Black Wednesday -- the CSA protest

[Ivan]

Not crazy about the idea but I will wear a black shirt with a red maple leaf and encourage my friends to do so as well.

[Winnipeg Fury]

quote:Originally posted by Ivan

Not crazy about the idea but I will wear a black shirt with a red maple leaf and encourage my friends to do so as well.

Just because 20,000 aren't going to wear black will not make it a failure. There will probably be enough people wearing black that the casual fan will start to ask questions and become informed. That in itself is a positive.

Hopefully the U-Sector and RPB will wear black. Even if one section wore black, every person in the stadium (and watching on TV) would start to ask 'why?'

I haven't read the numerous posts, but have you informed the U-sector and RPB's ? The U-Sector in particular I can see being involved, as they have always been Canada fans.

[ag futbol]

quote:

The fact of the matter is this: 99% of the people who post on this forum are fans of Canadian soccer. I'm tired of having newbs coming onto our forum and acting so indignant to the real fans that have shown passion of the game in Canada for years.

So being a real fan of Canadian soccer means having a large post count on the V's board? I think a few of the new people on the board are tired of being called "not a fan" by the old guard.

People are going to have different opinions on matters relating to soccer. Doesn't make them any less of the fan. Pretty much every demographic on this site uses the "you're not fan" card when they see someone else's opinion they don't like. It's pretty pathetic.

[Massive Attack]

quote:Originally posted by ag futbol

So being a real fan of Canadian soccer means having a large post count on the V's board? I think a few of the new people on the board are tired of being called "not a fan" by the old guard.

People are going to have different opinions on matters relating to soccer. Doesn't make them any less of the fan. Pretty much every demographic on this site uses the "you're not fan" card when they see someone else's opinion they don't like. It's pretty pathetic.

I actually have no problem with new members joining the forum. I also think the forum would be boring if people didn't have differing opinions. What I take issue with are members who only post about one issue - CSA bashing. CSA bashing is well deserved, but if you really want to earn my respect, a poster has to stick around and also post in soccer related threads. That's all I'm asking for. If a poster comes on this forum to only talk about one agenda, then I have little respect for them, and I question what agenda they have.

You are an example of a member that I have time for. I've seen your posts on BS and U-Sector and I know that you care about more than CSA bashing. You post on TFC/MLS issues as well as this topic.

I hope you can understand the difference I am trying to portray.

[ag futbol]

quote:Originally posted by Massive Attack

I actually have no problem with new members joining the forum. I also think the forum would be boring if people didn't have differing opinions. What I take issue with are members who only post about one issue - CSA bashing. CSA bashing is well deserved, but if you really want to earn my respect, a poster has to stick around and also post in soccer related threads. That's all I'm asking for. If a poster comes on this forum to only talk about one agenda, then I have little respect for them, and I question what agenda they have.

You are an example of a member that I have time for. I've seen your posts on BS and U-Sector and I know that you care about more than CSA bashing.

I can definately agree with you that some people are here for a singular purpose. Sorry if that seemed harsh, but I really hate the you're not a fan arguement, regardless of who it is used on.

[JB_Tito]

quote:Originally posted by Massive Attack

Haha, Jeffrey S. and G-L both being accused of being CSA lackies by the same newbie that knows sfa.

I love what happens to this forum when ever a disaster happens in Canadian soccer. All the agenda-driven people who care more about their own agendas than Canadian soccer come out of the woodwork. All the dedicated fans that have been posting for years get called out for not accomplishing anything. A few months later, these same **** disturbers will disappear, while the rest of us will still be here, discussing friendlies, Canadians abroad, meeting up for national team matches, distributing scarves, sharing video of Canadians in action, picking our best XI, and of course, bitching about the CSA (which isn't a new topic here).

The fact of the matter is this: 99% of the people who post on this forum are fans of Canadian soccer. I'm tired of having newbs coming onto our forum and acting so indignant to the real fans that have shown passion of the game in Canada for years.

Sorry, I needed to get that out of my system.

