CF Montreal - 2023 Season Thread

[narduch]

41 minutes ago, costarg said:

Without being a fan of some of the antics, I really feel bad for Saputo.  No one from any angle will give the guy a break or even give him a fair shot at respect which he's earned.  No one in Quebec has come close to doing anything near what Joey has done for Soccer in Quebec.

He pays millions in land tax for land he doesn't even own, and the mayor is on record saying she doesn't feel bad for the billionaire, meanwhile the Als and Canadiens get help and everyone wants to help the Expos come back.

He was having a great time with the Impact, built a contender quickly with a mix of local talent as well as with this own culture.  He was present and having a blast hanging out with his buddies. Media and the fans forced him to let them go, then they still pestered him for being too present on the field after games (which he still does for Bologna) some team fans would love to see that.  Yes the locker room stuff was too much, but it doesn't need to be so extreme to the other side.

Media treated him like absolute shit from day one, from trying desperately to find links to organized crime to accusing him of favouring Italian players, branding him the immigrant and clearly resenting his families success.

There is soo much more.  The man and team deserved better.  Not sure what the next steps are, but he's clearly lost interest.  A sale would not be surprising.

The irony here is that Bologna fans essentially complained about the opposite situation.

Which led to Saputo moving his family to Italy.

[brianjc]

58 minutes ago, costarg said:

There is soo much more.  The man and team deserved better.  Not sure what the next steps are, but he's clearly lost interest.  A sale would not be surprising.

But to who???

Let's not forget that Saputo had to step back in to save the Impact in 2001 when Ionian Financial Group and Strato Gavriil walked away from owning the team (Gavriil was arrested for defrauding investors in the 2000s, now works for Mattel)

Just a thought.

[costarg]

2 hours ago, narduch said:

The irony here is that Bologna fans essentially complained about the opposite situation.

Which led to Saputo moving his family to Italy.

His family moved?  I had no idea.  That would actually make sense and could explain much of his absence.

[costarg]

1 hour ago, brianjc said:

But to who???

No idea!  From a business perspective it doesn't seem to make much sense.  Just the stadium situation is bonkers.  It would be like buying a house at full list price, but you don't own it, you're actually paying rent, upkeep and the full tax bill! 

At least Joey joined the MLS at the perfect moment and increased the paper value of the team.  However cashing out is a different story, unless a new owner would buy to move the team.

[narduch]

1 hour ago, costarg said:

His family moved?  I had no idea.  That would actually make sense and could explain much of his absence.

Yes they moved around the start of the Serie A season.

And based on a quick Twitter search he has become a bit of a minor local celebrity now.

Also I think one of his kids is in the Bologna academy now.

Edited October 24, 2023 by narduch

[An Observer]

7 hours ago, costarg said:

His family moved?  I had no idea.  That would actually make sense and could explain much of his absence.

Bologna is a nice and very livable university town with a great food scene. I could see the appeal of living there.  

[phil03]

12 hours ago, costarg said:

Without being a fan of some of the antics, I really feel bad for Saputo.  No one from any angle will give the guy a break or even give him a fair shot at respect which he's earned.  No one in Quebec has come close to doing anything near what Joey has done for Soccer in Quebec.

He pays millions in land tax for land he doesn't even own, and the mayor is on record saying she doesn't feel bad for the billionaire, meanwhile the Als and Canadiens get help and everyone wants to help the Expos come back.

He was having a great time with the Impact, built a contender quickly with a mix of local talent as well as with this own culture.  He was present and having a blast hanging out with his buddies. Media and the fans forced him to let them go, then they still pestered him for being too present on the field after games (which he still does for Bologna) some team fans would love to see that.  Yes the locker room stuff was too much, but it doesn't need to be so extreme to the other side.

Media treated him like absolute shit from day one, from trying desperately to find links to organized crime to accusing him of favouring Italian players, branding him the immigrant and clearly resenting his families success.

There is soo much more.  The man and team deserved better.  Not sure what the next steps are, but he's clearly lost interest.  A sale would not be surprising.

I globally agree, but I have a somewhat more positive take on comparing the support the team got from the state with other sports and a potential business case for someone else to buy.

