Canadian Premier League

[matty]

5 hours ago, Ansem said:

No I don't know that. I said "harder" not impossible.

Very good Americans are oversee or in MLS. Those good enough in USL to crack a bench spot in MLS or on the right path are unlikely to risk a CPL move.

I'm sorry, but after we eliminate the elites, the top domestic tier in MLS and the average ones benching, what do you have left in terms of talent? Oh and MLS keeps on expending on top of that.

If they count as Internationals, Central Americans, Africans and South Americans makes more sense than Americans. Same logic applies in MLS, hence Canadians players barely being in that league.

How is the cpl a risk for them? If they succeed at the cpl level then mls will look at them more than usl.

Also the cpl will offer decent us players a chance to make more than the 70-90k a lot make in mls while leading a cheaper lifestyle than in many us cities. They can also return at any time

Mls expansion won't kill the fringe mls player pool likely.

Also we've gone over this: us pool is stronger than the central american and caribbean pool

[matty]

5 hours ago, Ansem said:

Really not surprising, it's already a daunting task to coach Canada, let alone without a league. It's a lot to ask someone to come here to fail without at least some tools to give him a chance to succeed.

This guy will be here 2 cycles at the very least.

Only if he earns it

5 hours ago, red card said:

Zambrano contract is up to Qatar. So, if we don't qualify, it is 1 cycle only.

Are you serious? Damn can't they let a guy prove himself first

[BringBackTheBlizzard]

34 minutes ago, Pat Carrasco said:

If I heard Anthony Totera correctly, it appears that the CSA may have promised the new coach of Canada's national men team a new pro league.

Not sure what this really amounts to. What else were they going to say when it is a publicly stated goal of the association?

[Ansem]

13 minutes ago, matty said:

How is the cpl a risk for them? If they succeed at the cpl level then mls will look at them more than usl.

Perhaps...If they don't succeed in CPL and end up being subs or benching, they will fall off the radar of MLS teams while being in the USL team keeps them in there. Higher risks but higher rewards because logically, if you can't start in CPL, forget about MLS

13 minutes ago, matty said:

Also the cpl will offer decent us players a chance to make more than the 70-90k a lot make in mls while leading a cheaper lifestyle than in many us cities. They can also return at any time

That salary is assuming they are that good. I don't disagree (to some extend) with the number of Americans on the bench, but starting? No way

13 minutes ago, matty said:

Mls expansion won't kill the fringe mls player pool likely.

In terms of number? no. Quality? Absolutely

13 minutes ago, matty said:

Also we've gone over this: us pool is stronger than the central american and caribbean pool

Bigger pool but better quality? Caribeean...depends where.

Central America? Not a chance. Don't let dual Americans on the national team trick you into thinking that it's a reflection of the quality of their pool. Klinsmann didn't think so either

[matty]

6 hours ago, Ansem said:

Perhaps...If they don't succeed in CPL and end up being subs or benching, they will fall off the radar of MLS teams while being in the USL team keeps them in there. Higher risks but higher rewards because logically, if you can't start in CPL, forget about MLS

I don't agree with start in CPL forget MLS. If it is a higher standard and you stand out then odds favour MLS wanting you. I see a lot of emerging Americans (and also Canadians) using CPL as a proving ground for why they belong on an MLS side. Sure they could fail but a successful CPL run could benefit them more than a USL one and I think MLS will agree.

6 hours ago, Ansem said:

That salary is assuming they are that good. I don't disagree (to some extend) with the number of Americans on the bench, but starting? No way

Again, I think MLS players of the mid level range will come here as it becomes harder to secure a spot that pays well in MLS. We're already seeing non-American line up and we know there's a massive difference between non-USMNT players and USMNT players in MLS and it's possibly phasing the non-USMNT players out with shitty pay. There are good guys in that group that would jump for an extra 10-20k.

6 hours ago, Ansem said:

In terms of number? no. Quality? Absolutely

I think this one is a bit more debatable. But there will still be real gems there.

6 hours ago, Ansem said:

Bigger pool but better quality? Caribeean...depends where.

Central America? Not a chance. Don't let dual Americans on the national team trick you into thinking that it's a reflection of the quality of their pool. Klinsmann didn't think so either

On average the US pool is better than Caribbean by far. We'll be able to find gems but I don't think it's a dependable pool

Central American it's again mostly the us that is better for what the CPL will pay. The average Costa Rica Premiera Liga player is lesser than the average MLS player and to get the goods from those leagues we'll have to compete with some rich clubs. Also look at the recent USU20MNT which won CONCACAF and tell me the pool is mega dependant on dual nationals for success. There's a lot of quality talent there that the CPL could pick up if it's available.

[Alex D]

Why is South America not on anyone's radar? Its the deepest pool of soccer players in the world. 