It is OK evreybody needs that from time to time.

You know sometimes changes happened because of **** disturbers, instead of bitching all the time about CSA I'm trying to do something about it. I did my part by sending tons of emails to several MPs and CSA members, now I'm allowed to bitch.

[Duane Rollins1555362254]

quote:Originally posted by Massive Attack

I'm tired of having newbs coming onto our forum and acting so indignant to the real fans that have shown passion of the game in Canada for years.

Sorry, I needed to get that out of my system.

The first two things I did when I got on the internet more than a decade ago was search for information on Canadian university football and on Canadian soccer.

I've been a member of this board since May 2003. I posted on the other board a couple years before that.

I don't have 4,000 posts, but I've been here a long time and I'll be here long from now.

I'm legitimately baffled that some people think this is somehow disrespectful to the players. They are taking a narrow view in my opinion.

G-L reacted to a pi$sy post of mine with a pi$sy post of his own. I'm fine with that. I respect his opinion even though I'm strongly opposed to it in this particular case

Jeffrey is convinced that his feces lacks odor. The rest of us know that something stinks about him and his attitude.

[Moosehead]

I would suggest saying something positive in the banner as well. Such as WE SUPPORT THE TEAM BUT NOT THE CSA.

[Massive Attack]

quote:Originally posted by MediaGuy

The first two things I did when I got on the internet more than a decade ago was search for information on Canadian university football and on Canadian soccer.

I've been a member of this board since May 2003. I posted on the other board a couple years before that.

I don't have 4,000 posts, but I've been here a long time and I'll be here long from now.

I'm legitimately baffled that some people think this is somehow disrespectful to the players. They are taking a narrow view in my opinion.

G-L reacted to a pi$sy post of mine with a pi$sy post of his own. I'm fine with that. I respect his opinion even though I'm strongly opposed to it in this particular case

Jeffrey is convinced that his feces lacks odor. The rest of us know that something stinks about him and his attitude.

My post wasn't meant to get all posters with lower post counts to start giving me their fan resumes.

I know who you are from this and other forums.

I just needed to vent about posters who joined this week that will not be on this forum in 3 months time.

I'm still on the fence about what I will wear on Sept. 12. I'm leaning towards a black shirt, as my scarf will be red anyway.

I may also make a bristol board poster.

[Duane Rollins1555362254]

quote:Originally posted by Moosehead

I would suggest saying something positive in the banner as well. Such as WE SUPPORT THE TEAM BUT NOT THE CSA.

To be clear, what we are trying to do is to create a full media blitz around this. Our message will be "We have the talent. The CSA is holding us back." Also, this is not a one-off thing. We aim to keep the pressure on.

We are trying to set up a meeting next week where we will bash out three or four message points.

We are not going to use the Vs name because we respect that not everyone will agree with us. We will be a coalition of Vs/RPB/U-Sector. Our soul purpose will be to advocate for change in the CSA. As such, we won't be a supporters group.

My e-mail is posted in this thread. I've already had a few contact me. I invite more.

[JB_Tito]

quote:Originally posted by Massive Attack

My post wasn't meant to get all posters with lower post counts to start giving me their fan resumes.

I know who you are from this and other forums.

I just needed to vent about posters who joined this week that will not be on this forum in 3 months time.

You see that is your problem. I’m very active in other forums like RPB,NEE and U Sector but with different name, I’m not here for a glory of how many post i will have on my account registered few days ago but I’m reading this forums for few years. Reason I‘m involved now is simply to help to get rid of CSA board. We didn't have chance like this before, with media writing about it, game in less than two weeks, believe me there are many fans outside this forum willing to do something and you can’t ignore them just because they are not on this forum. We have to get fans outside this forum outside the RPB,NEE, U Sector forums involved.

CMNT have black jerseys we can war these ones too, so everybody will be happy. Black, and still behind our boys on the pitch.

[RealGooner]

How about covering the entire South Stand railing in black. That would be highly visible and peopel can then choose to wear red.