Basically, the support the Als and the Habs got was sometimes ago, when public opinion was just more open to it. The same is true for much of the Expos talk, really (honestly, I'd make the case Baseball has broadly fallen outside of mainstream save for the GTA, because of the Jays, and a few pockets here and there in Canada). These days the attempts of the Als to get help are facing even more obstacles then what the Impact is dealing with, hence Peladeau and the CFL swallowing their pride and trying to make the Als the second CFL team to be junior tenants to a soccer club. 

I also do think the business case for buying them is not so bad once an at least functional deal is reached stadium-wise (and there is no point for Saputo to sell before, it would just lower what he is going to get significantly, even for a hypothetical move since he can ask more in that scenario) if he can point out that things are fine in MTL). The main issue in term of revenue is the size of the stadium, with a larger building that is solved, and the sales profit coming from the development club model are already helping a lot anyway. Moreover, the MLS is still growing in status fairly fast, so ods the value of the franchise will keep going significantly up, even if not as astronomically as in the last decade. The Impact is unlikely to ever be a cash cow but when all of that is put together it can be comfortably in the black.

Moreover, when he does talk in public, whether for Impact-related stuff or otherwise, Saputo does give the vibe of someone who, for all that he might be less into building the club then before, is still quite attached to it in a ''its my baby'' and/or ''it will be a great first line in my obituary'' kind of way. Its obviously hard to gauge these things, and there has been owners who were thought done with teams that where still 100% onboard and others who everyone thought happy who wanted to get rid of their clubs, but I highly doubt he'd sell to someone who want to move it. That would be a key legacy of his crumbling before his eyes.

I'd also argue that the development club model aligns with that: it basically allow him to still own the club either indefinitely or until he can find someone who want to throw more money to build it up in Montréal without having to dig into his wallet.

[Moldy9]

For anyone wanting a good laugh on a compressed version of Tony Marinaro’s rant tearing into CF Montreal’s 2023 season have a look at this video:

 

[costarg]

1 minute ago, Moldy9 said:

For anyone wanting a good laugh on a compressed version of Tony Marinaro’s rant tearing into CF Montreal’s 2023 season have a look at this video:

 

Heard this yesterday, man that's harsh and one-sided.  Marinaro and Filosa have declared jihad on Saputo.  Their reporting is not just reporting, it's seems personal.   

[RS]

1 hour ago, costarg said:

Heard this yesterday, man that's harsh and one-sided.  Marinaro and Filosa have declared jihad on Saputo.  Their reporting is not just reporting, it's seems personal.   

Filosa seems to have lost his MLS/Apple gig because of it.

 

[costarg]

1 hour ago, RS said:

Filosa seems to have lost his MLS/Apple gig because of it.

 

Wow, yet not incredibly surprised.  Definitely over the line and under the belt stuff from Filosa as well as Marinaro.  Without picking sides - cause everyone carries some blame in this thing - I'm pretty confident CFM and Saputo could win a defamation case with the stuff they were spewing.

[red card]

1 hour ago, costarg said:

Wow, yet not incredibly surprised.  Definitely over the line and under the belt stuff from Filosa as well as Marinaro.  Without picking sides - cause everyone carries some blame in this thing - I'm pretty confident CFM and Saputo could win a defamation case with the stuff they were spewing.

It's more par for the course for major North American pro sports leagues. They have final say on who gets to be the commentators for their games. The NFL is most hands-on about providing approval and removing consent. Given MLS has been following the NFL business model, they're just following their mentor's footsteps in firing Filosa. 

Filosa's mistake was not reading MLS HR Policies after he got hired for Season Pass. He would have then realized he needed to self-censor himself and move to toeing the corporate happy talk mantra. Talking about CFM's missteps and reading disparging third-party social media posts don't offer any grounds for lawsuits but it does mean you can't be a MLS made man anymore.

Edited October 25, 2023 by red card

[narduch]

I wonder if the plan next year is to only do Montreal games in French and this is part of it 

[costarg]

51 minutes ago, red card said:

Talking about CFM's missteps and reading disparging third-party social media posts don't offer any grounds for lawsuits but it does mean you can't be a MLS made man anymore.

