The Floro Replacement

[jpg75]

They probably wanted Bruce Arena and now he's gone. If they wait it out and the US move to another coach before or after the 2018 WC then they can swoop in and get their guy. Of course any normal association would hire a replacement coach in the meantime and when the guy they wanted becomes available they just turf the place-filler coach and sign their guy.

[Keegan]

1 hour ago, jpg75 said:

They probably wanted Bruce Arena and now he's gone. If they wait it out and the US move to another coach before or after the 2018 WC then they can swoop in and get their guy. Of course any normal association would hire a replacement coach in the meantime and when the guy they wanted becomes available they just turf the place-filler coach and sign their guy.

Exactly.  Look at our rivals like Jamaica and El Salvador, they never waste time getting managers in/out.  

[matty]

They've said they've had 80 applicants and I find it hard to believe there aren't good candidates in that 80. I also hope they're also calling people instead of just waiting to see who applies. As said before, the list of skilled and available CONCACAF/MLS coaches is pretty big right now and there's no reason they can't get a good coach.

I don't totally agree with @jpg75's idea of a place holder, but feel the CSA needs to be willing to sack a guy if the results are not there. 

[Soccerpro]

I think the CSA is just pinching pennies, holding off on having to pay a new manager until the last moment possible.

[matty]

5 minutes ago, Soccerpro said:

I think the CSA is just pinching pennies, holding off on having to pay a new manager until the last moment possible.

then they should play some home friendlies and generate some cash. *grumble*

[Soccerpro]

5 minutes ago, matty said:

then they should play some home friendlies and generate some cash. *grumble*

 

5 minutes ago, matty said:

then they should play some home friendlies and generate some cash. *grumble*

How much could they make off a home date these days? Marquee opposition demand hefty appearance fees. 

How many people would show in Vancouver to see Canada vs Jamaica?

[matty]

27 minutes ago, Soccerpro said:

 

How much could they make off a home date these days? Marquee opposition demand hefty appearance fees. 

How many people would show in Vancouver to see Canada vs Jamaica?

They'd be playing in Toronto likely and last time they played a friendly against Jamaica in Toronto, which was in 2014, 12,000 people showed up which is better than the US MNT drew to any US based friendly in 2016 (that said US vs Jamaica just drew 17,000 in fucking Chattanooga).

Even with low attendance at friendlies the US makes around $15m in revenue between USMNT and USWNT home games.

The CanMNT and CanWNT playing at home should be able to generate a fair bit of cash.

[BCM]

Definitely seem to be slow on the trigger, and my guess it is to save cash. So much for an integrated approach. I also reckon the appointment will be someone we haven't discussed.

[matty]

10 minutes ago, BCM1555362349 said:

Definitely seem to be slow on the trigger, and my guess it is to save cash. So much for an integrated approach. I also reckon the appointment will be someone we haven't discussed.

I'm moderately doubtful of the later at this point. The thread has been pretty focused on certain criteria that, not only fans but, media feel needs to be meet and the pool of guys that fit that profile is fairly small. Going outside of it, especially after this wait, could result in some actual mainstream media criticism of the CSA.

All that said, these guys are likely being cheap so I'm expecting some minor MLS guy.

[Kent]

11 hours ago, matty said:

I'm moderately doubtful of the later at this point. The thread has been pretty focused on certain criteria that, not only fans but, media feel needs to be meet and the pool of guys that fit that profile is fairly small. Going outside of it, especially after this wait, could result in some actual mainstream media criticism of the CSA.

All that said, these guys are likely being cheap so I'm expecting some minor MLS guy.

Did anyone predict Floro before he was hired? I don't remember what people were saying about criteria before his hire, but if it was CONCACAF experience, would anyone have been able to dig up his name?

It is possible the future CMNT coach has been mentioned, but it's a big world out there.

I also highly doubt Canada was shooting for Arena. Let's not forget that he wasn't available even when he took the US job. I don't think Canada would have been able to pull him from LA.

[matty]

38 minutes ago, Kent said:

Did anyone predict Floro before he was hired? I don't remember what people were saying about criteria before his hire, but if it was CONCACAF experience, would anyone have been able to dig up his name?

It is possible the future CMNT coach has been mentioned, but it's a big world out there.

I also highly doubt Canada was shooting for Arena. Let's not forget that he wasn't available even when he took the US job. I don't think Canada would have been able to pull him from LA.

I did say moderately. I think there's more of a spotlight now on the CSA than before and that the selection this time could get them shat on rather than praised, which largely was the case with Floro. I agree someone buried deep in the past (like Floro) could get the role but it seems somewhat less likely now than it did back then. I think the pool of what's being looked at (and what people want them to look at) isn't super wide atm but yes they could go outside it.

