload more to footy than the threat of crippling financial loss. TFC didn't have that threat, yet got the message that they needed to improve because the fans let them know. Now the team is winning and the fans are happy. All without pro rel. I get that it is how things work elsewhere. And I have never been a fan of change for change's sake (e.g. Countdown clock). But I am also not a believer that we need to slavishly do absolutely everything the way it is done elsewhere. The p/r thing works in areas where there are deep pyramids and where teams have not paid huge sums as league entry fees. In the Canadian market, much like MLS, neigh of these things are true, so it would be foolish to pursue a p/r system that relies on them. A wound that will fester? Hardly. MLS is doing just fine with or without the support of those fixated on p/r. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
masster Posted January 13, 2017 Share Posted January 13, 2017 On 1/12/2017 at 9:09 AM, ted said: Does being a cohost scupper any hope for infrastructure improvements outside Toronto, Montreal and Vancouver? Not necessarily. 48 countries will have to set up home bases for pre tournament camps and training sessions. Usually those are located outside of the major host cities. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GuillermoDelQuarto Posted January 14, 2017 Share Posted January 14, 2017 I wasn't really here to debate pro/rel. I don't think it should be done in the first 15 years at least. I just wanted to talk about how it could be done at that point. I'm young I've got time to wait. I just feel like it's necessary to have a vision of where we want to go in order to really get people on board. so where do we want to go? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BringBackTheBlizzard Posted January 14, 2017 Share Posted January 14, 2017 15 hours ago, matty said: ...but my issue is your opinion of the joint bids impact on the cpl. It's likely done much less to the plans than you think. Over the past few weeks there have been snippets on here that have suggested that Calgary Foothills, FC London, K/W United (assume anyway because it was Barry MacLean's name that was mentioned), and a team from Brampton or Mississauga may be possibilities along with the publicly acknowledged groups in Hamilton and Halifax. Factor in Victoria and Winnipeg from PDL and some of the non-GTA and Montreal L1O and PLSQ groups as the non-exposed part of the iceberg and it becomes possible to see a way ahead that tallies with the interest from 12 communities thing that has been mentioned. Something's afloat that existing soccer clubs/investors with the hands on experience needed to form a realistic outlook on what is doable appear to be looking at seriously with the CSA and that's a good thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lazlo_80 Posted January 14, 2017 Share Posted January 14, 2017 So is it just me or is the silence on this project a little deafening right now? even the pro CPL guys haven't said a peep about it in a long time. And this was sort of the time I think most of us were expecting to hear something more official. Wasn't totera supposed to say some stuff after Christmas? Hamilton guys, Is there anything they said I your meeting that led you to believe it would be this quiet at the moment? it seems strange. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rintaran Posted January 14, 2017 Share Posted January 14, 2017 8 minutes ago, lazlo_80 said: So is it just me or is the silence on this project a little deafening right now? even the pro CPL guys haven't said a peep about it in a long time. And this was sort of the time I think most of us were expecting to hear something more official. Wasn't totera supposed to say some stuff after Christmas? Yes, the silence is worrying. I was expecting an announcement soon. I'm hoping it was merely delayed so as not to coincide with the NASL/USL ruling, the MLS schedule launch, the MLS superdraft, and the announced retirements of CanWNT players. -- Out of curiosity, with all the talk of solo & joint bids, why is a joint Mexico/Canada bid, excluding the US, never considered an option? We could probably negotiate relatively equal number of matches, letting them have the final, and manage to get a handful of upgrades out of the deal. I'd even think it more amenable than a US/anyone deal considering the current political climate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rheo Posted January 14, 2017 Share Posted January 14, 2017 20 minutes ago, lazlo_80 said: So is it just me or is the silence on this project a little deafening right now? even the pro CPL guys haven't said a peep about it in a long time. And this was sort of the time I think most of us were expecting to hear something more official. Wasn't totera supposed to say some stuff after Christmas? Hamilton guys, Is there anything they said I your meeting that led you to believe it would