tmcmurph Posted September 21, 2015 Share Posted September 21, 2015 Yes the league does have it favourites but that is getting harder as more favourites clamour for similar status. NYFC, Orlando and LA2 will all be demanding same treatment as LA, NYRB, Seattle. Some teams can spend a lot on DPs with little to show for it. For some it works out. So in essence you will have 6 or 7 teams in major markets all demanding "fair" treatment (as in fair for them not everyone). At some point the salary cap does come into play to keep things sort of level. If they start allowing 8 DPs per team you'll know they are moving to the stage where only the big markets matter. We are half the way there already at 4 so close but not yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
An Observer Posted September 21, 2015 Share Posted September 21, 2015 Personally. I like parity and the fact that 10 teams are still in touch with 5 games to go is great in my opinion. The salary cap works to ensure this. 3 DPs...while make a difference...don't build a team. Frankly, I spent 17 years in London and got bored with the Premiership where at the beginning of the year, you know that only 3 or 4 sides have a realistic shot at winning. Since the premiership was started in 1992, you only have 5 sides that have ever won it (ManU, ManCity, Arsenal, Chelsea and Blackburn) and one of those won it at the beginning and will never win it again. Frankly, that is just boring. If you are a Newcastle or Everton fan, the best your club is ever going to do is qualify for the Europa Cup. Wow..so exciting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unnamed Trialist Posted September 21, 2015 Share Posted September 21, 2015 I guess all I am saying is that normally, in a critical moment in a league, some team stands out. And all credit to those that do, economic parity or not. If it has happened in the past, and in fact it has (2 teams have won half of all MLS Cups) then that means some clubs are doing things right. We are 5 games from the end and it is all in play, and that is very unusual. Some see parity, so that may seem good, but it also means not one team is really on a roll doing things right and taking advantage, pulling away. After 28 games there should be some team that has really figured it out and is taking the rest on successfully: What team is the team of reference in MLS this year? There isn't one, not one team to point to to say: there's a good team, there's a good example of where MLS is going. From the outside you have to say: I don't think any of those teams are a good example of what it means to build a new pro league in North America. No one says, hey, here is a successful formula for MLS, that is the right way to use DPs or sign foreigners or bring up academy players. But there is none of that, there is not one really positive lesson to be drawn in this season. Not one team figuring it out, not one coach getting the team fully competitive, not one starting 11 performing well consistently--and worse, the top teams are getting spanked. That is not good because it says free for all. They are not playing like winners, they are not competiting at a top level, it's a crap shoot. Claiming that MLS being competitive is one thing. Playing badly at the top, middle and bottom, well that is another story. Don't think it is anything to be proud of. Which explains why, if you look at fans across the league, not one set of supporters are really happy about their season, though maybe Caps fans, given we are doing way better than previous years, may be the most optimistic of all. Great, but you just have to look at this thread to see how not very optimistic even Caps fans are. PS, just want to say re EPL, most fans of that league say Spain is less competitive, that the Madrid-Barça rivalry dominates, which may be. But in fact since EPL started as many teams have won the league in Spain as in England (RM, Barça, At Madrid, Deportivo, Valencia). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmcmurph Posted September 21, 2015 Share Posted September 21, 2015 True and I was hoping the team that would pull away would be us but we seem to stumble in sync with Dallas & LA. I also wonder how much comes down to schedule congestion and player exhaustion at this time of year. We have a forward who has played more minutes than anyone other than our keeper. In the 4-5-1 that has got to wear on him. I think a lot of it has to do with who is healthy this time of year. In the last decade Barca = 7, RM = 2, AM = 1. ManU = 5,Chelsea = 3, ManC = 2. So the number of teams winning is about the same but last year in his victory interview Jose Mourinho described the EPL as more competitive than other leagues because it doesn't have 8-0 type blowouts. Whether that is a valid measure is debatable. In that same time MLS has had 6 different winners. In Euro leagues you need a bucket of money dropped in to just be competitive with the top teams. I'm not wanting to see that in MLS. I think increasing the salary cap is a good idea but all teams live with the same cap. I really don't like MLS changing the rules all the time to pander to big market teams. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obinna Posted September 21, 2015 Share Posted September 21, 2015 I think there's too much parity in MLS. It's a little ridiculous that the top team only has what, 48 points from 31 games? The bottom team is on 27 with a gang of teams hovering around 33 points? I want to see a champion that really owned the league, not one that lost a third (or more) of it's matches. You battle all year, put blood, sweat and tears into your season, and the margin between success and failure is as small as a small injury crisis, or a poor referee decision. If play-offs weren't such a big deal the parity wouldn't matter as much, but things are very black and white - make the post-season? Success. Miss the post-season? Failure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shermanator Posted September 21, 2015 Share Posted September 21, 2015 Would you rather see the same two or three clubs win year after year after year? I wouldn't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unnamed Trialist Posted September 21, 2015 Share Posted September 21, 2015 No, I agree, not the same ones. But I am into quality. And legacies. I like the idea that a team can have a good run with a good bunch of players. That is