I fully agree with you on Arena. 

[Grizzly]

14 hours ago, matty said:

I'm moderately doubtful of the later at this point. The thread has been pretty focused on certain criteria that, not only fans but, media feel needs to be meet and the pool of guys that fit that profile is fairly small. Going outside of it, especially after this wait, could result in some actual mainstream media criticism of the CSA.

All that said, these guys are likely being cheap so I'm expecting some minor MLS guy.

This thread seems to be focused on criteria that you think need to be met and that many others including myself disagree with. I have seen no evidence that your views are supported by the media or any other reliable sources or that the CSA is going in the direction you are advocating. You are giving us evidence like "I was talking to this guy who was wearing a CSA shirt". And by you writing every third post on the thread it is making it seem like your view is the common one and making the thread a bit useless to read because it is mostly you rehashing your same opinion over and over again. 

[matty]

2 minutes ago, Grizzly said:

This thread seems to be focused on criteria that you think need to be met and that many others including myself disagree with. I have seen no evidence that your views are supported by the media or any other reliable sources or that the CSA is going in the direction you are advocating. You are giving us evidence like "I was talking to this guy who was wearing a CSA shirt". And by you writing every third post on the thread it is making it seem like your view is the common one and making the thread a bit useless to read because it is mostly you rehashing your same opinion over and over again. 

The concacaf/mls focus comes from pieces that have appeared on mlssoccer.com, tsn.com and of course totz and some stuff that's been implied in the sun. A good handful are posted on page one.

The csa stuff comes from an admitted soft source that predates the csa shirt guy (who i didn't give as evidence of anything).

Yea i do post like 1/3 of the posts here and most of the random ones are little news stories about guys who are available that fit into said media desires.

[jpg75]

3 hours ago, Kent said:

I also highly doubt Canada was shooting for Arena. Let's not forget that he wasn't available even when he took the US job. I don't think Canada would have been able to pull him from LA.

Arenas' contract with LA expired at the end of this season so he would have been available.

[Grizzly]

Out of curiosity I looked at the articles you posted on page 1. First of all you are referring to criteria of "the media" yet your "good handful" are only 3 articles which while it might be representative of the overall lack of coverage of the issue in the sports media is not representative of a media consensus of who the CSA will choose. The article by Dunfield is mostly an analysis of Floro's tenure with one line at the end where he states his opinion that a new coach should have CONCACAF or MLS experience. The article by our fellow Voyageur, Squizz, is about who fans on forums such as The Voyageurs are speculating about as far as a possible new head coach. The second article references Squizz's article and the guy gives his own speculative list of candidates. This is not exactly any evidence of what direction the CSA is going or some sort of media consensus about who they should choose. This isn't Neil Davidson talking with a CSA insider with knowledge of the candidates who have submitted applications and who the committee is favouring. Nothing wrong with these guys writing opinion pieces but you shouldn't be presenting them as some sort of hard evidence of media opinion or CSA policy. And all 3 of the authors are either Voyageurs or likely read the forum regularly so you are creating circular evidence here, ie. You on the forum: A Canadian like Dos Santos would be a good choice. Squizz: People on forums are suggesting Dos Santos as a candidate You on the forum: The media is thinks a Canadian like Dos Santos would be a good choice. 

My problem with all of this is not that I don't agree with your opinion on the issue but that you have created a kind of bubble world thread in which we are talking about your perception of the issue not the issue itself. And this issue is one of the most important and interesting ones in Canadian soccer. I keep clicking on the thread when there are new posts thinking that it is going to be some news about the hiring only to see it is mostly yet another rehash of your opinion. It is making this thread into something similar to Mister215's threads and at least that guy's threads are obviously ridiculous topics not hijacking an important topic. 

[jpg75]

Hey Grizz, how about starting a new thread? Compile a bunch of articles from multiple media sources about this topic for the first post and we can get off to a fresh start.

[Grizzly]

Not sure we really need a new thread. Also I don't recall seeing very many articles in the media at all let alone multiple sources.

[Olympique_de_Marseille]

23 minutes ago, jpg75 said:

Hey Grizz, how about starting a new thread? Compile a bunch of articles from multiple media sources about this topic for the first post and we can get off to a fresh start.

Do we call the new thread "The Michael Findlay Replacement (unless the CSA says fuck it, were keeping this guy)" ?

 

3 minutes ago, Grizzly said:

Not sure we really need a new thread. Also I don't recall seeing very many articles in the media at all let alone multiple sources.

No serious need for a new thread. I think it's going to stay that way in terms of real sources. The CSA is tight-lipped.