We could get players who aren't really on any big leagues radar and might be solid contributors to the CPL. We just have to offer them decent pay and a higher standard of living. 

[matty]

5 hours ago, Alex D said:

Why is South America not on anyone's radar? Its the deepest pool of soccer players in the world. 

We could get players who aren't really on any big leagues radar and might be solid contributors to the CPL. We just have to offer them decent pay and a higher standard of living. 

I picture it as a dp pool and part of what i called other.

We're mostly talking about pools the cpl could raid in its original build up

[Alex D]

You will find players of the same caliber, in the same price range, but way more plentiful in numbers in CONEMBOL compared to CONCACAF. They may just play in the Brazilian second division instead of the Honduran first division. 

[matty]

14 minutes ago, Alex D said:

You will find players of the same caliber, in the same price range, but way more plentiful in numbers in CONEMBOL compared to CONCACAF. They may just play in the Brazilian second division instead of the Honduran first division. 

True but there's also the fact we actually stand a decent chance of snagging Honduran national team players to play our guys against regularly and develop a better understanding of which is more useful than playing 2nd tier Brazilians.

We might also be able to weaken Central American and Caribbean league team pools to make CPL teams stronger in CCL play.

There's also a case to be made of what draws fans. There's some evidence in the States that teams with Mexican national team players draw better on TV than teams that lack them. Given its size in Canada (around 3% of the total population), it might be worth it to bring in Caribbean national team players to see if they can help CPL draw in the early days. We have after all seen Jamaican fans turn out in droves when Jamaica plays Canada in Canada and there was even a decently sized Dominica supporters' group when they played Canada in 2015.

All that said, there will likely be a large number of South American players in CPL (likely similar numbers to those from Central America and the Caribbean).

[Dub Narcotic]

1. It takes a lot of work and connections to scout and sign players from Central and South America properly, just look at Carl Robinson's gong show with the Whitecaps. If you are Atlanta United with Tata Martino you can sign solid A-/B+ guys onto DP deals but that won't be the case for most if not all of the CPL teams and I certainly don't think it will be worth pouring many resources into high risk scouting ventures in Latin countries. 

A more realistic source of talent that will be available are foreign players who go through the NCAA system and are mid first-round draft pick-level quality but don't get signed because they will use international spots. Aaron Nielsen at RNO has been banging this drum for years and I agree with him.

Teams in the CPL, if it happens under the rumored parameters, are going to look like the Fury and FC Edmonton but with worse depth.

 

2. You know that Victor Montagliani wants the CPL announcement done before he leaves for Miami. If it doesn't happen in the next six weeks then you have to think the league is not particularly close.

[Ansem]

3 minutes ago, Dub Narcotic said:

1. It takes a lot of work and connections to scout and sign players from Central and South America properly, just look at Carl Robinson's gong show with the Whitecaps. If you are Atlanta United with Tata Martino you can sign solid A-/B+ guys onto DP deals but that won't be the case for most if not all of the CPL teams and I certainly don't think it will be worth pouring many resources into high risk scouting ventures in Latin countries. 

A more realistic source of talent that will be available are foreign players who go through the NCAA system and are mid first-round draft pick-level quality but don't get signed because they will use international spots. Aaron Nielsen at RNO has been banging this drum for years and I agree with him.

Teams in the CPL, if it happens under the rumored parameters, are going to look like the Fury and FC Edmonton but with worse depth.

 

2. You know that Victor Montagliani wants the CPL announcement done before he leaves for Miami. If it doesn't happen in the next six weeks then you have to think the league is not particularly close.

You're too optimistic, could you be more pessimistic?

I cringe whenever I read someone who says that our salvation goes through Americans and their system. 

NCAA...really?

[Complete Homer]

10 minutes ago, Dub Narcotic said:

1. It takes a lot of work and connections to scout and sign players from Central and South America properly, just look at Carl Robinson's gong show with the Whitecaps. If you are Atlanta United with Tata Martino you can sign solid A-/B+ guys onto DP deals but that won't be the case for most if not all of the CPL teams and I certainly don't think it will be worth pouring many resources into high risk scouting ventures in Latin countries. 

I agree, I think it's a bit difficult for us fans to grasp the cost, risk, and unreliability of scouting. Easily translatable levels of play will make a lot of mid level Americans pretty attractive. 

That said, I think CPL would do just as well with light scouting of the Carribean and Central American, as the leverage lent by the high standard of living will do a lot more in that case than it will for Americans. Scouting a major tournament probably wouldn't be a huge burden

[Ansem]

39 minutes ago, Complete Homer said:

I agree, I think it's a bit difficult for us fans to grasp the cost, risk, and unreliability of scouting. Easily translatable levels of play will make a lot of mid level Americans pretty attractive. 