The third party social media bit was one part of this show, but the previous shows were his own personal views and he went really low and personal there too.  This is not reporting, it was purely one-sided attacks to fit his agenda.  Claims like "He made money on selling players, spend it!" and "why wasn't he at the game?" isn't reporting.  Maybe Saputo had a bday party in Italy, either way, it's none of Tony or Jeremy's business where Saputo is or what he does with his money.  They've been reduced to shock jocks, kinda sad. 

[Ansem]

CPL/Onesoccer should hire Filosa. Despite being CPL critic, his following his undeniable and they'd follow him covering CPL. Have him being the French analysts for games too. Hopefully the league thinks about it.

[red card]

Filosa was on TVA Sports JiC last night. They showed a reply from MLS Chief Communications Officer saying no club has a say in hiring/firing a commentator but it is done by League office production team.

Filosa was puzzled why he was let go since all his games involved Whitecaps where there was no criticism of his work. 

World Soccer Talk opines: 

..this raises concerns about Apple and MLS’s willingness to offer honest commentary. Instead, it opts to protect relationships and branding, creating a very sterile experience...By allegedly punishing a commentator for comments he made on social media, it encourages other MLS Season Pass commentators to conform.

If the allegations are true, rather than defend free speech, Apple and/or MLS chose to drop Filosa. This perceived capitulation to MLS interests could significantly damage Apple’s reputation as an independent media provider. The tech giant looks weak allowing outside pressure to dictate business decisions and editorial standards. It certainly sheds a negative light on MLS for being unable to endure any criticism of its product.

If true, this raises dire concerns about commentators’ freedom to question leagues and teams without censorship. Fans stand to lose independent perspectives while teams control narratives. Unlike traditional media, Apple is not a journalistic outlet with policies protecting reporters. Thus, Filosa was an easy target for Montreal seeking to silence negativity, however valid or invalid it may seem.

From one view, Filosa showed courage by exposing how Montreal manipulated MLS and/or Apple and limited speech. On the other hand, some fans argue he should have known inflammatory comments could threaten his contract with an image-conscious sponsor. 

Those close to Filosa cite passion as both an asset and an occasional liability. While often critical, he cares deeply about Montreal’s success. By gagging Filosa, Montreal loses a candid voice with insider team knowledge. This fuels perceptions the club is thin-skinned, fearing reasonable critiques. 

https://worldsoccertalk.com/tv/mls-wont-renew-announcer-who-criticized-league-says-talent-20231026-WST-464810.html

[costarg]

31 minutes ago, red card said:

Filosa was on TVA Sports JiC last night. They showed a reply from MLS Chief Communications Officer saying no club has a say in hiring/firing a commentator but it is done by League office production team.

Filosa was puzzled why he was let go since all his games involved Whitecaps where there was no criticism of his work. 

World Soccer Talk opines: 

..this raises concerns about Apple and MLS’s willingness to offer honest commentary. Instead, it opts to protect relationships and branding, creating a very sterile experience...By allegedly punishing a commentator for comments he made on social media, it encourages other MLS Season Pass commentators to conform.

If the allegations are true, rather than defend free speech, Apple and/or MLS chose to drop Filosa. This perceived capitulation to MLS interests could significantly damage Apple’s reputation as an independent media provider. The tech giant looks weak allowing outside pressure to dictate business decisions and editorial standards. It certainly sheds a negative light on MLS for being unable to endure any criticism of its product.

If true, this raises dire concerns about commentators’ freedom to question leagues and teams without censorship. Fans stand to lose independent perspectives while teams control narratives. Unlike traditional media, Apple is not a journalistic outlet with policies protecting reporters. Thus, Filosa was an easy target for Montreal seeking to silence negativity, however valid or invalid it may seem.

From one view, Filosa showed courage by exposing how Montreal manipulated MLS and/or Apple and limited speech. On the other hand, some fans argue he should have known inflammatory comments could threaten his contract with an image-conscious sponsor. 

Those close to Filosa cite passion as both an asset and an occasional liability. While often critical, he cares deeply about Montreal’s success. By gagging Filosa, Montreal loses a candid voice with insider team knowledge. This fuels perceptions the club is thin-skinned, fearing reasonable critiques. 

https://worldsoccertalk.com/tv/mls-wont-renew-announcer-who-criticized-league-says-talent-20231026-WST-464810.html

This is exactly what FIlosa wants, pity and attention.  He is not a journalist/reporter any more than Fox is a news outlet.  Filosa is a fan that is trying to make money doing something he loves.  He only reports his feelings, there is no two sides of the story.