[Kent]

3 hours ago, matty said:

 

4 hours ago, Kent said:

Did anyone predict Floro before he was hired? I don't remember what people were saying about criteria before his hire, but if it was CONCACAF experience, would anyone have been able to dig up his name?

It is possible the future CMNT coach has been mentioned, but it's a big world out there.

I also highly doubt Canada was shooting for Arena. Let's not forget that he wasn't available even when he took the US job. I don't think Canada would have been able to pull him from LA.

I did say moderately.

 

Fair enough. I seemed to have forgotten that by the time I finished reading your post.

[Kent]

19 minutes ago, Olympique_de_Marseille said:

 

No serious need for a new thread. I think it's going to stay that way in terms of real sources. The CSA is doing nothing.

FYP

[Unnamed Trialist]

An open call like you were hiring an assistant manager at a department store is plain dumb. I know I never thought twice about this before, since in most cases in the rest of life I believe an open call is ideal. But not here, not in football. 

Same way a open trial for a pro team is a bad idea, and bad enough even for amateur.

Having to sift through 80 applications is plain stupid. No serious football country in the world does that. Nor do clubs.

Finding a manager is always done the same way. 

First, a post becomes available. Every frigging rep in the world find out the same day. All those who have clients out of work, talk to their clients and then contact the national federation (same goes with a club). Some coaches find out and ask their reps to make a call. No bios or resumes change hands. Unless the replacement is immediately announced, the federation speaks to those applying, and can also ask certain reps to have their clients step forward. 

Since you already have an idea what you want before you got rid of the last one, the profile is already determined. The criteria of the call has already been established.

All you need is to speak to a handful. You hire a coach for his record, for his connection with the club or national team, with the project. And maybe for something he says in an interview or the way you hit it off. And, finally, for him being in your budget range.

There is no need for an open call if you are doing your job, it just exposes your amateur mentality. 

This is footbal, it is different than most other job searches. In any given moment I would estimate there are a few hundred coaches without work, of those who aspire to coach at this level. A lot of the them are ex-players early in their coaching careers, maybe without a good season somewhere to point at yet.

BTW, since his name came up, Dely Valdes has returned to Málaga to coach one of their U-19 teams.

[matty]

5 hours ago, Olympique_de_Marseille said:

No serious need for a new thread. I think it's going to stay that way in terms of real sources. The CSA is tight-lipped.

That they are. Anytime business comes up they go quiet

[The Ref]

5 hours ago, Olympique_de_Marseille said:

No serious need for a new thread. I think it's going to stay that way in terms of real sources. The CSA is tight-lipped.

One would think Montigliani knows what he is doing.  But does he really?

[BCM]

12 hours ago, Unnamed Trialist said:

An open call like you were hiring an assistant manager at a department store is plain dumb. I know I never thought twice about this before, since in most cases in the rest of life I believe an open call is ideal. But not here, not in football. 

Same way a open trial for a pro team is a bad idea, and bad enough even for amateur.

Having to sift through 80 applications is plain stupid. No serious football country in the world does that. Nor do clubs.

Finding a manager is always done the same way. 

First, a post becomes available. Every frigging rep in the world find out the same day. All those who have clients out of work, talk to their clients and then contact the national federation (same goes with a club). Some coaches find out and ask their reps to make a call. No bios or resumes change hands. Unless the replacement is immediately announced, the federation speaks to those applying, and can also ask certain reps to have their clients step forward. 

Since you already have an idea what you want before you got rid of the last one, the profile is already determined. The criteria of the call has already been established.

All you need is to speak to a handful. You hire a coach for his record, for his connection with the club or national team, with the project. And maybe for something he says in an interview or the way you hit it off. And, finally, for him being in your budget range.

There is no need for an open call if you are doing your job, it just exposes your amateur mentality. 

This is footbal, it is different than most other job searches. In any given moment I would estimate there are a few hundred coaches without work, of those who aspire to coach at this level. A lot of the them are ex-players early in their coaching careers, maybe without a good season somewhere to point at yet.

BTW, since his name came up, Dely Valdes has returned to Málaga to coach one of their U-19 teams.

And you, my friend, will have just violated federal law. The government is paying, they need an advertisement. Canada is not alone. I know Australia and Hong Kong do it too, because they have to do so as well. It's not amateurism it is supposed to be for transparency and to guard against corruption. But don't think the federations take the advert seriously or that they aren't going through other channels. I do wonder if any open call applicants ever get an interview, much less the job - I would doubt it.

 

PS - just do a quick google search, Belgium's advertisement from 2016 will appear (amateur, eh), and even China's (so much for anti-corruption efforts).

[matty]

Does anyone know if the CSA exclusively hire from their pool of applicants or will they actually contact someone that hasn't applied that they may be interested in?