[shaku_bert]

I think the plain black thing is a good idea for a lot of reasons. Everyone has black gear so no-one has to make any effort. If anyone in the media picks up on the "wear black", which is likely as we have noticed that they certainly read this board, some traction could come from the plan as it is easy for casual fans to get on board. As it was noted previously, people not wearing black will notice what's up and ask about it and hopefully get educated about the evils of the CSA. Wearing black has absolutely nothing about not supporting the players, some of whom also read the board and will be cognizant of what is up. Throw some black banners from the more zealous hard-core fans and I think a statement will be made.

Re: Jeffrey S., I think folks need to chill out. We've seem him react like this before.

http://redwing.hutman.net/%7Emreed/warriorshtm/jekylhyde.htm

The fact that he drops the occassional bomb means less than what he contributes to the forum on a regular basis. Almost everyone has posted when they're gunned, or PO'd and then regrets it later.

[loyola]

quote:Originally posted by shaku_bert

http://redwing.hutman.net/%7Emreed/warriorshtm/jekylhyde.htm

This link is great.

[ray]

I applaud all of you who are trying to get out the message that there needs to be change at the CSA. Whether it is chants, black shirts or black banners is not that important. There is not ONE right way to do things.

However, change will have to come from a combination of public pressure and good people inside the CSA that want change for the better. The government and Sport Canada are not in a position to push for change even if they wanted. So all the more reason to show dissatisfaction.

[Duane Rollins1555362254]

quote:Originally posted by Jeffrey S.

I just want to say that the main reason there has not been a unified Voyageurs statement on this issue, however general, is because in the middle of developing one, with El Hombre incorporating ideas from quite a few posters, someone came along and did not respect the process. I do not have a problem with folks expressing their ideas, but the fact is that we have not put out a statement because Media Guy decided he was not going to respect the ongoing process already started and would grandstand. And even though a minority of people, a considerable minority, liked his version better, we did not put out either or any to respect their views and not impose a Voyageurs position on the minority.

That is the exact opposite spirit Media Guy and others are showing here. Meaning they are happy when others respect them but could not care less to show the same courtesy to those very people.

I am not talking about being visceral, as I am that quite often. I am talking about looking for consensus and hearing out divergent opinions. The result is that there is no Voyageurs position on this, at least not officially, though some press are publishing one of the versions of a position.

As for those who do not think I have a right to opinionate because I live in Barcelona, or other versions on the theme, I will be sending you the mailing list sent out and responses from the last Voyageurs protest letter, if your contact info is available on this site. And then, after sifting through or throwing out those hundreds of personalized messages, you can explain to me why noone on the board protested about that letter being sent out to Canadian soccer community from a guy living in Barcelona. Or about the media response it got, which I dare say was the most widespread Canadian press reaction Voyageurs has ever got in their entire history.

Looking forward to the pots calling the kettle black on the 12th.

Jeffrey...you're on crack. Serious friggin' crack.

Grandstand?!?

Yes, Jeffrey. This is all about me.

[Duane Rollins1555362254]

AND NO ONE IS TWO WORDS.

[The Ref]

A great number of people wearing the same color shows unity and in this case the color black represents the overwhelming disapproval of the CSA board. It is a visible message that if the media is aware of what it represents, it will surely be talked about.

[L.T.]

I don't believe for a minute that the intent was to grandstand, but Jeffrey's got a point in that the submission of the second release effectively killed what up to that point was a fairly involved and communal effort.

I think we all need to realize that we will not always be in full agreement with the ideas that are proposed here. However, since The Voyageurs does not have a formal organizational structure or process for bringing these initiatives forward, we have to make do with what we have.

So whether it be El hombre with his release or MediaGuy with the BMO protest, let's share our ideas an our opinions on them. But to denigrate someone becuase their thinking does not line up with yours is counterproductive.

There are enough reasonably intelligent people on this forum that make me confident that nothing will go out as an official Voyageur position/action that would be detrimental to the game in this country. If something is truly potentially destructive, enough people will come out and say so.

