shermanator Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 You mean LB? Right is the new left! :confused: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BringBackTheBlizzard Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 Latest appears to be that Aceval isn't a done deal yet: http://www.sportsnet.ca/soccer/2012/01/26/tfc-preseason/?utm_source=Soccer%20Lineup%20RSS-Images&utm_medium=feed&utm_content=TFC%20has%20high%20hopes%20for%20new%20season Winter also revealed that TFC signed Ecuadorian centre-back Geovanny Caicedo and that it is close to agreeing terms with Chilean left-back Miguel Aceval. It’s all part of the club’s master plan to hit the ground running when exhibition games come fast and furious next month ahead of the start of the regular season in March. Not a direct quote from Winter but worth noting that Aceval is described as a left-back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
torontoSC Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 I still think TFC is short at Forward. If Koev goes down, no one can step into that CF role. Ryan Johnson can play CF and they'll just switch over a winger to his position on the right. Also, Stefan Vukovic is being rumored to be signing with TFC so maybe he's another option. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maccaliam Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 Not a direct quote from Winter but worth noting that Aceval is described as a left-back. Makes sense with the signing of Caicedo and there still not being any apparent competition at LB for Morgan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soccerpro Posted January 29, 2012 Share Posted January 29, 2012 http://www.torontofc.ca/news/2012/01/toronto-takes-41-preseason 41 players in preseason. 9 academy players. Apparently of which only "2 or 3" have a chance of making the squad. Vukovic and Camargo? Maybe Jackman? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RS Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 Miguel Aceval signing is official. http://www.torontofc.ca/news/2012/01/aceval-arrives-toronto Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greatest Cockney Rip Off Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 Miguel Aceval signing is official. http://www.torontofc.ca/news/2012/01/aceval-arrives-toronto And here is Winter talking about how is is a left footed CB. http://torontofc.neulion.com/tfc/console.jsp?catid=2&id=3980 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BringBackTheBlizzard Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 It sounds from his later comment that they were expecting Iro to stay, which is what makes it all hard to fathom because he did not look up to it last season to me. Hopefully they know what they are doing. Last season I thought Soolsma looked like a pub team player in training camp clips but eventually he more or less looked the part so hopefully Winter's judgement on this is more in that sort of vein than it was on Eddie Viator. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gian-Luca Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 And here is Winter talking about how is is a left footed CB. http://torontofc.neulion.com/tfc/console.jsp?catid=2&id=3980 The seems more physically built like a LCB, rather than someone who will go bombing up and down the left flank (though probably could play on the left if need be). Seems like another promising signing, I wonder if TFC will get a discount for English as a second language lessons for all these guys that can't speak English on the team! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpg75 Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 And here is Winter talking about how is is a left footed CB. http://torontofc.neulion.com/tfc/console.jsp?catid=2&id=3980 Stop perpetuating the conspiracy! Aceval was signed to take PT away from Morgan at LB and piss off us Canadian supporters, didn't you get the memo? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maccaliam Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 The seems more physically built like a LCB, rather than someone who will go bombing up and down the left flank (though probably could play on the left if need be). Seems like another promising signing, I wonder if TFC will get a discount for English as a second language lessons for all these guys that can't speak English on the team! I wonder what the thinking is with competition for Morgan at LB? Perhaps Aceval will split time between left-back and Centre-half? Either way, from the little I have read on Aceval and videos I've seen, he looks like another smart pick-up tp shore up the backline. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canuck Oranje Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 First of all, I think many fans underestimate the amount of turnover that takes place at big clubs in Europe. Many big clubs, including Ajax, turnover 40-50% of their first team roster even in good years. Bad years would be higher than that. So why wouldn't you expect TFC to turnover their non-core? Especially, with salary cap considerations. Second, many TFC fans also underestimate the quality of the young Canadians and consequently discount their potential contribution to the MLS team. Evaluating a young player is a moving target. While there are possibilities of a drop back, the probability of progression for an 18-21 year is much higher than even a 23-25 year old. In fact, many professional clubs have a ruthless cull at 20-21 years of age. For some sense of the blunt reality, take a look at this article from the New York Times magazine in 2010 about the Ajax academy http://www.nytimes.com/2010/06/06/magazine/06Soccer-t.html?pagewanted=all Third, in the Dutch system of development (and Brazil's as well), young players are expected to play more than one position. Also young players tend to enter the first team from outside positions and gradually work toward central positions, if that's where they will ultimately play. In this regard, watch for Doniel Henry to play more central back this year than last. And expect Aaron Maund to play more left back than left centre back (apparently, he has played at LB from time to time). It is also very common in Brazil and Holland for young defensive midfielders to play fullback positions. I seem to recall Aron Winter, himself, playing multiple midfield positions and fullback, even the Dutch national team level when he played. Aceval, at the listed 210lbs, will not be an attacking left back. Although, I'm sure he provides the option of playing three centre backs from time to time (quite common in South America). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BringBackTheBlizzard Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 s Stop perpetuating the conspiracy! Aceval was signed to take PT away from Morgan at LB and piss off us Canadian supporters, didn't you get the memo? Would be interested to hear how you would rationalize keeping Yourassowsky until January? Also would have thought that Adrian Cann and Doniel Henry would not benefit in playing time terms from the arrival of two experienced central backs and a first round draft pick given Ty Harden is still around and probably on a guaranteed contract due to his age and years of experience in the league so not at all clear what difference it makes from an over-eager CMNT supporter sort of standpoint. