Why a fully open ... Voyageurs Cup is needed to grow the game...

[Kent]

My biggest hope for the Voyageurs Cup is that it makes lots of money for the D3 teams, so that more D3 leagues will be enticed to sprout up across the country.

[Zem]

1 hour ago, Kent said:

My biggest hope for the Voyageurs Cup is that it makes lots of money for the D3 teams, so that more D3 leagues will be enticed to sprout up across the country.

I think the indirect impact of playing in the VC could be huge as well. Getting the opportunity to play against pro clubs every year could really help legitimize them to the local community and improve league attendance, especially in places where there isn't already a pro club nearby.

[Kurt-MTL]

What do you guys think of including the winner of the Challenge Cup? Add the PLSQ and L1O champs plus 8 CPL clubs plus 3 MLS clubs:  14 clubs open draw, 2-leg knock-out; 7 winners move on, highest seed (would be based on prior V-Cup results) gets a bye with 6 remaining playing another 2-leg knock-out, 3 winners join the highest seed and move to semi-final 2-leg knock-out with 2 winners playing in a cup final at the end?

[Kent]

4 hours ago, Kurt-MTL said:

What do you guys think of including the winner of the Challenge Cup? Add the PLSQ and L1O champs plus 8 CPL clubs plus 3 MLS clubs:  14 clubs open draw, 2-leg knock-out; 7 winners move on, highest seed (would be based on prior V-Cup results) gets a bye with 6 remaining playing another 2-leg knock-out, 3 winners join the highest seed and move to semi-final 2-leg knock-out with 2 winners playing in a cup final at the end?

I'm not against the winner of the Challenge Cup getting in, but my higher priority would be to have more PLSQ and L1O teams included.

[HfxCeltic]

Why aren't PDL teams like the foothills or Thunder Bay involved in the Voyageurs Cup?

[deschamp86]

19 minutes ago, HfxCeltic said:

Why aren't PDL teams like the foothills or Thunder Bay involved in the Voyageurs Cup?

I believe the reasoning was that they wanted PDL teams to join Canadian D3 leagues like L1O like FC London eventually did.

Unfortunately Foothills and Thunder Bay aren't located near a Canadian D3 league, but imagine that if they made concessions for them, it would set a poor precedent

[Kurt-MTL]

17 hours ago, Kent said:

I'm not against the winner of the Challenge Cup getting in, but my higher priority would be to have more PLSQ and L1O teams included.

Sure, would be cool to see the Challenge Cup winner plus all PLSQ/L1O teams (save the champs who could get a bye) in a preliminary round (would be 24 teams by my count as of right now).

[Rheo]

Dino Rossi’s ideal Voyageurs Cup set up 

 

[deschamp86]

Works well, but I still would prefer that MLS and CPL are on the same playing field if they are to be both considered Div 1A & B.

IMO 3 spots in second round should be previous Voyageurs Cup winner, Whichever CPL team is in first place by a certain date, Whichever MLS team is ranked highest by a certain date

[hamiltonfan]

CPL champion should earn spot in CONCACAF CL. Similar to MLS Cup and LH Open Cup for Yanks. 

[m-g-williams]

Surprisingly great video from Canada Soccer on the AS Blainville-Oakville match and the impact of opening up the V Cup. 
 

 

[Ansem]

On 5/23/2018 at 2:05 PM, Rheo said:

Dino Rossi’s ideal Voyageurs Cup set up 

 

I will always be against MLS teams entering later than CPL

[Zem]

Peter Montopoli was on the Ottawa-Blainville stream and said that due to fixture congestion next year's VC might not be a two-legged tournament. Since nothing's been officially announced yet he was very non-committal, so I imagine nothing is set in stone.

When asked about the possibility of the competition being expanded further into D3 in the future he seemed to imply that the venue issues this year weren't necessarily a problem, but that there would need to be improvement on that front before further D3 clubs can be added.

[Kent]

I know they didn’t play an MLS team, but it was nice to see Blainville record some respectable score lines (1-0, 1-0) after hearing some people say D3 teams would get slaughtered if they were playing in this tourney.

[Toronto Ruffrider]

2 hours ago, Zem said:

Peter Montopoli was on the Ottawa-Blainville stream and said that due to fixture congestion next year's VC might not be a two-legged tournament. Since nothing's been officially announced yet he was very non-committal, so I imagine nothing is set in stone.

When asked about the possibility of the competition being expanded further into D3 in the future he seemed to imply that the venue issues this year weren't necessarily a problem, but that there would need to be improvement on that front before further D3 clubs can be added.

This doesn't surprise me - the three MLS teams typically play four matches in the Voyageurs Cup (assuming they make it to the final round). If the competition is restructured into a single-legged knockout format, I could imagine the MLS teams playing roughly the same number of matches when going the distance (one quarterfinal, one semifinal, and perhaps a two-legged final).

What I find intriguing about the possibility of a single-elimination format is that it may lead to some real upsets. No team can afford to have an off night in such a competition - one bad game, and it's all over. It would be interesting to see how any of the three MLS teams would react to playing a single-knockout game in a CPL team's stadium.

[Blackdude]

Just wondering about this. If we have a single-leg knockout format, should we have something similar to the Davis Cup when drawing teams ie. the team that gets the home tie in the first match up would be playing away the next time? I think something like that would be interesting.

