Trillium Posted June 10, 2007 Share Posted June 10, 2007 Question... Was our coach out coached .. did he not have any tactical response to what was happening on the pitch ? I was not impressed by out teams passion ..nor by the passing patterns they wanted to use, too much is going on where the ball is not sent on a simple clean pass to someone who knows where it is going...and for some reason the coaching staff seems incapable of teaching any type of patterned play... And all that talk of Guadalope ...being a easy mark before...when is the CSA going to recognize our standing in the FIFA rankings is an indication of our relative strength... we have a great deal of work to do, I hope the new National Coach watched this and has some thoughts to pass on to the supporters about how he will turn it around for World Cup qualification.... Hopefully some of the paid media covering soccer in Canada will get to learn how to ask some probing questions .... are you listening Mr. Starnes.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mighty_TorontoFC Posted June 10, 2007 Share Posted June 10, 2007 The players were pathetic tonight....no effort, no skill, no heart= 0 points. The team looked like a team that hasn't played to often and it showed, the CSA must take the blame there, the players must take the blame for walking through the first half like on a summer vaction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Ref Posted June 10, 2007 Share Posted June 10, 2007 We should have won that game. I think we overdid it with the passing. Guadalupe was played a much simpler and direct game. Shame on us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trueviking Posted June 10, 2007 Share Posted June 10, 2007 such is the life of a canadian soccer fan.... wow, that was terrible...at least they will be well rested for haiti as they barely broke a sweat this game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rivaldo Posted June 10, 2007 Share Posted June 10, 2007 Maybe Canada should have had a penalty for the tackle on Hume in the 88th minute. There should have been a lot more time added, but it might not have done any good. There was a 1 minute injury/acting performance in injury time, but the ref blew immediately after the announced 6 minutes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sj Posted June 10, 2007 Share Posted June 10, 2007 Did we had to play with only one striker against ateam like Guadeloupe are we going to see the same formation against Haiti.Gerba is no tardet man like Friend is. should have changed to a 4-4-2 formation once we noticed that Gaudeloupe was going to play a counter attack tactics. well I guest we will see monday if Haiti's leading up to this tournament serious preparation will be too much of a factor to overcome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paddy Posted June 10, 2007 Share Posted June 10, 2007 Things I wanted to say after the first game but didn't (for fear or reprisals). 1. The fancy passing is nice, but has to be kept in its place. Tonight there was a lot of BS heals and flicks that went nowhere. Save it for a lead. 2. Individual effort goals (like Deguzman's second) are great but cannot be relied upon on a game to game basis. There needs to be a variety of build up that gets strikers into position. 3. Passing around in our end is fine but should not be confused with dominating a game. It can just end up being wasted effort. I definitely saw hints of this in the Costa Rica game. Also, I can't really blame Sutton for the second goal. Our defense dropped off a rapidly attacking player...always a danger. I can remember Figo not being shut down by Enlgand once and scoring a powerful goal on the run (2000 Euros). Anyway...let’s hope all of Haiti's prep was in vain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
youllneverwalkalone Posted June 10, 2007 Share Posted June 10, 2007 quote:Originally posted by Trillium Question... Was our coach out coached .. did he not have any tactical response to what was happening on the pitch ? I was not impressed by out teams passion ..nor by the passing patterns they wanted to use, too much is going on where the ball is not sent on a simple clean pass to someone who knows where it is going...and for some reason the coaching staff seems incapable of teaching any type of patterned play... And all that talk of Guadalope ...being a easy mark before...when is the CSA going to recognize our standing in the FIFA rankings is an indication of our relative strength... we have a great deal of work to do, I hope the new National Coach watched this and has some thoughts to pass on to the supporters about how he will turn it around for World Cup qualification.... Hopefully some of the paid media covering soccer in Canada will get to learn how to ask some probing questions .... are you listening Mr. Starnes.... I gave Hart his due after last match, but I have no doubt he was outcoached. One thing that will change when Mitchell shows up is that he'll make the necessary adjustments to get a result. Any Football Manager rookie could learn on the internet in five minutes that tactical adjustments must be made based on the opposition and players available. Hart preached a clean sheet, but didn't make