If there are 1 or 2 objectors, then I would thank them for their input but move ahead anyway.

It may not be the best action to take, but 99 times out of a 100 it will do more good than harm, as long as we've all had a chance to provide input...

[JB_Tito]

Jeffrey ,

Why are you so concern about black Canada jerseys and us wearing black tshirts?

If you check some other forums you will see that idea is picking up.

Let's face it without RPB, U Sector, NEE the game protest would be almost impossible to achieve but since they are in we will do it one way or another. Black shirts, black banners.

U Sector is working on black banner "You can't spell FIASCO without CSA"

You can always do the other part with emails etc and help that way.

At the end of the day we all want the same better future for Canada soccer boys and girls.

ALL FOR ONE!!!

[CanadasBest]

quote:Originally posted by Jeffrey S.

Grandstanding again.

Can you guys just chill it down a bit? (Now i'm Grandstanding... And yes I checked, grandstanding is only one word)

Seriously though. I thought Jeffrey S. did a great job on the last press release. We certainly got the message out. MediaGuy also brought up some valid points about the latest press release. Wouldn't it be best to move forward here in a more constructive fashion?

[CanadasBest]

quote:Originally posted by JB_Tito

Jeffrey ,

Why are you so concern about black Canada jerseys and us wearing black tshirts?

If you check some other forums you will see that idea is picking up.

Let's face it without RPB, U Sector, NEE the game protest would be almost impossible to achieve but since they are in we will do it one way or another. Black shirts, black banners.

U Sector is working on black banner "You can't spell FIASCO without CSA"

You can always do the other part with emails etc and help that way.

At the end of the day we all want the same better future for Canada soccer boys and girls.

ALL FOR ONE!!!

"You can't spell FIASCO without CSA"

That is brilliant.

Well said on the rest of your post.

[Toronto MB]

Ok, so in an attempt to be pro-active about the situation at hand, here's how I see it.

Before we can send out the media release which will inherently have to be tied back to the Vee's in order to give it legitimacy, we do need to have the support of our own group, at least in a relative majority.

I think we all agree on the following:

- we want to execute as public and powerful a protest as possible against in an attempt to raise awarenees of the CSA's inadequacy

- we want an objective and unbiased review of the CSA and its practices to take place...in a similar fashion to the Crawford report

As Vee's, we are basically grassroots activists in this situation seeking to move our government to take action. We need to commit to one idea for this protest in unfied form.

I still stand by the dressed in black idea, but I also have immense respect for the contributions of GL and others who oppose the idea.

Bottom line is, we need to pick our method, and do it soon. I think Monday is a realistic target to send out the press release for whatever we will be doing.

I will be as impartial as possible in collecting all ideas and presnting the one with the greatest support as our unified choice.

And to those questionning my "experience" as a Voyageur, I have travelled, as a Voyageur, to Boston, Florida, Germany and across Canada supporting our boys and have been enjoying the information and characters on this forum for a good 7 years now.

I inivte all to chime in with ther ideas, and support or constructive criticism of potential choices.

Speak Voyageurs.

[Guest Jeffery S.]

I've deleted my posts on this thread. Don't want to be a spoiler and I am sure the media will be fine with the idea.

[DJones]

I like the "Men in Black" (and women) idea and the red card affect as well. I sure the players will totally understand the point, as do professional players overseas understand when their fans do these types of things at their club directors.

What about a march and a big black banner with a anti CSA slogan? Nothing get's media attention then a march to the ground. Here in Vancouver, everytime their is a march to protest the Olympics, the media is all over it. It works well in England (Man U fans protesting the Glazer takeover) and nothing puts wheels in motion better than media attention. Meet at a park close by and march to the game chanting in loud voices. Sound's very 60's ish but seems to work. Might want to let the media know before hand. Just keep it civilized as any bad publicity would take away from the real message!

Another thing to possible do is if a CSA member is introduced before the game, have everyone turn their backs in the stand. I doubt they'd have the balls to do that with this state of unrest.