That said, I think CPL would do just as well with light scouting of the Carribean and Central American, as the leverage lent by the high standard of living will do a lot more in that case than it will for Americans. Scouting a major tournament probably wouldn't be a huge burden

This is a good article regarding scouts

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/the-agony-and-the-ecstasy/2016/apr/21/scouts-young-players-marcus-rashford-manchester-united

For CPL, it will come down to how much the teams are willing to spend in that area. History has proven it to be wise to spend there are you can build extremely competitive teams at a cheaper price when they are spot on.

Another wrestling reference:it comes down to the mighty dollar

[lazlo_80]

http://www.thespec.com/sports-story/7196653-ball-rolling-on-professional-soccer-in-hamilton/

[DannyFromToronto23]

The presidentOf the CSA sayst hat "more Than 10" potential Owners have expressed interest int the #CanPL 

[BringBackTheBlizzard]

We were told that there has been expression of interest in 12 cities before Christmas, so that's nothing new. Any word on whether he said anything about the league starting in 2018? I think that's the big thing we are all waiting to hear.

[matty]

7 hours ago, Ansem said:

You're too optimistic, could you be more pessimistic?

I cringe whenever I read someone who says that our salvation goes through Americans and their system. 

NCAA...really?

NCAA is a large pocket of unsigned that's seen some real talent emerge from it (including Canadains). I'd be shocked if there weren't a ton of NCAA guys and CIS guys signed to lower paying contacts or picking CPL over USL to make a bit for cash

Also anyone get the feeling the CSA might be the hold up rather than ownership?

[Pat Carrasco]

The Spec is now reporting that more than 10 potential owners have expressed interest in the impending national professional soccer league.

 

[jpg75]

17 hours ago, baulderdash77 said:

On the other hand of the cap is 1.5 million with a 40k minimum and  24 roster spots there's only 520k to pay guys above the league min for the whole team.

You have to think most of the 12-24 guys will be making the league minimum.  That really starts limiting where you get those players from.  The USL pool of played is the most abundant to fill out the bench. 

Is 24 roster spots something that's out in the blogosphere or something people are speculating about? 

[Gopherbashi]

Honestly, the biggest news from that article isn't that there's potentially ten interested owners; it's that they're getting publicly pessimistic about a 2018 launch.

Montagliani conceded that the new league is getting short on runway for a 2018 launch, but says it's still possible for it to begin play next year. He considers six the minimum number of franchises required to kick off a season.

[baulderdash77]

No I think it's clear the number of teams ready to launch is the issue.  Steve Milton is a respected and connected journalist.  Nobody is "on record" with the team list but I'm sure he's privy to off the record comments.  

Its also clear that they can't launch without 6 teams.  So it's pretty clearly inferred they have 5 teams ready to go.

"But we want to make sure that that first number, whatever it is, is solid. Some teams might not be ready to come in it in the first year, they might come in the second."

No one connected to the league has commented publicly on membership, but it's believed that core franchises would be located in Hamilton, Regina, Calgary, Ottawa and Edmonton, all CFL cities. The latter two have teams in second-tier U.S. leagues, Ottawa in the USL and Edmonton in the NASL. Other possible locations include Quebec City, Winnipeg and Halifax, which has expressed strong interest. It's also possible that MLS teams would want to enter their development teams in the league.

 

[baulderdash77]

That's 8 potential cities and investors, add in the 3 MLS teams who would all want to add a 2nd tier team (which they keep saying is a non starter) plus the 1 mystery Toronto investor that has Bill Manning so worked up about and we have 12 investors.

I think Milton's article clears up a lot of things.

[Rheo]

5 hours ago, lazlo_80 said:

http://www.thespec.com/sports-story/7196653-ball-rolling-on-professional-soccer-in-hamilton/

Thanks for this 

[BringBackTheBlizzard]

1 hour ago, Gopherbashi said:

Honestly, the biggest news from that article isn't that there's potentially ten interested owners; it's that they're getting publicly pessimistic about a 2018 launch.

Montagliani conceded that the new league is getting short on runway for a 2018 launch, but says it's still possible for it to begin play next year. He considers six the minimum number of franchises required to kick off a season.

Agreed, and Montagliani could easily be leaving it to his successor to make any negative announcement on that as he is out soon as CSA president. I suspect they needed Edmonton and Ottawa on board to be able to launch on that timeline and the problem they have is that the NASL didn't fold and Ottawa may have been able to purchase the FC Montreal franchise from the Impact. It wouldn't take much for the NASL's future to become untenable over the next few months, if for example San Fransisco follow a Rayo Oklahoma trajectory or another team announces it is defecting to USL when a lower exit fee kicks in, and that may be the scenario they are holding out hope for.

[Rheo]

Good to see you can still find the negative in anything lol.

Although kudos for the new spin of Vic delaying it to throw his successor under the bus.