the necessary adjustments. He didn't make any adjustments at all. Unlike Costa Rica, this opponent did not come forward and we did not have Friend holding up the ball. This congested the midfield and left our defense vulnerable to counter attack. Nash is not the player to stop it and Hutch and De Guzman were having a hard time running box to box, while Bernier was neutralised on the wing. Haiti will play us exactly the same way. IMHO, we need to put Bernier and Julian in front of the defense to neutralise the coutner-attack and let Hutch and DeRo, our best one v. one players push the ball down the flanks into the box. We need to take our corners, take some dives in the box, and have Gerba and/or Hume there to poach. And be happy with a 1-0 victory. That's what it's going to take. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trueviking Posted June 10, 2007 Share Posted June 10, 2007 how often in the past 10 years have we seen canada up against a CONCACAF team that we should beat and they score early forcing us to play catch up as we watch the other team roll around on the pitch as if they had been shot with a cannon. it happens all too often, but it is our own fault for falling behind to a team that we should have killed. i have seen this so many times before...a good win followed immediately with a terrible loss and then when a result is needed in the third game, it is lost for some very frustrating reason (fluke goal, bad ref)...hopefully the trend is broken on monday. nash sucks in my opinion...his passing is horrible...we need a general back there to run the show. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrennanFan Posted June 10, 2007 Share Posted June 10, 2007 This was a disgrace. All of the players should be ashamed of their effort. Disgusting. Dont blame Hart, the formation was not the problem, this was all about the players not playing up to their ability. Sheer lack of professionalism. THIS WAS GUADELOUPE, I MEAN MY GOD! Oh, and Sutton, YOU SUCK! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyson M Posted June 10, 2007 Share Posted June 10, 2007 the good news is it doesn't affect the rankings... the bad news is that this result affects my personal rating of the team... like i said earlier. lone striker only works with friend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bungey Posted June 10, 2007 Share Posted June 10, 2007 Well crud. We all saw our weaknesses going into this tournament -- central defense and goaltending. Boy did they show themselves today. Sutton gifted the first goal and the lack of a defender on the ball gifted the second goal. I expected defense would take us out in the semis, I just didn't see it coming so soon. Well, okay, I guess I expected we would lose to Costa Rica for these reasons but my expectations got out of whack after winning game 1. In the first half it looked so positive. Building, building, finally breaking them down for the first goal. At that point I expected many more. But we barely created more chances. We controlled the midfield for sure, but just had no original ideas in the final 3rd. Do the coaches repeatedly yell "Just hit a high one to the striker!" or did the players decide to do that again -- and again -- and again. Substituting Nash for Pozniak was -- at least -- puzzling. Trying to nail down that 1 goal deficite, was Stephen Hart? "Let's shut this down right here, it'll come down to goal differential to get us into a coin toss." For some reason Stalteri didn't push forward like he did against Costa Rica. Makes no sense. I guess it was a total team loss. The defense and goaltender for just sucking. The midfield and striker for not taking advantage of superior possession and breaking down a weaker side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Posted June 10, 2007 Share Posted June 10, 2007 quote:Originally posted by Tyson M like i said earlier. lone striker only works with friend. For comparison between Ali and Friend as lone striker see: Austria 2006 It's like the fans know the strengths (and history!) of the players better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrennanFan Posted June 10, 2007 Share Posted June 10, 2007 Canada falls to Guadeloupe http://www.canadasoccer.com/eng/media/viewArtical.asp?Press_ID=2730 MIAMI (FLORIDA) - Canada’s men’s national team fell to Guadeloupe today in their second game of the 2007 CONCACAF Gold Cup preliminary round. The Canucks are stuck on three points after a 1:2 loss to Guadeloupe. Canada’s third and last game in Group A will be Monday 11 June against Haiti. 'I thought both goals were definitely preventable,' said coach Stephen Hart. 