There is a lot of shit being written about this, a lot of people are criticizing CFM for their role here without really knowing if CFM is even involved.  Regardless of Apple controlling the negative press or not, if Apple is looking for any kind of solid reporting based on facts, Filosa is not that person.  He's unprofessional and turns off anyone who's interested in more than negativity and a shock jock. 

[phil03]

Quebecor, of which TVA is a part, has a massive beef with Apple in general and the Impact in particular since the end of last year, as showing MTL's games was the main show (sorry Als!) of TVA sports when the Habs were off during the summer. Peladeau, Quebecor's owner, is known for both holding grudges and for, intentionally or not, having those affect the editorial line of his media. In those circumstances, TVA sports bashing Apple and defending their former employer was to be expected.

On hiring Filosa to cover CPL's game, I am skeptical. He is definitely known among Impact fans but I wouldn't say he has a following, so to speak, and his over-the-top criticisms are not particularly popular among a good segment of them...

Moreover, and although that might be more for a CPL thread, it does feel like a convoluted solution instead of a very simple one. If you want to have more French-Canadian fans give the CPL a shot you just need to be better at bilingualism and provide more French content.

Of course, not having a CPL team in a French-majority area doesn't help but I'd argue decades of having French-Canadian Hockey fans support the Sens when the Habs are out and the former are still kicking show (and the same being kinda true about any non-Leafs Canadian NHL team, really) it isn't necessarily needed to achieve something with them. What is needed is for the CPL to understand that if you wrap yourself in the flag embracing the country's bilingualism is a big part of that. Make the marketing, the logos, the trophies, and the like in both languages. Make your website bilingualism. The same is true for OneSoccer: they have made a good start by having the games themselves commented in French but continuing on that road by adding French-speaking punditry alongside their English-speaking one would do much good. Ottawa has shown that if you put in the effort with French-speaking fans you are going to get results, but you do need to put in the minimum effort...

[phresh]

 

[red card]

Filosa was on Marinaro's podcast to tell his side of the story.

Filosa: Pleaded for his job. But MLS said no conversation to be had. Deleted tweet thread was the problem which he actually deleted while on the phone with MLS. He has no issues with league & Caps.

Should he have let this one go, not spoken about it? Overwhelming message from people was that it was tough but fair. MLS is better deserved when reporters call it like it is. MLS would be better off dealing with the issues in Montreal rather than the people talking about it.

Since announcement, Filosa has gotten lots of support from current/former CFM players, Canadian national team players, Canadian & US media circles & Canadiens/Als management. 

Marinaro: Was told earlier in the season by CFM that Filosa was persona non grata. Was told previously by MLS that clubs are consulted on which broadcasters should be hired. MLS should come out and say anti-club social media posts violate their policies. Filosa produced the best soccer coverage ever seen in the history of Montreal. Filosa is one of the few left who works for the fans rather than the clubs. 

Nick De Santis: Negative feedback hurts but part of the game. Now it seems the club can’t handle any level of negativity. Filosa did his job but speaking the truth isn’t always the best thing to do. 

 

[Ozzie_the_parrot]

There's a reason that Jimmy Brennan & Co never say anything controversial on Onesoccer. When the league is linked closely to the broadcaster in a webstream package sort of way it's a good move not to bite the hand that feeds you. I guess Jeremy Filosa had been used to a more traditional broadcasting environment previously where the broadcaster and the sports team are not so closely linked?

[phil03]

3-2 against a Miami without Messi but with plenty of his buddies with massive careers. It definitely wasn't the cleanest of win but we are like life in Jurassic Park: we find a way

[costarg]

27 minutes ago, phil03 said:

3-2 against a Miami without Messi but with plenty of his buddies with massive careers. It definitely wasn't the cleanest of win but we are like life in Jurassic Park: we find a way

Agreed, it wasn't pretty, but can't complain with the massive result.  There could have been a lot more goals at both ends.