a model for everyone else. Great teams, however rich, are worthy of admiration. It is like when Atletico won the league two years ago in Spain, a huge accomplishment, great coach, great team, they beat Barça in our stadium on the last game of the year and we stood and applauded. So far there is no team to really applaud in MLS, and no team you really do NOT want to face. No fear, because no real quality. And no fear, no fun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ruffian Posted September 21, 2015 Share Posted September 21, 2015 No, I agree, not the same ones. But I am into quality. And legacies. I like the idea that a team can have a good run with a good bunch of players. That is a model for everyone else. Great teams, however rich, are worthy of admiration. It is like when Atletico won the league two years ago in Spain, a huge accomplishment, great coach, great team, they beat Barça in our stadium on the last game of the year and we stood and applauded. So far there is no team to really applaud in MLS, and no team you really do NOT want to face. No fear, because no real quality. And no fear, no fun. If there was not one or two teams running away with the La Liga title you would not be saying it is because of lack of quality. Seems like a very biased statement. League parity definitely makes for better entertainment in any league. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obinna Posted September 21, 2015 Share Posted September 21, 2015 I am with Unamed Trialist. I also like legacies but not the same handful of teams winning the league for decades and decades. That is different. Ideally, i'd like to see the top teams finish the season in the 70 point range. That would provide enough spread for you to look up the table and say "yup, those guys were the best team all season". Having 2 or 3 teams chasing the champion durig the final stretch is always fun, but at the same time I also want to see a clear top, middle and bottom. I'd like to see Liga MX level parity. You have your historically dominant teams like Chivas and America, but you also get a wide-array of winners. Leon, Santos Laguna and Monterrey come to mind as teams that have won recently, and you just get a sense that any team could win it any given season (much like MLS). However, unlike MLS, there is a clear (and often changing) bottom every year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackdude Posted September 21, 2015 Share Posted September 21, 2015 I am with Unamed Trialist. I also like legacies but not the same handful of teams winning the league for decades and decades. That is different. Ideally, i'd like to see the top teams finish the season in the 70 point range. That would provide enough spread for you to look up the table and say "yup, those guys were the best team all season". Having 2 or 3 teams chasing the champion durig the final stretch is always fun, but at the same time I also want to see a clear top, middle and bottom. I'd like to see Liga MX level parity. You have your historically dominant teams like Chivas and America, but you also get a wide-array of winners. Leon, Santos Laguna and Monterrey come to mind as teams that have won recently, and you just get a sense that any team could win it any given season (much like MLS). However, unlike MLS, there is a clear (and often changing) bottom every year. Here are last 5 teams with most points in Liga MX (34 matches played) 60 65 63 63 65. Here are the last 5 Supporters' Shield winners: 64 59 66 67 67* * It was a 30 match season, so I multipled by 17/15 (LA had 59 points) Having teams with 70 points is rare even in Mexico. The 70 point is more arbitrary IMHO and you're trying to compare yourself to places where teams play 4 more matches. I do think that having a close league is fun for everybody and even the fan of the worst team has hope of winning the top division in the not-so distant future. So on average, Supporters' Shield winners have more points than Liga MX teams. And to be fair, you have your top teams, LA, Seattle, Red Bulls who are always near the top, but anybody has a shot. Sure you had years where Columbus would have won the league with 55 points in the league. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obinna Posted September 22, 2015 Share Posted September 22, 2015 Good post, but are you suggesting that Liga MX has a similar level of parity to MLS? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmonte Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 They definitely have more parity among their teams than a lot of European leagues do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackdude Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 Good post, but are you suggesting that Liga MX has a similar level of parity to MLS? I think so. I don't see a big difference between those leagues except in years when you have a really bad team or really good team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmcmurph Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 Building a dynasty type club in a salary capped league like MLS requires that your organization be full of freaking geniuses or that you cheat a lot (or both). By cheating I mean either bend the rules into a pretzel or get the league to change them for you. So far cheating seems to be the modus operandi of LA. They are the closest to a dynasty type club in MLS currently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obinna Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 The funny thing is that MLS fans rarely make that comparison to Liga MX when discussing parity... Perhaps it is simply a matter of perception? America and Chivas are historically the most successful clubs by a fair margin (I think Cruz Azul is up there too), but as far as I know they don't win championships as reguarly as years past (someone can dust off the record books to double check, if they'd like). At the same time however, there is still a pecking order as far as size of clubs go. In MLS, the bigger clubs such as Seattle, LA and Toronto have a bigger financial backing and a reputation for on the field success (TFC excluded), but without the deep history of legacies you just feel that everyone is on the same playing field. That is good for keeping fans engaged, but I love to see long term david and golith franchises, personally speaking. MLS feels too much like everyone's the same, just like the NHL or NBA, where storied franchises like the Maple Leafs or Lakers can suck for multiple years at a time. Can you ever see Club America near the basement for multiple tournaments? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmonte Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 I mean yes, MLS has parity, but it IS by design. Those in charge rightfully worry about getting the league off the ground in a very tough, competitive North American climate. People from Houston aren't going to drive to LA every week to see the top club, neither are people from Atlanta going to drive to New York. Especially when soccer already isn't the most popular sport. So creating parity is definitely on purpose. They want every team to have SOME level of success to better infiltrate that competitive market. If one team blew every other team out of the water too early, then people in, say, Denver have little reason to add the Rapids into their Broncos infused lifestyle. As a fan of the sport of soccer itself, I have to support this approach, in that without it, you'll never start to get soccer to become a culture, especially in middle America. But it IS creeping into American culture more and more. I think without this approach, not only does soccer as a culture fail, MLS fails, as you can't have a team with 3 teams existing and 17 teams that perennially consider folding up shop because they aren't making a profit. So what is the other path? Profit sharing. And while that might start to sound feasible NOW, imagine trying to propose that to the teams that weren't sure they were even going to make a profit when the league (and Cap rules) began. I really love the traditional soccer too, leagues where you'll see the same teams deservedly at top over and over and over again. I just don't know, because of geographical challenges described above, if it works as well in North America as it would in Europe, where someone could feasibly just drive a few hours to see ANY team in the league they wanted to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unnamed Trialist Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 I just want to say, regarding Mexico, that having Apertura winners, Clausura winners, and Liguilla winners, gives an appearance of more parity. As "success" is easier that way, like in Argentina. If you took the big leagues and looked at the first half of the season, and called them winners, they would seem to have more parity as well. I recall maybe 10 years ago in Spain Real Sociedad leading the league with three games to go, then Madrid trapped them and won. That happens because the pressure, overall, is immense, on refs too. The last games of an Apertura are nowhere near as hot. Lesser teams can and do win a shorter season, but the stronger will prevail in a longer one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmcmurph Posted October 4, 2015 Share Posted October 4, 2015 Well a draw on the road is better than our recent results so I'll take the point against San Jose but we had so many chances to win it. Oh well it moves us just a little bit closer to a home playoff game. That said we really need a win or two against Dallas. That is the season right there in our next 2 games. Pedro looks like he is out for the rest of the season. Came in as a sub and pulled his hamstring again and had to be subbed out. Sucks to be him and us in that regard. So who will sub in for Rosales at the hour mark when he runs out of gas? Maybe a chance for Bustos? Kianz has played good in that role as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toontownman Posted October 4, 2015 Share Posted October 4, 2015 The end of the match sums up exactly why Manneh will likely never go anywhere further than the MLS. While he has a lot of the skills to step up to the next level he lacks the mental it factor and decision making. Yes he has time to improve but he has absolutely stagnated, possibly gone backwards over the past year. Big disappointment. Those three points would have meant everything. Need to beat Dallas twice which will be hard. Maybe Houston can do us two favours Draw is good to stop the alarming slide. Still can't believe we surrendered the Cascadia Cup and Champions League like that, but its a world apart from last season and a great learning experience from this squad. Some wise spending and recruitment this winter and we will be look very strong next year. A couple of decent strikers to help Rivero share the load are essential. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmcmurph Posted October 4, 2015 Share Posted October 4, 2015 Manneh's decision making is not good right now. Earlier in the year he seemed to be "getting it" but has regressed to head down and run. He is still only 20 so he can still learn. Next year hopefully a Morales that isn't injured or a #10 who can play a full season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toontownman Posted October 4, 2015 Share Posted October 4, 2015 Think it depends how Jordan Smith works out too. We need decent RB and LB options. Harvey has been steady again but needs replacing. Still not convinced Adekugbe is ready. Hopefully he can stay injury free and get a run of games to prove himself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmcmurph Posted October 8, 2015 Share Posted October 8, 2015 Another draw this time 0-0 against Dallas. It puts us in the playoffs so with 2 games remaining we need to secure a home game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soccerpro Posted October 8, 2015 Share Posted October 8, 2015 Not sure why Robinson is so reluctant to play a 2nd forward. Rivero is on his own island up there every match. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmcmurph Posted October 8, 2015 Share Posted October 8, 2015 Not sure why Robinson is so reluctant to play a 2nd forward. Rivero is on his own island up there every match. We would have to play some formation that isn't 4-5-1 on defence if we had 2 forwards. Rivero does a whale of a job up top all alone game after game. 2465 minutes so far. Only Ousted has more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soccerpro Posted October 8, 2015 Share Posted October 8, 2015 What's wrong with a 4-4-2? It's not like Rosales contributes anything as a CM besides giving the ball away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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