'All the credit to Guadeloupe as they defended well in the first half. I thought we moved the ball better in the second half, but at the end of the day we didn’t score.' In the first-ever meeting between the two national senior sides, Guadeloupe scored first and scored last en route to a 2:1 victory at the Orange Bowl in Miami, FL. Jocelyn Angloma scored in the ninth minute and David Fleurival scored the winner in the 34 minute. Canada’s lone goal was scored by striker Ali Gerba in the 31st minute. With the loss, Canada’s career record stands at 11 wins, four draws and 10 losses in Gold Cup competition. Dwayne De Rosario, who created a few dangerous plays, earned his 40th career cap with the national team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpg75 Posted June 10, 2007 Author Share Posted June 10, 2007 Wow, that really sucks. Just when you think things are going smooth, whammo! It's almost ironic that we've morphed from a strong defensive country with a robotic offence to a technically strong, flashy team with a loose, mistake prone defence. First goal, bad. You just can't make mistakes like that at this level. Second goal, we just didn't close down the shooter. But credit where it's due, that was a good shot by Fleurival. Nice setup by ?? to Ali Gerba. That was a simple play and exploited a lapse on the Guade defence. I think we just tried to do too much sometimes and just didn't get some bounces. Anyways, it's not the end of the world. I still think we can beat Haiti on Monday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Ref Posted June 10, 2007 Share Posted June 10, 2007 Did I say keep Hart? I changed my mind, Hart is an idiot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Beaver Posted June 10, 2007 Share Posted June 10, 2007 Hugely disappointing, but a good experience for a fairly inexperienced bunch. The first goal was a classic communication error between two players who have not played a single game together--Hastings and Sutton. (But a killer finish, too). The second goal was a defensive breakdown--right out of the midfield--followed by another killer finish. Playing these sorts of games are tough for us because we are used to being on the other side, sopping up pressure from the opposing team and countering. We have to learn to be patient, to break down opposition sides who bunker etc. As painful as it was to watch this game, it should be a kick in the pants for our lads, and a bit of a learning experience for coach and players alike. 4-4-2 would have made more sense, and would have likely prevented the second goal. Lack of finishing didn't help either, though we did not have the sort of clear chances we had against the Ticos. Our lack of height certainly was evident tonight, among other things. i think the guys fought hard--they just had few clues as how to play this sort of team and this sort of game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JPB Posted June 10, 2007 Share Posted June 10, 2007 The problem, first and foremost, was poor coaching. No doubt the original idea was for Canada to win with a possession game and to hold back to save something for the next game. Score a goal and then sit on the lead. In other words, just show up and assume the three points. No team of players -- as an entire unit -- plays the way that Canada played in the first half unless instructed to do so from the bench. Slow. Overly tentative with the passing even within shooting range. This was a case of the players being faithful to The Plan. In the second half the players were clearly distracted. By the frustration with the squandered 45 minutes that should have seen them take the lead and rush to run up the score. (Kill the clock later, first get the lead. Duh. Much smacking of forehead.) Distracted by the lack of leadership from the bench as soon as Gauadaloupe scored that first goal. No change in tactics was enforced by the coach who seemed to sit on his hands as if he was just a spectator. Distracted, also, by dissension in the ranks, I'd speculate, based on all of that. And, of course, distracted by the expectation that Guadaloupe would use the anti-football tactics of killing the clock and deflating the game. Distracted when that inevitably was played out right under the nose of the officials who acted more like accomplices than guardians of the rules and the spirit of the beautiful game. Add to that the knawing self-incrimination based on Canada having played to kill the clock in the first half -- even while down a goal -- with slow passing, slow running, and barely a convincing intent to leave their own half of the pitch. That distraction was all over their faces. It was manifest in the lack of a single shot on goal during the last twenty minutes -- from about the time the goalie stopped the game with his injury time. There was a rugby style tackle in the last few minutes that deserved a yellow card, at least, and the player got nothing -- not even a foul. The Canadian coach seemed to be unable to make the effort to put forth a protest. The Canadian players seemed to be so dejected, even resigned to poor officiating, that the Guadaloupe players seemed to be genuinely surprised at their good fortune. At half time I commented to all and sundry that the game was destined for either a goal scoring frenzy by both sides -- Canada dominating but Guadaloupe striking back with counter attacks -- or it was going to be deflated and listless. No middle ground in these tournaments. Canada did not have the leadership to forebear the indignities and the team became distracted by everything -- everything. I thought that Guadaloupe was well-coached and their rope-a-dope strategy was flexible enough to include a change of tactics half way through the second half. They were focussed. Guadaloupe has a good counter attack which was based on making 2-3 