I dont think I'm 100% sold on the idea, but it's an idea that should be considered. 

[Kent]

4 hours ago, Blackdude said:

Just wondering about this. If we have a single-leg knockout format, should we have something similar to the Davis Cup when drawing teams ie. the team that gets the home tie in the first match up would be playing away the next time? I think something like that would be interesting.

I dont think I'm 100% sold on the idea, but it's an idea that should be considered. 

By next time I assume you mean the following year? Then presumably a fresh draw every other year so you don’t have teams that can never be drawn against each other based on being on the same home/away schedule?

[Blackdude]

4 hours ago, Kent said:

By next time I assume you mean the following year? Then presumably a fresh draw every other year so you don’t have teams that can never be drawn against each other based on being on the same home/away schedule?

By the next time those teams would play each other in the V's Cup.

So, let's say HFX Wanderers hosts Valour FC in the V's Cup  draw in 2019. (Yes an actual draw) And that they don't face each other in the V's Cup until 2022. Well in 2022, Valour FC would host HFX Wanderers. (I'm also going on with what Montopoli said in saying that it will probably go single-knock out.

I'm confused with your second question. I can't really answer it. The draw would be the same every year, but if you've hosted the previous leg between both teams, you have to play away. If it's a new pairing, they do a second draw for whoever gets home for the first leg.  (Or don't do a draw especially if there are no seeded teams, because in Davis Cup, there are seeded teams)

[Kent]

49 minutes ago, Blackdude said:

By the next time those teams would play each other in the V's Cup.

So, let's say HFX Wanderers hosts Valour FC in the V's Cup  draw in 2019. (Yes an actual draw) And that they don't face each other in the V's Cup until 2022. Well in 2022, Valour FC would host HFX Wanderers. (I'm also going on with what Montopoli said in saying that it will probably go single-knock out.

I'm confused with your second question. I can't really answer it. The draw would be the same every year, but if you've hosted the previous leg between both teams, you have to play away. If it's a new pairing, they do a second draw for whoever gets home for the first leg.  (Or don't do a draw especially if there are no seeded teams, because in Davis Cup, there are seeded teams)

OK I see. What I was imagining you meant was something like this.

2019 draw: Valour hosts HFX, Edmonton hosts Cavalry, York 9 hosts Victoria, Hamilton hosts Impact, etc.

2020 draw: since Valour, Edmonton, York 9, and Hamilton were home teams in the first round last year, this year they have to be away teams. As a result, Valour, Edmonton, York 9, and Hamilton can't be drawn against each other (and HFX, Cavalry, Victoria, and Impact can't be drawn against each other either).

[Cblake]

I would do a 40 team single elimination tournament, similar to the US Open Cup format before they expanded it greatly in recent years.

It would go as follows with all the MLS, CPL, L10 and Quebec League teams plus additional teams. The early rounds would be regional as they do in the US to keep travel for the lower level teams close by. 

1R     2R     3R       QF   SF    F

32      16      16      8      4      2

[shamrock]

My two cents:

1. Go to single elimination, saves time and causes more upsets, similar to European Cup set-up

2. MLS teams equal to Can PL teams. You can't say we're tier 1 and then give the upside to MLS teams

3. Only winners of QPLS / L1 qualify. It would get too big if other provinces start their D3 leagues plus it's supposed to be a price. So not all of the teams will have a shot. 

[Gordon]

Title is wrong but a good read nonetheless:

http://canpl.ca/video/voyageurs-cup-creator-delighted-with-addition-of-cpl-clubs-to-canadian-championship

[Blackdude]

4 hours ago, Gordon said:

Title is wrong but a good read nonetheless:

http://canpl.ca/video/voyageurs-cup-creator-delighted-with-addition-of-cpl-clubs-to-canadian-championship

Why is the title wrong? I mean I always thought that Dwayne was the main man being the V's Cup.

[Gordon]

6 hours ago, Blackdude said:

Why is the title wrong? I mean I always thought that Dwayne was the main man being the V's Cup.

Dwayne (Winnipeg Fury) was definitely a key player, and certainly the person I would point to for these sorts of interviews, but as he explains in the article, the ‘creator’ was the voyageurs. IIRC, and I may be mistaken in my dotage, there was a small organizing committee of which Fury was a member. He did do all the leg work associated with acquiring the trophy and case (and took all of the heat for the choice from some) and was heavily involved post creation so I don’t want to undersell at all his contributions - they were massive - but it overstates to say he was the creator. 

If you’re lurking Dwayne, please correct anything I’ve misstated!

[Free kick]

21 hours ago, Gordon said:

Dwayne (Winnipeg Fury) was definitely a key player, and certainly the person I would point to for these sorts of interviews, but as he explains in the article, the ‘creator’ was the voyageurs. IIRC, and I may be mistaken in my dotage, there was a small organizing committee of which Fury was a member. He did do all the leg work associated with acquiring the trophy and case (and took all of the heat for the choice from some) and was heavily involved post creation so I don’t want to undersell at all his contributions - they were massive - but it overstates to say he was the creator. 

If you’re lurking Dwayne, please correct anything I’ve misstated!

The actual idea was first posted by DJT.  Then the ball got rolling.