be this quiet at the moment? it seems strange. It doesn't bother me at all. They're being cautious and making sure they have everything together before they announce/launch it. It appears they aren't as far along as we had hoped but what can you do. You only have one chance to make a first impression so they have to make sure they're ready to go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rheo Posted January 14, 2017 Share Posted January 14, 2017 22 hours ago, Macksam said: Besides the final showpiece stadium, we'd need to only build four 40000 seater stadiums (or 30000 seats with temp seating) Yeah but the point is what use is a 40000 seat stadium in most of these cities after the Cup? It's a waste of public money that can be put to better uses. I want the Cup but here as much as anyone but it's financially foolish to try and go it alone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rheo Posted January 14, 2017 Share Posted January 14, 2017 18 hours ago, GuillermoDelQuarto said: so where do we want to go? A self-sustaining league that gives our players a place to play at home and helps to continue to grow the game across Canada as it expands when possible and makes sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grasshopper1917 Posted January 14, 2017 Share Posted January 14, 2017 2 hours ago, Rheo said: Yeah but the point is what use is a 40000 seat stadium in most of these cities after the Cup? It's a waste of public money that can be put to better uses. I want the Cup but here as much as anyone but it's financially foolish to try and go it alone. Good point 40,000 is even way too big for the CFL - well maybe except for Saskatchewan but even there it would be stretching it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 15, 2017 Share Posted January 15, 2017 3 hours ago, Rintaran said: Out of curiosity, with all the talk of solo & joint bids, why is a joint Mexico/Canada bid, excluding the US, never considered an option? We could probably negotiate relatively equal number of matches, letting them have the final, and manage to get a handful of upgrades out of the deal. I'd even think it more amenable than a US/anyone deal considering the current political climate. Mexican fans wouldn't want any of it. Plus co-hosts usually need to be near each other Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 15, 2017 Share Posted January 15, 2017 On 2017-01-13 at 1:47 PM, BringBackTheBlizzard said: there is a strong preference for venues to be in separate cities, so there almost certainly would have been a need for new builds. I think they threw away that strong preference when they gave the 2022 World Cup to Qatar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gopherbashi Posted January 15, 2017 Share Posted January 15, 2017 edit: delete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gopherbashi Posted January 15, 2017 Share Posted January 15, 2017 On 1/13/2017 at 4:56 PM, red card said: If the CPL doesn't at least say pro-rel is being considered 5-10 years out with even something where the advantage is clearly in favour of the CPL, this will become a wound that will fester. And for a segment of folks who won't give the CPL a chance, this will be cited as reason x of 10. Tell me, which of the plethora of well-vetted billionaire D2 team owners will we be promoting to the CPL? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rheo Posted January 15, 2017 Share Posted January 15, 2017 Kurt Larson promising CPL news tomorrow Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Macksam Posted January 15, 2017 Share Posted January 15, 2017 4 hours ago, Rheo said: Yeah but the point is what use is a 40000 seat stadium in most of these cities after the Cup? It's a waste of public money that can be put to better uses. I want the Cup but here as much as anyone but it's financially foolish to try and go it alone. Make it 25000 to 30000 with temp seating to make it 40000. After the World Cup, take out the temp seating and you have stadiums for the CPL (and CFL possibly). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Macksam Posted January 15, 2017 Share Posted January 15, 2017 4 minutes ago, Rheo said: Kurt Larson promising CPL news tomorrow Is this guy pro CPL or no? Or neutral? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rheo Posted January 15, 2017 Share Posted January 15, 2017 13 minutes ago, Macksam said: Is this guy pro CPL or no? Or neutral? Generally neutral. He was the first to report in TFC's interest in the league and wanting to be a part of it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Macksam Posted January 15, 2017 Share Posted January 15, 2017 4 minutes ago, Rheo said: Generally neutral. He was the first to report in TFC's interest in the league and wanting to be a part of it Very good. I think we'll get an insightful piece then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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