passes upfield and then shooting -- from wherever possible -- leaving it really up to the third man to make the most of the fast transition. That stood out all the more because Canada made their approach far too predictable with such a deliberately ponderous build-up -- or not really a build-up, more like a build-down with no threat at the other end. Attacks were too often self-extinguished by an extra pass or a frivolously too-slick attempt at a cute move. Canada was reluctant to shoot -- even when opportunities arose -- and took no half chances to force the retreated Guadaloupe defence to react. The team should have repeated the effort that resulted in the one Canadian goal. Pass to the flank. Quick movement to the top of the danger zone. Hold and shoot, no hesitation. As much as one might hope that the players on the field would over-ride the coach and do it attack through purely individualized effort, there seemed to be tension between players on the field. Too many looked confused for that to have been due to lack of effort on their part. Unfortunately, as much as this loss will cause nightmares for Hart, it is also something that most coaches go through when stepping up to the leadership on the larger stage. Maybe he will bounce back and bring his team back to the pitch with a stronger strategy, renewed unity, and he will stick his neck out for them. This next game has become HIS test of leadership. A tie against Haiti is not good enough. A loss would be a disaster. But given what we've seen even before this game, a three-way tie for second was always a good possibility with this Group. Canada seemed to have played down to that expectation. It is up to the coach, and I would also expect Salteri as team captain, to redeem this national team at the earliest opportunity -- against Haiti and not in some dismal result that gets them through based on a third place finish. If not now, when? The players do have their pride. They sacrfice to put on the jersey and to walk onto the pitch despite the lousy experiences. They are very good atheletes with excellent skills. But none of that amounts to much without leadership. The coach supplies that. It is too bad that there was not a large crowd of Canadian supporters in the stands to sing "You'll Never Walk Alone" to remind and to instill wreckless determination. Guadaloupe's team work (even the bad sportsmanship that the officials let them get away with) is an example of how leadership wins games in tournies like this. Opportunism is the name of the game that they play. But it takes strong leadership to grab opportunities and make the very most of the gifts of Providence. I am quite sure that Guadaeloupe expected to get into a scoring race -- with a result as high as they had when they played Martinique a few months ago. A shoot out. But when Canada backed-off, Guadaloupe settled in for a fairly easy defensive posture that kept their "injured" goalie idle for the last half of the second half. Easy in terms of execution; difficult in terms of effort and stick-to-it-ness. Like I said, they looked rather surprised. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kibby Posted June 10, 2007 Share Posted June 10, 2007 Ah f*vk u gotta be kidding me.. i was out all day and night... we lost to guadelope??? are u serious? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Juby Posted June 10, 2007 Share Posted June 10, 2007 ohhh god, just got off work expecting so much and ohh god Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
youllneverwalkalone Posted June 10, 2007 Share Posted June 10, 2007 who invited these assholes anyway? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winnipeg Fury Posted June 10, 2007 Share Posted June 10, 2007 Very depressing. Nothing positive to say except great goal by Gerba, who scored his third goal for Canada. The heat definetly took it's toll in the second half. By the 75th mniute, our legs were gone. Would kill for a rematch vs Guadeloupe. The CSA owes us after this humiliation. We need to shake it off and regroup for Haiti. Fortunetly for Canada, we are still in second place in this group and can clinch first place with a victory vs Haiti. (Haiti was lucky to draw CR. They have no defence, but a solid goalie). We are also the second game on Monday, so hopefully it will have cooled off a bit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kibby Posted June 10, 2007 Share Posted June 10, 2007 was this a lucky result? did we get outplayed? did we hit alot of posts? were we horrendous? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Juby Posted June 10, 2007 Share Posted June 10, 2007 quote:Originally posted by Massive Attack This game will not count on our FIFA ranking. I remembered this and couldn't stop laughing, who would have thought before the game this could be a good thing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Massive Attack Posted June 10, 2007 Share Posted June 10, 2007 I really don't want to comment on the game itself, because smarter people than me have already done so. Just wanted to say that I'm not ready to jump off any bridges, this is nothing new for a Canadian soccer fan. By the way JPG75, I still expect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.