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keegan Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 s Would be interested to hear how you would rationalize keeping Yourassowsky until January? Also would have thought that Adrian Cann and Doniel Henry would not benefit in playing time terms from the arrival of two experienced central backs and a first round draft pick given Ty Harden is still around and probably on a guaranteed contract due to his age and years of experience in the league so not at all clear what difference it makes from an over-eager CMNT supporter sort of standpoint. Well they would have needed to offload Yourassowsky to free up an international spot for these signings no? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BringBackTheBlizzard Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 Well they would have needed to offload Yourassowsky to free up an international spot for these signings no? Even after dispensing with the services of Viator, Griffit and Martina? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpg75 Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 s Would be interested to hear how you would rationalize keeping Yourassowsky until January? Also would have thought that Adrian Cann and Doniel Henry would not benefit in playing time terms from the arrival of two experienced central backs and a first round draft pick given Ty Harden is still around and probably on a guaranteed contract due to his age and years of experience in the league so not at all clear what difference it makes from an over-eager CMNT supporter sort of standpoint. I would keep my mouth shut because i don't know what's going on behind the scenes instead of pretending I do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BringBackTheBlizzard Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 At no point have I suggested any inside knowledege and threads like this on fan messageboards provide an opportunity for interested fans to try to work out what is going on. Keeping Yourassowky around until well into January when he clearly hadn't made the grade in MLS terms still seems a tad bizarre to me. As does offering Iro a new contract. Hopefully it all works out for the best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BringBackTheBlizzard Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 Aceval, at the listed 210lbs,.... Is also a bit of a concern in the context of left centre back. The technical quality of MLS gets questioned a lot but the athleticism of the players is never in question and that causes problems for some newcomers from other leagues. Marco Reda getting absolutely killed for pace by Eddie Johnson in one of the very first TFC games back in 2007 comes to mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ssk Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 He seems athletic enough for his role. I don't know his fat content, but when he was younger, his weight was listed as 200 lbs, so he could maybe lose 5-15 lbs. 200 lbs at 6 ft is more of a NHL physique and I wouldn't say those guys are slouches. He seems like a heavy mesomorph. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BringBackTheBlizzard Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 Not looking to reignite any arguments but the official website is talking up Aceval's versatility today: http://www.torontofc.ca/news/2012/02/winter-very-satisfied-defence Thing to watch maybe between now and the start of the season is if another near league mimimum player is added at left back as extra cover. Injuries and suspensions happen regularly so it would be very surprising if Ashtone Morgan were able to play the full 90 in every single game this season, and I think it would also be surprising if Winter/Mariner were counting on it given his relative inexperience and the importance of making the playoffs this season in career longevity terms. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpg75 Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 I don't think Morgan is expected to play every minute of every game. With Aceval being left footed and with 5 CB's he (Aceval) can provide cover at LB. Before you jump on this statement, you were disputing that he was being brought in as a LB and not a CB. No one ever disputed that he is versatile. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BringBackTheBlizzard Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 The lingering question I have in all of this is how Andy Iro would have fitted into the scheme of things if he had put pen to paper on the contract offered to him. That may be something that only Winter, De Klerk and Mariner will ever know for sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Hombre Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 The lingering question I have in all of this is how Andy Iro would have fitted into the scheme of things if he had put pen to paper on the contract offered to him. That may be something that only Winter, De Klerk and Mariner will ever know for sure. Wouldn't he have been deep injury backup. I think with the last season where they had to resort to Eckersley playing CB, they realize that sometimes you need a lot of backup, particularly with both Cann and Williams coming back from significant injuries. My understanding was that they offered him a fairly cheap contract, so why not roll the dice and see if you can get an MLS capable CB on the cheap to sit on the bench if you need him? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BringBackTheBlizzard Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 The reasoning against Iro as depth is that they already had Ty Harden in place for the low price experienced back-up sort of angle and he actually played reasonably OK in the latter portion of the season. Williams appears to be a huge question mark in injury terms but all the signs have pointed towards Cann being back for this season so prior to Aceval's arrival there was potentially going to be Caicedo, Iro, Cann, Harden, Henry and Maund all competing for two starting places, before options like Frings, Eckersley and Hall even start to be taken into consideration. Hopefully Aceval and Caicedo are the answer this season. The season very much hinges on them not being Latin America's version of Usanov and Hscanovics. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Hombre Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 All I was saying is that Cann and Williams are both serious question marks at this point. As are both Aceval and Caicedo. I figure they would want known quantities like Harden and Iro just in case. If they really low-balled Iro (which it sounds like they did) then there's no harm in having him play reserves and being ready if options 1 thru 4 don't work out as planned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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